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Weapons Stats Sheet - Updated for All Balance Changes


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#76
Cyonan

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Creakazoid wrote...

Thanks for the input. So, are these assumptions correct?

1) This damage multiplier is a multiplicative modifier that is applied after weapon mods, gear and consumables. That is to say, it isn't added into the weapon mods and gear modifiers.
2) This multiplier does not affect the subsequent ammo power damage.

Those are what I currently use to calculate stats, but I dont know if they are entirely accurate.


1. Yes, this is correct.
2. Ammo powers work kind of weird. According to the damage formula, it's applied separately from actual weapon damage, and isn't subject to things like armour reduction. I'm not sure how they interact with modifiers, but I suspect that it is not changed by them. I can't say 100% for sure, though.

#77
BoomDynamite

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The Acolyte does 500% more damage to shields/barriers, not 300%.

#78
unclemonster

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Wow!!!

Thank you soo much!!! Awesome work!!!

#79
Guest_MastahDisastah_*

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Nice job! Really appreciated!
I've some problems with the reegar though, 200% multiplier doesn't seem to match ingame damage as I can one clip prime/banshee shields on gold (10-11k), with 66 max damage (82.5 with EB) that would require at least a 6-700% multiplier to do that with only 22 bullets.

#80
Cyonan

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MastahDisastah wrote...

Nice job! Really appreciated!
I've some problems with the reegar though, 200% multiplier doesn't seem to match ingame damage as I can one clip prime/banshee shields on gold (10-11k), with 66 max damage (82.5 with EB) that would require at least a 6-700% multiplier to do that with only 22 bullets.


The Reegar is special =P

I've done a bit of testing with it, and what I've found is that for every ammo that the Reegar consumes, it hits multiple times, almost as if it were actually a pellet based gun. A single shot hit an Assault Trooper 5 times(then killed it so I don't know if there should have been more), despite the fact that I only used up 1 ammo.

The gun also has a ramp up feature, which takes 0.75 seconds to fully ramp up at which point it starts using more ammo. I didn't get an exact number, but my testing showed that it's using 2.

If I use 5x pellets per ammo, +45% damage(20% passives, 25% EB, using this number because my testing used my Drell Adept with those numbers) and that the last 5 shots of the gun will consume 2 ammo, you get 16269 damage per clip to a shield or barrier or 8134.5 to health

That is actually a lot more closer to in-game experience than any numbers I pulled during my testing. I still feel as though the numbers I saw in-game were a little bit higher than what I just theorycrafted out, but it's possible my number of pellets are off.

Modifié par Cyonan, 08 août 2012 - 07:27 .


#81
Cyonan

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Updated for today's changes.

#82
brblx

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i still don't understand 'single clip DPS.' is it damage per second or isn't it? mag size is irrelevant to that, regardless of how fast you burn ammo. that's what the capacity and reload time stats are for. you could add 'damage per mag' or simply state how long a mag lasts if someone really needs that.

#83
Cyonan

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brblx wrote...

i still don't understand 'single clip DPS.' is it damage per second or isn't it? mag size is irrelevant to that, regardless of how fast you burn ammo. that's what the capacity and reload time stats are for. you could add 'damage per mag' or simply state how long a mag lasts if someone really needs that.


single clip(More commonly just called burst) DPS is how much damage per second it puts out by just firing off a full clip. It doesn't account for reloading.

There is also sustained DPS, which takes into account that eventually, you're going to need to reload your gun. That's not on the spreadsheet right now though.

#84
Meatiershower

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Great as usual, Cyonan. The PPR has a 4x damage modifier after 50 rounds, IIRC. Did not see that on the sheet.

One of the best player references in the entire community - thanks again.

#85
Cyonan

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Meatiershower wrote...

Great as usual, Cyonan. The PPR has a 4x damage modifier after 50 rounds, IIRC. Did not see that on the sheet.

One of the best player references in the entire community - thanks again.



The 4x modifier kicks in after 2 seconds(I put it in the "heat up time" section for the PPR), which isn't modified by RoF increases.

It's around 26 rounds before the modifier activates without any RoF increases.

#86
eltdown

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Cyonan, thanks for the update! Was just thinking yesterday that the older one hadn't been updated in a while.

I'm a little surprised that the arc pistol doesn't do increased shield damage, what with being an electrical weapon. And if those Talon DPS stats don't include the 1.5x multiplier I think that gun may see more use on my Justicar again.

#87
brblx

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Cyonan wrote...

brblx wrote...

i still don't understand 'single clip DPS.' is it damage per second or isn't it? mag size is irrelevant to that, regardless of how fast you burn ammo. that's what the capacity and reload time stats are for. you could add 'damage per mag' or simply state how long a mag lasts if someone really needs that.


single clip(More commonly just called burst) DPS is how much damage per second it puts out by just firing off a full clip. It doesn't account for reloading.

There is also sustained DPS, which takes into account that eventually, you're going to need to reload your gun. That's not on the spreadsheet right now though.


okay, i understand now. personally i would just call that 'DPS' with no qualifier, but i guess how i can see how others might be confused...it just kind of went the opposite way for me, i thought it was actually relative to mag capacity.

also thanks for the effort. i tend to go by the 'just use it and see if you like it' philosophy, but it's nice to have a concrete reference.

#88
Elecbender

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About that Reegar...

I was doing some Bronze testing with nothing boosting the Reegar's damage and my results were odd:

Sometimes one unit was doing at least 525 DMG which meant the shot hit the Assault Trooper 8 times, sometimes 2 or even more did the same amount, and sometimes I only took off 2 bars. I even got the OHK headshot with 1 unit of fire.

Conclusion: This weapon seems to have multiple "hitzones" but how many I'm not exactly sure. But this weapon is more powerful than most people realize.

#89
bd2eazy

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dope!!! this will come in handy since i cant use the spruced up manifest scripts.


thanxB)

#90
N7 Whiskey

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Thanks for they Cyo.  Wondered why there hadn't been an update for awhile.

#91
retic

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if its not much of a bother...

a) what weapons "innately" have armor piercing capabilities?

top of my head I recall the ff: has innate AP

javelin
widow (the big bang one? or both?)
typhoon
graal
gps

Did I miss anything else? does the wraith and evi also have innate AP?

B) supposing I equip a typhoon with an AP 5 mod; will the AP mod "override" the innate AP of the weapon? or will they stack? same question if I used AP ammo.

#92
LGear

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retic wrote...

if its not much of a bother...

a) what weapons "innately" have armor piercing capabilities?

top of my head I recall the ff: has innate AP

javelin
widow (the big bang one? or both?)
typhoon
graal
gps

Did I miss anything else? does the wraith and evi also have innate AP?

B) supposing I equip a typhoon with an AP 5 mod; will the AP mod "override" the innate AP of the weapon? or will they stack? same question if I used AP ammo.


1. The correct official term for what you're describing is actually armor "Penetration", aka the ability for the shot to pass through walls and physical cover. "Piercing" refers to the ability of weapons to negate the damage reduction on enemy armor.  This is to prevent confusion for later reference. 

The weapons with innate Penetration ability (with penetration distance numbers) include: 

- Widow (.50m)
- Black Widow  (.25m)
- Crusader (1m)
- Javelin (1m)
- Typhoon (.25m)

The Graal and GPS don't have innate penetration ability, rather their weapon behavior is what allows them to penetrate Guardian shields (accuracy for the former and splash for the latter). The Kishock has the ability to penetrate Guardian shields directly (i.e. you can hit the center of the shield and still damage the Guardian behind it), but it does not have the ability to penetrate other environmental cover. 

2. AP mods do stack yes. For example, if your weapon has 1 meter of penetration (like the Crusader or Javelin), and you add an AP mod to it, you now get around 2 meters of penetration, allowing you to shoot through walls that thick. Do keep in mind that for the 5 weapons listed above with innate penetration, they actually deal full damage at penetration; however, adding AP mods will override said mechanic, and so while adding an AP mod will allow you do penetrate further, you'll actually deal less damage doing so.  

Modifié par LGear, 09 août 2012 - 07:34 .


#93
The JoeMan

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Having the single player only weapons like the Valkyrie, Argus, Adas and Bloodpack SMG confuses the spreadsheet. We need to keep multiplayer info seperated from single player info. If those weapons ever make it to multiplayer they will be completely rebalanced anyway. They really need to be removed and a seperate sheet should be created with single player data. Both sheets should be clearly marked for clarity.

#94
LGear

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The JoeMan wrote...

Having the single player only weapons like the Valkyrie, Argus, Adas and Bloodpack SMG confuses the spreadsheet. We need to keep multiplayer info seperated from single player info. If those weapons ever make it to multiplayer they will be completely rebalanced anyway. They really need to be removed and a seperate sheet should be created with single player data. Both sheets should be clearly marked for clarity.


I agree with this actually. Since the weekly balance changes, weapons in singleplayer have completely different stats from their MP counterparts - as an example, the Falcon in SP is still the same fast-firing Falcon from launch. 

I'm all for a separate SP and MP weapons database, just so proper points of comparison can be made. 

#95
The JoeMan

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LGear wrote...

The JoeMan wrote...

Having the single player only weapons like the Valkyrie, Argus, Adas and Bloodpack SMG confuses the spreadsheet. We need to keep multiplayer info seperated from single player info. If those weapons ever make it to multiplayer they will be completely rebalanced anyway. They really need to be removed and a seperate sheet should be created with single player data. Both sheets should be clearly marked for clarity.


I agree with this actually. Since the weekly balance changes, weapons in singleplayer have completely different stats from their MP counterparts - as an example, the Falcon in SP is still the same fast-firing Falcon from launch. 

I'm all for a separate SP and MP weapons database, just so proper points of comparison can be made. 


Thanks.  I didn't want to come off like a douche bag because I appreciate the effort that's being put in but it's getting hard to decipher what weapons stats we are actually looking at. 

#96
retic

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LGear wrote...

text


Thanks for the clarifications. So I guess that means i'm better off modding my typhoon 1 with Extended barrel 5 and extended ammo 5. :)

#97
Cyonan

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The JoeMan wrote...

Having the single player only weapons like the Valkyrie, Argus, Adas and Bloodpack SMG confuses the spreadsheet. We need to keep multiplayer info seperated from single player info. If those weapons ever make it to multiplayer they will be completely rebalanced anyway. They really need to be removed and a seperate sheet should be created with single player data. Both sheets should be clearly marked for clarity.


I agree, and I was looking for a good way to note that certain guns aren't in certain modes. This seemed like the best option, especially since a lot of guns have significnatly changed since launch in MP.

There's now 2 new spreadsheets(one for normal and one for mobile with no images) for the single-player guns, with none of the the weekly balance changes applied to the stats.

You can select from the tabs at the top. Might change something else on the SP sheets to make it clearer it's the SP sheet if you aren't at the top.

#98
MikeSlackenerny

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It'll be lower on the priority list, but any chance we can also have a higher-resolution picture for the Reegar Carbine and Krysae??

Thanks again!

#99
blaze55555

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To see the kind of UI and tools you're dealing with, I've taken to editing a copy of the most recent updated version.

I've done the following:
docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AovrJmXi58nfdFBFdWtXRWVlQmxkYlJ1TlA1eHVReXc

a few things:
1. I first started by finding what seems to universally be called a "freeze" function and implemented it. Dunno why that term is used but for all intents and puroses, for data table programs it appears to be a solid standard word used for a given function I like which you may notice first: Dunno if this is necessary but I started by clicking the "B" for column "B" before I looked for the function as that's how it works in OpenOffice Spreadsheet; next, where I found it was under the "View" tab > Go to "Freeze Columns >" and click 1 column, or you can merge the columns 1 & 2 for the guns and freeze 2 columns (you'll have to add space between the stat names and guns) this allows the mod stats to also be frozen. That's it.
2. Next I noticed the 4/5 of the leftmost images reacted poorly, I suppose freezing that column made a hard edge which they could not cross, but were, as such, I merely moved them back into place.
3. I sought out all of those thick, pesky, stat-name columns, and cut&pasted the data following them over to the left until all of it was gone (as you don't use a universal column, say every 3 columns, for all guns, I had to do this manually, and unlike OOSpreadsheet, I could not highlight a Range and drag it with a mouseclick - I had to highlight a range, right-click > Cut, then find where I wanted the upper-left-most cell would end up, right-click in that cell, and click "paste." I did this the whole way across each weapon type until there was only the left-most column stating the names of the stats.
4. I believe my next step was shifting the images over to match the new positions of cells, however I did this simultaneously with 3.
5. I think the last thing I did was: I was a tad OCDically bothered by the fact that the row-coloring wasn't consistantly to the end of the column or to at least a specific column for all rows and all guns, so I merely went down the ~210 row line clicking each row number and clicking bg color > black/light blue (depending on the row I was deciding the color for)

I'm very appreciative of you retrieving this data, it's much-appreciated, and I hope I can help any format troubles/tediousnesses you have in the future, if you care to ask. I'm starting to get very intrigued with what one can do with some of these programs...

Edit: as google docs, though flushed out and awesome for a free online-office tools thingy, I find the UI less than perfect, so I have only so far edited sheet 1 for MP weapon stats with images.

Modifié par blaze55555, 20 août 2012 - 09:18 .


#100
peddroelm

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While testing the hipfire penalties for the various sniper rifles I've noticed my Valiant I does ~396.5 base damage ...


Will dump the test numbers here

Valiant I 317.2 base damage (according to cyonan updated damage table)

Same destroyer as for krysae test

Calculated health body shot scoped damage
317.2 * (1 + 0.25 + 0.3 + 0.275 + 0.04) = 591.578

Measured
900 - 161.0869 = 738.9131 Damage inflicted scoped ???
396.5 * (1 + 0.25 + 0.3 + 0.275 + 0.04) = 739.4725 this is much closer to the measured damage value... Either the table is wrong on Valiant or Valiant I is bugged to do Valiant X damage ...

900 - 530.5434 = 369.4566 Damage unscoped

738.9131 * 0.5 = 369.45655 50% hipfire penalty



---------
The Destroyer referenced

Extended Barrel 25% WD
DM 30% WD 35% rof
T5-V Battlesuit passive 27.5% WD
4% WD gear - densified ammunition I

Modifié par peddroelmz, 20 août 2012 - 10:01 .