209 réponses à ce sujet

[AppealToReason]

These ideas are all terrible. All you "restrictions" guys will be the same ones crying when no one enters your lobby because no one meets the criteria. Remember the N7 matchmaking you all wanted? And then hated?

[j_plemons]

thenotsothinman wrote...

Lots of games have the hardest difficulties locked for the start. You have easy and normal, then you have to beat the game to unlock hard and insane. Why should the co-op mode be different?

Exactly

[SMichelle]

j_plemons wrote...


That is another excellent idea, and thank you for taking the time to post it.  Perhaps I will give that a try.  It certainly can not be any more time consuming then this (and I bet I get less hate pm's from people I have booted too!)

Honestly, I hope you do.  You're not the first person to complain about who enters your Platinum lobby (which is why I only play Gold and Platinum with friends - I know my limitations ) and I think you'd have a lot more fun playing as well. 


Good Luck.

[rmccowen]

thenotsothinman wrote...

Lots of games have the hardest difficulties locked for the start. You have easy and normal, then you have to beat the game to unlock hard and insane. Why should the co-op mode be different?

There's no reason it has to be, but any system has to start by figuring out a fair and objective metric for determining how good someone is. It can't be number of matches completed at X difficulty level, because (as noted multiple times upthread) it's pretty easy to farm or be carried through any number of matches, even when you're not otherwise ready for prime time. It can't be gear or classes, because of microtransactions and the RNG structure--no one to see players buying their way into higher difficulties, nor being excluded because (for example) the store decides it's only dropping rare gear for you this month. It's well recognized around here that N7 rank is pretty pointless, since it only takes into account the number of promotions, and not where you earned the XP.

(In fact, BW effectively gated all lobbies by N7 for a while, a couple of months ago. It was a disaster that drastically lengthened the time to find a match, and didn't improve match quality at all.)

The problem isn't that it's simply impossible to implement a fair gate, but no one here has suggested one. All of the available and easily constructed metrics for performance have large and obvious problems.

[thenotsothinman]

rmccowen wrote...

thenotsothinman wrote...

Lots of games have the hardest difficulties locked for the start. You have easy and normal, then you have to beat the game to unlock hard and insane. Why should the co-op mode be different?

There's no reason it has to be, but any system has to start by figuring out a fair and objective metric for determining how good someone is. It can't be number of matches completed at X difficulty level, because (as noted multiple times upthread) it's pretty easy to farm or be carried through any number of matches, even when you're not otherwise ready for prime time. It can't be gear or classes, because of microtransactions and the RNG structure--no one to see players buying their way into higher difficulties, nor being excluded because (for example) the store decides it's only dropping rare gear for you this month. It's well recognized around here that N7 rank is pretty pointless, since it only takes into account the number of promotions, and not where you earned the XP.

(In fact, BW effectively gated all lobbies by N7 for a while, a couple of months ago. It was a disaster that drastically lengthened the time to find a match, and didn't improve match quality at all.)

The problem isn't that it's simply impossible to implement a fair gate, but no one here has suggested one. All of the available and easily constructed metrics for performance have large and obvious problems.

Wouldn't having a prerequisite of extracting on the previous difficulty say five times or something be better than nothing at all?  Wouldn't you agree that anyone that can contribute anything to a gold or platinum team sould have no problem beating silver a few times?

At least that way you would know that other players had put some time and effort into the game and should know the basics of how thing work.

[Rudenut]

Sevrun wrote...

j_plemons wrote...

Because kicking the same scrubs with lvl 4 rare weapon and no equipment mods playing drell adept over and over and over again for 30 minutes is tiring.

Sure, as soon as you elitists get off your snobby horses and grow up.  kay?

Why does everyone keep using that term?  Is it elitist to want to finish a map?  When 2 of 4 ppl on a team have no business (skillwise) in a gold match, much less a plat match they are essentially griefing players that can hack it.  N7 rank means nothing.  I don't promote, my n7 is 990, I can roll with any shooter (power classes are a bit more troublesome).  That being said, there are people who join gold and plat knowing they can't hack it and expect to be carried...alot of them.  When half the team is made up of ppl who need a bit more experience, it makes it impossible for the other 2 guys, who are skill appropriate not neccessarily elite, fail. 

[j_plemons]

Rudenut wrote...

Sevrun wrote...

j_plemons wrote...

Because kicking the same scrubs with lvl 4 rare weapon and no equipment mods playing drell adept over and over and over again for 30 minutes is tiring.

Sure, as soon as you elitists get off your snobby horses and grow up.  kay?

Why does everyone keep using that term?  Is it elitist to want to finish a map?  When 2 of 4 ppl on a team have no business (skillwise) in a gold match, much less a plat match they are essentially griefing players that can hack it.  N7 rank means nothing.  I don't promote, my n7 is 990, I can roll with any shooter (power classes are a bit more troublesome).  That being said, there are people who join gold and plat knowing they can't hack it and expect to be carried...alot of them.  When half the team is made up of ppl who need a bit more experience, it makes it impossible for the other 2 guys, who are skill appropriate not neccessarily elite, fail. 

My sentiments exactly.

Modifié par j_plemons, 29 juillet 2012 - 05:44 .

[SSPBOURNE]

theillusiveman11 wrote...

Make it N7 ranking based. 6,000 minimum to play Platinum.

What if you don't want to promote your characters a million times?

[Schneidend]

I hear the Friends List and Private Lobby features have a lot of synergy.

[j_plemons]

Schneidend wrote...

I hear the Friends List and Private Lobby features have a lot of synergy.

Both of which are negated if no friends are online.  What if you play odd hours and cant connect with your friends?   If you speak a different language then other players?   Skill is not diminished in either scenario, however the proclivity of other players to befriend one might be.

[Schneidend]

j_plemons wrote...

Both of which are negated if no friends are online.  What if you play odd hours and cant connect with your friends?   If you speak a different language then other players?   Skill is not diminished in either scenario, however the proclivity of other players to befriend one might be.

Sounds like a series of personal problems, and not something for which Bioware is responsible. They've given you the tools. Whether you utilize them or not is not anybody's concern but your own.

[rmccowen]

thenotsothinman wrote...

Wouldn't having a prerequisite of extracting on the previous difficulty say five times or something be better than nothing at all?  Wouldn't you agree that anyone that can contribute anything to a gold or platinum team sould have no problem beating silver a few times?

Yes: everyone that can contribute meaningfully to a Gold+ run can beat Silver. But the converse isn't necessarily true: not everyone who has beaten Silver can contribute meaningfully to a Gold match. In fact--admittedly speculating based on a handful of anecdotes--I'd bet there are lots of people who can farm FBWGG who can't contribute meaningfully even to a Silver match.

At least that way you would know that other players had put some time and effort into the game and should know the basics of how thing work.

That's really my point. It's hard to find any single, easily measured quantity that says person X is capable of playing difficulty Y. Any metric you come up with risks either excluding a substantial number of people who are actually good enough, or (worse, from the perspective of the OP) including a lot of people who aren't good enough, but have simply been persistent and/or lucky enough to make it through a handful of matches.

[j_plemons]

Schneidend wrote...

j_plemons wrote...

Both of which are negated if no friends are online.  What if you play odd hours and cant connect with your friends?   If you speak a different language then other players?   Skill is not diminished in either scenario, however the proclivity of other players to befriend one might be.

Sounds like a series of personal problems, and not something for which Bioware is responsible. They've given you the tools. Whether you utilize them or not is not anybody's concern but your own.

The multiplayer mode in this game was included as a novelty, but has proved to be highly popular.  This said, bioware has been faithful in including more functionality to make the game more enjoyable for the playerbase.  A more refined matchmaking system is a hallmark of a more polished game, and yes gated difficulty is part of that.  I dont feel as if I am wrong for wanting this, as I have paid my hard earned $$$ to purchase not only this, but other bioware products.  I am well within my rights to create this post petitioning for this.  If you disagree that is also your right.

Judging from several responses to this post, and several other posts, I am not alone in this.

Modifié par j_plemons, 29 juillet 2012 - 06:02 .

[Schneidend]

You're perfectly within your rights to post this suggestion. But, as you say, I'm perfectly within my rights to point out how stupid your suggestion is. Nothing requires you to play Platinum with randoms. In fact, the game provides systems for avoiding exactly that. You're just not using them.

[SkreeMalicious]

Gazz66666 wrote...

Nah. Typhoon is waaay too common now.

Players must have Brilliant Surge X to play Platinum.

lol i laughed



I could see a minimum of N7 500 atleast... but in reality it should be something like, complete 25-40 gold matches or something, atleast

Modifié par SkreeMalicious, 29 juillet 2012 - 06:05 .

[JerZey CJ]

j_plemons wrote...

I can think of only one reason why people would be opposed to this idea...

Because it's a ridiculous, elitist idea, thought of only to boost your epeen to show that "lol i r so bettah than u scrub n00bz!"?

Modifié par JerZeyCJ2, 29 juillet 2012 - 06:07 .

[j_plemons]

It is a ridiculous, elitist idea, that is in most other multiplayer games for a reason. People become frustrated, quit playing, and quit spending money on games that force you to carry others to the detriment of the team. If this is a foreign concept to you I suggest you play a team sport for a while to find out how they work.

[PaladinEagle]

This is a problem without a solution me thinks, I'll play mostly silver without any problems, gold is a push, but fun when I want a challenge. That said I know my limitation and Platinum is reserved for me and my friends I don't want or expect to be carried (too much).

[Schneidend]

j_plemons wrote...

It is a ridiculous, elitist idea, that is in most other multiplayer games for a reason. People become frustrated, quit playing, and quit spending money on games that force you to carry others to the detriment of the team. If this is a foreign concept to you I suggest you play a team sport for a while to find out how they work.

"Most other multiplayer games"? Name three.

[Mysteryman2000]

theillusiveman11 wrote...

Make it N7 ranking based. 6,000 minimum to play Platinum.

I am N7 450 and I don't promote, I'd kick your in game score out the water without trying.  And I don't like playing with randoms.  If there is one thing I hate is carrying a whol bunch of randoms to the end of extraction because they don't know how to use cover or medi-gel or missiles.

[j_plemons]

Mysteryman2000 wrote...

theillusiveman11 wrote...

Make it N7 ranking based. 6,000 minimum to play Platinum.

.  If there is one thing I hate is carrying a whol bunch of randoms to the end of extraction because they don't know how to use cover or medi-gel or missiles.

Exactly

[Nicator]

A question for all the people who keep questioning how a bad loadout can be recognized: Here's a rough description of someone I had the pleasure of playing with:
- N7 rank below 120
- Level 15 N7 Slayer
- Claymore II with only a Smart Choke
- Using an SMG Amp and no consumables
Would you want this guy in your Gold/Platinum game?
(Hint: On Gold he managed to score an average two to three thousand points per round.)

[j_plemons]

Schneidend wrote...

j_plemons wrote...

It is a ridiculous, elitist idea, that is in most other multiplayer games for a reason. People become frustrated, quit playing, and quit spending money on games that force you to carry others to the detriment of the team. If this is a foreign concept to you I suggest you play a team sport for a while to find out how they work.

"Most other multiplayer games"? Name three.

Diablo 3
World of Warcraft and other MM0s have "tiers" of PVP based on characters "level"
Do I need to list the other MMOs?

[thenotsothinman]

rmccowen wrote...

thenotsothinman wrote...

Wouldn't having a prerequisite of extracting on the previous difficulty say five times or something be better than nothing at all?  Wouldn't you agree that anyone that can contribute anything to a gold or platinum team sould have no problem beating silver a few times?

Yes: everyone that can contribute meaningfully to a Gold+ run can beat Silver. But the converse isn't necessarily true: not everyone who has beaten Silver can contribute meaningfully to a Gold match. In fact--admittedly speculating based on a handful of anecdotes--I'd bet there are lots of people who can farm FBWGG who can't contribute meaningfully even to a Silver match.

At least that way you would know that other players had put some time and effort into the game and should know the basics of how thing work.

That's really my point. It's hard to find any single, easily measured quantity that says person X is capable of playing difficulty Y. Any metric you come up with risks either excluding a substantial number of people who are actually good enough, or (worse, from the perspective of the OP) including a lot of people who aren't good enough, but have simply been persistent and/or lucky enough to make it through a handful of matches.

You made good points and I don't disagree.  I'm not saying I have the answer but thats not to say there isn't an answer.  If nothing esle there should be a way to keep N7 1 level player trying their first match ever on gold. I have seen lots of players with single digit N7 levels on gold.  I know as much as anyone that N7 overall is meaningless, (mine is only N7 450~ because I've only promoted to help the operations that required promotion) but N7 1 sould start on bronze.

One thing that would held would be to take away the ability to search for random difficulty.  I think most should agree with that.