303 réponses à ce sujet

[Bravenu3]

Master Che wrote... Guilt by association. They have to assume that you were complicit in the cheat; i.e., the guy who set up the cheat is a buddy of yours.

Not if the lobby was public. Besides, there is a good reason that association isn't definite proof of guilt. I know this is not a legal issue, but aren't those principles something even communities within private (server) spaces should aspire to?

[Beerfish]

The part that does not wash for me is the "I didn't know or kept track of how many credits i had." I would assume that someone else hacked the game and you ended up with a pile of undeserved credits. The moment you spent those credits rather than reporting the problem you were taking advantage of the situation and thus the ban. That's what it sounds like to me.

[SimulatedSnowman]

Bravenu3 wrote...

And if you have no way of knowing whether you were affected by someone else's cheat? Does BW investigate cases like "I think I got credits because of someone else cheating. Please reduce them to the correct amount!"?

I very seriously doubt that any cheaters are increasing the amount of credits they get by small amounts. It would be impossible for me not to notice that I suddenly had 100 million credits. To say that I wouldn't notice that would be to admit that I am, in fact, a moron. To spend those credits willingly would be admission that I am okay with reaping the rewards of cheating.

Modifié par SimulatedSnowman, 18 juillet 2012 - 03:58 .

[Bravenu3]

Beerfish wrote...would assume [...] sounds like to me.

And those are acceptable grounds for harsh punishments in a game?

[NM_Che56]

Bravenu3 wrote...

Master Che wrote... Guilt by association. They have to assume that you were complicit in the cheat; i.e., the guy who set up the cheat is a buddy of yours.

Not if the lobby was public. Besides, there is a good reason that association isn't definite proof of guilt. I know this is not a legal issue, but aren't those principles something even communities within private (server) spaces should aspire to?

You can switch from private to public after your buddies get on.

In the end, association is not proof of guilt, but it makes you a suspect nevertheless, right?  If you're with someone and they rob a bank, then unless you call the police and snitch your ass off you'll be arrested and questioned before they decide whether or not to charge you.

Modifié par Master Che, 18 juillet 2012 - 04:01 .

[Bravenu3]

SimulatedSnowman wrote... I very seriously doubt that any cheaters are increasing the amount of credits they get by small amounts.

Don't give them ideas ;-)

SimulatedSnowman wrote... It would be impossible for me not to notice that I suddenly had 100 million credits. To say that I wouldn't notice that would be to admit that I am, in fact, a moron. To spend those credits willingly would be admission that I am okay with reaping the rewards of cheating.

I feel for you. Luckily I only save credits up to a few PSPs. But again, instead of BW fixing the underlying problems, us players have to deal with the consequences. Why should I have to keep track of my honestly earned credits?

Modifié par Bravenu3, 18 juillet 2012 - 04:02 .

[InfamousResult]

I'm not going to discuss whether I think you're guilty or innocent. But this thread was pretty pointless.

And no, I don't think that banning for cheating is stupid. We all paid for the service- yes, the service, not the game, we don't OWN the multiplayer- and just like all services, it came with ToS that we had to agree to. This isn't some big, new policy that Bioware came up with; it's the same in pretty much all multiplayer games, and online services.

[msantos]

@ OP

I'm certain the Bioware staff will look carefully at your case and decide as optimally as they can. However unfortunate this may appear to many, the rules have been pretty explicit and no amount of assumption will exonerate those who truly cheat.

Maybe Bioware will rescind your ban, maybe not... but more importantly to the rest of the community, let this be a life lesson for all those who see nothing wrong with cheating.

For those who do not cheat and have the decency of playing a fair game then you certainly have nothing to fear and kudos to you for helping make this a healthier community.

[Silasqtx]

SimulatedSnowman wrote...
I very seriously doubt that any cheaters are increasing the amount of credits they get by small amounts. It would be impossible for me not to notice that I suddenly had 100 million credits. To say that I wouldn't notice that would be to admit that I am, in fact, a moron. To spend those credits willingly would be admission that I am okay with reaping the rewards of cheating.

Idk if I'm getting this right but i'll give it a shot.

You're saying that cheaters obviously increase the amount of credits they get by large amounts. Now Idk how anti-cheat policies work but has to do with numbers. 700.000.000 is way bigger than 7.000, it's easier to spot, imho.
Smart cheaters will increase credits per match by little numbers because all the attention is focused on big numbers and/or hackers/rocketglitchers.

[Beerfish]

Bravenu3 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...would assume [...] sounds like to me.

And those are acceptable grounds for harsh punishments in a game?

Those are the rules that are set out by BioWare.  Hey if it was me I would have a temp ban and confiscate items on the 1st offense but I'm not making up the rules and as the rules are outlines, yes that is reason for a ban and harsh punishment.  They have a very ironclad no cheating policy and that is the best way to not allow that line to creap backwards.

[Beerfish]

Bravenu3 wrote...

SimulatedSnowman wrote... I very seriously doubt that any cheaters are increasing the amount of credits they get by small amounts.

Don't give them ideas ;-)

SimulatedSnowman wrote... It would be impossible for me not to notice that I suddenly had 100 million credits. To say that I wouldn't notice that would be to admit that I am, in fact, a moron. To spend those credits willingly would be admission that I am okay with reaping the rewards of cheating.

I feel for you. Luckily I only save credits up to a few PSPs. But again, instead of BW fixing the underlying problems, us players have to deal with the consequences. Why should I have to keep track of my honestly earned credits?

Because they are STARING YOU IN THE FRIGGIN FACE each time you play the game.  The "I didn't know hgow many creds I had" is a very poor and unbelievable defense.

[steampunk1850]

The OP has stated he had 3-5 million all together. A different poster said the 100 million. And hurray! I was banned too. Yet I have not played MP since June 30th (major computer crash just got it back up and running in fact). So I guess I was banned for something between June 19th and June 30th. What really irrates me however is that during that time I was only playing with a few people and none of them have been banned. If they were not cheating/ benefiting from cheating i would like to know how the heck I was.

[Bravenu3]

Master Che wrote... You can switch from private to public after your buddies get on.

Didn't know that, thanks! I hop BW can track such changes in the lobby settings.

Master Che wrote... In the end, association is not proof of guilt, but it makes you a suspect nevertheless, right?  If you're with someone and they rob a bank, then unless you call the police and snitch your ass off you'll be arrested and questioned before they decide whether or not to charge you.

Yes, but here, the questioning part is not happening before the verdict and punishment, is it? This seems more like "Guilty as charged, no trial, punishment commences immediately".

[Bravenu3]

Beerfish wrote...Because they are STARING YOU IN THE FRIGGIN FACE each time you play the game.  The "I didn't know hgow many creds I had" is a very poor and unbelievable defense.

Yes it is. I just stated that I would like to have the game not be exploitable, so I don't have to worry about exploits.

[Silasqtx]

Beerfish wrote...
Those are the rules that are set out by BioWare.  Hey if it was me I would have a temp ban and confiscate items on the 1st offense but I'm not making up the rules and as the rules are outlines, yes that is reason for a ban and harsh punishment.  They have a very ironclad no cheating policy and that is the best way to not allow that line to creap backwards.

With permanent bans? That will ruin their income as time passes. This week they probably lost 1300+ potential buyers, some guilty, some not.

One of the points of this thread is to look for a compromise between harsh anti-cheat policy and customers.

@Beerfish

It's a poor excuse because it's the truth.

Modifié par Silasqtx, 18 juillet 2012 - 04:12 .

[Bryan Johnson]

We do also look at some peoples multiplayer manifests and if they have ever weapon ultra-rare at 10, including ones we released a day ago we will typically investigate that account. Not saying that is what is happening here but when this happens it is very obvious to all to see.

[upinya slayin]

Well technically your not perma banned.
Its not as harsh as one would think. a online pass is like 10 bucks i think so the punishment is basically 10$ fine and losing all the stuff you got by cheating and didn't earn anyway.

[SimulatedSnowman]

Bravenu3 wrote...

I feel for you. Luckily I only save credits up to a few PSPs. But again, instead of BW fixing the underlying problems, us players have to deal with the consequences. Why should I have to keep track of my honestly earned credits?

Again, this would be a valid point if the amount gained from cheating was something that could be easily overlooked. I guess a hundred million credits could be an amount that some players could overlook, but even players I've seen on the forum who post results of buying 60 PSPs at once after grinding it out... that's still only around 6 million credits. 100 million credits is way, way more than that, and easily noticed. 

I know that using a legal argument here is kind of ridiculous, but just to draw a parallel... Let's say you have 6 million dollars in your bank account (!!!!!!!). In a week, Ferrari is having a sale where you can buy their brand new cars. The day before the sale, you check your bank account and you now have 106 million dollars, though you can't recall working the equivalent amount of overtime to gain 100 million dollars. Are you suspicious? Or do you spend the money and hope that because Ferrari was having a sale, everyone would be okay with you spending this random money that you can't be bothered to keep track of?

[steampunk1850]

Well for me I literally downloaded the new DLC and within 5-10 mins I got an email saying i was banned. I didn't even have time to play the new DLC.

[zRz Tyr]

Bryan Johnson wrote...

We do also look at some peoples multiplayer manifests and if they have ever weapon ultra-rare at 10, including ones we released a day ago we will typically investigate that account. Not saying that is what is happening here but when this happens it is very obvious to all to see.

Well then i guess im green, since i seem to never get my ultra-rare weapons anywhere.....
Okay im exagerating, but still.

[upinya slayin]

Bravenu3 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...Because they are STARING YOU IN THE FRIGGIN FACE each time you play the game.  The "I didn't know hgow many creds I had" is a very poor and unbelievable defense.

Yes it is. I just stated that I would like to have the game not be exploitable, so I don't have to worry about exploits.

thats liek saying you'd rather have no way for people to kill each other so you wouldn't have to worry about being killed. its impossible to cover everything. We as a gaming community need to not take advanatge

[Si7ent Sigh]

Haha. That is all.

Rocket glitchers deserve it.

[Beerfish]

upinya slayin wrote...

Well technically your not perma banned.
Its not as harsh as one would think. a online pass is like 10 bucks i think so the punishment is basically 10$ fine and losing all the stuff you got by cheating and didn't earn anyway.

Yup, that is why we often see a big influx of low N7 players back into the game a week later with poor weapons but are actually pretty good experienced players.

[Silasqtx]

upinya slayin wrote...

Well technically your not perma banned.
Its not as harsh as one would think. a online pass is like 10 bucks i think so the punishment is basically 10$ fine and losing all the stuff you got by cheating and didn't earn anyway.

That's another thing. We PC users can't get another online pass, we have to buy another Me3 game.

[steampunk1850]

i would be willing to have all my items reset instead of this ban. I got it legally the first time quickly with grinding and I can do it again but having no access to multiplayer without at least being able to defend myself or see the evidence is upseting.