360 réponses à ce sujet

[dreman9999]

Headhunter128 wrote...

People please, no need to obsess over Bioware's lack of knowledge of warfare. If they knew everything about war and every outcome to every situation. They would have done the smart thing of taking over EA long ago Salarian style

Jokes aside, no matter what the original plans/concepts for the reapers in Mass Effect 3 was, I don't think we were ever meant to stand a chance of winning conventionally. ME 1 and 2 was not only about preventing/preparing for the return of the Reapers. It was about Hope and having faith in that when the times comes, we will win. ME 3 however, is about holding on to that hope.

I think the reason why some people want the conventional win so badly is because that Shepard is forced to put his faith and hopes into the Crucible, and are repeatedly told, that this is the ONLY hope. I think that is what truly upsets people. That this is the only way, were as the other games have taught us that there is always another way. ME 3 breaks this illusion. (And I say illusion because that Bioware seems very clear on the fact that this cannot be won conventionally.)

That said, not the biggest fan of the endings, but the crucible is certainly not one of my reasons. Take out the catalyst complete and insert whatever of the endings that you prefer most (Didn't say like). And the endings is actually quite satisfying for me with the EC.

Btw. As for Space Magic, I'm pretty sure that's the same arguemnt people used in the Middle Ages for things they coulnd't explain. I'm no scientist, but I'm sure that a more reasonable explanation could be found for why a wave of light have different effects. Sound silly, but doen't mean impossible.

It was already made clear to why conventional victory is impossible. No ammount of military knowlegde will change that.

[Conniving_Eagle]

dreman9999 wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

The Twilight God wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

295 Ships? Okay...

And how many reaper ships are they supposed to fit on screen at one time? Count the number of our ships on screen when they jumped through the Sol relay if you want to play that game.

Keep deluding yourself and ignoring facts. I'm sure you're utterly convinced the world is flat and nobody is ever going to be able to prove that to you.

Reaper's vastly outnumber us
Catalyst: http://www.youtube.c...yvUblf28#t=468s

Deal with it.

Don't worry I can deal with it fine. By asserting that conventional victory is impossible (it will always be debatable) you further assert the bad writing of ME3. So atleast we agree on one thing 

Conventional victory being impossible is not bad writing.

Not necessarily, but facing an unbeatable enemy and being forced to use a DEM is.

[Clayless]

It looks like this is getting ignored so I'm gonna quote it:

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

The Reapers vastly outnumber us.

Also they can brainwash us. A simple "FTL around indoctinating planets with a bit of devastating hit-and-run tactics to cripple the galaxy included".

Vastly outnumber, far superior firepower and defenses, the ability to escape without being tracked and brainwashing capabilities = no conventional victory.

[Taboo]

You're told twice before reaching the Citadel for the first time that a conventional victory is impossible...

[Kamfrenchie]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

It looks like this is getting ignored so I'm gonna quote it:

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

The Reapers vastly outnumber us.

Also they can brainwash us. A simple "FTL around indoctinating planets with a bit of devastating hit-and-run tactics to cripple the galaxy included".

Vastly outnumber, far superior firepower and defenses, the ability to escape without being tracked and brainwashing capabilities = no conventional victory.

indotrination doesn't happen instantly, hammer proves it

[Conniving_Eagle]

Taboo-XX wrote...

You're told twice before reaching the Citadel for the first time that a conventional victory is impossible...

You are told several times throughout Mass Effect 2 that you are not going to survive the suicide mission/people are going to die.

[dreman9999]

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

The Twilight God wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

295 Ships? Okay...

And how many reaper ships are they supposed to fit on screen at one time? Count the number of our ships on screen when they jumped through the Sol relay if you want to play that game.

Keep deluding yourself and ignoring facts. I'm sure you're utterly convinced the world is flat and nobody is ever going to be able to prove that to you.

Reaper's vastly outnumber us
Catalyst: http://www.youtube.c...yvUblf28#t=468s

Deal with it.

Don't worry I can deal with it fine. By asserting that conventional victory is impossible (it will always be debatable) you further assert the bad writing of ME3. So atleast we agree on one thing 

Conventional victory being impossible is not bad writing.

Not necessarily, but facing an unbeatable enemy and being forced to use a DEM is.

You forced to attack there weakness. That is not bad writing. DA:Oand Lothr does this too.
Ender's game does this as well.
The crucible is not a DEM.

Modifié par dreman9999, 26 juillet 2012 - 07:25 .

[Clayless]

Kamfrenchie wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

It looks like this is getting ignored so I'm gonna quote it:

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

The Reapers vastly outnumber us.

Also they can brainwash us. A simple "FTL around indoctinating planets with a bit of devastating hit-and-run tactics to cripple the galaxy included".

Vastly outnumber, far superior firepower and defenses, the ability to escape without being tracked and brainwashing capabilities = no conventional victory.

indotrination doesn't happen instantly, hammer proves it

Yeah, it can happen over weeks or months, which is fine because time is irrelevant to the Reapers.

[dreman9999]

Kamfrenchie wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

It looks like this is getting ignored so I'm gonna quote it:

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

The Reapers vastly outnumber us.

Also they can brainwash us. A simple "FTL around indoctinating planets with a bit of devastating hit-and-run tactics to cripple the galaxy included".

Vastly outnumber, far superior firepower and defenses, the ability to escape without being tracked and brainwashing capabilities = no conventional victory.

indotrination doesn't happen instantly, hammer proves it

Yes, it can.Via touch  wit an indctination device and reaper proximity.

[dreman9999]

Taboo-XX wrote...

You're told twice before reaching the Citadel for the first time that a conventional victory is impossible...

Your tld from AFTER mars. Than their the "darken the shy comment for sovergin. Then therre's this from ME2.
 

[Ticonderoga117]

Taboo-XX wrote...

You're told twice before reaching the Citadel for the first time that a conventional victory is impossible...

And that's why it's bad writing.
We've hardly fought the Reapers at this point, and the Alliance Fleet's head-honcho is already cutting his wrists going "It's impossible, we might as well roll up and die unless we use this convinent plot device."

This is not Hackett, this is a Cerberus spy or indoctrinated agent.
Or just bad writing.

Modifié par Ticonderoga117, 26 juillet 2012 - 07:25 .

[dreman9999]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

You're told twice before reaching the Citadel for the first time that a conventional victory is impossible...

And that's why it's bad writing.
We've hardly fought the Reapers at this point, and the Alliance Fleet's head-honcho is already cutting his wrists going "It's impossible, we might as well roll up and die unless we use this convinent plot device."

This is not Hackett, this is a Cerberus spy or indoctrinated agent.
Or just bad writing.

No that's bad writing. We knew thye over powered us from ME1. Then theirs this.

^ This say it all.

[Clayless]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

You're told twice before reaching the Citadel for the first time that a conventional victory is impossible...

And that's why it's bad writing.
We've hardly fought the Reapers at this point, and the Alliance Fleet's head-honcho is already cutting his wrists going "It's impossible, we might as well roll up and die unless we use this convinent plot device."

This is not Hackett, this is a Cerberus spy or indoctrinated agent.
Or just bad writing.

You don't need to fight someone a lot, you already know their capabilities, and Hackett probably already knows a vague range of their numbers by that stage (e.g at least thousands at that early in the invasion). With that knowledge alone it's pretty easy to make a judgment.

Modifié par Our_Last_Scene, 26 juillet 2012 - 07:31 .

[Ticonderoga117]

dreman9999 wrote...
No that's bad writing. We knew thye over powered us from ME1. Then theirs this.

^ This say it all.

Versus this:


All armed with weapons that don't care about Kinetic Barriers would trash Reapers. But no, bad writing ahoy-hoy!

[F4H bandicoot]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...



All armed with weapons that don't care about Kinetic Barriers would trash Reapers. But no, bad writing ahoy-hoy!

They don't even use the Thanix cannons, and it takes 4 dreadnoughts with thanix to take down 1 Capitol ship.

[Ticonderoga117]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

You don't need to fight someone a lot, you already know their capabilities, and Hackett probably already knows a vague range of their numbers by that stage (e.g at least thousands at that early in the invasion). With that knowledge alone it's pretty easy to make a judgment.

Yeah, that we need to do something new.
-Develop weapons that say "FU barriers"
-Make better versions of lasers and nuclear divlery systems.
-Better tactics

Not:
-Use this convient plot device NO ONE HAS EVER SUCCESSFULLY FIELDED BEFORE and make it THE ONLY OPTION TO WIN.

[Ticonderoga117]

F4H bandicoot wrote...
They don't even use the Thanix cannons, and it takes 4 dreadnoughts with thanix to take down 1 Capitol ship.

Lasers, particle beams, and nuclear explosions ALL ignore Kinetic Barriers.

Nevermind actually coming up with BETTER NEW weapons.

The Normandy took out Soverign with one dinky shot after it shields were no longer a problem.

[Clayless]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

You don't need to fight someone a lot, you already know their capabilities, and Hackett probably already knows a vague range of their numbers by that stage (e.g at least thousands at that early in the invasion). With that knowledge alone it's pretty easy to make a judgment.

Yeah, that we need to do something new.
-Develop weapons that say "FU barriers"
-Make better versions of lasers and nuclear divlery systems.
-Better tactics

Not:
-Use this convient plot device NO ONE HAS EVER SUCCESSFULLY FIELDED BEFORE and make it THE ONLY OPTION TO WIN.

See my first post about a tactic the Reapers could easily deploy which would counter those 3 points you made.

[dreman9999]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
No that's bad writing. We knew thye over powered us from ME1. Then theirs this.

^ This say it all.

Versus this:


All armed with weapons that don't care about Kinetic Barriers would trash Reapers. But no, bad writing ahoy-hoy!

The reapers still have more ship, Take more damage , have endless husk forces and oculies forces, and can one shot our ships.
My pic was a fraction of the reapers forces. Yours is a masive part of the allied force.
The reapers oare not going to lose conventionally.

[dreman9999]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

You don't need to fight someone a lot, you already know their capabilities, and Hackett probably already knows a vague range of their numbers by that stage (e.g at least thousands at that early in the invasion). With that knowledge alone it's pretty easy to make a judgment.

Yeah, that we need to do something new.
-Develop weapons that say "FU barriers"
-Make better versions of lasers and nuclear divlery systems.
-Better tactics

Not:
-Use this convient plot device NO ONE HAS EVER SUCCESSFULLY FIELDED BEFORE and make it THE ONLY OPTION TO WIN.

1. You asking for a magic gun and we don't have time or the recource to make it.
2.The reapers have signal blockers and oculies to counter that.
3. Better tactic do nothing to endless husk foces.

The crucilbe is a divice left from the past races to help us. It's not a question of if it can kill the reapers. It's how.

[Ticonderoga117]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

The Reapers vastly outnumber us.

Also they can brainwash us. A simple "FTL around indoctinating planets with a bit of devastating hit-and-run tactics to cripple the galaxy included".

Vastly outnumber, far superior firepower and defenses, the ability to escape without being tracked and brainwashing capabilities = no conventional victory.

This?

We have no data on thier numbers. If they number more than 50K, the galaxy wouldn't stand a chance... ever. The Cruicible would be toast from the get-go.

Indoctrination takes a long time being in close proximity, no data about being indoctrinated in orbit exists.

Firepower? Sure, but we can develop our own.

Defenses? Get neutralised with weapons that aren't effected by barriers.

The ability to escape is for everyone.

So, conventional victory still impossible? Nope.

[dreman9999]

F4H bandicoot wrote...

Ticonderoga117 wrote...



All armed with weapons that don't care about Kinetic Barriers would trash Reapers. But no, bad writing ahoy-hoy!

They don't even use the Thanix cannons, and it takes 4 dreadnoughts with thanix to take down 1 Capitol ship.

They are using thanix cannons.

[F4H bandicoot]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

The Reapers vastly outnumber us.

Also they can brainwash us. A simple "FTL around indoctinating planets with a bit of devastating hit-and-run tactics to cripple the galaxy included".

Vastly outnumber, far superior firepower and defenses, the ability to escape without being tracked and brainwashing capabilities = no conventional victory.

This?

We have no data on thier numbers. If they number more than 50K, the galaxy wouldn't stand a chance... ever. The Cruicible would be toast from the get-go.

Indoctrination takes a long time being in close proximity, no data about being indoctrinated in orbit exists.

Firepower? Sure, but we can develop our own.

Defenses? Get neutralised with weapons that aren't effected by barriers.

The ability to escape is for everyone.

So, conventional victory still impossible? Nope.

They're going to have more than 1k Capitol ships for sure.
Of course we can, whilst the reapers rip us a part for fun.
Which don't exist,
It's impossible, face it.

As i've said before. Unconventional does not equal super space weapon. 

[dreman9999]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

The Reapers vastly outnumber us.

Also they can brainwash us. A simple "FTL around indoctinating planets with a bit of devastating hit-and-run tactics to cripple the galaxy included".

Vastly outnumber, far superior firepower and defenses, the ability to escape without being tracked and brainwashing capabilities = no conventional victory.

This?

We have no data on thier numbers. If they number more than 50K, the galaxy wouldn't stand a chance... ever. The Cruicible would be toast from the get-go.

Indoctrination takes a long time being in close proximity, no data about being indoctrinated in orbit exists.

Firepower? Sure, but we can develop our own.

Defenses? Get neutralised with weapons that aren't effected by barriers.

The ability to escape is for everyone.

So, conventional victory still impossible? Nope.

1. You asking for a magic gun and we don't have time or the rescource to make it. Added, the reaper are destoring our rescources as well.
2.The reapers have signal blockers and oculies to counter that nukes and lazers can't kill massive ammouts of oculies at one.
3. Better tactic do nothing to endless husk foces.

The crucilbe is a divice left from the past races to help us. It's not a question of if it can kill the reapers. It's how. 

Modifié par dreman9999, 26 juillet 2012 - 07:43 .

[Ticonderoga117]

dreman9999 wrote...

1. You asking for a magic gun and we don't have time or the recource to make it.
2.The reapers have signal blockers and oculies to counter that.
3. Better tactic do nothing to endless husk foces.

The crucilbe is a divice left from the past races to help us. It's not a question of if it can kill the reapers. It's how.

1. Particle weapons, lasers, and nukes aren't magic.
2. How do signal blockers effect something guided by sight or laser, and occuluses won't be able to if you can stealth the delivery system,
3. Hit them from orbit. Or high ground. Or with tanks. Or with artillery. Or use automatic shotguns. Or the Krogan. Or an almost endless supply of Geth troopers.

Pffft.