20 réponses à ce sujet

[tehturian]

 Technically he is a grey warden isn't he?

Modifié par tehturian, 23 juillet 2012 - 01:40 .

[Fauxnormal]

Ohhhh, people think they're clever.

[transmutable]

I'd still rather sacrifice myself than my dog.

[TobiTobsen]

PETA would've invaded Ferelden if you'd send Dog to die in your place.

[jillabender]

Hehe… that is an interesting question! But no, I don't think the dog could have made the Ultimate Sacrifice, even though he did survive swallowing darkspawn blood.

The Joining is what makes someone a Grey Warden, and there's a bit more involved in the Joining than just drinking darkspawn blood – Alistair states at one point that it also requires Lyrium and magical preparation. For example, Ruck isn't a Grey Warden, even though he's been drinking darkspawn blood. And Riordan definitely makes it sound as though only a Grey Warden can permanently slay the Archdemon, not just anyone who's survived drinking darkspawn blood.

That aside, I don't think I could ever bring myself to sacrifice poor Rex!

Modifié par jillabender, 23 juillet 2012 - 06:03 .

[Blazomancer]

Only if your mabari were barkspawn. Probably. Hmm.

[Remanentmoss01]

did Riordan not say that the darkspawn blood that a warden drank had to be mixed with the blood of the last Archdemon killed then it went through some magical ritual and only then the recruit drank it and became a warden

[TEWR]

Not quite. To become a Grey Warden, you have to drink some potent tainted blood. Just having dog gnawing on a Hurlock's face and drinking its blood doesn't carry with it enough potency to really make one a Grey Warden.

Now, if you found a very powerful Darkspawn and ate him, that might work. But otherwise, he'd need to drink the Archdemon's blood.

At least, that's how it works for humanity. It's never really discussed in detail if it works differently for Mabari, though the comments made by the Ash Warriors and the Kennel Master -- as well as the presence of Hafter the Hound in the Calling -- seem to point to it being different and that they should be Grey Wardens.

I dunno. Theoretically, yes. But... I doubt a hound's teeth could pierce dragonskin to land the killing blow.

[thats1evildude]

There was a dog in The Calling who was implied to have gone through the Joining.

The Warden's Dog was not a Grey Warden. He had merely become resistant to the taint.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 23 juillet 2012 - 11:07 .

[Mike3207]

Duncan could have given him the Joining formula in a dish when he had custody of him. I notice Dog gets the warrior talents after spending time with Duncan.

[Face of Evil]

That's just Duncan's awesomeness rubbing off.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

I thought that merely being Tainted and keeping your soul was what empowered you to kill an Archdemon. Or is the Joining necessary to look sufficiently like a darkspawn for the task?

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 29 novembre 2013 - 10:44 .

[Ferretinabun]

I'm no Lore Keeper, but in my head, a Grey Warden taints themself by drinking Darkspawn blood, but the other juju magic in the joining ritual merely serves to make sure the taint's degenerative effects take hold only very, very slowly - and possibly wards off some other, lesser effects of it too.

I suspect the Taint is not taking hold in Dog at all - slowly or otherwise. I think he's just immune. And therefore not a Grey Warden.

[MisterJB]

Or maybe dogs just don't have souls. Riordan did say what caused the Archdemon to die was fighting with the Warden's soul.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

You've clearly never had a dog.

[MisterJB]

I have a dog rigth now. And, if you were to ask me whether I believe I have any more of a soul than he does, I'd answer you that I don't.
But it's commonly accept by religious people that humans have souls and animals don't. So, maybe the reason Dog can't make the sacrifice is because, like the Darkspawn, he is a soulless vessel the Archdemon could inhabit.

Of course, that raises a few questions. In DAA, we learned that Darkspawn can gain sentience but, it's also true that the Archdemon can transfer his "essence" to a Spawn and be reborn.
Does that mean the Darkspawn gains a soul after drinking Grey Warden blood? Could an Awakened Darkspawn kill the Archdemon?
We also know that souls do exist in the DA universe. We've even talked to a few.

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

The very thought breaks my heart.

[Silvershroud]

MisterJB wrote...
Does that mean the Darkspawn gains a soul after drinking Grey Warden blood? Could an Awakened Darkspawn kill the Archdemon?

Well, I did kind of get the impression that they were essentially Darkspawn wardens, so I wouldn't be at all suprised if they could.

Also, to the people who said that the dog would have to drink the blood of a very powerful darkspawn in order to kill the Archdemon, remember, Riordan said they used the blood of an Archdemon.  In order to kill the Archdemon, the dog would probably end up swallowing some of it's blood anyways.

The real question in my opinion would be whether or not the lyrium and stuff that is involved in the joining is necessary for killing the Archdemon, or if it just helps to slow the taint in the warden.

[Corker]

MisterJB wrote...
Of course, that raises a few questions. In DAA, we learned that Darkspawn can gain sentience but, it's also true that the Archdemon can transfer his "essence" to a Spawn and be reborn.
Does that mean the Darkspawn gains a soul after drinking Grey Warden blood? Could an Awakened Darkspawn kill the Archdemon?

Western medieval mysticism (and, I think, theology) separates the ability to think from the possession of a soul.  (That's the whole 'body/mind/spirit' thing.)  So a human infant, or a brain-dead person in a coma, neither of whom exhibit much intelligence, are both considered to be ensoulled.  A dog, which can exhibit some intelligence and a great deal of emotion, may not be.

I think it's sort of fascinating, and very much a thing of dark fantasy, to consider that darkspawn aren't ensoulled, ever, even if they gain sapience.  How terrible would it be to have a mind, and to know that you lacked a soul?

But I don't think there's a canonical pronoucement on whether or not the Awakened gain souls.

[azerSheppard]

tehturian wrote...

 Technically he is a grey warden isn't he?

The dog always makes the sacrifice in my playthrough. Logan that is.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

You know, he might take that as a compliment.