169 réponses à ce sujet

[whateverman7]

 for the most part i agree with the OP, but i disagree on 1 key thing:

it's not bw that's contradictory, it's the bsn community....the community asks for better and/or improvements to weapons/characters/powers, bw complies, community then complains those things are too good/need to be nerfed.....community asks for the game to be harder cause it's gotten too easy, bw complies, community then complains the game is too hard/needs to be nerfed....

the bsn says it wants variety, but then complains weapon A doesnt work like weapon B; the bsn posts threads/vids about what builds/weapons/characters are 'viable', yet complains when they see people using said builds/weapons/characters....the bsn tells people how to make the game easier, yet complains when people take that advice and make the game easier....

for the most part,the bsn is and wants to be a sheepish/follow the leader community, yet the bsn gets upset when people actually follow the lead....it's the community that's leading bw down the contradictory path...

Modifié par whateverman7, 28 juillet 2012 - 11:12 .

[whateverman7]

oh, 1 other thing:

all characters/classes can be used on higher difficulties....just cause the supposedly 'good' players dont use them, doesnt make that less true...that's just another example of the bsn being sheepish...the same goes for weapons too

[nukembaby]

DullahansXMark wrote...
He perceives his opinion as fact. Elitist.

Elitists get a bad rap here. Sure many of them are very egotistical and arrogant--but when they give advice, I listen. And I learn. And I become a better player for it. The problem I see is that many of you DON'T listen because you're too proud to admit somebody is better than you. Well guess what, there is ALWAYS somebody better--even for the so-called elitists.

[DullahansXMark]

nukembaby wrote...

DullahansXMark wrote...
He perceives his opinion as fact. Elitist.

Elitists get a bad rap here. Sure many of them are very egotistical and arrogant--but when they give advice, I listen. And I learn. And I become a better player for it. The problem I see is that many of you DON'T listen because you're too proud to admit somebody is better than you. Well guess what, there is ALWAYS somebody better--even for the so-called elitists.

The elitists are better than me AT THE GAME. I admit to that much, but it doesn't mean that we should have to adapt to what they tell us to do. Just because they can play one game good doesn't mean that they have the right to impose their will on the way the game plays. There are many more casual gamers out there than hardcore gamers, and some casuals actually give Gold a shot once in a while. Myself included.

[nicethugbert]

This game is a casino by design! Run! Run away for your wallet!

[nukembaby]

DullahansXMark wrote...

The elitists are better than me AT THE GAME. I admit to that much, but it doesn't mean that we should have to adapt to what they tell us to do. Just because they can play one game good doesn't mean that they have the right to impose their will on the way the game plays. There are many more casual gamers out there than hardcore gamers, and some casuals actually give Gold a shot once in a while. Myself included.

I don't get why casuals would be tempted by gold? It's meant to take a lot of practice and experience on lower levels to do well on gold; you have to build up to it. Do you run a marathon "casually" or does it take weeks/months to train for it? Or do you take performance enhancing drugs so that you can do it without training?? That's what overpowered weapons/builds are to this game--crutches that allow you to do something you naturally should not be able to do yet.

So no, BW does not balance the game according to the best players. The best players don't use crutches; they can solo gold with an avenger. No, BW balances the game when they see "casual" players skipping bronze and silver and being able to do gold simply because of an overpowered weapon/power/class.

Modifié par nukembaby, 28 juillet 2012 - 12:32 .

[LiarasShield]

nukembaby wrote...

DullahansXMark wrote...

The elitists are better than me AT THE GAME. I admit to that much, but it doesn't mean that we should have to adapt to what they tell us to do. Just because they can play one game good doesn't mean that they have the right to impose their will on the way the game plays. There are many more casual gamers out there than hardcore gamers, and some casuals actually give Gold a shot once in a while. Myself included.

I don't get why casuals would be tempted by gold? It's meant to take a lot of practice and experience on lower levels to do well on gold; you have to build up to it. Do you run a marathon "casually" or does it take weeks/months to train for it? Or do you take performance enhancing drugs so that you can do it without training?? That's what overpowered weapons/builds are to this game--crutches that allow you to do something you naturally should not be able to do yet.

So no, BW does not balance the game according to the best players. The best players don't use crutches; they can solo gold with an avenger. No, BW balances the game when they see "casual" players skipping bronze and silver and being able to do gold simply because of an overpowered weapon/power/class.

Some of that sounds like rubbish what if they player just knows how to use that class you would nerf the class to have everyone suffer just because a particular individual is great with that class....?

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

   I suspect most of the people who think the game has become easier since its release have two things happening.
   First, they've unlocked very powerful weapons which can be serious game-changers.
   Second, they've gleaned a great deal of experience playing, and can clearly remember how challenging the game was when they were first playing, and had no experience.
   For people who are starting the game now, I think the task of "catching up" is a lot more daunting than it was when I started.

Modifié par Jeremiah12LGeek, 21 mars 2013 - 10:57 .

[nukembaby]

LiarasShield wrote...

Some of that sounds like rubbish what if they player just knows how to use that class you would nerf the class to have everyone suffer just because a particular individual is great with that class....?

If only a few were doing it, then it wouldn't even show up on their radar. For example, I became really good at playing the Turian Sentinel. I went from bronze to silver to gold and beyond with him. Do you think BW would nerf him? No, because not many others played that character more than any other character.

The GI with Krysae on the other hand--well, we all know the story with that one. EVERYBODY was doing that combo for a while on gold. It was way out of proportion to the normal distribution that would normally play gold, so it's easy to deduce that many players who would normally be in bronze/silver were now able to play gold with this build.

So in actuality, BW balanced the game (TC/Krysae nerf) according to what the bronze/silver players were doing, NOT the elite players who would be on gold anyway, Krysae or no Krysae.

Modifié par nukembaby, 28 juillet 2012 - 12:58 .

[nukembaby]

Jeremiah12LGeek wrote...

   I suspect most of the people who think the game has become easier since its release have two things happening.
   First, they've unlocked very powerful weapons which can be serious game-changers.
   Second, they've gleaned a great deal of experience playing, and can clearly remember how challenging the game was when they were first playing, and had no experience.
   For people who are starting the game now, I think the task of "catching up" is a lot more daunting than it was when I started.

-Jeremiah the 12th Level Geek

Why would it be more daunting? I would think it would be much easier, what with all the new kickass characters and weapons AND the collective wisdom of this forum which wasn't even around in my time. I envy the beginners; as long as they don't take shortcuts, this game can be very fun during that phase.

[DullahansXMark]

nukembaby wrote...

I don't get why casuals would be tempted by gold? It's meant to take a lot of practice and experience on lower levels to do well on gold; you have to build up to it. Do you run a marathon "casually" or does it take weeks/months to train for it? Or do you take performance enhancing drugs so that you can do it without training?? That's what overpowered weapons/builds are to this game--crutches that allow you to do something you naturally should not be able to do yet.

So no, BW does not balance the game according to the best players. The best players don't use crutches; they can solo gold with an avenger. No, BW balances the game when they see "casual" players skipping bronze and silver and being able to do gold simply because of an overpowered weapon/power/class.

Casual players aren't purely bronze/silver players. Casual =/= not looking for a good challenge. Nor does casual = bad player. It simply means we just don't take the game as seriously as most other people. We play the game to have fun, and some of us find Gold fun. I don't consider being able to successfully play a God match hardcore, because all it takes is good team synergy and practice at the game (and some of the nice weapons and classes you get for doing so).

My Krogan Vanguard and Reegar Carbine combo does more damage and score higher than my Human Sentinel with a Predator? Good! It's SUPPOSED to be like that, otherwise why have certain weapons/classes harder to unlock than others? Balance is fine, heavily nerfing good weapons that are hard to obtain isn't. (I didn't even use the Krysae before because I honestly found it rather underwhelming in comparison to most other sniper rifles; now I'd never even bother using it because now it's even worse than when I got it.)

[LiarasShield]

nukembaby wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

Some of that sounds like rubbish what if they player just knows how to use that class you would nerf the class to have everyone suffer just because a particular individual is great with that class....?

If only a few were doing it, then it wouldn't even show up on their radar. For example, I became really good at playing the Turian Sentinel. I went from bronze to silver to gold and beyond with him. Do you think BW would nerf him? No, because not many others played that character more than any other character.

The GI with Krysae on the other hand--well, we all know the story with that one. EVERYBODY was doing that combo for a while on gold. It was way out of proportion to the normal distribution that would normally play gold, so it's easy to deduce that many players who would normally be in bronze/silver were now able to play gold with this build.

So in actuality, BW balanced the game (TC/Krysae nerf) according to what the bronze/silver players were doing, NOT the elite players who would be on gold anyway, Krysae or no Krysae.

So you nerf stuff just because of popularity that sounds sillly..

[4ut0b4hn5child27]

nukembaby wrote...

himegoto wrote...

Yuanrang wrote...
It is very easy, but rather depressing.

I started a bit before Earth (like 3 weeks before), and I more or less completely skipped Silver. I did a few random public silvers, but with a 50-50 win rate, I found Bronze to be better credits.

What I did was basically just get a Salarian Engineer, skip Silver, farm FBWGG ad nauseum and then just do gold instead while grooming out the manifest.

Yeah.. Looking at that makes me feel rather depressing.

As much as I like the game, I wouldn't recommand any of my friends as newcomers to the game.

I re-read your post and think I understand now. You feel the game is all about farming now and hence no longer fun for new players.

I disagree. You will always be able to find other random players out there who are doing it "right," progressing from bronze to silver to gold as their skills/knowledge/experience improve, without skipping levels by farming. Those who truly want to enjoy the game and get as much as they can out of it will naturally reject farming. The farmers are the ones who are already on the way out; they don't really play for the game, just to satisfy some OCD about getting all the weapons/characters.

I play ME3 SInce March 

recently I play with random since 1 AM 3 times  and 11 PM 3 times

I Play at PC and i see many of the random know how they're doing. AND STILL they want to doing it full extract. Even in FBWGG.

Please don't make a bullfeces assumption that farmers are the bad here.

Some of them farming because they are out of resources, And maybe their friends not in the time of playing this game. So they out to find some good for contributing player for farming credits. So in the future when they play with their friends, they will not letting them down because of one mistakes.

Even very skilled player sometimes need a teamwork effort you know.

Many people in this world has a very different  free time. So stop blaming the Farmers.

They need some quick credits but also they need a good random Player on gold to contribute. if not they will fail and the effort they put will become eradicated into ashes just like Reapers turn all peope become hopeless. i saw many good player at Gold PUG

I admit, i also want to get all weapons. I have all weapons (common, uncommon and rare at MAX lv) and UR is the one i want to maxed. But now i want to enjoy playing Bronze and Silver.

Even i already maxed all the things. i still wanna play it again. helping new player. i don't care if the new player better than me.

i just play this ME3 MP. because for me ME3 MP is the new kind of MP i've ever played in my life.

Fighting Giant robot, Space Magic Oversync-kill Ninja, Indoctrinated Fleshy disgusting Cyber-abominations?

for me this MP are new. Eventhough the  MP jsut CO-OP I'm happy.

Even i play FBWGG over and over. I didn't bored me. Don't know why? maybe i played it because this is challenging for people like me.

many people fight in this game for different reason. So stop stereotyping that farmers are bad.

Modifié par 4ut0b4hn5child27, 28 juillet 2012 - 12:45 .

[legion999]

Agreed OP.

[xSNPx ZoDiaC]

Yes! Yes! Very well said OP kudos to you!


Just BeWare though... rEApers are very keen on "balancing" this game to the abyss.

[soulstriker09]

Optimistman wrote...
It's making this game rather virtually impossible to play with randoms. Yes, teamwork prevails everything, but there's no teamwork with randoms. No verbal communication for the most part is the equivalent of everybody doing their own thing.  And don't give me that brain-dead garbage that you should constantly play with people you know, because if that was the case, there shouldn't even be a quick match option.

AYE! OP speaks the truth! Thank you OptimistMan for your uhhh.. Realist views! 

I don't know how they should be addressing this though :|
it may be my fault that I hate my voice when I hear it am horribly introverted when dealing with strangers across the internets

[BlessedSoldier]

DullahansXMark wrote...

The voice of reason.

I shall friend you.

This.

[BaladasDemnevanni]

I think what bothers me most about this current incarnation of multiplayer is that it lacks creativity. For example, I notice that enemies on Gold tend to behave very similarly to those on silver, yet success is much more difficult to achieve. It takes no thought to simply double an enemy's health/shields or decide instead of Wave 3, bosses start popping up on wave 1. That's not the kind of difficulty Bioware should strive for: new enemies, new abilities, better tactical coordination. This is what we need. Instead, I feel like I'm playing WoW everytime a boss appears on screen because it's really just a dps sink.

I also think Bioware needs to kill this RNG system they've built up. They call it a store. Well, give everything a price and let me see what I'm buying. At least I'll have a target goal and expected time for when I can acquire it, rather than this trading card approach. The current system is idiotic.

[Optimistman]

soulstriker09 wrote...

Optimistman wrote...
It's making this game rather virtually impossible to play with randoms. Yes, teamwork prevails everything, but there's no teamwork with randoms. No verbal communication for the most part is the equivalent of everybody doing their own thing.  And don't give me that brain-dead garbage that you should constantly play with people you know, because if that was the case, there shouldn't even be a quick match option.

AYE! OP speaks the truth! Thank you OptimistMan for your uhhh.. Realist views! 

I don't know how they should be addressing this though :|
it may be my fault that I hate my voice when I hear it am horribly introverted when dealing with strangers across the internets

While saying this multiplayer is a little off, i still enjoy playing it very much despite the gltiches and everything. This multiplayer is fun and it is one of the best horde modes i've played next to gears of war. It's just not at it's max potential.

I could say they should make a few things a little less hardcore, such as the perfect accuracy and the sync-killing. But that would be selfish as some people still find the game too easy right now or may enjoy the challenge that the enemies give them. See i'm not like "nerfers"; I think about how some changes would effect other people before i go asking for them. I think it's what most people should start doing, because neither the world or this game revolves around any one person.

It's just wierd for bioware to be anti-farming, but yet  make the enemies this way so the only real way to deal with them most of the time is staying stationary and making lookout points. Not really how you want your playerbase to feel - like they are backed into a corner of one playstyle to win. I literally haven't been in ONE game (even playing with friends) in which we have had relative success in gold by moving around. We always camped somehow or in some area and held off there for rounds at a time.

[Alijah Green]

bump