216 réponses à ce sujet

[Conniving_Eagle]

fiendishchicken wrote...

Add a high EMS refuse.

My whole issue with the ending is also technical.

Instead of giving a last second choice that decides your outcome, why not just make an ending that is determined from all the choices, morality, and assets collected throughout the trilogy?

Basically none of those matter as is. Make War Assets similar to how the Normandy upgrades worked for the SM in ME2. That would have been so much better and easier. And have the ability to allocate those assets to separate area's of battle.

This is what I wanted.

[Darth Death]

Say that it's free. People like free stuff.

[Nefla]

Post ending DLC or nothing.

But really, I think they'll just cut their losses and market only to those already satisfied, or cancel future DLC due to lack of sales/popularity like with DA2.

[Conniving_Eagle]

I want them to redo the entire Priority:Earth mission, retcon the Catalyst, etc. But the least I will settle for is victory through refusal with sufficient EMS.

[Grub Killer8016]

Post videos on youtube. That's how i saw the EC endings. I got the DLC but was nowhere near to seeing them.

[Conniving_Eagle]

AlanC9 wrote...

Like I said, first paragraph was good, but this one goes off the rails

3DandBeyond wrote...
From Bioware's point of view (they've basically said this) if they do anything to regain the loyalty of those who dislike the EC then they might lose those who like it. I don't think this is true because those who like it are willing to accept almost anything BW does. I don't mean they have lower standards, I think many of them don't think complaining is good and that game companies always make mistakes and that the endings were made better for free and that's awesome. Many of them do have high standards of loyalty, too-an admirable trait. They may have low expectations or just don't care that much about game endings or the EC was really ok for them. We are all wired differently..

The reason we're divided is that the proposals being made to "fix" the endings are seen as genuinely bad. I could recap the reasoning, but the essential point is that a high EMS refuse -- which seems to be the proposed fix du jour  -- means abolishing the facts of the situation so Shepard and his player don't have to make a tough decision. And some of us like having to make tough decisions in games.

I hope you understand enough about the ending to realize that those are very poor 'tough decisions.'

Modifié par Conniving_Eagle, 28 juillet 2012 - 08:04 .

[Conniving_Eagle]

Darth Death wrote...

Say that it's free. People like free stuff.

Free doesn't fix anything. It may be a show of good faith on Bioware's part, but I doubt it will win back many people's loyalty. That is, if the DLC doesn't affect the ending. If they're going to make free DLC that doesn't change the ending they are wasting resources and money. It is better to include a DLC that also alters the ending and charge money for it from their standpoint.

[Conniving_Eagle]

Nefla wrote...

Post ending DLC or nothing.

But really, I think they'll just cut their losses and market only to those already satisfied, or cancel future DLC due to lack of sales/popularity like with DA2.

I hope they don't.

This problem is so incredibly easy to fix.

[3DandBeyond]

AlanC9 wrote...

Like I said, first paragraph was good, but this one goes off the rails

3DandBeyond wrote...
From Bioware's point of view (they've basically said this) if they do anything to regain the loyalty of those who dislike the EC then they might lose those who like it. I don't think this is true because those who like it are willing to accept almost anything BW does. I don't mean they have lower standards, I think many of them don't think complaining is good and that game companies always make mistakes and that the endings were made better for free and that's awesome. Many of them do have high standards of loyalty, too-an admirable trait. They may have low expectations or just don't care that much about game endings or the EC was really ok for them. We are all wired differently..

The reason we're divided is that the proposals being made to "fix" the endings are seen as genuinely bad. I could recap the reasoning, but the essential point is that a high EMS refuse -- which seems to be the proposed fix du jour  -- means abolishing the facts of the situation so Shepard and his player don't have to make a tough decision. And some of us like having to make tough decisions in games.

Some of you do and some of us don't want to be forced into it with no logical reason for it.  That is the promise that existed in  the games up until the ending.  The ending is like a totally new game.  If you didn't like a high EMS refuse possible win ending who would be forcing you to buy that DLC and play it?  How would it hurt you?  But you would force me to accept something I abhor in a game series that never was like that and one that I've loved.  Remember, I want to like it again.  I need a way back in order to still like it as you do.  I wouldn't ever presume to say you should be forced into some ridiculous nonsensical happy ending, so why would you determine it's ok for you and BW to force me into what I see as nonsensical and gratuitously abhorrent immoral endings?  I don't mind making tough decisions.  I do mind being called upon to make insane and immoral ones.  That's how I see them.  And I have no way out.  But if BW made a way out for me through DLC, you would not have to buy it.

Case in point.  I bought the Arrival.  That is the first inkling that someone thinks no win genocidal scenarios are fun.  I don't play it anymore.  I don't want that in a game.  In no other place in the game was ME like this and in no other place is ME like the end.  That is the world ME was set in.  If the game had been called, "demented ways to save the galaxy" I would have expected it and not played it.  But it was called ME3 and the 3 means it should logically follow and explain the main events of the story that came before and that it should fit in with it.

Mac Walters wanted the galaxy to be destroyed at the end-he said it would be a wasteland.  The Arrival was to show how and why.  The original endings showed it did happen.  Retconning on twitter tried to say it wasn't true.  The EC announcement tried to say we were silly for thinking it happened.  At this point, BW wouldn't know the truth if it fell on their heads because they believe they can retcon the real world like they can a story in one of their games.

The only way they could get those that dislike the endings to maybe consider buying new DLC is to substitute their best marketing tool for some of the other tools at BW-Shepard and use one of two 2 word names for the DLC:  Shepard Lives or Conventional Victory.  And you would not be forced to buy either one.

[Darth Death]

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Darth Death wrote...

Say that it's free. People like free stuff.

Free doesn't fix anything. It may be a show of good faith on Bioware's part, but I doubt it will win back many people's loyalty. That is, if the DLC doesn't affect the ending. If they're going to make free DLC that doesn't change the ending they are wasting resources and money. It is better to include a DLC that also alters the ending and charge money for it from their standpoint.

Why not both? Why not change the endings & release them free? That would send shockwaves. 

[3DandBeyond]

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Nefla wrote...

Post ending DLC or nothing.

But really, I think they'll just cut their losses and market only to those already satisfied, or cancel future DLC due to lack of sales/popularity like with DA2.

I hope they don't.

This problem is so incredibly easy to fix.

If they do this they have effectively killed 2 (3 with SWTOR) franchises.  They could redeem themselves if DA3 is really good and they address mistakes with good ME3 DLC.  I don't see it, but anything could happen.

[chuckles471]

It will be the first real opportunity to see if the ending huhah, has done any damage to the brand.


It is harder to get people to download something when it's not free, even if they pander to people who hate the ending. EA will have a number and if the dlc doesn't match that, I can see no more dlc for ME3. Like what happened to DA2, they just cut their losses and start the next game.

[Conniving_Eagle]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Nefla wrote...

Post ending DLC or nothing.

But really, I think they'll just cut their losses and market only to those already satisfied, or cancel future DLC due to lack of sales/popularity like with DA2.

I hope they don't.

This problem is so incredibly easy to fix.

If they do this they have effectively killed 2 (3 with SWTOR) franchises.  They could redeem themselves if DA3 is really good and they address mistakes with good ME3 DLC.  I don't see it, but anything could happen.

I am highly doubtful that DA3 will be remarkable. That is an optimistic promise people have made themselves in hopes that Bioware will acheive redemption. DA3 will likely combine elements from DA2 and DA:O with a few new, small surprises; nothing groundbreaking.

DA2 and ME3 have made it clear which direction the studio is going in. But hey, we can still apply the '3 strikes' rule.

[chidingewe8036]

Nefla wrote...

Post ending DLC or nothing.

But really, I think they'll just cut their losses and market only to those already satisfied, or cancel future DLC due to lack of sales/popularity like with DA2.

I hope this happens because Bioware is stupid, Casey messed up his own franchise, good job buddy roflmao

[Conniving_Eagle]

Darth Death wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Darth Death wrote...

Say that it's free. People like free stuff.

Free doesn't fix anything. It may be a show of good faith on Bioware's part, but I doubt it will win back many people's loyalty. That is, if the DLC doesn't affect the ending. If they're going to make free DLC that doesn't change the ending they are wasting resources and money. It is better to include a DLC that also alters the ending and charge money for it from their standpoint.

Why not both? Why not change the endings & release them free? That would send shockwaves. 

It would indeed.

Personally,

If Bioware fix the endings, I am reluctantly willing to trust them again.

If Bioware fix the endings and create the full musical of Scientist Salarian, they have won back my trust 100%

[Robhuzz]

ME3 had enough quality to trust in BioWare writing itself. I simply do not believe BioWare can do a good job with EA meddling in development. Assure me that EA didn't have a hand in the development of the new DLC (by having a proper dev time for starters and don't focus so much on lame advertising campaigns) and I have no doubt the DLC can be good. If it is, I might even purchase it...

[PanzerGr3nadier]

Nefla wrote...

Post ending DLC or nothing.

You honestly think they would make it so soon??

I don't think BW is going to market it to the people that are not interested in it.

I'm buying it and before you start to bash me; The ending sucks, there is no getting away from it. But hey, You can create your own headcanon and forget the BW's vision.

[Conniving_Eagle]

You guys should support the Puzzle Theory social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13110654/3

[chidingewe8036]

chuckles471 wrote...

It will be the first real opportunity to see if the ending huhah, has done any damage to the brand.


It is harder to get people to download something when it's not free, even if they pander to people who hate the ending. EA will have a number and if the dlc doesn't match that, I can see no more dlc for ME3. Like what happened to DA2, they just cut their losses and start the next game.

Love these types of posts...........Bioware just says "SCREW IT becuase we screwed ourselves in thinking our fans would accept such a crap fest ending."

They should just forget it because they are not going to give the majority of fans what they want or wish for via dlc so what is the point of even creating some stupid random mission based dlc and charge for it becuase i am telling you guys right now if it does not add content to our ME2 squad they aren t getting my money for nothing guaranteed. I will just watch some fanboy/girl who will purchase anything Mass Effect related post it on YouTube and save my money lol.

[AlanC9]

3DandBeyond wrote...
Some of you do and some of us don't want to be forced into it with no logical reason for it.  That is the promise that existed in  the games up until the ending.  The ending is like a totally new game.  If you didn't like a high EMS refuse possible win ending who would be forcing you to buy that DLC and play it?
  How would it hurt you?  

Well, while such a DLC would trash the coherence of the game world, you're quite right that it wouldn't have any effect on my game world since I wouldn't buy it. I have never opposed making a DLC that makes the game worse as long as that DLC isn't bundled with something I actually want. Back when the EC was being designed this was a live issue; you were around here when the battle lines were drawn around "happy endings," right? As I repeatedly said, I had no problem with a happy ending DLC as long as it was separate from the EC, since I did want the EC and didn't want a happier ending. I kinda sorta lost that fight, since I would have preferred it if the relays stayed destroyed. OTOH, that only really made sense in Destroy, and I don't play that ending anyway.

But you would force me to accept something I abhor in a game series that never was like that and one that I've loved.

Ummm... no. I'm not in a position to force anything on you, unless the sheer intellectual and rhetorical force of my ridicule of a victorious Refuse ending causes Bio to abandon doing one. I don't think that's likely, mostly because Bio has no intention of doing one anyway.

Although my interests might be better served by having Bio write you off as a customer. What you want from games seems to be quite different from what I want from games, so if you and everyone likes you storms off in a huff and vows never to buy any Bio product again, this could concevably work for me. But I'm not playing that sort of long game, and in any event, like I said, I don't think I have any influence on Bio.

[dirty console peasant]

quite easily actually. JUST FIX THE GODDAM ENDING.

[chidingewe8036]

Bioware eats those fan boys/girls that purchase anything and everything Mass Effect for lunch mmmmmmmm good.

I admit I am one of those people for the simple reason that I was stupid enough to purchase the Collector's Edition for me and my brother in law so I fell into their trap. Then we get this crappy final product. So I paid twice as much for a turd game. Just laugh at me now you guys don't fall into the same trap by purchasing dlc just because its Mass Effect I beg you lol.Don't give them any more self confidence.

[chidingewe8036]

Shepard Cmdr wrote...

quite easily actually. JUST FIX THE GODDAM ENDING.

Amen brother Amen tell'em

[Atakuma]

You don't. A lot of people claiming they will not buy DLC probably will, and those who won't are not worth the effort.