324 réponses à ce sujet

[luciox]

Rio, just got another crash

[FlowCytometry]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

That's it! Hey evereyone, this is the person whom ur supossed to channel all our hate of cheating Geth and stunlocks and Banshees and Phantoms and Vanguard glitches and gun nerfs now!

GOGOGO!

In all serious: I dislike Goddess the most atm. The setting is beautiful. but like Condor and London you can get shot from many angles you wouldn't think possible, and many rooms dont have much in the way of chokepoints or good escape (I also disliked London till the recent Op, where it grew on me a lil; Condor I actually don't mind, oddly- save for the weak ammo crates).

Also, FBW gets mention simply because w/ all the farming runs seeing it is tiring, even not in a farm match (the map itself is fine, just overplayed- ala Glacier)

I also dislike Rio because of crashing there a few times; I'm a bit scared of it. The map would be fine otherwise imo.

Modifié par FlowCytometry, 17 août 2012 - 01:29 .

[sentinel_87]

My least favorite map is easily Rio. It is just one long corridor; very difficult to run around on if enemies spawn on both sides of the map. Other maps I do not like that much are Vancouver and London, both are very drab and plain to look at. On Vancouver it seems almost like two separate maps, teams tend to get separated on it I find. The hack objectives in London and Goddess that are in the open can get very frantic as well.

I do not feel that the harder objectives are detrimental to my experience in the game, but I am pretty easy going with the game. It is actually fun if you have a good group with you and you complete an objective that was hard.

On a side note I hope we get a map for Rannoch. Currently it is the only home world we have seen in the games that does not have a map for multiplayer; the reaper base has some nice visuals and is fairly bright. I actually find that my favorite maps are bright and light; like White, Goddess and Jade.

[Niniva]

Condor and Glacier, really.

[audicdm]

For Condor, I don't care that it's dark...I care about the ridiculous bugs i.e cover issues, enemies shooting through the cover and ammo crates not filling up. Also, the enemies do not respect player position. If you're on the hill with people halfway down the hill...the enemies will spawn between your team.

For every other map that I have issues with it's mostly due to enemy spawns not respecting player position (especially during hack objectives). Example: Reactor - If your team is at the top of the reactor and they get a hack mission in the same location, guess where the enemies will spawn? Right in the middle of the objective...literally on top of your team, and that's ridiculous.

Modifié par audicdm, 17 août 2012 - 01:29 .

[wirelesstkd]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

I like the harder hack objectives. I mean, I HATE them in a way, but I enjoy them, too. So on the whole, I don't dislike and level because it's "hard" or contains "hard objectives." In that sense, I guess I'm not the person you're asking this question to, but I just wanted to pipe up to say that some people don't mind (or even like) the really difficult objectives.

Also, yes, I agree that completing the really hard ones make winning a bit sweeter.

[Alex_Dur4and]

Maps, appreciation and explainations:
P.S. According to me, all ammo boxes should give a least 2 grenades on any difficulty level.

Condor (1/5)
It's a very dark map and enemies get a clear shot at you from almost everywhere. Cover is frequently innadequate because of terrain elevation and because of the general design of the map itself. But what really grinds my gears is ammo boxes. They don't give enough ammo and grenades... That alone is enough to make me hate it! The sceenery is nice though...

Dagger (4/5)
The design is simple but original. The landscape is a bit dull, though...

Ghost (3/5)
I personnaly don't really like this map because of it's design. There are to many separated area with very few accesses. It is easy to get ambushed in tight quarters (by pyros, marauders, phantoms, hunters, etc)

Giant (4/5)
At first, I hated this map because my game would freeze, lag out of control or time out frequently on this level, mainly during the wave 10 upload in the computer room on the other side of the map. Now, I like it! Even if the landscape is little dull.

Glacier (3/5)
It's a small map... a very small map (I wish it was bigger)! Sometimes enemies (like banshees) get stuck on the balcony above the lower section. The fact that it is used for farming on platinum irritates me... but I really like it's design.

Goddess (5/5)
I don't know why... I love this map! It's probably because I like everything about the Asari! lol.

Hydra (3/5)
Sometimes, Atlases will spawn on top of the roof of the room beside the landing zone. Enemies, sometimes, remain at the landing zone, immobile. Their is way to much open space but the control room is a good place to hold the line if need may be.

Jade (4/5)
Beautiful designed and a real challenge. Don't venture downstairs and stay there though... You won't live very long.

London (2/5)
I really don't like this map... It's a big T shaped map with inadequate cover. Most of the objectives are right in the center of it! It's the ultimate troll map! But it looks nice...

Reactor (5/5)
When I started to play this game, I would have given it a 1/5 rating without a doubt. It is now one of my favorites! Lot's of places to hide, it's large and it's challenging without being plain cheap (like London!)

Rio (5/5)
I absolutely do NOT understand why people hate this map... It's like Christmas for grenade users as the boxes frequently contain 2 or 3 grenades per box. There is lots of cover... but no counters! (ok! I understand now...)  It's also a very beautiful map.

Vancouvert (3/5)
I don't really like this map. The ladder in the middle is useless and their is far too much open space. It seems like anywhere you go on this map, you are a sitting duck. Love the city in the background, though...

White (2/5)
It's so small and so easy to complete! It's the ultimate noob farming level... Remove the two counters down stairs and put a few pillars in stead... Mouahahaha! ...It really looks nice though.

[Bhatair]

Condor. The ammo crates sometimes don't give ammo, and they're really spread out which can cause spawn location problems. Oh yeah, spawn location problems.
Also, it's really open and very vertical. It's a neat idea, a map that is more based around having multiple levels but the execution wasn't too spectacular.

9 out of 10 times everyone ends up running everywhere on this map and just gets surrounded.

Also the ammo crates don't always work, did I mention that already?

Modifié par Bhatair, 17 août 2012 - 01:33 .

[Xaijin]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

This makes for good reading material, everyone. Seeing as I'm responsible for at least a few of your most hated levels (though some love them, too), would you mind elaborating a bit on reasons why you dislike certain levels so much for those who haven't?

London: Schizophrenic cover and perhaps the worst hack/escort sight lines in the entire game,which considering that Rio only has med cover for the middle length of the map, is saying something. Very AR and power unfriendly, Geth Platinum is an exercise in getting your face shot off. The fact that cover is scattered and chaotic is lore accurate and prevents cheese, along with the balcony killbox funneling, but still venturing anywhere near the center is asking for an asswhooping unless you're an inf.


Hydra: The aesthetics are great, and the "map room" is amazing, and this map is gigantic pain in the ass to hold. Players trying to hold the LZ is a player problem, not a map problem, but this honestly feels like a UT map where you're supposed to run around strafe killing everything and jumping from ramp to ramp. There's no jumping or strafing in ME.

Condor: Being funneled into the top of the map isn't particularly fun, and it's pretty clear why turians are so grumpy about attacking everything and so pissed off before Shepard shows up, because they make the worst defense works in the galaxy. A bulwark with slanted holes in it every three feet is not a defensible position, it's an enemy's headshot practice gallery. The middle hack objective is beyond awful, almost as bad as glacier's LZ hallway hack. Add in the fact that a team of four can only cross-sight in TWO spots on the BOTTOM of the map where everyone can shoot the **** out of them from high cover and congrats, most annoying map in the game. Turians are idiots.

Rio: Recycled Mars assets not on Mars makes me grumpy. I don't mind the layout personally, but players attempting to bunker in a room that isn't even a room to begin with is just frustrating as hell. Players attempting to hide in the cargo containers is just as annoying.

Modifié par Xaijin, 17 août 2012 - 01:42 .

[BobWalt]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

Effort is fine Frustration is not.  The problem with some maps is the lack of a defensible location for hack jobs with enemies coming from all sides.  Along with this there is poor cover and places that lock you in place so you can not fire out of cover.  It goes beyond effort as it is very frustrating when the group is being mobbed by Banshees and Brutes.  The Reapers are the worst enemies for these maps.

The worst one is Goddess followed by Condor.

And while we are talking about difficulty why is the difficulty delta between bronze and silver so much greater than the difficulty between silver and gold?  Oh and my comments are not based on God level gaming ability but rather average gaming ability.

[DragonRacer]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

Jos,

I'd love to know what maps you created. I will actually buck the trend here and admit that there is actually no map that I hate. Nope, don't hate Condor. Don't hate Reactor. Don't hate Rio or Goddess or any of them. As a lot of my friends can attest, I am a self-proclaimed map "ho" (trying to use a family-friendly version of what I truly call it, LOL). Whenever a new DLC drops, I see so many folks talking about saving up their credits to unlock the new characters, weapons, gears, etc. Me? I want to explore the new maps. While I enjoy a new character or gun as much as the next guy or gal, I am fairly set on my favorite set-up... so I am most excited to take my dearly beloved Turian Sentinel to new locales.

The only map I find occasionally irritating is Condor and that is ONLY because of the glitchy ammo boxes (i.e. I feel like I spend all my between-waves time hitting every ammo box just to find one that will actually, you know, refill my clip).

Personally, I like challenging objectives. That's kind of the point, right? To be challenged, above and beyond just "kill the horde of mooks"? Granted, I mostly play in Silver and occasional Gold, so maybe most of the people bleating on about bad hacks play more Gold and Platinum than I do and, thus, face more failure and frustration. But I really can't think of anything to complain about map-wise other than Condor's stingy ammo boxes and Hydra's ability to eat pizzas when dropped in certain locations.

/butt-kissing  

Modifié par DragonRacer, 17 août 2012 - 01:46 .

[Bhatair]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

Honestly I'd have to agree with that view. Getting a hack in the room with the counters on white is so much easier than say, getting the hack outside where the only cover is the L shaped chest high walls. The difference being when you pull off the second it feels more rewarding.

If every objective was as easy as the first example they'd start feeling like annoyances rather than challenges.

It sucks to get a hack in the middle of the map in giant, sure but it's also the chance to use all of your skills and consumables to pull your squad through.

If I had any issue with the objectives it would be with bugs like the pizza box or Glyph the escort drone falling through the map in certain levels.

[Jos Hendriks]

Thanks everyone so far for sharing your thoughts on the levels. It's great to see almost every level getting both praise and criticism.

BobWalt wrote...

And while we are talking about difficulty why is the difficulty delta between bronze and silver so much greater than the difficulty between silver and gold?  Oh and my comments are not based on God level gaming ability but rather average gaming ability.

I wish I could provide an answer but difficulty scaling between difficulty settings is not something I set up or know much about.

[kyles3]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

I feel like I get punished enough by the store system and some of the randoms I get teamed up with. I don't expect Gold to be a cakewalk, but if I play the right way and still fail on wave 10 because of an impossible hack or disable objective then I feel like that's the wrong kind of challenge. Kind of like the Geth are the wrong kind of challenge--yes, they're challenging, but only because they're cheap. 

[MagicThoughts]

I just hate condor's middle area you can get shot from like 6 different directions and get swarmed easily. plus if you use a geth and turn on hunter mode oh my god it hurts your eyes so badly. lol.But if it comes up while we're playing Unknown I'll play it every now and then.

[Chardonney]

I love all the maps, as well, and I've never had any bugs or glitches in any of them, not even in Rio or London. I only mentioned Glacier because it's a fast paced, blocky and small map, which makes it pain it xxxx for a sniper. I usually just change my character if that's where I'm going.

[VioletEagle]

Reactor is my least favourite, followed by Rio and Ghost

[Das Rouse]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

I think it's good, but only if teamwork is applied.  I know the hack objective inside of the Reactor on FB Reactor definitely requires good teamwork.  I personally hate that one.  I think that is key, and a little luck helps.  I think it does make me feel better once it is done and out of the way.

[YachiruChin]

There are some maps I don't really enjoy.. such as Reactor.

But the one I really really hate is Condor. >=(

[Jos Hendriks]

DragonRacer wrote...

Jos,

I'd love to know what maps you created.

With the caveat that a lot of people work on each individual level, and on the design side some levels get worked on by several designers, I've had a majority stake in Hydra, Goddess, Jade, and London. I've also had a lesser part in all the other DLC MP levels.

[klokked]

Jade. I hate it so much.
I don't like Ghost much either.
I don't like London, Vancouver, or Rio.
Goddess is tolerable, but I'd prefer something else.

[xx DJ ONE xx]

Jos Hendriks wrote...


Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

My opinion -    
Not detrimental at all.
I buy games as much for the challenge they offer as for any other element of play or storyline. In fact I believe that failing an objective that requires skill can be far more fun & engaging than "coasting" to an easy victory. To me the mark of a good game is the level of engagement it offers.

*By the way, thank you (and the rest of the ME team) for your engagement with this community. It's rare that we gamers get a chance to share ideas with the people that create our cherished games & it's clear that you guys don't just think of us as a bunch of $$$$. 

[Chardonney]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

I've had a majority stake in Hydra, Goddess, Jade, and London. I've also had a lesser part in all the other DLC MP levels.

Then I will bow and say thank you for giving us Hydra and London. They are both awesome.

[Chaoswind]

Jos Hendriks wrote...

One of the common comments I see is that certain hack objectives (a lot of them set up by yours truly) are hard/unfair/difficult to hold down. Now, I'm admittedly a sucker for a bit of punishment on the player not necessarily being a bad thing. I feel that if a level has one or two (out of a good few more) objectives that could come up that is more difficult to complete, it adds a bit to the tension of what objective could be coming up, and succeeding feels a bit sweeter.
With that in mind, I'd like to ask:

Do you feel objectives that are harder than others/require more effort are detrimental to your experience overall?

Honestly I hate the darkness of some maps and how the darkness + visual effects can make it imposible to see some enemies (Rage on Reactor, Hunter Mode on Condor, etc)

Regarding Hack zones, they are indeed anoying, yes I can live with it, but is just too unfair when the enemies spawn right next to the hack zone and start to shot at you right away, specially in goddess when you use a missile to clean 3 phantoms and an ATLAS and watch them spawn right away and start to shot at you.

Hackzones spawn locations shouldn't be the ones closest to the hack zone, I know this is important to keep the pressure, but on some maps its just unfair.