254 réponses à ce sujet

[mrwizeguy]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

Why do you think headshots were removed on the big creatures?

Let me answer that for you Mr.Holmes.
They were removed so the weapons were made equipment dependant .

Like so many changes. Do i need to explain this in detail?

I have a request Mr.Holmes , please spare 2 min of your valuable time and after looking at my manifest.
Can you please recomend me a build that would benefit from racial evolution 5b ?

[Jon Phoenix]

For the record I think Bosses "should" have weak points.

However, simple headshots are not the way to implement it.

The damage spike for the Atlas is probably the best way to implement it. I believe this achieved by blowing armored parts off of the knees. But the problem is that the armored parts have damage reduction (at the moment). It might be better that blowing off the parts expose the weak points, which then get a damage bonus.

For example, for the Atlas, have the wind shield crack after concentrated piercing damage. After the wind shield is cracked then you can get bonus damage.

For the Banshee maybe have it animation based. Maybe have an animation (perhaps after a stagger) where you get bonus damage for a short duration. Couple it with her immunity, so it's cyclical.

The Prime, well maybe reduce it's shields, but increase the frequency of shield restore (Drone based, like the Engineer/Atlas).

Just some ideas to make the boss fights more entertaining.

[soultaker65]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

What do you folks think would be a fair multiplier?

2X on Ravager, Brute, Banshee and Geth Prime

1.5X on Atlas

The normal multiplier on Phantoms

[Matiasvidi]

Why are peeps acting like douches when a dev is trying to help with this amazingly broken yet funny as hell game? Spoiled playerbase is spoiled.

[Madeline Lightning]

The devs just like to ruin the game. It's like they want people to be unhappy.

[defleshing]

a good reason no.

[Xaijin]

Boss monsters should not be susceptible to stun or pain, otherwise there's not much point in having a boss monster in the first place.

[Mindlog]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

What do you folks think would be a fair multiplier?

for what it's worth

In my view bringing back headshots on bosses will inevitably lead to bosses getting more health and armor. I disagreed with the decision at first, but it was the right call. Honestly, even on Platinum bosses die way too fast. The best idea I ever came across for boss headshots was to simply re-introduce the stagger animation.

I don't know how hard that would be to implement. Perhaps some sort of force modifier could be applied to headshots?

Xaijin wrote...

Boss monsters should not be susceptible to
stun or pain, otherwise there's not much point in having a boss monster
in the first place.

I can understand that point of view. I'm fine with the current setup, but with the great number of bosses on certain difficulties I don't believe a skilled shot preventing a sync-kill is a bad thing.

Right now I can prevent boss sync-kills almost entirely by other means.

Modifié par Mindlog, 25 juillet 2012 - 05:36 .

[thegamefreek78648]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

Why do you think headshots were removed on the big creatures?

Because it makes no sense for boss mobs to be taken out FASTER than most of the troops around it.

[Havocmasta]

Perhaps adjusting enemy base health and keeping the multiplier the way it is may be an option? Considering Primes and Atlases move relatively slow, they would obtain the largest health boost, where Banshees would become a "weaker" fast attack cover-breaker. I do think that powers need to affect them while their barriers are down, that change was... unkind. Otherwise, taking into consideration that they are the fastest enemy in the game (I think), they should be dangerous, but ultimately weak to sustained weapons and powers. As it stands, they are one of two units that simply laugh in the face of caster classes and promptly bend over anything that can't roll. And the Phantom doesn't even have armor!

TL;DR: Take back boss headshots, increase base health to compensate, banshees do everything mean.

[Kyerea]

Mindlog wrote...

Brenon Holmes wrote...

What do you folks think would be a fair multiplier?

for what it's worth

In my view bringing back headshots on bosses will inevitably lead to bosses getting more health and armor. I disagreed with the decision at first, but it was the right call. Honestly, even on Platinum bosses die way too fast. The best idea I ever came across for boss headshots was to simply re-introduce the stagger animation.

I don't know how hard that would be to implement. Perhaps some sort of force modifier could be applied to headshots?

Xaijin wrote...

Boss monsters should not be susceptible to
stun or pain, otherwise there's not much point in having a boss monster
in the first place.

I can understand that point of view. I'm fine with the current setup, but with the great number of bosses on certain difficulties I don't believe a skilled shot preventing a sync-kill is a bad thing.

Right now I can prevent boss sync-kills almost entirely by other means.

That's already happened post-headshot removal. Two times actually.

[Pete Zahut]

Since they took off headshot damage, I haven't touched my snipers or specced into damage for my infiltrators. There was nothing more fun than blowing off a prime head with my indra, and now I don't even use it.

[przemko877]

It would be cool to have different multiplayers for different layers of health, for example: 3x for normal health and 2x for armor, but if it's impossible 2x is decent enough for every mob, including bosses.

[ArtGerhardt]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

soldo9149 wrote...

So it would take longer for use to kill them.

Sort of... it's because they're (generally) easier to headshot and we had no way of controlling the headshot multilplier ona per-creature basis. And the headshot multiplier is goofy (3.5x or something like that?), intentionally - because it's normally somewhat harder to do (on a normal creature).

That said, I think it's something we're interested in - as headshots are always nice... if it was to be done, it would probably have to be implemented in such a way as to give us control over the multiplier per creature though.

What do you folks think would be a fair multiplier?

I have an idea, but it probably won't be an easy fix.

Banshee's and brutes should get some headshot multiplyer. How much? Not so much that it makes it easy. My first idea would be to increase the total armor/barriers but bring back the headshot multiplyer, but that would make powers and non-heatshotting weapons useless.  So this is my best solution:

Banshee's and brutes should get some headshot multiplyer. Not much though, since they have a lot of armor built up on their faces. Brutes should only get a 1.5x multiplyer to the front of the face, maybe 2x if shot in the back of the head, which is hard to do. Same idea for the banshees but less damge inflicted to the back of the head, since it's easier to get around behind them and get sights on their head.

Primes get pretty much no headshot mulitplyer. They aren't organic, and they don't have brains, their heads don't do much other than support their "eyes." Headshots don't do extra damage, but a powerful headshot should temporarily reduce their movement speed, refire rate, and accuracy.

As for the atlas, shots that hit in the tight crevaces of the arm joints and waist joint should inflict more damage and possibly stagger the mech. This would require more still than just aiming at the canvass with a hurricane and holding down the trigger, but you won't have to buff the shields and armor to the point that powers are useless.

Modifié par ArtGerhardt, 25 juillet 2012 - 05:55 .

[DragonRageGT]

I don´t mind headshots not gaining damage bonus on bosses but they should definitely count towards the 20 headshots medal and still have the head exploding animation if died due to a headshots, in Geth Prime cases.

Headshots are the main reason I still play this game compulsively and I got addicted to it. Give me my true headshots count per match, Bioware, please?

[Mabari Owns High Dragon The 2nd]

I wondered why I wasn't dealing more damage by shooting Primes/Atlases there... I just assumed my aim sucked or something.

[Valmar]

If you cant change the headshot multiplier per-creature, what about just putting the 'headshot' box somewhere other than the head? Atlas could have a weak point on its back in that engine thing. Primes, well I guess that's more of a toughy. Even if they don't actually get headshot bonus it would be nice to see their head explode if the killing blow is technically a headshot, even if it doesn't include a multiplier. Banshee's and brutes should get headshot bonuses if their barriers are down (Banshee). Its not like its as easy to get on them as it is on an Atlas, if the Atlas 'headshot' was the large front glass. Banshee's are constantly teleporting around so you'd have to lure her into stopping by acting as bait. Brutes like to cover themselves with that armored claw of theirs and have a lot of bulky armored mass shielding their dangley little head anyway.

[humes spork]

I'd prefer not see straight-up headshots return to bosses, but on the other hand giving them weak spots wouldn't be a bad idea. As bosses are, they mostly exist to draw fire from the genuinely dangerous enemies so allowing players in the right place at the right time to prioritize a boss for a quick kill as a tactical choice is never a bad idea.

Many of them already come with spots that one would already assume to be a weak point, so it's good there. The thermal exhaust port on the backside of the atlas would be a good weak spot, as would brutes' exposed intestines, the geth prime's antennae (or the power conduit on their back), and just for pure lulz the banshee's ****** (or, you know, just add a small damage multiplier when she's not charged to balance out her stupidly high defense while charged).

[RiouHotaru]

Rifneno wrote...

InfamousResult wrote...

Evo_9 wrote...

Thats a great attitude to have towards your fanbase.

If a fan wants a serious response, maybe they should act like it and not insult the staff.

Just maybe.

It comes with the job.  Right after putting in a major nerf, people are going to be angry.  And why shouldn't they be?  BW is the ones who screwed up.  If a dev comes in here now and walks off in a huff on the entire community because of one rude person a few hours after angering a good portion of the fanbase, then he wasn't serious about any changes anyway.

Except the community being angry is the community's fault.

[TrveOmegaSlayer]

They removed headshots t make the game harder, so more people fails the mission, gets less credits, are more prone to buy packs with real money
Point is, they're driving people away from the game
In the PS3 fanbase, many will move to Uncharted 3 as soon as it gets the new trophies, they still love ME multiplayer, but they hate how Bioware is handling it and they will sell the game

[saxybeast418]

Wow, it never occurred to me that all yall at Bioware couldn't control the headshot multiplier on a per-creature basis...

As far as a fair multiplier, maybe double damage for a headshot/weakpoint hit on a boss? 2.5? Or 1.75? I dunno, I'm pulling these numbers out of my rear... then again, if they are too easy to hit (like the atlas, for example), maybe 1.25 or 1.5 with a higher chance to stagger/interrupt an attack.

So question for Bioware: roughly how much work would it take to differentiate mooks and bosses in terms of headshot damage?

[Techo Angel]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

What do you folks think would be a fair multiplier?

1.5x Boss monsters, 3x against Normal Monsters I think be fair.

[Omega2079]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

 ...had no way of controlling the headshot multilplier ona per-creature basis. And the headshot multiplier is goofy (3.5x or something like that?), intentionally - because it's normally somewhat harder to do (on a normal creature).

That said, I think it's something we're interested in - as headshots are always nice... if it was to be done, it would probably have to be implemented in such a way as to give us control over the multiplier per creature though.

Is possible to do something like have a random 'heatshot area' or have it so that it randomly enables and disables, or moves slightly without making significant programming changes?

Modifié par Omega2079, 25 juillet 2012 - 06:52 .

[Brenon Holmes]

 Bleh, in bit of a pissy mood earlier... sorry. :happy:

Anywho - yes... *currently* we cannot change headshot multipliers per creature, however this is something we could potentially add with a patch (new feature, sort of deal).

Changing the headshot volume is actually fairly difficult. The creatures are made up of collections of spheres, cubes and sphyls (cylinders with rounded ends)... these are the hitboxes, or things that your bullets actually hit when you shoot at the enemies. Certain primitives are marked up as "head" volumes and that's where the multiplier is applied.

If we were to change the volume size, your bullets wouldn't hit what looks like the geometry of the creature. So your shots on the Banshee's head would pass through the edges, for example (which would probably feel pretty crappy).

We can also play with bullet magnetism values to make the aim assist harder for headshots - but the head zoom snap boxes are already fairly strict and this wouldn't affect PC players equally (since they don't apply in the same ways).

Adding new parts that could be blown off is probably not in the cards either - a lot of mesh changes are fairly intensive and would probably mean re-shipping the creature which has it's own challenges. (Code patches are fairly straightforward... just time intensive - content patches are a fair bit more complicated :happy:).

With respect to the Atlas, we originally did want a weakpoint on the exhaust port on the back - but it got cut towards the end as there wasn't enough time to modify the physics asset (the collection of the aforementioned hit boxes) appropriately. That is something we could look at re-adding... as an aside, what do you guys think of the armour plates? (If you weren't aware, you can blow them off to get a bit of a damage bonus - each shoulder, knee and cod piece).

The issue with the Brute is that his head hangs almost directly over the center of his chest - so with a zoom snap on the sniper rifle you actually almost always hit the head by accident since the larger snap volume for the body applies and pulls your aim almost directly over the head... I think a headshot on him would be nice, but we'd probably want to keep the above in mind...

Ravagers... their "head" is actually their body... plus you already get a bit of bonus damage when you pop the sacks. (I can't recall the exact values off of the top of my head, but I'm fairly certain it's a decent % of max health).

Primes and Banshees are fairly straightforward... I think we'd probably want to look at just adding them back.

[GarethJShep]

Its amazing these days how people moan about something stupid.