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[plfranke]

I don't know why MB did that. He seems dead set on starting arguments with the control and synthesis supporters right now.

[RavenEyry]

Restrider wrote...

Oh, and one poster said that the IT would have more plotholes than literal POV.

I've seen that so many times, they must think saying it enough will make it true.

[paxxton]

MB's thread was locked 7 hours ago.

[Eryri]

ElSuperGecko wrote...

Restrider wrote...
I just skimmed over MB's thread. I have to say that I do not really support such actions. If some players do not like this kind of interpretation we established here, so be it. You are not going to change that by opening threads provoking flame wars. In the best case scenario, nothing will be gained. In the worst case, you shed a bad light onto the supporters of this thread.

Agreed.  What drew me to the Indoctrination Theory thread in the first place was the civilised discussion of the story of Mass Effect 3 and the various interpretations of the endings.  We look at the game, the various sequences, cutscenes and conversations and try to find meaning in them.  We try to make sense of what we've been given.

There's no reason or need to deliberately provoke others into arguments, even if others are trying to do that to us.  It's counterproductive.

Agreed. As frustrating as the "ITers are all zealots" taunts can be, there's nothing to be gained in looking for trouble. 

I don't think we need to worry that the anti-IT crowd will scare Bioware away from following their original plans (assuming IT was their original plan). 

Let's face it, this is the third incarnation of the IT thread and its over eleven hundred pages! I think it's clear to Bioware and everyone else what the most passionately supported theory is.

[Rifneno]

RavenEyry wrote...

Restrider wrote...

Oh, and one poster said that the IT would have more plotholes than literal POV.

I've seen that so many times, they must think saying it enough will make it true.

I know, right?  I've never seen a single one of them actually LIST these supposed plot holes.  Aside from Vendetta not detecting indoctrination in Shepard because they don't understand IT means he's not indoctrinated yet.

[Restrider]

plfranke wrote....

Secondly, I did not say that IT opened plotholes, I said it left an unfinished story. Of course, they can finish the story. However, the point was to say that finishing the story a year after it comes out is not a great way to treat your fans.

No, you get me wrong! I was not referring to you or someone posting in this thread, but someone posting in MB's thread "Why do you hate IT?".

[plfranke]

Restrider wrote...

plfranke wrote....

Secondly, I did not say that IT opened plotholes, I said it left an unfinished story. Of course, they can finish the story. However, the point was to say that finishing the story a year after it comes out is not a great way to treat your fans.

No, you get me wrong! I was not referring to you or someone posting in this thread, but someone posting in MB's thread "Why do you hate IT?".

ahh my bad!

[Restrider]

Anyways, does something like an IT FAQ already exist? If not, I strongly recommend to create one.

Modifié par Restrider, 01 octobre 2012 - 11:50 .

[plfranke]

Rifneno wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

Restrider wrote...

Oh, and one poster said that the IT would have more plotholes than literal POV.

I've seen that so many times, they must think saying it enough will make it true.

I know, right?  I've never seen a single one of them actually LIST these supposed plot holes.  Aside from Vendetta not detecting indoctrination in Shepard because they don't understand IT means he's not indoctrinated yet.

Not that Vendetta should be taken as the be all end all of indoctrination detection. Where was he when the prothean civilization fell? Not to mention, he could be a Reaper trap, himself. He does foreshadow the Catalyst afterall. I always found it wierd that the Reapers had no interest in where Shepard was going. In a literal interperetation, the Reapers are as obvlivious to the Crucible as literalists are to points for IT. It's as if they try not to see it.

Edit: I meant where Shepard was going when he was on Thessia

Modifié par plfranke, 01 octobre 2012 - 11:54 .

[Restrider]

Rifneno wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

Restrider wrote...

Oh, and one poster said that the IT would have more plotholes than literal POV.

I've seen that so many times, they must think saying it enough will make it true.

I know, right?  I've never seen a single one of them actually LIST these supposed plot holes.  Aside from Vendetta not detecting indoctrination in Shepard because they don't understand IT means he's not indoctrinated yet.

I think you must feel like this.

[masster blaster]

I did it not to provok them, or tell them to go to our side. No I just needed some info on what there agruments are, so I can make counter argument with using what evidence we have on here.

[Norlond]

Wow, 300 new pages, i am NOT gonna read all that

Well, I'm back, could someone please sum up the last 2 weeks? Just IT stuff pls, already know about Trilogy, Omega, Ray and Greg leaving...

btw, most of Ireland is quite nice, but the prices... (4,50€ for a whopper?? )

[masster blaster]

Also I just needed to know why they Hate IT, but without using the same staments every time. No I wanted them to list why they hate IT, and now that I have the info I can use it against them if they come here. Also todays my birthday, and that means Cookie cake.

[DoomsdayDevice]

I have suggested an IT FAQ several times, but we can't seem to agree on what evidence is junk (unlimited ammo, for one) and what isn't.

Does anyone else think that when TIM says his dying line, that he's seeing something that we don't see?

"There... Earth. I wish you could see it like I do, Shepard. So... perfect."

Perfect? It's being completely destroyed. Really makes me think TIM is seeing something that we don't see. Kind of reminds me of the synthesis/control slideshows at the end.

Thoughts?

Modifié par DoomsdayDevice, 01 octobre 2012 - 12:04 .

[ThisOneIsPunny]

plfranke wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

Restrider wrote...

Oh, and one poster said that the IT would have more plotholes than literal POV.

I've seen that so many times, they must think saying it enough will make it true.

I know, right?  I've never seen a single one of them actually LIST these supposed plot holes.  Aside from Vendetta not detecting indoctrination in Shepard because they don't understand IT means he's not indoctrinated yet.

Not that Vendetta should be taken as the be all end all of indoctrination detection. Where was he when the prothean civilization fell? Not to mention, he could be a Reaper trap, himself. He does foreshadow the Catalyst afterall. I always found it wierd that the Reapers had no interest in where Shepard was going. In a literal interperetation, the Reapers are as obvlivious to the Crucible as literalists are to points for IT. It's as if they try not to see it.

Edit: I meant where Shepard was going when he was on Thessia

Likely because they were one step ahead nearly the whole time (Cerberus).

Oh hey speaking of terrible endings, totally reminded me of the first Borderlands and how vague THAT was (here is a boss. You kill boss. Yey \\o/ now cut to satellite orbiting pandora.) and then Borderlands 2 comes out...

[RavenEyry]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I have suggested an IT FAQ several times, but we can't seem to agree on what evidence is junk (unlimited ammo, for one) and what isn't.

I keep saying nothing is junk unless it is factually wrong. Every potential clue is just that, only potentially. If we're gonna drop the infinite ammo because it might not be a clue, we may as well drop everything because they all have alternate explanations even if some are stronger than others.

Dream foliage was droped because it appears on grissom station for instance, that is a factual error, the infinite ammo is not.

[Rifneno]

plfranke wrote...

Not that Vendetta should be taken as the be all end all of indoctrination detection. Where was he when the prothean civilization fell? Not to mention, he could be a Reaper trap, himself. He does foreshadow the Catalyst afterall. I always found it wierd that the Reapers had no interest in where Shepard was going. In a literal interperetation, the Reapers are as obvlivious to the Crucible as literalists are to points for IT. It's as if they try not to see it.

Edit: I meant where Shepard was going when he was on Thessia

Yep.  The fact that you can put indoctrinated rachni into the Crucible and it changes nothing, that alone just screams the Crucible is their doing.  The Reapers know the Crucible is being built, and almost certainly know where.  But they don't do anything about it.

Speaking of Vendetta, have you ever noticed that the Temple of Athame has one of the most obvious "ringing in the ears" sounds in the game?  Yeah, I don't trust Vendetta for a second.

[masster blaster]

My badger friend That is 100% correct they know about the crucible. If they knew that in the most recent cycles, they build the crucible, then why not go to mars first, since they were comming that way in the first place. If the Crucible was a threat to them, then why not Indoctrinate someone, that is a prime target of being selected to build the Crucible and have at it at that.

[pseudonymic]

wow, this whole time away and nothing new?

[Dwailing]

Rifneno wrote...

plfranke wrote...

Not that Vendetta should be taken as the be all end all of indoctrination detection. Where was he when the prothean civilization fell? Not to mention, he could be a Reaper trap, himself. He does foreshadow the Catalyst afterall. I always found it wierd that the Reapers had no interest in where Shepard was going. In a literal interperetation, the Reapers are as obvlivious to the Crucible as literalists are to points for IT. It's as if they try not to see it.

Edit: I meant where Shepard was going when he was on Thessia

Yep.  The fact that you can put indoctrinated rachni into the Crucible and it changes nothing, that alone just screams the Crucible is their doing.  The Reapers know the Crucible is being built, and almost certainly know where.  But they don't do anything about it.

Speaking of Vendetta, have you ever noticed that the Temple of Athame has one of the most obvious "ringing in the ears" sounds in the game?  Yeah, I don't trust Vendetta for a second.

And how can Shepard magically sense the presence of a Prothean beacon?  Now that I think about it, it seems a bit weird.

[masster blaster]

DD You may be right. But that could also imply Destroy. Think about it in Destroy everything is perfect. People are rebuilding, and no Synthetics are being created/ no cycle restarting. It's perfect, yet Shepard wakes up from it. It's like the high you ems the more your Shepard will power starts to rise again.

When looking back when Shepard starts to shoot the red tube Shepard can't shoot straight, but as he, or she get's closer. He, or she regains apart of his/her mind, and remembers those most important to him/her. Also I am beginning to wonder if Thans slide when picking your choice, is like a warning. It could mean that the path you are taking is wrong, because most of the time in Destroy we see EDI, but when you have low/mid EMS you see Thane.

[Restrider]

Maybe thanks to the Cipher?

[zioninzion]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I have suggested an IT FAQ several times, but we can't seem to agree on what evidence is junk (unlimited ammo, for one) and what isn't.

Does anyone else think that when TIM says his dying line, that he's seeing something that we don't see?

"There... Earth. I wish you could see it like I do, Shepard. So... perfect."

Perfect? It's being completely destroyed. Really makes me think TIM is seeing something that we don't see. Kind of reminds me of the synthesis/control slideshows at the end.

Thoughts?

Perhaps that line is referring to how he sees Earth as a much better place than any other place and hence why humans are better than others hence why they need to control the reapers for mankind?

Sorry bout the 10,00- hences:lol:

[plfranke]

Dwailing wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

plfranke wrote...

Not that Vendetta should be taken as the be all end all of indoctrination detection. Where was he when the prothean civilization fell? Not to mention, he could be a Reaper trap, himself. He does foreshadow the Catalyst afterall. I always found it wierd that the Reapers had no interest in where Shepard was going. In a literal interperetation, the Reapers are as obvlivious to the Crucible as literalists are to points for IT. It's as if they try not to see it.

Edit: I meant where Shepard was going when he was on Thessia

Yep.  The fact that you can put indoctrinated rachni into the Crucible and it changes nothing, that alone just screams the Crucible is their doing.  The Reapers know the Crucible is being built, and almost certainly know where.  But they don't do anything about it.

Speaking of Vendetta, have you ever noticed that the Temple of Athame has one of the most obvious "ringing in the ears" sounds in the game?  Yeah, I don't trust Vendetta for a second.

And how can Shepard magically sense the presence of a Prothean beacon?  Now that I think about it, it seems a bit weird.

My God that scene is just like in Leviathan when Shepard gets taken control of. And I didn't even think about the Rachni thing. Great catch. There are also several times where you can see Reapers clearly in vicinity of the Crucible and they're not attacking it at all.

[RavenEyry]

The fact that Leng got to vendetta first then left only to arrive again at an inconvenient moment is what makes me so suspicious of vendetta. In fact, cerberus agents beat you to every source of crucible info.