303 réponses à ce sujet

[Jadebaby]

maaaze wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Yes maaaze we gathered this information.

He's a proxy that offers an opinion.

But that doesn't mean he isn't a horrendous ass pull.

No he does not offer...he gives context. Shaperd could have done everything alone without the Catalyst knowlege.
but he would have no context as what he was about to do...

that is why the catalyst reveals himself...to explain himself and explain the crucible.

No, he revealed himself because the crucible 'changed' him. It had nothing to do with him explaining himself. Because we all know he doesn't care what anyone thinks, his cycle is the only solution...

[Fawx9]

What you are suggesting make no sense whatsoever.

You are basically saying that the crucible was designed with this magical room in mind.

THAT'S NOT POSSIBLE.

Star Jar states no one has ever been there, are you suggesting that this device was made on pure coincidence? There's no way for the designers to know about anything in that room, including the elevator, if they had never been there and studied it.

[Mazebook]

Fawx9 wrote...

So let me get this straight, someone designed an energy source that somehow takes into account a magical energy refinery on a part of the citadel no one has access to except for the Star Jar?

It is not hard to imagine how prevoise cycles could gather the amount of information needed.

The room is not important..."The first organic ever" is not about the room...it is about the abilty to activate the crucible.

[Mazebook]

Fawx9 wrote...

What you are suggesting make no sense whatsoever.

You are basically saying that the crucible was designed with this magical room in mind.

THAT'S NOT POSSIBLE.

Star Jar states no one has ever been there, are you suggesting that this device was made on pure coincidence? There's no way for the designers to know about anything in that room, including the elevator, if they had never been there and studied it.

It is not about the room...the room could be studied by a cycle before us and incorperated by the designers.

it is about the ability to use the crucible.

[Mazebook]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

maaaze wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Yes maaaze we gathered this information.

He's a proxy that offers an opinion.

But that doesn't mean he isn't a horrendous ass pull.

No he does not offer...he gives context. Shaperd could have done everything alone without the Catalyst knowlege.
but he would have no context as what he was about to do...

that is why the catalyst reveals himself...to explain himself and explain the crucible.

No, he revealed himself because the crucible 'changed' him. It had nothing to do with him explaining himself. Because we all know he doesn't care what anyone thinks, his cycle is the only solution...

both.

[v TricKy v]

maaaze wrote...

Shepard could have done nothing. It was the Catalyst who got you up there in the first place. 

NO!!!...it is the crucible who get´s you up in the first place. There is no reason to believe that the catalyst pulls you up. 

His dialoge would make no sense if he were the one who pulls you up.

IT is the crucibles doing.

argument 1 : it makes sense that the designers would include a way to get to the crucible in case the arms a closed. And you would put this mechanism in place from where you open the arms of the citadel.

argument 2: the citadel being part of the catalyst does not imply he has control over it. As much you don´t have control over your heartbeat.

argument 3: the following to statements imply that he did not lift Shaperd up.

"you being here, the first organic ever, proves my solution won´t work anymore" this statement makes no sense if the catalyst himself brought him there. Here meaning a place to activate the crucible.

In the low ems ending : "Why are you here ?" the catalyst himself is surprised that Shaperd did make it to the crucible...it makes no sense for him to ask him that question if he himself brought him there. Surly he knows what Shaperd intends to do. 

So how does the giant battery activate the elevator which gets you there? It just an energy source nothing more. Even the Catalyst says that himself. So the only reason you get up there is because the Catalyst brings you there. The Citadel is a part of him after all. He also says that himself.

[BigBadMammogram]

maaaze wrote...

It is not hard to imagine how prevoise cycles could gather the amount of information needed.

Yes it is. I'm trying to imagine how they would have gained any information on the catalyst now. Considering he kept himself hidden, and nobody had ever seen him or even suspected that he exists, I cant think of a single way they could have found out how to reprogram him.

[Fawx9]

maaaze wrote...

Fawx9 wrote...

So let me get this straight, someone designed an energy source that somehow takes into account a magical energy refinery on a part of the citadel no one has access to except for the Star Jar?

It is not hard to imagine how prevoise cycles could gather the amount of information needed.

The room is not important..."The first organic ever" is not about the room...it is about the abilty to activate the crucible.

It is extrodinarly important.

If you gave someone a picture of a wall jack and asked them to make something that utilizes it do you think they can?

It's the infinite number of monkeys on typewriter problem.

There is an un godly low chance that the designers made anything that could interface with the citedal with specific functions in mind.

[BigBadMammogram]

Previous cycles also had no access to the citadel after the reapers invaded, and they had no idea the reapers were about to invade. So how did they gather information about something they didnt even know to look for from a place they couldnt get to?

[Jadebaby]

maaaze wrote...

both.

C'mon, two posts and I only get one word out of you?

Care to explain how synthesis exists as an option if the Catalyst has no participation in the crucible's design?

[Mazebook]

jstme wrote...

I am glad that you agree that catalyst is not needed. A panel with 3 huge buttons and some neutral holo explaining things (and not the reaper king itself suddenly becoming mentor and guide) would be so much better.
Not ideal.But waaaay better then that glowing monstrosity.

he is needed to give context...no one else could fill that role in a believable way.

[BigBadMammogram]

maaaze wrote...

No one could fill that role in a believable way.

Fixed.

[Mazebook]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

maaaze wrote...

both.

C'mon, two posts and I only get one word out of you?

Care to explain how synthesis exists as an option if the Catalyst has no participation in the crucible's design?

It is not clear if this was the intended use of the crucible or if the catalyst thought of this by him self...

He just sees the potential the crucible gives Shaperd when used a certain way.

No need for him to design it.

[Mazebook]

BigBadMammogram wrote...

maaaze wrote...

No other could fill that role in a believable way.

fixed.

Don´t try to change my words...thank you.

[Mazebook]

BigBadMammogram wrote...

Previous cycles also had no access to the citadel after the reapers invaded, and they had no idea the reapers were about to invade. So how did they gather information about something they didnt even know to look for from a place they couldnt get to?

the harvisting process took hundreds of years. information could get gathered. if you count in that the information is based on thousands of cycles.

[BigBadMammogram]

maaaze wrote...

Don´t try to change my words...thank you.

Alright. Just trying to show that it doesnt matter who they picked to the be the catalyst. No one could have filled that role in a believable way because they catalyst is just... dumb.

[Mazebook]

v TricKy v wrote...

maaaze wrote...

Shepard could have done nothing. It was the Catalyst who got you up there in the first place. 

NO!!!...it is the crucible who get´s you up in the first place. There is no reason to believe that the catalyst pulls you up. 

His dialoge would make no sense if he were the one who pulls you up.

IT is the crucibles doing.

argument 1 : it makes sense that the designers would include a way to get to the crucible in case the arms a closed. And you would put this mechanism in place from where you open the arms of the citadel.

argument 2: the citadel being part of the catalyst does not imply he has control over it. As much you don´t have control over your heartbeat.

argument 3: the following to statements imply that he did not lift Shaperd up.

"you being here, the first organic ever, proves my solution won´t work anymore" this statement makes no sense if the catalyst himself brought him there. Here meaning a place to activate the crucible.

In the low ems ending : "Why are you here ?" the catalyst himself is surprised that Shaperd did make it to the crucible...it makes no sense for him to ask him that question if he himself brought him there. Surly he knows what Shaperd intends to do. 

So how does the giant battery activate the elevator which gets you there? It just an energy source nothing more. Even the Catalyst says that himself. So the only reason you get up there is because the Catalyst brings you there. The Citadel is a part of him after all. He also says that himself.

no it is not only a battery...it was designed to do a specific thing...to destroy the reapers with  the help of the mass relays and citadel...which required a lot of energy.

it makes sense that the designers thought about a way...that you can get to the crucible after you open the arms of the Citadel...otherwise the crucible would be pointless.

[AresKeith]

maaaze wrote...

BigBadMammogram wrote...

Previous cycles also had no access to the citadel after the reapers invaded, and they had no idea the reapers were about to invade. So how did they gather information about something they didnt even know to look for from a place they couldnt get to?

the harvisting process took hundreds of years. information could get gathered. if you count in that the information is based on thousands of cycles.

NOBODY knew about that room where the Starbrat is, so they can't know about the options

[Jadebaby]

maaaze wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

maaaze wrote...

both.

C'mon, two posts and I only get one word out of you?

Care to explain how synthesis exists as an option if the Catalyst has no participation in the crucible's design?

It is not clear if this was the intended use of the crucible or if the catalyst thought of this by him self...

He just sees the potential the crucible gives Shaperd when used a certain way.

No need for him to design it.

lol

So you actually believe that the Synthesis function of the crucible was just a coincidence?

That Shepard jumping into the beam and his DNA being harnessed and thrown throughout the entire galaxy, wasn't actually designed to happen by the crucible, but happened.. 'Just because'?

wow

[Mazebook]

BigBadMammogram wrote...

maaaze wrote...

Don´t try to change my words...thank you.

Alright. Just trying to show that it doesnt matter who they picked to the be the catalyst. No one could have filled that role in a believable way because they catalyst is just... dumb.

I beg to differ. I find him very interessting and tragic.

[Mazebook]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

maaaze wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

maaaze wrote...

both.

C'mon, two posts and I only get one word out of you?

Care to explain how synthesis exists as an option if the Catalyst has no participation in the crucible's design?

It is not clear if this was the intended use of the crucible or if the catalyst thought of this by him self...

He just sees the potential the crucible gives Shaperd when used a certain way.

No need for him to design it.

lol

So you actually believe that the Synthesis function of the crucible was just a coincidence?

That Shepard jumping into the beam and his DNA being harnessed and thrown throughout the entire galaxy, wasn't actually designed to happen by the crucible, but happened.. 'Just because'?

wow

we don´t know if it was intended.

the discovery of penicillin and many other things were also just a coincidence.

This is quite common.

[BigBadMammogram]

maaaze wrote...

BigBadMammogram wrote...

Previous cycles also had no access to the citadel after the reapers invaded, and they had no idea the reapers were about to invade. So how did they gather information about something they didnt even know to look for from a place they couldnt get to?

the harvisting process took hundreds of years. information could get gathered. if you count in that the information is based on thousands of cycles.

How? Im honestly trying to think of a way to gather information about something you dont even know exists, from a place that you cannot get to. None of the previous cycles had access to the citadel after the reapers invaded. So how did they gather information from it?

[Mazebook]

AresKeith wrote...

maaaze wrote...

BigBadMammogram wrote...

Previous cycles also had no access to the citadel after the reapers invaded, and they had no idea the reapers were about to invade. So how did they gather information about something they didnt even know to look for from a place they couldnt get to?

the harvisting process took hundreds of years. information could get gathered. if you count in that the information is based on thousands of cycles.

NOBODY knew about that room where the Starbrat is, so they can't know about the options

How do you know nobody knew???

because of the "first organic ever" line? That was about the ability to use the crucible and not the room...

the room is not important. it never was...it is just the point where the crucible docks...and existing equitment are adepted to serve the crucible.

[Mazebook]

BigBadMammogram wrote...

maaaze wrote...

BigBadMammogram wrote...

Previous cycles also had no access to the citadel after the reapers invaded, and they had no idea the reapers were about to invade. So how did they gather information about something they didnt even know to look for from a place they couldnt get to?

the harvisting process took hundreds of years. information could get gathered. if you count in that the information is based on thousands of cycles.

How? Im honestly trying to think of a way to gather information about something you dont even know exists, from a place that you cannot get to. None of the previous cycles had access to the citadel after the reapers invaded. So how did they gather information from it?

How do you know that...?someone could have gone in and send a message out about what goes on in there...
so other scientist could find a way to incoperate this information into the crucible.
the protheans did it....other cycle probably too.

[Fawx9]

One more thing, if it was always the crucible preparing these choices, why the hell weren't they marked in the designs?

You'd think they come with a warning label saying "btw here's what this is supposed to do".

Instead it seems no race understood what they were building so again your asking that whatever they built just magically connected properly with the citadel and magically produced these 3 choices when it did magically interface.