175 réponses à ce sujet

[fluffyamoeba]

A lot of that stuff was mentioned at beta launch. The ability to separate in progress and "finished" projects would help a lot. And I still think that we need a simple voting system, otherwise in a year's time, good new projects will have lower popularity counts that abandoned and rubbish projects that were created last year.

[Proleric]

 Nostalgia isn't what it used to be...

Are we just in the storming phase of a new community, which in time will be as good as NWN once was, or has the world changed?

[Proleric]

fluffyamoeba wrote...

A lot of that stuff was mentioned at beta launch. The ability to separate in progress and "finished" projects would help a lot. And I still think that we need a simple voting system, otherwise in a year's time, good new projects will have lower popularity counts that abandoned and rubbish projects that were created last year.

Agreed. A community rating of 9+ was always a reasonable guide to the good stuff.

[FalloutBoy]

I have tried to be very open-minded about this site. It is great for communication, but it fails miserably as a hub for finding content. I wasn't happy with the Nexus at first, but at least they put a little effort towards showing off good content.



At this site, they either don't care enough or they just don't have enough people working on it. I no longer accept the excuse of "if you guys don't give us feedback then we can't make improvements." There are features related to project organization that we have been requesting since before the game. It is either indifference or incompetence, and neither one is acceptable.



You would think BW would put out a little more effort towards encouraging us to make content for their game. There are completed (or at least playable) modules on this site that have been out for a couple weeks and have like 100 downloads. This playerbase is much larger than NWN and yet, nobody is downloading modules, probably because they can't find them. Bioware wanted to own the community, so they made this site, but they are proving that they are completely incapable of managing it. They should have stuck to just doing forums.

[georage]

The buggy nature of this toolset has driven off many NWN people, I would surmise.



Today I had to spend more than an HOUR trying to manually select files to export for a player build because of the gpu.rim bug. If Bioware can't create a streamlined module export process, why should anyone make modules?

[Proleric]

Actually, there don't seem to be many bugs, though a much better reporting system has just been announced.

[Dallo]

FalloutBoy wrote...

This playerbase is much larger than NWN and yet, nobody is downloading modules, probably because they can't find them. Bioware wanted to own the community, so they made this site, but they are proving that they are completely incapable of managing it. They should have stuck to just doing forums.

Well, there is this forum:  http://social.biowar...tegory/97/index

It's mostly filling up with fan fiction but they probably would've preferred mods and modules...



EDIT:  how in the hells do you post a link??

Modifié par Dallo, 15 janvier 2010 - 01:41 .

[fluffyamoeba]

The same way as on the old forums. (url=http://example.com)an example (/url). Replace the ( ) with [ ]

It's not very clear to players that the module announcement forum is aimed at them IMO. I think they assume it's for modders to recruit/announce a project has started/request beta testers.

Modifié par fluffyamoeba, 15 janvier 2010 - 01:49 .

[Dallo]

Proleric1 wrote...
Are we just in the storming phase of a new community, which in time will be as good as NWN once was, or has the world changed?

Nice model but not sure that it really applies.  I know what you mean though 

It's a bit of a mess here for sure, and for sure also Bioware/EA have banked on modders helping to fill the gaps between their own more substantial releases.  Game longevity etc etc.  And without a doubt I've seen a bunch of ideas in the OC that have been adapted from community projects.  So we are fertile ground for them too.  And of course they recruit sometimes from our ranks...

Storming?  It's certainly chaos... The game has proven way more popular than they'd expected, and they weren't prepared for it.  They lack the experience and resources (including human).  Their bad, big time...

It will settle down...  The kids will find something else to obsess about, the whiners will diminish in numbers, and maturer heads will eventually prevail.  Whether it will ever be as good as the NwN community was remains to be seen, but I am optimistic    

Modifié par Dallo, 15 janvier 2010 - 02:01 .

[Challseus]

I opened a new thread in the help forum talking about project page changes, and I got a response from Jeff, one of the web programmers. So, they are at least planning something, which is good. Better than nothing. He says they are taking suggestions as well.

[georage]

Proleric1 wrote...

Actually, there don't seem to be many bugs, though a much better reporting system has just been announced.

Interesting view considering:

* The toolset broke the OC. (this alone probably drove off many modders)
* The toolset simply would not install for a lot of people (database errors).
* You have to export areas with water twice
* The latest toolset nerfed a lot of modders custom 2das
* The builder-to-player export calls for files with illegal file names.
* Memory management is out of control.
* The game (daupdater actually) kills a lot of people's internet connections.

I guess your computer has to explode in your face for it to be considered a major bug.

I use the toolset for hours a day. It is the most buggy piece of software installed on any computer I own.

[Dallo]

georage wrote...

* The toolset broke the OC. (this alone probably drove off many modders)

This has been fixed though, right?

* The toolset simply would not install for a lot of people (database errors).

I had this problem initially but it was an easy fix once i looked for (and readily found) a solution.

* You have to export areas with water twice
* The latest toolset nerfed a lot of modders custom 2das
* The builder-to-player export calls for files with illegal file names.
* Memory management is out of control.

Can't comment about these issues.  I have opened the toolset exactly twice.  Once to find out that it didn't work properly, and the second time to ensure that it did once I'd corrected the issues.

* The game (daupdater actually) kills a lot of people's internet connections.

I had this glitch too, and it drove me mad for a little while.  Turned out to be a simple firewall issue though. 


Personally, I think the major problems with the majority of would-be builders getting their hands dirty, so to speak, are a) the apparent complexity of the toolset and the fact that there does seem to be a few beetles still to squash.  Lots of folks (myself included) got burnt badly by the NwN2 toolset - lost a number of work sessions in a row and just gave up on it in disgust, and the OC is so very cool, and they are still playing.

The latter certainly applies to me, though I'm beginning to get a bit jaded.  In comparison I played the NwN and NwN2 OCs exactly once, and within a short while had my head in the toolset and/or was actively trying to help other modders in any way I could.

The structure here obviously needs to be sorted out, and that's a huge issue, and the remaining bugs in the toolset need to be fixed, but I honestly do believe that building activity will start to increase very soon.

[Dallo]

fluffyamoeba wrote...

The same way as on the old forums. (url=http://example.com)an example (/url). Replace the ( ) with [ ]

Thanks.  I'll give it a whirl.  I remember now that's what you needed to do to get links in your sig, but in general I used to do it the lazy way ie copy the link location, paste it wherever I wanted, and then edit my post to change the "Click here" to whatever I wanted... 

It's not very clear to players that the module announcement forum is aimed at them IMO. I think they assume it's for modders to recruit/announce a project has started/request beta testers.

Yep, for sure...

[ladydesire]

georage, the 2das that I need to work as m2das haven't ever worked that way. As far as the .gpu.rim issue goes, I know that Bioware can do it, so maybe there is an problem in our packing tool.

[Proleric]

I'd stand by the assertion that there are not many toolset bugs compared with most software launches - less than ten so far, which strikes me as remarkable (especially when considered as defects per function).

Early adopters generally expect to find bugs. It's encouraging that most of the issues are about integration into the home environment, not the toolset itself. Of course, there are a lot of minor scripting issues which need to be documented, but that's no surprise. 

For anyone considering whether to move on from Neverwinter Nights to Dragon Age, I'd suggest that toolset reliability is not a significant barrier. 

[Maddyanne]

I'm having SQL issues. Ah well. Playing is still pretty distracting, but more and more I'm itching to get to building.

[maudlin27]

I could create loads of huge areas in NWN very quickly. With DA:O after spending several hours I'm not able to do even the most basic of things. I tried loading up an existing area thinking I could just modify bits of it to save on time, but that was read only with no obvious option to copy. Compared to the nwn toolset DA:O's is an absolute nightmare so far, and is bound to put off many people like me who create modules for fun+don't have any real experience with game design.

I've not tried the other functions of it yet like the script editor so don't know whether that's any better/worse, but I'm very disappointed since what I'd really hoped for was something with the same user-friendly interface+options as the nwn toolset but with greater depth and more advanced features for those that wanted them.



In fact so far all the DA toolset's done is made me tempted to go back to my old unfinished nwn module and work on that!

[Proleric]

@maudlin27 - you're probably giving up too easily. Try following the wiki tutorials about making a new module - most of the design object concepts are very similar to NWN.

[Baracuda6977]

there is no denying that this toolset is a monster hellbent on devouring everyone's sanity



but it isnt that hard to make stuff with, i just wish that the competent modders were more mentor friendly and would help ppl with their problems better if they have several

[Proleric]

Baracuda6977 wrote...

... i just wish that the competent modders were more mentor friendly ... (

Interesting - my impression is that most queries get a reply? We're still learning, and the quality of questions varies, inevitably, but I guess the forum still works, broadly speaking?

The wiki seems like a huge opportunity... I'm trying to remember to capture answers, and refer folk there. I very much like what's happening in terms of refinement of the content, owing to the inclusive nature of public editing. Also, the recent move towards wiki suggestion boards is great - so far, it seems to be a much better way of drawing out the real issues and establishing consensus. Do you feel we're giving enough there?

Did you also mean "mentor" in the sense of "experienced buddy"? I guess we don't do that much, but the social networks and projects that this site encourages could be a good place to start?

[Baracuda6977]

by "mentor" i meant they would help new toolset users troubleshoot their projects so that they in turn can help newer ppl with problems



im going to go pour over the wiki again though

[maudlin27]

I don't find the wiki very user friendly I'm afraid. What I need is a simple 'to create an area, follow these steps' type guide since the toolset is to me so far rather unintuitive - there are some videos on youtube that cover some of the stuff though, and a few of the wiki articles are useful (especially one that shows what every model looks like - saved me lots of time!). Others have me lost straight away with all the technical terms they give out though, and don't really seem written towards someone like me (whose only real experience with game design has come through toolsets that shipped with the game).

That said I did persevere and finally got some results - after most of a day, I was able to design a large hall and figure out how to test it! (in the same time I'd have been able to fully design a large area and populate it in nwn, but at least I managed something). I've now scaled back my initial idea and decided to try and squeeze everything into just 1 new area, with the rest of it utilising existing areas as I don't think I'd be able to keep my sanity trying to design multiple new areas.

[Baracuda6977]

can you test anything in the toolset or just areas?



things like that are surprisingly hard to find out...

[BrotherJason]

You can preview some things in the editor (eg. Stages for Conversations, Cutscenes, Areas and such), while other things can only be previewed in game (everything that in some way has anything to do with scripts). The wiki is still in a very incomplete state I'm afraid, but I'm certain it will improve over time as more and more people learn how to use the Toolset. I may post some articles myself, once I've got some things puzzling me atm sorted out, and hopefully others will do so too.

[Haleseen]

I just started making my mod like two days ago. Figured out that I made it in the wrong module, so the mod can't use water in-game. So I changed the story line to address this fact.



Currently the project that I am soloing right now is going to have some kind of persistence of either age or something else. But It is going to be a full length campaign.



The Tool-Set at first was very not user-friendly, But I pushed through using some of the very scant in number youtube videos about the tool-set.