454 réponses à ce sujet

[Cyonan]

blaze55555 wrote...

To see the kind of UI and tools you're dealing with, I've taken to editing a copy of the most recent updated version.

I'm very appreciative of you retrieving this data, it's much-appreciated, and I hope I can help any format troubles/tediousnesses you have in the future, if you care to ask. I'm starting to get very intrigued with what one can do with some of these programs...

Edit: as google docs, though flushed out and awesome for a free online-office tools thingy, I find the UI less than perfect, so I have only so far edited sheet 1 for MP weapon stats with images.

Yeah, Google Docs is nice, but it's very counter-intuitive at times, especially when dealing with images.

I'm still trying to figure out what to do with the nightmare of formatting that is my wave spawns spreadsheet.

peddroelmz wrote...

While testing the hipfire penalties for the various sniper rifles I've noticed my Valiant I does ~396.5 base damage

I remember them saying something about buffing all of the promotional N7 weapons before bringing them into MP, so this is probably where the numbers changed. Valiant is the only one that hasn't received damage buffs since then though, so I'll have to PM Eric to see if I can get the current live numbers.

[Stritt57]

Cyonan wrote...

Urdnot Trex wrote...

Can you calculate the dps of PPR at rank 1 for before charge up, after charge up, and combine them somehow? I wanna compare to the harrier.

Prothean Particle Rifle I:
Burst DPS before charge - 256.00
Burst DPS after charge - 1024.00
Average Burst DPS per "clip" - 802.13
Sustained DPS(Assuming that you stop firing at 10 rounds left) - 500.
One clip lasts 6.75 seconds. 2 without charge and 4.75 with.

Cyonan I think your numbers for the PPR I are slightly off.
The burst DPS are correct, but I don't agree with the average burst or your sustained burst. Assuming the damage and RoF numbers on your sheet are correct, as well as, the assumption that the RoF does not increase in "hot" mode; I was getting the following numbers...

Actual Damage per magazine (100rnds): 6144
Time to empty magazine: 7.5 seconds
Avg DPS (one full magazine 100rnds): 819.20

I calculated the actual damage per mag using the following equation.

(cT*cD) + (((M-(cT*rS))/rS)*hD)

cT = Charge Time = 2 seconds
cD = "Cold" DPS = 256.00
hD = "hot" DPS = cD * 4 = 1024.00 
M = Mag Size = 100rnds
rS = Rounds per second(rps) = 800rnds / 60sec = 13.3333

(cT*cD) = 2sec * 256 dmg = 512 dmg
((M-(cT*rS))/rs) = ((100rnds - (2sec*13.3333rps))/13.3333rps)= 73 rnds left / 13.3333 = 5.5 seconds of "hot" mode
 time of "hot" mode * hD = 5.5 * 1024 = 5632dmg

512 "cold" damage + 5632 "hot" damage = 6144

Total Time Firing = 7.5 seconds
Avg DPS = 6144 / 7.5 seconds = 819.2

Modifié par Stritt57, 20 août 2012 - 11:02 .

[megawug]

Cyonan, thanks for picking this up and taking over! Much appreciated!

[blaze55555]

OH! request not for myself:
1. in your main post, mind changing the link to the same link minus the &output=html thingy?
2. put in 4 more links linking people who click on them directly to the mobile MP, SP w/ Images, and mobile SP pages? If you're on the sheet and copy the URL, I do believe it should be different - at that point it should be as simple as C&P.

P.S. if you want me to, in the near future I'll try to take a look at your... enemy wave spawns? I'll read over your comment again after I submit.

[Cyonan]

Stritt57 wrote...
Cyonan I think your numbers for the PPR I are slightly off.
The burst DPS are correct, but I don't agree with the average burst or your sustained burst. Assuming the damage and RoF numbers on your sheet are correct, as well as, the assumption that the RoF does not increase in "hot" mode; I was getting the following numbers...

Actual Damage per magazine (100rnds): 6144
Time to empty magazine: 7.5 seconds
Avg DPS (one full magazine 100rnds): 819.20

I calculated the actual damage per mag using the following equation.

(cT*cD) + (((M-(cT*rS))/rS)*hD)

cT = Charge Time = 2 seconds
cD = "Cold" DPS = 256.00
hD = "hot" DPS = cD * 4 = 1024.00 
M = Mag Size = 100rnds
rS = Rounds per second(rps) = 800rnds / 60sec = 13.3333

(cT*cD) = 2sec * 256 dmg = 512 dmg
((M-(cT*rS))/rs) = ((100rnds - (2sec*13.3333rps))/13.3333rps)= 73 rnds left / 13.3333 = 5.5 seconds of "hot" mode
 time of "hot" mode * hD = 5.5 * 1024 = 5632dmg

512 "cold" damage + 5632 "hot" damage = 6144

Total Time Firing = 7.5 seconds
Avg DPS = 6144 / 7.5 seconds = 819.2

I was assuming that the player was stopping at 10 rounds left in the clip, since if you completely empty the clip, you suffer a much longer delay before the recharge begins. 10 seemed like a good number, since trying to time for 1 would be optimal, but most people will end up missing it and hitting 0 quite often.

[Cyonan]

Updated for today's changes.

Haven't played a match yet, but theorycrafting suggests that the Locust isn't that good yet. It should be better than the commons, but still on the lower half of the uncommons in terms of damage output. Weight and accuracy still really good, though.

Numbers say that Crusader has potential to have the damage output of the Revenant, with much better accuracy(and much more weight), but only if you have it at X which not a lot of people do.

[Merkit91]

So, what about Kishok? Damage multiplier for full charge was increased from 150% to 175%, so charged shot for Kishok X should do 1411.9 damage now, right?

Modifié par Merkit91, 21 août 2012 - 05:41 .

[Cyonan]

Merkit91 wrote...

So, what about Kishok? Damage multiplier for full charge was increased from 150% to 175%, so charged shot for Kishok X should do 1411.9 damage now, right?

Yeah it does 1129.45 - 1411.9 damage from I to X now fully charged.

Stat damage has been updated as well, Google Docs is just being really laggy right now for me =P

[Cyonan]

Cyonan wrote...

peddroelmz wrote...

While testing the hipfire penalties for the various sniper rifles I've noticed my Valiant I does ~396.5 base damage

I remember them saying something about buffing all of the promotional N7 weapons before bringing them into MP, so this is probably where the numbers changed. Valiant is the only one that hasn't received damage buffs since then though, so I'll have to PM Eric to see if I can get the current live numbers.

I got a response from Eric about this.

The Valiant does 396.2 - 515.5 damage. They buffed it a bit when they imported it into MP.

Since the other 3 N7 weapons have all recieved damage buffs, then their numbers are accurate.

[peddroelm]

Cyonan wrote...

peddroelmz wrote...

While testing the hipfire penalties for the various sniper rifles I've noticed my Valiant I does ~396.5 base damage

I got a response from Eric about this.

The Valiant does 396.2 - 515.5 damage. They buffed it a bit when they imported it into MP.

Since the other 3 N7 weapons have all recieved damage buffs, then their numbers are accurate.

Nice ...

Should you also add hipfire penalty for sniper rifles to the stats table ?

Mantis 35%
Viper 85%
Raptor 85%
Krysae 75%
Valiant 50%
Indra 50%
Javelin 50%
Widow 50%
Incisor 50%
Kishok Harpoon 100% - no hipfire penalty
Black Widow 50%

========
Also here is a thread with video (which you can wath frame by frame add see the damage inflicted per bullet) on PPR damage mechanics 

http://social.biowar.../index/13775208

Without rof increase 27 ammo to hit charged mode ..
When charged it gets the *4 damage multiplier (yet to test if this applies to ammo damage - I hope it does) BUT uses 2 ammo per 1 shot ...

Modifié par peddroelmz, 22 août 2012 - 04:14 .

[corlist]

The Raptor's listed DPS is slightly off. Its true ROF is 400, attributed to its minimum refire time of 0.15 sec. This has been tested in-game with a macro to be true.

[IrishDeath420]

Is their a way to show damage per clip (instead of DPS) on weapons that have increase in fire rate?

[blaze55555]

I'm blaze55555 and this thread and the original poster are my favorite on BSN.

[Misfiring]

I'm Misfiring and this is my favorite thread on the BSN.

[PeskySquirrel]

Cyonan, I was wondering if you could modify the spreadsheet to display the maximum dps for weapons that have variable rates of fire. All the information to calculate that is on the sheet but instead it simply says that the dps is variable. Maybe use a format along the following lines:

Max 600 (Variable, ROF increases during fire)

This would be much more informative. Thoughts?

[Cyonan]

IrishDeath420 wrote...

Is their a way to show damage per clip (instead of DPS) on weapons that have increase in fire rate?

I could look into adding it. Typhoon has its' own sheet because of how complicated it gets. I need to still update it, as we've been trying to figure out what the deal with the modifiers working/not working are.

corlist wrote...

The Raptor's listed DPS is slightly off. Its true ROF is 400, attributed to its minimum refire time of 0.15 sec. This has been tested in-game with a macro to be true.

Yeah, right now the DPS is just (Damage * RoF / 60). When I have some spare time I'll go through and calculate the numbers for guns with refire times that limit their RoF.

PeskySquirrel wrote...
Cyonan, I was wondering if you could modify the spreadsheet to display the maximum dps for weapons that have variable rates of fire. All the information to calculate that is on the sheet but instead it simply says that the dps is variable. Maybe use a format along the following lines:
Max 600 (Variable, ROF increases during fire)
This would be much more informative. Thoughts?

It probably would be, but unfortunately I would only be able to do that with the Typhoon. Both the Geth SMG and the Striker don't actually list their maximum rates of fire in the Coalesced file.
I'll be adding Sniper Rifle hipfire penalties to the sheet soon.

[Mgamerz]

I don't know if you're using a memory viewer to see how the Typhoon works, but if you're on PC you can edit coalesced to change the game speed modifier in the biodifficulty section. Only for letting the memory viewer keep up with the game though, not for cheating.

[Gamemako]

corlist wrote...

The Raptor's listed DPS is slightly off. Its true ROF is 400, attributed to its minimum refire time of 0.15 sec. This has been tested in-game with a macro to be true.

That's... peculiar. I found the exact opposite to be true back when I tested it, with the gun reaching just under 550RPM as a result of my testing. In fact, I tested all single-shot weapons with refire times and found the refire times to be fully nonfunctional. I will have to retest this.

//EDIT: Re-tried. 6 tests, about 300RPM each time. Should be 430 max on Gold due to timescaling. Strange to get a result that is exactly the opposite of what was previously observed.

Modifié par Gamemako, 24 août 2012 - 09:17 .

[corlist]

Gamemako wrote...

corlist wrote...

The Raptor's listed DPS is slightly off. Its true ROF is 400, attributed to its minimum refire time of 0.15 sec. This has been tested in-game with a macro to be true.

That's... peculiar. I found the exact opposite to be true back when I tested it, with the gun reaching just under 550RPM as a result of my testing. In fact, I tested all single-shot weapons with refire times and found the refire times to be fully nonfunctional. I will have to retest this.

//EDIT: Re-tried. 6 tests, about 300RPM each time. Should be 430 max on Gold due to timescaling. Strange to get a result that is exactly the opposite of what was previously observed.

Well, I have no idea whether the ROF was really 400. All I was sure about was that the ROF was not 550, as it very noticably shoots slower than the Locust. You do much better tests regarding ROF after all.

Modifié par corlist, 25 août 2012 - 01:53 .

[Gamemako]

corlist wrote...

Well, I have no idea whether the ROF was really 400. All I was sure about was that the ROF was not 550, as it very noticably shoots slower than the Locust. You do much better tests regarding ROF after all.

My previous testing suggested that the single-shot min refire times didn't actually affect ROF, but that is clearly not the case here. Moreover, I am not certain when min refire times trigger anymore. I had previously believed, and had good evidence that, they triggered at the end of the last fire delay (like reloads do). However, if I can fire at 300RPM with the Raptor, that cannot be the case because it would top out at 232 RPM (249 after accounting for timescaling). Thus, it either begins concurrently with the last round fired from the burst or begins with some delay after the last round that is less than the ROF delay. Never bothered setting up macros or anyting like that, though I could certainly do so. Probably will have to, given that 1 frame is the difference between 400RPM and 327RPM. <_<

[ZoM_Head]

The M8 level X does more DPS than the Particle Rifle at level X.

Really?

[Cyonan]

ZoM_Head wrote...

The M8 level X does more DPS than the Particle Rifle at level X.

Really?

That's before charge up.

The PPR's DPS before charge up is pretty much non existant.

After you hit the charge, it's 1024 - 1376.

[ZoM_Head]

Cyonan wrote...

ZoM_Head wrote...

The M8 level X does more DPS than the Particle Rifle at level X.

Really?

That's before charge up.

The PPR's DPS before charge up is pretty much non existant.

After you hit the charge, it's 1024 - 1376.

If you add the limited range of the PR, the M8 is better. More damage vs charge up, no charge up and "unlimited" range.

Depends on how you play i guess.

[Cyonan]

Sniper Rifle hipfire damages have been added to the sheet(Thanks to Peddroelmz for getting the numbers).

I'm working on getting in multi-clip(Sustained) DPS numbers in, once I find formatting that I'm happy with for it.

[Cyonan]

Updated to add in multi-clip(sustained) DPS values. I decided on adding a border to the top/bottom to break up the mess of numbers it created. Not completely sold on the idea yet.

These numbers make certain assumptions that you just need to make in theorycrafting. Among these assumptions are that the player is a computer that can time everything absolutely perfectly. Human element means that what you get in game will be different than what is listed on this sheet. This is merely the maximum potential(before consumables, abilities, and passives of course) of the weapons.

The numbers are there for the sake of data, and to provide a better understanding of the weapons. They aren't meant to tell you how to build your character, and certainly not so you can go create a thread about "OMG Piranha has best sustained dps in game, nerf!"(Though I suspect it's going to happen anyway, specially now that I said that =P).

A few guns have issues with calculating sustained DPS values right now. Mainly the ones with variable rates of fire as we don't know the max RoF for the Striker/Geth SMG, and the Typhoon is buggy at best right now. Reegar also has some hidden things that massively inflate its' damage.

In the interest of not having horribly cluttered numbers all charged based weapons assume that you are not charging the gun and just spamming the trigger, except in the cases where you must charge(Such as the Acolyte pistol)

Also, the PPR's no reload cancel numbers are if you take the clip to 0, while the reload cancel numbers are if you take the clip to 1, and don't suffer the full 5 second delay for emptying the clip.