80611 réponses à ce sujet

[TSA_383]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Rosewind wrote...

I am going to say this now to everyone Please do not post DLC spoilers some of us actually want to be suprssed when they play it.

DLC spoilers? Does that mean there's a dlc out?

No, it means that I keep leaking major plot points and not warning people first.
Sorry Rosewind 

[HellishFiend]

We received another lockdown eh? No love for our multi-millennial speculation threads....

[Rosewind]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Rosewind wrote...

I am going to say this now to everyone Please do not post DLC spoilers some of us actually want to be suprssed when they play it.

DLC spoilers? Does that mean there's a dlc out?

No I mean people keep talking about scripts and stuff of it.

[Starbuck8]

Hello Indoctrination Theory Mark III!

K back to catching up on the posts.

[FellishBeast]

Haha not again xD

We shall rise again, like cockroaches! You cannot get rid of us, BSN!

Watch this.

[lex0r11]

FellishBeast wrote...

Haha not again xD

We shall rise again, like cockroaches! You cannot get rid of us, BSN!

Watch this.

The hell are you talking about? I had you in the last list.

[masster blaster]

masster blaster wrote...

You know I always found it funny that in the Destroy ending, weather or not it's high or low Hackett does not mention anything about Shepard, but in the Control/Synthesis they do. Also in refuse Liara does not even mention Shepard, who she herself wanted to put Shepard in the time capsule if they failed. So it's wither Bioware forgot to add that, or Liara did not mention Shepard at all.

Speculations anyone?

[TheConstantOne]

Anyone else think it would be interesting if helping Leviathan causes him to appear and start messing with the Starchild in the final scene? It would be intriguing to see a showdowon of sorts between Harbinger (who stands for the extinction of countless species and the enslavement of the galaxy's evolutionary cycle) and Leviathan (standing for the freedom of the galaxy's evolution). The paragon Reaper vs the renegade Reaper

[TheConstantOne]

Wayning_Star wrote...

actually the IT'ers have a point that Shep was indoctrinated before he was aboard the citadel. It's the only way the catalyst can communicate with organic life. All the dream scenes were the symptoms of indoctrination, as Sheps mind became accustomed to the wavelength, of sorts, of this channel. Very over powering, could even destroy Sheps sanity. The fact that Shep underwent trauma every time he encountered a form of reaper strong enough to emmit that signal,almost put Shep in the throws of indoctrination.

But something is different about Shepard, for some reason he can withstand it, barely, and able to communicate directly with the catalyst during their meeting. It always bugged me that these visions were always confused in Shepards mind, from the first beacon encounter to the time he was wisked up to the citadel. Who prepped Shepard for that. Getting strafed by a reaper molten metal beam isn't bad enough, to being removed from your body and end up where they take organics to get harvested,without getting reduced to random atoms is a strange thing.

Shep had to be in some sort of trancelike state on the ground, his intellect taken up that beam(kind of like when they harvest the DNA and memories) to talk it over and decide.In a sense, Shepard was indoctrinated, but only enough to be in state capable of surviving direct contact with the catalyst computer AI, who appears to be just memory of Shepards dream state. It's understandable that the IT folks feels that the whole thing is a sham and trap. The only hole there is that if the catalyst wished to just 'take over' Shep, why not use direct control? Cause it said that the IM wasn't able to control cause he was truely indoctrinated. Like Saren, unable to resist and keep their independent 'self' as it were.

just a theory taken from the game facts I experienced...

I think the reason for this is that the direct control trick requires the puppet to be cybernetically enhanced or altered in some way.  Consider Saren and the Collectors.  Sovreign "augmented" Saren by essentially replacing a good portion of him with cybernetics.  That's why, when Saren is killed by Shepard for the first time, Sovreign can assume direct control of the corpse and you fight a skeletal cyborg as the final boss.  The Collectors were altered extensively both genetically AND cybernetically (as Mordin says, many fundamental pieces of themselves and their society was replaced by tech.)

Indoctrination seems to work via nanites altering brain chemistry.  These nanites have been shown to create cybernetic alterations to a body (this is talked about in one of the ME novels) but Shepard hasn't been indoctrinated to this point yet nor are his cybernetics designed to allow such a control feature.  His strong willpower has helped keep him on the correct path and resist Reaper influences but the fight has been a long one and the end of the game takes us to Shepard's breaking point.  Whether he breaks or not is up to whether he can successfully escape Harbinger's/the Reaper collective's final illusion.  

[masster blaster]

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

[KJSync]

TheConstantOne wrote...

Anyone else think it would be interesting if helping Leviathan causes him to appear and start messing with the Starchild in the final scene? It would be intriguing to see a showdowon of sorts between Harbinger (who stands for the extinction of countless species and the enslavement of the galaxy's evolutionary cycle) and Leviathan (standing for the freedom of the galaxy's evolution). The paragon Reaper vs the renegade Reaper

I don't know if Leviathan is paragon... but it would be nice if he play some role in the ending not just something related to dialogs with Starchild.

[Chriz Tah Fah]

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

[paxxton]

FellishBeast wrote...

Haha not again xD

We shall rise again, like cockroaches! You cannot get rid of us, BSN!

Watch this.

That's some psychedelic mood.

EDIT: LOL. I checked a few other videos on your channel. Seems you're smoking too much.

Modifié par paxxton, 31 juillet 2012 - 02:34 .

[Wayning_Star]

TheConstantOne wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

actually the IT'ers have a point that Shep was indoctrinated before he was aboard the citadel. It's the only way the catalyst can communicate with organic life. All the dream scenes were the symptoms of indoctrination, as Sheps mind became accustomed to the wavelength, of sorts, of this channel. Very over powering, could even destroy Sheps sanity. The fact that Shep underwent trauma every time he encountered a form of reaper strong enough to emmit that signal,almost put Shep in the throws of indoctrination.

But something is different about Shepard, for some reason he can withstand it, barely, and able to communicate directly with the catalyst during their meeting. It always bugged me that these visions were always confused in Shepards mind, from the first beacon encounter to the time he was wisked up to the citadel. Who prepped Shepard for that. Getting strafed by a reaper molten metal beam isn't bad enough, to being removed from your body and end up where they take organics to get harvested,without getting reduced to random atoms is a strange thing.

Shep had to be in some sort of trancelike state on the ground, his intellect taken up that beam(kind of like when they harvest the DNA and memories) to talk it over and decide.In a sense, Shepard was indoctrinated, but only enough to be in state capable of surviving direct contact with the catalyst computer AI, who appears to be just memory of Shepards dream state. It's understandable that the IT folks feels that the whole thing is a sham and trap. The only hole there is that if the catalyst wished to just 'take over' Shep, why not use direct control? Cause it said that the IM wasn't able to control cause he was truely indoctrinated. Like Saren, unable to resist and keep their independent 'self' as it were.

just a theory taken from the game facts I experienced...

I think the reason for this is that the direct control trick requires the puppet to be cybernetically enhanced or altered in some way.  Consider Saren and the Collectors.  Sovreign "augmented" Saren by essentially replacing a good portion of him with cybernetics.  That's why, when Saren is killed by Shepard for the first time, Sovreign can assume direct control of the corpse and you fight a skeletal cyborg as the final boss.  The Collectors were altered extensively both genetically AND cybernetically (as Mordin says, many fundamental pieces of themselves and their society was replaced by tech.)

Indoctrination seems to work via nanites altering brain chemistry.  These nanites have been shown to create cybernetic alterations to a body (this is talked about in one of the ME novels) but Shepard hasn't been indoctrinated to this point yet nor are his cybernetics designed to allow such a control feature.  His strong willpower has helped keep him on the correct path and resist Reaper influences but the fight has been a long one and the end of the game takes us to Shepard's breaking point.  Whether he breaks or not is up to whether he can successfully escape Harbinger's/the Reaper collective's final illusion.  

The codex in the game doen't mention any nano tech, just subliminal and extrasensory sound stuff.  The nanites would be more believeble, to me anyway.  Nanites are definitely used during harvesting, they reduce victims on the collector ship. Shep, has some inate ablity to communicate with reaper stuff, and the catalyst creator tech for some reason,from the start. This kind of puts a damper on the IT, as Shep has an edge on it. Ahead of the game, in that regard, the 'why' is the mystery though...

addendum: wiki

""
The precise mechanics of the indoctrination effect are poorly understood. It is believed that the Reapers generate an electromagnetic field, waves of infrasound and ultrasound, or both in order to stimulate areas of a victim's brain and limbic system. The resulting effect varies depending on the intent of the Reaper: the victim may suffer headaches and hallucinations, have feelings of "being watched" or paranoia, or come to view the Reaper itself with superstitious awe. Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signal, manifesting as voices within the victim's mind.
Rana Thanoptis, an asari neuroscientist on Virmire, goes into more detail. She describes indoctrination as a subtle whisper you can't ignore, that compels you to do things without knowing why. Over days, perhaps a week of exposure to Sovereign's signal, the subject stops thinking for themselves and just obeys, eventually becoming a mindless servant. That was the fate of Rana's predecessor, who became her first test subject, and the captured salarians who had once been Captain Kirrahe's men.
But as Saren Arterius discovered during his research into indoctrination at the facility, there is a balance between control and usefulness. The more control Sovereign has over a person, the less capable they become. Saren realized that to keep his mind free of Sovereign's control, he had to make himself an invaluable resource. He believed that Sovereign would allow him a reprieve from indoctrination, because the Reaper needed Saren's mind intact to find the Conduit.
The mental damage from indoctrination is severe and permanent. As Shepard saw, the captured salarians on Virmire had been turned into shambling husks, who either attacked on sight or just stood awaiting orders. Only people with immense mental strength are able to resist indoctrination, and even then, only for a short time. Matriarch Benezia used her abilities to keep a 'haven' in her mind free of indoctrination, hoping for a chance to use it, but this meant she was effectively trapped in her own mind, watching in horror as she committed atrocities on Saren's orders. When mortally injured on Noveria, a despairing Benezia refused Shepard's offer of help and chose to die, saying "I am not myself, I never will be again."
The only person who fully escaped indoctrination's grip was Shiala, but her case was unique; Sovereign's control was supplanted by the Thorian's when she was exchanged for the Cipher, which ended with the Thorian's demise—a scenario unlikely to be repeated.
Ironically, Sovereign's indoctrination may have led to its undoing. After the attack on Virmire, when Shepard told Saren he had been indoctrinated without realizing it, Saren's resolve began to falter and he started questioning what he was doing. To keep Saren loyal, Sovereign put cybernetic implants in Saren's body and used those implants to influence and control the former Spectre. Saren found his loyalty to Sovereign's cause greatly strengthened, although he wasn't a brainless slave and could still be reasoned with. When Saren died, the Reaper somehow used the implants to reanimate his corpse and fight Shepard. Because Sovereign was focusing a significant portion of energy to control Saren, the Reaper fell off balance by losing shields and became vulnerable with the destruction of its avatar. With its shields down, the Alliance Navy was able to destroy the Reaper. Although the rest of the Reapers during the invasion don't seem to suffer from this flaw, notable when Harbinger assumes direct control of a Collector Drone.

http://masseffect.wi.../Indoctrination

Modifié par Wayning_Star, 31 juillet 2012 - 02:31 .

[masster blaster]

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

???????

[KJSync]

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

I saw too 

[paxxton]

Brazukka wrote...

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

I saw too 

whatisthaalabou?

[masster blaster]

paxxton wrote...

Brazukka wrote...

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

I saw too 

whatisthaalabou?

Got a clue Paxxton, on what they are saying?

[KJSync]

masster blaster wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Brazukka wrote...

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

I saw too 

whatisthaalabou?

Got a clue Paxxton, on what they are saying?

GW

[TSA_383]

Brazukka wrote...

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

I saw too 

TheConstantOne wrote...

Anyone else think it would be interesting if helping Leviathan causes him to appear and start messing with the Starchild in the final scene? It would be intriguing to see a showdowon of sorts between Harbinger (who stands for the extinction of countless species and the enslavement of the galaxy's evolutionary cycle) and Leviathan (standing for the freedom of the galaxy's evolution). The paragon Reaper vs the renegade Reaper

 
Can you imagine a more irrelevant place for shepard than in a pitched reaper battle?
*Pulls out predator*
*fires*
*neither of the reapers notice*

[masster blaster]

Brazukka wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Brazukka wrote...

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

I saw too 

whatisthaalabou?

Got a clue Paxxton, on what they are saying?

GW

Ya so what's wrong with GW.

[byne]

TSA_383 wrote...

TheConstantOne wrote...

Anyone else think it would be interesting if helping Leviathan causes him to appear and start messing with the Starchild in the final scene? It would be intriguing to see a showdowon of sorts between Harbinger (who stands for the extinction of countless species and the enslavement of the galaxy's evolutionary cycle) and Leviathan (standing for the freedom of the galaxy's evolution). The paragon Reaper vs the renegade Reaper

 
Can you imagine a more irrelevant place for shepard than in a pitched reaper battle?
*Pulls out predator*
*fires*
*neither of the reapers notice*

To be fair, even a husk will barely notice if you shoot it with a Predator.

[paxxton]

masster blaster wrote...

Brazukka wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Brazukka wrote...

Chriz Tah Fah wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

I guess everyone is off playing MP. Oh well back to watching Gundam Wing.

Did anyone else see what I think I am seeing? 

I saw too 

whatisthaalabou?

Got a clue Paxxton, on what they are saying?

GW

Ya so what's wrong with GW.

Maybe they think you're too young to watch Gundam Wing cause it's from 1995.

[Arian Dynas]

munnellyladt wrote...

You know what I'm thinking,
What if bioware did plan this whole thing but to keep the speculating and attention for the game going.

As in releasing every single piece of dlc before revealing the "true"ending to make the game game a long lasting one,instead of just playing through a game once and say"done,on to the next one".

-.- been saying exactly this for quite some time now. -.-

[paxxton]

@Arian: You let that Banshee instakill you. But the fight was epic. You stood alone for quite a time. On Gold!

Modifié par paxxton, 31 juillet 2012 - 02:46 .