287 réponses à ce sujet

[Applepie_Svk]

maaaze wrote...

at what cost...it is stated in game that he did that.

Your speculations did that ...

[Omega2079]

maaaze wrote...

Omega2079 wrote...

If the Catalyst has no power (a direct or even indirect way to force physical action), how was the first Reaper created?

It states that they (beings turn into the Reaper) didn't approve. If you don't approve, you don't accept. If you don't accept, it means you're forced.

I think he had control over the keepers. and the keepers had control over the citadel.

But the Protheans changed the signal. so now he has no control.

They keepers wiped out an entire race? A race capable of the resource managment needed to build the first reaper?

[Ticonderoga117]

maaaze wrote...
We only see that the catalyst powers down...we don´t know if this coursed by the crucible...or if the Crucible got damaged.

Any weapons fire directed at the Crucible would likely make it explode, violently, like the cruiser in the first mission. Now, since the Cruicible is an eezo core on steroids, that explosion would be MASSIVE.

The game over screen before the EC suggests that the crucible was destroyed through the inaction by shaperd.
(if you waited to long. Shooting the Catalyst is interpreted by the game as refuse...taking no action)

Again, MASSIVE explosion, and why are the Reapers shooting at it anyway? Is GlowBoy suicidal or something?

I think he indirectly controls him...like i said...his only power is controling the reapers.

You think? He out right says "I control them."!
It's not like "Oh, I give them suggestions." or "I give them orders, but they sometimes ignore me."
No, they are his pawns. Period.

It is clearly shown that he has no control over the citadel. (shaperd opens the arms, Soverign.)

But he operates the "Evelator to Heaven" and he makes the arms open wider.
Your Soverign example isn't valid because he didn't exist back then, which is why he is a HORRIBLE addition to the narrative.

[Mazebook]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

maaaze wrote...

at what cost...it is stated in game that he did that.

Your speculations did that ...

No he said that they were turned into a reaper against their will...but reapers enjoy being a reaper...so reprogramming seems to be a part of this process.

[Memnon]

maaaze wrote...

He has no imidiate direct control over the reapers. (their goals are programmed /indoctrinated and thats it)
Besides this the only thing he maybe capable of is to program the keepers. 

I'm so tired of this argument. From the game itself, this is a direct quote:

Shepard: I need to stop the Reapers. Do you know how I can do that?
Catalyst: Perhaps. I control the Reapers. They are my solution

How the heck did he harvest his creators if he can't control the Reapers? 

Modifié par Stornskar, 29 juillet 2012 - 07:47 .

[Applepie_Svk]

This thread is atleast funny, you are start falling very deeply in your own speculations ...

[Isichar]

*Headdesk*

Ok I am out. Way too much headcanon.

[Thaa_solon]

ha LOL

[AresKeith]

he's right and were wrong

[Mazebook]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

maaaze wrote...
We only see that the catalyst powers down...we don´t know if this coursed by the crucible...or if the Crucible got damaged.

Any weapons fire directed at the Crucible would likely make it explode, violently, like the cruiser in the first mission. Now, since the Cruicible is an eezo core on steroids, that explosion would be MASSIVE.

The game over screen before the EC suggests that the crucible was destroyed through the inaction by shaperd.
(if you waited to long. Shooting the Catalyst is interpreted by the game as refuse...taking no action)

Again, MASSIVE explosion, and why are the Reapers shooting at it anyway? Is GlowBoy suicidal or something?

I think he indirectly controls him...like i said...his only power is controling the reapers.

You think? He out right says "I control them."!
It's not like "Oh, I give them suggestions." or "I give them orders, but they sometimes ignore me."
No, they are his pawns. Period.

It is clearly shown that he has no control over the citadel. (shaperd opens the arms, Soverign.)

But he operates the "Evelator to Heaven" and he makes the arms open wider.
Your Soverign example isn't valid because he didn't exist back then, which is why he is a HORRIBLE addition to the narrative.

You think? He out right says "I control them."!
It's not like "Oh, I give them suggestions." or "I give them orders, but they sometimes ignore me."
No, they are his pawns. Period. 

I said indirectly...i think he controls them indirectly...meaning he simply changes their goals...maybe even without their knowlege... I don´t think the reapers are fully aware of the catalyst.

Any weapons fire directed at the Crucible would likely make it explode, violently, like the cruiser in the first mission. Now, since the Cruicible is an eezo core on steroids, that explosion would be MASSIVE. 

Does not have to be that way...maybe energy just disolves if the crucible breaks...you would have to shoot the trigger...which is the citadel...to set it of.

an interesting related article 

A block of C4 plastic explosive can withstand a rifle shot without exploding. You can even set one on fire without too much worry.  [...]
 Here's how it works: A power source—usually a few batteries—provides an electrical charge that sets off a tiny explosion in one part of the detonator. This sets off another, somewhat bigger charge, which in turn ignites the payload of C4 or TNT. If a bullet were to strike the detonator, it could easily set off the more-volatile explosives stored inside. 

Modifié par maaaze, 29 juillet 2012 - 07:57 .

[Applepie_Svk]

AresKeith wrote...

he's right and were wrong

[Mazebook]

Omega2079 wrote...

maaaze wrote...

Omega2079 wrote...

If the Catalyst has no power (a direct or even indirect way to force physical action), how was the first Reaper created?

It states that they (beings turn into the Reaper) didn't approve. If you don't approve, you don't accept. If you don't accept, it means you're forced.

I think he had control over the keepers. and the keepers had control over the citadel.

But the Protheans changed the signal. so now he has no control.

They keepers wiped out an entire race? A race capable of the resource managment needed to build the first reaper?

The keepers always had control over the citadel...they maintained it...so they had control.

[Mazebook]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

he's right and were wrong

would you please not picture spam...thank you.

[Memnon]

Just to be clear, when we question the logic from the game we're told to look closely at the narrative. When we do look at the narrative and quote it directly, we are told to think about what they really meant instead of what the narrative literally says?

[wantedman dan]

I love when people pass off their headcanon as fact.

[Mazebook]

Stornskar wrote...

maaaze wrote...

He has no imidiate direct control over the reapers. (their goals are programmed /indoctrinated and thats it)
Besides this the only thing he maybe capable of is to program the keepers. 

I'm so tired of this argument. From the game itself, this is a direct quote:

Shepard: I need to stop the Reapers. Do you know how I can do that?
Catalyst: Perhaps. I control the Reapers. They are my solution

How the heck did he harvest his creators if he can't control the Reapers? 

like i said...we do not know how much he is in control...he never demonstrated it.

I think he has no imidiate control...i don´t think he can assume control.

[Mazebook]

wantedman dan wrote...

I love when people pass off their headcanon as fact.

like what?

[wantedman dan]

maaaze wrote...

He has no imidiate direct control over the reapers. (their goals are programmed /indoctrinated and thats it)

This.

Besides this the only thing he maybe capable of is to program the keepers.

This.

that is all...he is no god...he is just a limted A.I.

Can't forget about this.

think of him as Steven Hawking who does a lot of thinking to solve his problems but requires help from outside to execute them.

This too.

In the final moments he has no power. Shaperd has all the power, if he is willing to use it.

And ultimately, this.

[Mazebook]

Stornskar wrote...

Just to be clear, when we question the logic from the game we're told to look closely at the narrative. When we do look at the narrative and quote it directly, we are told to think about what they really meant instead of what the narrative literally says?

just not assume you know everything...only go from what is stated.

control has many ways of achiving it...the indirect way is in my opinion the most likly...because reapers are known to indoctrinate...which is indirect.

[dreman9999]

Isichar wrote...

OP likes his headcanon.

Tell me when does the game actually talk about the catalysts specific capabilitys?

When the catalyst tells you. You have that option to ask him post-ec.

[dreman9999]

He is all the reapers at one. Legion in ME2 does state that the reapers work via consensus.

As he describes it:
"One ship, one will, many minds. Like the geth."

That runs along the line from the catalyst.
" I am the collective intelligence of the reapers."

Him have not power over what the crucible does is spot on.

[dreman9999]

Applepie_Svk wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

he's right and were wrong

But he is right. The catalyst has not power over what the crucible does . Even it says so.

[AresKeith]

dreman9999 wrote...

Applepie_Svk wrote...

AresKeith wrote...

he's right and were wrong

But he is right. The catalyst has not power over what the crucible does . Even it says so.

um I wasn't agreeing with the Catalyst or Maaaze

[Mazebook]

wantedman dan wrote...

maaaze wrote...

He has no imidiate direct control over the reapers. (their goals are programmed /indoctrinated and thats it)

This.

Besides this the only thing he maybe capable of is to program the keepers.

This.

that is all...he is no god...he is just a limted A.I.

Can't forget about this.

think of him as Steven Hawking who does a lot of thinking to solve his problems but requires help from outside to execute them.

This too.

In the final moments he has no power. Shaperd has all the power, if he is willing to use it.

And ultimately, this.

He has no imidiate direct control over the reapers. (their goals are programmed /indoctrinated and thats it)  

I forgot to say ...i think... before that statement.

Fact is we don´t know how far his control goes...if it is direct or indirect.


The rest are not headcannons they are conclusion which originated form the evidence.
Shaperd opening the arms.
Him not able to trigger the crucible.
Reapers showing personality and individuality.

[Memnon]

dreman9999 wrote...

He is all the reapers at one. Legion in ME2 does state that the reapers work via consensus.

As he describes it:
"One ship, one will, many minds. Like the geth."

That runs along the line from the catalyst.
" I am the collective intelligence of the reapers."

Him have not power over what the crucible does is spot on.

So he does have control over the Reapers