22 réponses à ce sujet

[Naughty Bear]

I cant remember too much as it has been a long time since i played DA2 but i know that mage circles are up in flames and mages are escaping/fighting?

Does anyone think that if chosen to play as a mage in DA3, it would be a hedge mage? Someone on the run from the circle?

I asked this as i like the idea of being on the run from templars and i hope the option is in.

[Fox In The Box]

I think a hedge mage is someone who was never in the Circle to begin with, though I'm not sure. At any rate, if the ending of DA2 and Asunder is to be believed, the mage class in DA3 won't be a Circle mage since the Circle doesn't exist anymore. So, in short; I think you'll get the chance to be on the run from the templars.

Modifié par Fox In The Box, 24 juillet 2012 - 07:58 .

[Naughty Bear]

Ah yeah, i was wondering if i got that wrong. There is another name for mages who escaped from the circle.

I liked the idea in Dragon Age 2, just strange you can use blood magic and no-one notices a thing.

[thats1evildude]

Asunder goes into a bit of detail about this. "Hedge mage" is actually a derogatory term for people who show a degree of magical ability but received only a little or no proper training. In most cases, they don't know how to cast spells but their magic manifests in other ways. Cole is theorized to be a hedge mage (which doesn't turn out to be true, but that's beside the point).

There's a deleted Codex entry detailed on the Wiki that describes another such unfortunate mage:

Saramish was a witch who lived in the Planasene Forest about a hundred years ago. She possessed only a modicum of magical power—enough to draw the templars' attention, but not nearly enough to defend herself from them. As the templars closed in on her, Saramish worked a spell of transformation. No one knows what her intentions were, but the outcome could not have been to her liking. All that was left of Saramish when her spell was complete was a mighty hedge, almost as tall as a man.

The hedge was uprooted and taken to the College of Enchanters in Cumberland, where the enchanters declared it harmless, and not too different from a common hawthorn. Since hawthorn bushes do not have the capacity for thought, it was decided that it would be impossible for Saramish to return to her true form. Out of pity for the poor woman, the "hedge witch" was planted outside the college.

It was later uprooted and sold to a private collector of curios, as the college's groundskeepers could no longer maintain the "hedge witch"—for while it required very little water or sunlight, the bush's aggressive growth made constant trimming a necessity.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 24 juillet 2012 - 08:17 .

[King Cousland]

OP, I think the word you're looking for is "apostate" 

Regarding the main point of the thread, I think it'd be quite likely that we'll play as an apostate, since I expect Orlais will be where the fighting is thickest. Even if we were a Circle mage we still technically be an apostate since the Circles are in rebellion, though I suppose I would like the option to play as a Chantry loyalist. 

Regarding your point about use of blood magic in DAII, BioWare's confirmed that specializations will have a greater impact in the future, so you won't be able to use stuff like blood magic without people reacting. 

[Arthur Cousland]

While mage Hawke was an apostate, the Kirkwall tempars never tried to capture them, nor did they even notice that they were a mage at all in most cases. It would be nice in DA3, if a mage character had to actually fight off the templar pursuit, and that the templars actually used templar talents like holy smite, silence and etc. My Origins arcane warrior was greatly annoyed everytime templars used cleanse area.

[LobselVith8]

According to the codex on apostates, hedge witches are "those with magical ability out in the hinterlands who follow a different magical tradition than our own."

If Dragon Age III provides the opportunity to be a mage, it would make sense to be able to be one of the rogue mages. Whether resources will be devoted to providing a proper mage POV and having characters acknowledge that your protagonist is a mage is another thing entirely.

[Naughty Bear]

harkness72 wrote...

OP, I think the word you're looking for is "apostate" 

Regarding the main point of the thread, I think it'd be quite likely that we'll play as an apostate, since I expect Orlais will be where the fighting is thickest. Even if we were a Circle mage we still technically be an apostate since the Circles are in rebellion, though I suppose I would like the option to play as a Chantry loyalist. 

Regarding your point about use of blood magic in DAII, BioWare's confirmed that specializations will have a greater impact in the future, so you won't be able to use stuff like blood magic without people reacting. 

 

That's the one, apostate! I really want to play as them, love mages.

[Cyberarmy]

Or as an Elven Keeper maybe even a Tevinter Blood Mage.

Edit: Heck even as a spirit/demon "possessed" mage who strugles to gain control.

Modifié par Cyberarmy, 25 juillet 2012 - 07:19 .

[Naughty Bear]

Cyberarmy wrote...

Or as an Elven Keeper maybe even a Tevinter Blood Mage.

Edit: Heck even as a spirit/demon "possessed" mage who strugles to gain control.

Not sure about a spirit/demon possessed Keeper and Tevinter blood Mage would be great. It's boring that the only origin is a circle mage. Why not a apostate prince origin?

[LobselVith8]

Naughty Bear wrote...

Why not a apostate prince origin?

Mages can't legally inherit a title in Andrastian society. While you could have a situation like Connor, it could end the same way once the protagonist was revealed to be a mage. Andrastian society isn't exactly tolerant of people with magical abilities.

[thats1evildude]

Technically speaking, all mages are now apostates.

[Naughty Bear]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Naughty Bear wrote...

Why not a apostate prince origin?

Mages can't legally inherit a title in Andrastian society. While you could have a situation like Connor, it could end the same way once the protagonist was revealed to be a mage. Andrastian society isn't exactly tolerant of people with magical abilities.

That was what i meant.

[LobselVith8]

Naughty Bear wrote...

That was what i meant.

What kind of apostate prince story would you like to see developed? One where he lost everything and had to adjust, or where he tried to hold onto what he had in vain? Or something entirely different?

[Silfren]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Naughty Bear wrote...

That was what i meant.

What kind of apostate prince story would you like to see developed? One where he lost everything and had to adjust, or where he tried to hold onto what he had in vain? Or something entirely different?

Personally, I'd be interested in seeing the story of an apostate prince (or any sort of noble) playing out in the mage/templar conflict.  Awakening's baronness was a noblewoman from Orlais, right?  Do we know how it was that she wasn't in the Circle?  Did she hide her abilties or pay off the right people?  Did she simply figure that Orlais's occupation of Ferelden gave her the opportunity to hide from the Orlesian Chantry while disregarding the Ferelden one?

Connor's own story may not be that unusual.  It may be that it's not uncommon for wealthy Orlesian families to use their money to avoid the Circle.  We already know that one family used its wealth to actually build an opulent Circle so that its daughter could live according to her assumed comfort.  Perhaps other families use their money and influence to keep mage scions out of the Chantry's notice.  The new war would provide a chance to push such a person into the spotlight.  We'd have the chance to see life from their perspective, of always having lived free, only to now be on the run. 

I wonder also how societies with free mages will be affected.  It seems that so far, the Chasind and Dalish and Rivaini have been mostly left alone by the Chantry.  At least we hear no reports of ongoing attempts to force Chantry law onto them.  But with templars under the Lord Seeker now basically running amok, they're probably going to harrass those previously mostly ignored societies. 

They may not qualify as mage princes, but I'd also enjoy seeing the conflict through the perspective of a Chasind.  Say, a chieftain who is a mage, who now finds not only her own freedom threatened but that of her people, too, since the entire society would be at risk. 

The mages who've been hiding their whole lives, whether they've managed to mostly live free, like Morrigan, or those who've been on the run constantly, like Hawke's family, have interesting perspectives, but so too do those who've always lived free among their own people, even in positions of respect and prestige. 

[Maclimes]

Silfren wrote...

I wonder also how societies with free mages will be affected.  It seems that so far, the Chasind and Dalish and Rivaini have been mostly left alone by the Chantry.  At least we hear no reports of ongoing attempts to force Chantry law onto them.  But with templars under the Lord Seeker now basically running amok, they're probably going to harrass those previously mostly ignored societies. 

Actually, there was at least one Circle in Rivain. But at the start of the Mage/Templar war (shortly after the events of DA2), the Templars there carried out the Rite of Annulment. NOW there's no circle in Rivain. 

[Silfren]

Maclimes wrote...

Silfren wrote...

I wonder also how societies with free mages will be affected.  It seems that so far, the Chasind and Dalish and Rivaini have been mostly left alone by the Chantry.  At least we hear no reports of ongoing attempts to force Chantry law onto them.  But with templars under the Lord Seeker now basically running amok, they're probably going to harrass those previously mostly ignored societies. 

Actually, there was at least one Circle in Rivain. But at the start of the Mage/Templar war (shortly after the events of DA2), the Templars there carried out the Rite of Annulment. NOW there's no circle in Rivain. 

Annulled or not, there are free mages in Rivain if the codices are to be believed.  I had to dig out my copy of Asunder and re-read the relevant bit.  I'd forgotten that bit about the Rivaini Circle.  Although keep in mind this IS the no spoiler forum.

Anyway, yes, we do know that there is lore stating that Rivain has a Circle of Magi.  However, we also have a codex that states Rivain is hostile to Chantry influence, to the extent that Andrastianism never got much of a foothold there, and that this is specifically because Chantry law concerning mages violates centuries of Rivaini tradition.  So it does rather stand to reason that the Circle of Rivain was significantly different from Circles elsewhere in Thedas.  

(We also have a codex discussing the fact that many Rivaini peoples are strident followers of the Qun.  Given this clash between an extremist anti-mage culture and a very accepting pro-mage culture, I'd love to see what the resultant mash-up of local tradition looks like.  It stands to reason that Qunari (all the followers, not just Kossith) would be more tolerant than Qunari elsewhere, and that any Andrastians that do happen to be in the area are far more tolerant toward mages than elsewhere. 

Modifié par Silfren, 26 juillet 2012 - 10:28 .

[Chiramu]

A "hedge mage" (going from what other people described it to be...) would be quite fun to play a story through with . Especially in terms of levelling, it would make more sense to start out as a mage who knows very little and end up at the end of the game with a more competent mage .
Would be more fun than starting out with a character who's already competent and strong (the way Hawke was written, as with Felicia Day's character and the Dawn of the Seeker character), if you're already strong there's not as much for you to learn throughout your story.

Modifié par Chiramu, 26 juillet 2012 - 10:59 .

[LinksOcarina]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Naughty Bear wrote...

Why not a apostate prince origin?

Mages can't legally inherit a title in Andrastian society. While you could have a situation like Connor, it could end the same way once the protagonist was revealed to be a mage. Andrastian society isn't exactly tolerant of people with magical abilities.

Well, you got Tevinter...who I doubt will be sitting quiet during this entire mage uprising. 

[LobselVith8]

Chiramu wrote...

A "hedge mage" (going from what other people described it to be...) would be quite fun to play a story through with . Especially in terms of levelling, it would make more sense to start out as a mage who knows very little and end up at the end of the game with a more competent mage .
Would be more fun than starting out with a character who's already competent and strong (the way Hawke was written, as with Felicia Day's character and the Dawn of the Seeker character), if you're already strong there's not as much for you to learn throughout your story.

A hedge mage wouldn't necessarily be inexperienced, as the label also applies to mages outside the Circle who are taught non-Circle magic (like the shape-shifting abilities Morrigan employs, as she mentions some pass down their knowledge for generations). It could be interesting to see a hedge mage who uses radically different forms of magic than the mages we have seen so far.

[Maclimes]

Silfren wrote...

Annulled or not, there are free mages in Rivain if the codices are to be believed.  I had to dig out my copy of Asunder and re-read the relevant bit.  I'd forgotten that bit about the Rivaini Circle.  Although keep in mind this IS the no spoiler forum.

Anyway, yes, we do know that there is lore stating that Rivain has a Circle of Magi.  However, we also have a codex that states Rivain is hostile to Chantry influence, to the extent that Andrastianism never got much of a foothold there, and that this is specifically because Chantry law concerning mages violates centuries of Rivaini tradition.  So it does rather stand to reason that the Circle of Rivain was significantly different from Circles elsewhere in Thedas.  

(We also have a codex discussing the fact that many Rivaini peoples are strident followers of the Qun.  Given this clash between an extremist anti-mage culture and a very accepting pro-mage culture, I'd love to see what the resultant mash-up of local tradition looks like.  It stands to reason that Qunari (all the followers, not just Kossith) would be more tolerant than Qunari elsewhere, and that any Andrastians that do happen to be in the area are far more tolerant toward mages than elsewhere. 

If I had to draw a conclusion based on what we know, I'd guess Rivain was in the following situation:

The Chantry has some influence and adherents in Rivain, mostly in the Southern regions (such as around Dairsmuid). But, given that the majority of Rivaini have their own independent religion, as well as allowing free mages, the order of Templar in Dairsmuid would have far less local support than most places, as the citizens often help their own local mages to escape Templar scrutiny. This feeling of distrust, alienation, and simple "unwelcome" would cause the Templar to be more paranoid than most, not to mention simple distance from their support and allies in Val Royeaux. On the flipside, the mages in the Circle there would be more bitter (or at least conflicted) than in most places, since there are so many free mages running around.

When word of what happened at Kirkwall reached Dairsmuid, the mages were inspired and rebelled. The already paranoid and distrusting Templar reacted quickly and harshly, carrying out the act of Annulment without hesitation.

******

Prior to the annulment, the free mages of Rivain, according to their own religious and social culture, must be feeling a lot of pressure. From the south in  Dairsmuid, the Chantry preaches that mages should be kept confined and controlled by their militant order. From the north in Kont-arr, the Qunari would be pressing in as well, also determined to keep mages under lock and key. 

I would not be surprised to learn that the free mages of Rivain, being squeezed from both sides by oppressive movements, would be more desperate than most, and turn to demons and blood magic at a higher rate than anywhere else. Other than Kirkwall, that is, (going by DA2) where every other mage is a blood mage.

******

After the annulment, I'm not sure. I suspect the Templar and Chantry would have been set upon by the angry residents (and free mages) from the local areas, and been driven out. Could be a plot point in DA3.