205 réponses à ce sujet

[Endorlf]

I must say that people's attachment to previously established characters make it more difficult for the fanbase to accept newcomers. I can imagine that it annoys people who see their fleshed out ME2 character get sidelined while new squadmates take the spotlight. It's an understandable sentiment.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

Really, because she was sexualized and then her spot takes up one that could go to a ME2 squaddy.


To each their own but I loved EDI. I don't *like* the sexy outfit but I simply never cared about sexed-up female characters and I can't bring myself to, so it makes 0 difference to me. I enjoyed her character-arc.

[Gigerstreak]

I loved EDI! I fist pumped when I got my collectors edition of the Artwork and saw her in there. I really enjoyed the idea of her taking over and using the assassin robot body. I never took her around in the "******" outfit and I found her attempts at romance to be endearing.

Frankly, I thought of her like a daughter and I saw how she could be a great companion to Joker. He probably didn't have many friends because he couldn't "play" which most likely led him to being pretty alone. She was there for him and I felt for his character too. When I found that she was made from the AI I destroyed on Luna I did Jaw Drop. It may be a sci-fi trope but Bioware did it well.

The reasons I love Mass Effect so much are because it is an amalgam of all of my favorite sci-fi things squished into one great story. EDI is my Number 5. I AM ALIVE!

I ended up picking Synth because I couldn't sacrifice "my child." They wanted her to be sexy and they played that up... but I looked past that at what she really was. When she was damaged in my EC (I always took her as a squad mate) and her voice warbled... I actually opened up to the EC! When she hugged Tali at the end... I felt like I could get past the starkid. It may sound cliche, but EDI and the Synth Voiceover of her made me love ME again!

She wasn't just the robot... she was the whole ship! And who didn't love the Normandy? I outright BEG for more DLC that has something, ANYTHING, to do with her. Outfits (That hair with individual follicles she was talking about?.. I mean, what if she could shift into looking like her human form?), more scenes, anything!

Modifié par Gigerstreak, 21 juillet 2012 - 04:55 .

[The_Crazy_Hand]

I don't think EDI is universally loathed, she has some detractors, but I've not noticed enough to see a huge hatebase for her.

[NedPepper]

chemiclord wrote...

TakedaMauro wrote...

That's the point, consequences.  You let some squadmates die in ME2? now you have to survive without their help in ME3. It adds a whole new level of replayability not only for ME3, but for ME2 also.

That would be true if it wasn't absurdly easy to get everyone out alive of the Collector Base.

I think everyone on this forum maybe.  I know someone playing right now and he rushed off to get that IFF right after the Collector Ship....and all I could think is....squaddies are going to die.  The casual gamer?  I'd be curious to see some data on it or dev input.

[AlanC9]

nedpepper wrote...
  I know someone playing right now and he rushed off to get that IFF right after the Collector Ship.

IIRC one of the devs said the game should have forced that. That's how I always play it myself.

Modifié par AlanC9, 21 juillet 2012 - 05:31 .

[The_Crazy_Hand]

AlanC9 wrote...

nedpepper wrote...
  I know someone playing right now and he rushed off to get that IFF right after the Collector Ship.

IIRC one of the devs said the game should have forced that. That's how I always play it myself.

I play it that way too, but it's so I can get Legion early.

[RadicalDisconnect]

JakeMacDon wrote...

EDI was designed to do one thing:  give Joker's girlfriend boobs and booty - and by that I mean the Normandy.  First they gave the ship a brain.  Then they gave the ship a port Joker could interface in a way that didn't burn anything off.

Then the hypersmart AI turns into "Tell me how to loooove, Shepard, your Mojo is the Mightiest."

"Uh... tell each other jokes...?"

People hate on Jack because she gets "redeemed" through Shep's man-dangler, but EDI is a "better" character because she's made a Real Girl by Joker's glass tubing?

Dafuq?  Uh.... no.

I've said it elsewhere:  it is an unremittingly stupid sci-fi cliche that all the robot has to do is learn to love and laugh and suddenly - magically, unscientificallimetaphysicalkaldociously, a "soul" drops from the Guff and they be made all real and brand new people.  

The idea that "souls" are so readily available - don't forget that if EDI and Legion have them, the Reapers certainly do - kinda devalues the "souls" we supposedly have, and makes us no different, so the Synth/Control end whinefest is without merit, and the Refusal end makes those choosers look even more like le supreme bag 'ledouche.

The notion of "souls" implies the idea of an "afterlife" and a "god" or "gods".  The Reapers negate the idea of just godlings - because their work is murder on a vast scale over millions of years - no intervention until now?  What was Gawd and his ilk waiting for - robots to get smart enough to have souls so s/he/it can give them rights and decide that death in the uncountable trillions was all worth it because said soulful 'bots are become bangable?  Or was it that Gawd just promised no more floods, and tried the Reapers for past and future sh!ts and giggly genocide?

The idea is beyond stupid.

We treat actual living creatures as disposable, and don't blink when we argue that some chassis with ski-slope tatas is suddenly worthy of all this consideration because it can emulate intelligence and put on a show?  Don't buy it, sorry, and I'm past tired of this in every damn sci-fi anything. 

(I'm also sick of giant spiders and wolves in every "open world" RPG. FFS! Giant mantids or centipedes would be a lovely change, no?  Sheesh.)

Personally, that's why I'm no fan of EDI.  She could have easily been left on the ship and a ME2 squadmate used in that space for mission-specific gameplay.  They sent Liara back to the ship so Garrus could join us, they could just as easily have done that on Grissom or Tuchanka or Sur'kesh.  I wouldn't have complained at all.  

"James/Ashley/Javik!  Coordinate anti-Cerberus efforts here!  Wrex/Kirrahe!  You're on!"  Wouldn't have bothered me at all.

Mobile Tittie-bot 5000 was completely unnecessary.  The "romance" could have been played out every time you visited Joker and gave you a reason to actually bother. It'd be a "spiritual" thing. They were doing fine before she got legs.  

Some of us are no longer 15 and have grown past eye-candy over actual content.

Oh my...

I'm not sure how much sense you made here. EDI never explicitly stated that she has a soul. I think you're confusing one AI with another. It is clear that EDI is already an individual in ME3, and no, her sole purpose is not to satisfy Joker because otherwise you wouldn't be able to discourage their relationship. 

EDI's humor is not due to Shepard's encouragement. She does it on her own accord, and possibly because of Joker. It's fine if her humor doesn't suit you; I'm not a big fan of it either.

If EDI's oversexualized body is the only thing you notice about her, then that's your problem. Yes, EDI's highly sexualized body is indeed very stupid, but as I said, to view her as nothing more than a sexbot when you have Miranda and Ashley and what not is quite the double standard, i.e. claiming she doesn't have a personality because she's a synthetic/sexbot.

For the record, I also think that her acquisition of a body isn't handled very well, but the concept isn't inherently bad. It's the execution that's sloppy, as I find nothing abhorrent about the concept.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but in a nutshell, you dislike EDI because you don't like the synthetics == alive theme in sci-fi?

Modifié par RadicalDisconnect, 21 juillet 2012 - 06:25 .

[Ski Mask Wei]

While I'm not crazy about what they did with EDI in ME3 I could've accepted it better if they didn't ruin Joker in the process. I mean the best pilot in the Alliance fleet is like one those weirdo guys that you see on those Nat Geo shows? You tellin' me blowin' up Sovereign can't get you some action? You tellin' me flying through the Omega 4 Relay and back can't get you some action? Joker should have an Asari freak at least. And the fact that other people cosign his behavior is ugh.

Bioware might have thought Joker gettin' with Fleshlight 3000 was funny and cool but to me it comes off as creepy and sad.

[Errationatus]

RadicalDisconnect wrote...

Oh my...

I'm not sure how much sense you made here. EDI never explicitly stated that she has a soul. I think you're confusing one AI with another. It is clear that EDI is already an individual in ME3, and no, her sole purpose is not to satisfy Joker because otherwise you wouldn't be able to discourage their relationship. 

 

The implication is that because EDI is smart,  self-aware - in machine terms - that she is automatically "alive", she has a "soul".  If Legion has one, EDI has one and the Reapers certainly do.  Of course, this is metaphysical nonsense, because there's not a shred of evidence that organics have "souls", so saying machines automatically acquire one because they can say "I think therefore..." is equally ludicrous.  And you don't discourage their relationship.  Shepard tells Joker to be "her friend first".  Shepard tells EDI she needs more information before rushing in. That is not discouragement, that's simply telling them to slow down.

 
EDI's humor is not due to Shepard's encouragement. She does it on her own accord, and possibly because of Joker. It's fine if her humor doesn't suit you; I'm not a big fan of it either.

 

I don't think I bashed the humour.  I personally don't find her character funny.  The "jokes" thing was Shepard lamely telling them that since both like humour, base the relationship on that, for starters.

 
If EDI's oversexualized body is the only thing you notice about her, then that's your problem. Yes, EDI's highly sexualized body is indeed very stupid, but as I said, to view her as nothing more than a sexbot when you have Miranda and Ashley and what not is quite the double standard, i.e. claiming she doesn't have a personality because she's a synthetic/sexbot.

 

Fortunately for my argument, I never claimed that she had no personality due to being a metal Real Doll.  Put EDI in a hijacked geth shell.  Is she still as interesting?  Would that relationship develop as quickly as it does?  Would Joker get as horny as he does for her eff'n mind?  Don't think so.  For the record, I'm no fan of Miranda or Ashley, and neither are all that appealing to me physically.  If I had to choose, I'd pick Ashley, because I'm tired of talking to Miranda's can. Given a broader choice, I'd pick Jack, Samara, Liara, Shiala, Gianna or Kasumi over either one in a frelling heartbeat.

Who decided Miranda had the "perfect" body - or anything - anyway?  Wasn't me.

 
For the record, I also think that her acquisition of a body isn't handled very well, but the concept isn't inherently bad. It's the execution that's sloppy, as I find nothing abhorrent about the concept.

 

No, making her an gynoid is no big deal.  There's a billion little over-sexualized girlbots out there in sci-fi - mostly in anime - and EDI is not even remotely original.  The concept is just utterly boring.  Joker got his cake and the chance to eat it too.  So much for the "purity" of their relationship.  It makes her desperate and him crass and juvenile. Honestly - a hypersmart AI and the object of her virginial synthetic lust is Captain Infantile Moreau? Puh-leeze.

 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in a nutshell, you dislike EDI because you don't like the synthetics == alive theme in sci-fi?

I don't dislike EDI, but I'm pretty tired of the "I am a robot that feeeeelssss, so I'm alive!" bull, yeah.  I don't buy the "supersmart machine = automatically alive" thing writers like to throw around. It's supposed to be some deep philosophical question, but its just tired nonsense.

Was Skynet alive?  Terminators?  Maria in Metropolis?  Astroboy?  Rosie The Robot?  The bot from Forbidden Planet and Lost in Space?  All those done-in 'puters Kirk put down?  Data?  Pinnochio when he was wooden?  KITT from Knight Rider?  A machine is a machine is a machine.  They can be smart, they may even be able to compute that they are machines ("self-awareness") but they are not, and will never be, alive.  

Was EDI just as "alive" without the body?  Would she be as defensible as an entity without the bodacious boobies?

I don't think so.

What exactly is the criteria to say a machine crosses that line?  Just because we build them to look and act like us doesn't make them us. It makes us more comfortable around them, and that's about it.  It's this "thing" humans have, it's the same in thinking that our cars can be cajoled into operating better, or that that rattle is because its tempermental and not poorly designed.  It's why we call ships "she" and give our pets sophisticated reasons for the things they do.  It's called "anthropomorphizing" - imbuing something with qualities it does not naturally possess. We as humans do it all the time, but it doesn't change reality.  

Reality makes its own rules, whether we like it or not.

[v TricKy v]

I have nothing about EDI but the body and the Joker romance were just unnecessary and weird.

[ScotGaymer]

People don't hate EDI.

They had what Bioware did to her; that is they hate that she got turned into a Miranda 2.0 Sexbot complete with ****** catsuits.

[v TricKy v]

FitScotGaymer wrote...

People don't hate EDI.

They had what Bioware did to her; that is they hate that she got turned into a Miranda 2.0 Sexbot complete with ****** catsuits.

Dont even take about that one. Dont know what Bioware thought

[Asharad Hett]

Garrus > EDI > Tali > Javik > Liara > Joker > Traynor > Cortez > Ashley > Chakwas > Kaiden > Allers > Vega

Modifié par Asharad Hett, 21 juillet 2012 - 12:47 .

[nhsknudsen]

I was getting used to EDI, then she walked out of that smoke cloud in EVAs body and started to behave like a number 6... I never trusted her after that.

[Asharad Hett]

nhsknudsen wrote...

I was getting used to EDI, then she walked out of that smoke cloud in EVAs body and started to behave like a number 6... I never trusted her after that.

I would have betrayed my species and murdered millions for just one day as Gaius Baltar.

[F4H bandicoot]

ME2 EDI was great. She was interesting, part of the team, but not in the sense of being a character that killed people, she just provided analysis and the little tid bits of comedy between her a Joker were hilarious.
ME3 sexbot EDI was stupid as far as I am concerned, there was no reason to give her a body, and if she did get a body, the one she got was stupidly over sexualised. I don't even see her in the same sexualised was a samara or miranda, hell, miranda isn't even that sexualised imo, and samara is sort of acceptable imo too.
EDI's camaltoe, massive boobs, and overall sexualisation does stink of trying to please teenage guys.
As a teenage guy, that annoys me. I don't need sone super sexualised character to make my day.

[nhsknudsen]

Asharad Hett wrote...

nhsknudsen wrote...

I was getting used to EDI, then she walked out of that smoke cloud in EVAs body and started to behave like a number 6... I never trusted her after that.

I would have betrayed my species and murdered millions for just one day as Gaius Baltar.

Well, would you trust it?

One thing is pleasure for pleasures sake, but trust is something entirely different.

[Asharad Hett]

nhsknudsen wrote...

Asharad Hett wrote...

nhsknudsen wrote...

I was getting used to EDI, then she walked out of that smoke cloud in EVAs body and started to behave like a number 6... I never trusted her after that.

I would have betrayed my species and murdered millions for just one day as Gaius Baltar.

Well, would you trust it?

One thing is pleasure for pleasures sake, but trust is something entirely different.

Not 6, no.

Getting back to Mass Effect.  My Shep and EDI have a trusting friendship.  One would risk termination to save the other.

I do have one play through where I was unfriendly toward EDI, and discourage her exploration of emotion and companionship.  It felt like I was creating a monster.   That particular Shep was definitely a monster. 

Modifié par Asharad Hett, 21 juillet 2012 - 01:09 .

[nhsknudsen]

We have terms then, savvy?

Asharad Hett wrote...

I do have one play through where I
was unfriendly toward EDI, and discourage her exploration of emotion and
companionship.  It felt like I was creating a monster.   That
particular Shep was definitely a monster. 

Heh my next planned playthrough from ME1 to ME3 (If can muster it knowing how it ends I'm planning on going full anti-AI sentiment and killing the Rachni because they are too different.

Just can't get myself past becoming a spectre in ME1 or even continuing my adept in ME2..

Modifié par nhsknudsen, 21 juillet 2012 - 01:12 .

[Asharad Hett]

v TricKy v wrote...

I have nothing about EDI but the body and the Joker romance were just unnecessary and weird.

I'm more comfortable with that, than I am the male homosexual characters.  Just saying.

[Asharad Hett]

nhsknudsen wrote...

Heh my next planned playthrough from ME1 to ME3 (If can muster it knowing how it ends I'm planning on going full anti-AI sentiment and killing the Rachni because they are too different.

Everyone needs one play-through as a jerk.  It becomes especially enjoyable when Javik joins the team.

Modifié par Asharad Hett, 21 juillet 2012 - 01:17 .

[Ryzaki]

I couldn't play ME3 as a renedouche not because it was too hard but because the forced friendships made him OOC.

[BuzzShepardN7]

1. She asks newb questions that she should know already after having watched everyone on the ship.
2. She steals an ME1/ME2 squad slot when she is perfectly fine as a ship computer.
3. She turns Joker into "Jeff" the roboperv.
4. That body belonged to one of my worst enemies. Even if it was actually hot, I would still not find it hot.

[shodiswe]

No hate here. No despising, might not be my favrite character though.. But she was ok, I liked Legion more.

Modifié par shodiswe, 21 juillet 2012 - 03:06 .