BansheeOwnage wrote...
Do you know that for a fact?Xilizhra wrote...
But that makes no sense either. First of all, how, when Kenson lacks implants? Second, why? Assume direct control for something she was going to do anyway, namely imprison Shepard? Did he control her to ensure she did it badly?
Yes. Because Rho indoctrinates very slowly. The Project didn't even start until after Rho was found, and it was finished before the indoctrination came into full effect.You know what has hallucinations as a symptom? Indoctrination. Besides, you're saying Object Rho indoctrinates the facility but not Shepard specifically?
Xilizhra wrote...
Object Rho had some kind of knockout field effect that may have had similar properties to indoctrination without actually giving the full package of it, and left a temporary lingering vision effect. Or maybe Shepard just hallucinated that while falling unconscious.1. How is that possible, without being partially indoctrinated him/herself?
spotlessvoid wrote...
BatmanTurian wrote...
spotlessvoid wrote...
Would anybody here really expect IT DLC if Mike Gamble himself said it wasn't coming?
I'd call him a liar to his face and then say " I'll let your art speak for itself when I see it."
I'd be pissed it took this long but I'd move on and still consider buying future Bioware products, and wouldnt rage at them. If the DLC cycle comes and goes and there is nothing then I'll no longer be a customer. I can.accept screw ups and vague bs, but I cant accept outright deception
TIM isn't vouched for by VIs. And "partial indoctrination" doesn't immediately zap one into severe waking hallucinations without one of the more brain-melting signals being sent to induce that.spotlessvoid wrote...
Also, Xil admits TIM can be partially indoctrinated, but that's impossible for Shep though.
Interesting, but why would Harbinger only assume control for that specific instant?"The third discovery is that the object
broadcasts signals and information on many different spectra. One such
pulse, suspected to be similar to a quantum entanglement communicator,
reaches into Reaper territory. Another broadcast is infrasound,
consistent with frequencies that trigger feelings of awe and fear in
humans, a known factor in Reaper indoctrination."
It's like the Leviathan artifacts, they allow the Reapers control from dark space.
Modifié par Xilizhra, 20 octobre 2012 - 04:16 .
Xilizhra wrote...
I'm gleaning Harbinger's motive from all the times it's struck to kill. Which is all of them, except when it could only act through Object Rho and couldn't use lethal force to begin with.
Modifié par Bill Casey, 20 octobre 2012 - 04:17 .
Why on earth (or in space) would the kid let the reapers destroy the crucible while Shepard is choosing one of his 3 "solutions"???Xilizhra wrote...
And how, pray, does it make less sense?Them not shooting it makes no sense. Conversely, them shooting it while Shepard is deciding makes less sense.
'Bill Casey wrote...
Xilizhra wrote...
I'm gleaning Harbinger's motive from all the times it's struck to kill. Which is all of them, except when it could only act through Object Rho and couldn't use lethal force to begin with.
"Preserve Shepard's body if possible"
“Neutralize Commander Shepard.”
“Shepard, you could have been useful.”
“Shepard, submit now.”
“You do not yet comprehend your place in things.”
“You cannot escape your destiny, Shepard.”
“Why do you resist us, Shepard?”
I think it's because the Reapers are still stuck on the Catalyst's harvest solution, which is why the Crucible needs to launch that huge blue beam to bring them all under the Shepard-Catalyst's control, instead of Shepard just uploading into the Citadel without needing the Crucible at all.Why on earth (or in space) would the kid let the reapers destroy the crucible while Shepard is choosing one of his 3 "solutions"??
Modifié par Xilizhra, 20 octobre 2012 - 04:20 .
"Shepard, I always survive."Bill Casey wrote...
Xilizhra wrote...
I'm gleaning Harbinger's motive from all the times it's struck to kill. Which is all of them, except when it could only act through Object Rho and couldn't use lethal force to begin with.
"Preserve Shepard's body if possible"
“Neutralize Commander Shepard.”
“Shepard, you could have been useful.”
“Shepard, submit now.”
“You do not yet comprehend your place in things.”
“You cannot escape your destiny, Shepard.”
“You are arrogant, Shepard, you will learn.”
“Why do you resist us, Shepard?”
Modifié par spotlessvoid, 20 octobre 2012 - 04:22 .
What about in Arrival where Harbinger had every opportunity to kill Shepard but chose not to, even allowing Shepard to escape because of his unwillingness to kill him?Xilizhra wrote...
'Bill Casey wrote...
Xilizhra wrote...
I'm gleaning Harbinger's motive from all the times it's struck to kill. Which is all of them, except when it could only act through Object Rho and couldn't use lethal force to begin with.
"Preserve Shepard's body if possible"
“Neutralize Commander Shepard.”
“Shepard, you could have been useful.”
“Shepard, submit now.”
“You do not yet comprehend your place in things.”
“You cannot escape your destiny, Shepard.”
“Why do you resist us, Shepard?”
None of those are inconsistent with Harbinger killing Shepard.I think it's because the Reapers are still stuck on the Catalyst's harvest solution, which is why the Crucible needs to launch that huge blue beam to bring them all under the Shepard-Catalyst's control, instead of Shepard just uploading into the Citadel without needing the Crucible at all.Why on earth (or in space) would the kid let the reapers destroy the crucible while Shepard is choosing one of his 3 "solutions"??
Illusive Man avatar for the win!Restrider wrote...
If you ask yourself why I changed my avatar, I have to say that this thread lacked a certain classiness, although there are people here with nice avatars aswell (Home Run, Badger, TSA, Otter and even Xil to name a few). Since there was no Illusive Man in this thread I thought that I may fill that role.
What I'm saying is that it makes no sense for Harbinger to indoctrinate Shepard when Shepard could just be vaporized, and even if it did have some reason for doing so, Shepard would be completely screwed upon waking up due to being Harbinger's immediate prisoner, and having no way of escape from indoctrination. Moreover, no one's ever broken free of indoctrination after already being indoctrinated, enough to do anything except kill themselves.plfranke wrote...
@X
So you use the argument that "Illusive Man wasn't indoctrinated back then" but you fight tooth and nail against Shepard not being fully indoctrinated until the beam run?
Because Harbinger had less control over the asteroid than you seem to think.What about in Arrival where Harbinger had every opportunity to kill
Shepard but chose not to, even allowing Shepard to escape because of his
unwillingness to kill him?
Modifié par Xilizhra, 20 octobre 2012 - 04:22 .
I think if Xil doesn't get that VI's are fallible (and irrelevant here) there is no hope of convincing him/her that Harbinger wants Shepard alive.plfranke wrote...
What about in Arrival where Harbinger had every opportunity to kill Shepard but chose not to, even allowing Shepard to escape because of his unwillingness to kill him?
1. Just like no one had ever returned from the Omega-4 relay. No one stopped the reaper vanguard before. No one united a galaxy before. The list goes on.Xilizhra wrote...
What I'm saying is that it makes no sense for Harbinger to indoctrinate Shepard when Shepard could just be vaporized, and even if it did have some reason for doing so, Shepard would be completely screwed upon waking up due to being Harbinger's immediate prisoner, and having no way of escape from indoctrination. Moreover, no one's ever broken free of indoctrination after already being indoctrinated, enough to do anything except kill themselves.plfranke wrote...
@X
So you use the argument that "Illusive Man wasn't indoctrinated back then" but you fight tooth and nail against Shepard not being fully indoctrinated until the beam run?Because Harbinger had less control over the asteroid than you seem to think.What about in Arrival where Harbinger had every opportunity to kill
Shepard but chose not to, even allowing Shepard to escape because of his
unwillingness to kill him?
Guest_magnetite_*
AresKeith wrote...
magnetite wrote...
Just finished reading about Paul Grayson's indoctrination process in the Retribution novel. Quite interesting. Well, maybe not the torturing part, but the details and such.
Don't you wish Bioware used that Kai Leng, instead of Deception's Kai Leng?
Modifié par magnetite, 20 octobre 2012 - 04:29 .
We only see Kenson's eyes, and they're only yellow once, right as Shepard is falling unconscious, while Kenson is giving an order that Harbinger clearly didn't need to be controlling her to give.plfranke wrote...
What do you mean he had less control over the asteroid? Everyone had yellow eyes and Shepard was surrounded by Harbinger's henchmen but they chose to spare him. That was Harbinger's influence.
Ah, yes, more hypocrisy from the one who can't accept Control being possible because NPCs disagreed with it. Or Synthesis, for that matter.1. Just like no one had ever returned from the Omega-4 relay. No one stopped the reaper vanguard before. No one united a galaxy before. The list goes on.
Because Kenson is an idiot.If Harbinger wanted Shepard dead, why didn't he kill him/her while Shepard was unconscious for two days and thus completely at his mercy?
Xilizhra wrote...
Misinterpreted. Vendetta's line on Cronos Station is "You are attempting to rescue me from indoctrinated forces?" This would meaningless if Shepard was indoctrinated. And Prothean VIs, like Vigil, can always sense indoctrination.
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