80611 réponses à ce sujet

[masster blaster]

Well Leon we know Javik would pick Destroy hands down. So would EDI, and Tali, Ash, Kadin,Liara,Garrus,Hackett, Anderson, Wrex, Grunt, Samara, Mordin, Thane, Legion,Miranda,Jacob,Zaeed,Kasumi, Kirrha,Vega,and everyone else in the galaxy. Honest why do you think Bioware didn't want your LI, or your Squad mates/Anderson with you.

Because Reapers are trying to Indoctrinate Shepard. First Harbinger had to get rid of the squad you had with you when running to the Conduit beam. If Harbinger were to kill them it would make the player only pick Destroy, unless you save the base, then in low EMS. The Reapers have the upper hand on you.

Now After Shepard get"s knocked out. Harbinger knows he has little time to Indoctrinate Shepard before the rest of Hammer/ sword arrives, so we get to Rapid Indoctrination in Synthesis. Slow Indoctrination in Control, but for Destroy we do a virus sweep.


What I mean is that as I watch the endings I saw in Destroy that when the Reapers are going down, and the husk getting turn to ash. I couldn't help wonder if we Destroyed the Indoctrination hold on Shepard.


If you think back there are three people that Represent Control, Synthesis, and Refuse.


Kenson=Refuse didn't want to stop the Reapers became Indoctrinated.

Saren=Synthesis wanted to unite Organics and Synthetics to savve everyone from the Reapers.Indoctrinated

TIM= Control wanted to use the Reapers for Humanitys gain is Indoctrinated.

No body really has been fighting Indoctrinateion/ the Reapers.

Grason was, but he got Red Sand into his system causing his willpower to fall flat.

That's what's happeneing to Shepard. Shepard is badly wounded and he/she is all alone with Harbinger the master of Indoctrinateion/ Reaper Leader. But for real guys. Everyone thinks that we can never beat the Reapers, and they are nice once you get to know them, but everyone that says this is Indoctrinated oe being Indoctrinated.

Also um something just hit me. Leviathans saw themselves as gods right, and the pinncle of Evoultion. Harbinger is made from the Leviathans right, and what does he call his race. " We are the Pinnicle of Evoultion."

The Catalyst at the end considers it's kind as the top dog of Evoultion, and if you remember Nazar Sovig also said they are the Apex of evolution.

Now isn't funny that the Catalyst the so called protector of Organics is name calling it's race the pinnicle of Evoultion. Really people and in Synthesis it is inevitable that we will reach Synthesis. If it is then let it happen over time.

Oh and guys did Kenson have Indoctrinated eyes? Because if she didn't, then maybe that's what happened to Shepard in refuse. If Shepard refuses, then the Reapers/Harbinger can't make Shepard what they wanted to do, and now he/she is a mindless tool for the Reapers, and he/she wouldn't make a good agent because Shepard would tell everyone not to attack the Reapers. Just like the Alliance leaders did.

[NebuchadnezzaRT]

Just a quick question, after the Cerberus Coup, during the conversation where you decide if your VS gets back on the Normandy, Ashley says some important dialogue regarding Indoctrination, "How do you fight something that can worm it's way into your head?" Just for reference, does anyone remember what Kaiden says? Haha where is DD and the quote compilation?

[NebuchadnezzaRT]

@masster Kenson had thhe "assuming direct control Harbinger" eyes.

[Linkforlife]

Here is an interesting watch for those interested. Note that I am not forcing anyone to watch it, but I found it interesting. Be warned if you do watch it, there are multiple parts about 25 minutes long each.

EDIT: something I would like to mention is that I watch these videos to see if I can find explanations to what the commentator is saying,

Modifié par Linkforlife, 30 octobre 2012 - 01:45 .

[demersel]

Yeah - those are old news. Not to mention that they are done poorly.

[Linkforlife]

After rewatching the videos by smudboy, I realized that there could be an explanation other than the Indoctrination Theory, I am not sure if it has been brought up before, but the idea is that Shepard has be undergoing post-traumatic stress syndrome during ME3.

Here is an article about it, there are similarities between the symptoms and what Shepard is undergoing throughtout ME3: http://www.nejm.org/...98712243172604.

EDIT: I realize now after talking to a few people on this thread that the PTSD thing is a mistake on my part, but it could actually be a valid IT theory argument, note that I do not believe it could work, but your mileage my vary.

Modifié par Linkforlife, 30 octobre 2012 - 02:28 .

[demersel]

 And what  the exact couse for the PTSD would be? 
After rewatching videos by smudboy, I just realized that there could be an explanation other that the Indoctrination Theory, I am not sure if it has been brought up before, but the idea is that Mass Effect 3, along with Mass Effect 2, and some parts of Mass Effect 1 is just written badly. 

Here is an article about it, there are some similarities between the examples and some plot points and conversations in ME1, ME2 and ME3:
instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/writsamp0.htm

[Linkforlife]

demersel wrote...

 And what  the exact couse for the PTSD would be? 
After rewatching videos by smudboy, I just realized that there could be an explanation other that the Indoctrination Theory, I am not sure if it has been brought up before, but the idea is that Mass Effect 3, along with Mass Effect 2, and some parts of Mass Effect 1 is just written badly. 

Here is an article about it, there are some similarities between the examples and some plot points and conversations in ME1, ME2 and ME3:
instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/writsamp0.htm

The idea of it is to go back to the dreams, and how they "could" be just that, dreams. PTSD victims also have dreams similiar to the ones Shepard was having. Although, the rest of the IT theory is still up for debate. I would also like to point out that I agree with the poor writing aspect for some parts.

[demersel]

Linkforlife wrote...

The idea of it is to go back to the dreams, and how they "could" be just that, dreams. PTSD victims also have dreams similiar to the ones Shepard was having. Although, the rest of the IT theory is still up for debate. I would also like to point out that I agree with the poor writing aspect for some parts.

PTSD victims have a trigger event. What was the trigger event for shepard? Say the answer to that qiestion out loud to hear how stupid it sounds.

[Linkforlife]

demersel wrote...

Linkforlife wrote...

The idea of it is to go back to the dreams, and how they "could" be just that, dreams. PTSD victims also have dreams similiar to the ones Shepard was having. Although, the rest of the IT theory is still up for debate. I would also like to point out that I agree with the poor writing aspect for some parts.

PTSD victims have a trigger event. What was the trigger event for shepard? Say the answer to that qiestion out loud to hear how stupid it sounds.

The trigger event could have been Horizon, or Shepard dying in ME2, or how about Thessia? There are a lot of parts that could have triggered it, or how about even going so far back as ME1 when you picked Shepard's background and military history: Sole Survivor, s/he watched their whole unit get wiped out by a Thresher Maw.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Linkforlife wrote...

demersel wrote...

 And what  the exact couse for the PTSD would be? 
After rewatching videos by smudboy, I just realized that there could be an explanation other that the Indoctrination Theory, I am not sure if it has been brought up before, but the idea is that Mass Effect 3, along with Mass Effect 2, and some parts of Mass Effect 1 is just written badly. 

Here is an article about it, there are some similarities between the examples and some plot points and conversations in ME1, ME2 and ME3:
instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/writsamp0.htm

The idea of it is to go back to the dreams, and how they "could" be just that, dreams. PTSD victims also have dreams similiar to the ones Shepard was having. Although, the rest of the IT theory is still up for debate. I would also like to point out that I agree with the poor writing aspect for some parts.

While the symptoms Shepard show do have some in common with PTSD we have two cases of PTSD in game showing us quite clearly the one very important symptom Shepard is missing, an aversion to the events, situations or people which caused the PTSD.

The Asari in Huerta Memorial cannot take a shower and is afraid to be near Humans as a result of her PTSD and Kelly Chambers does not want to return to the Normandy as that was where she was taken by the Collectors, her PTSD trigger.

Shepards aversion should going by the events which "supposedly" triggered it be Children...and Reapers...see how that one dosent quite work?

Also it would whollely illogical for Shepard to develop PTSD over the death of the child considering the horrors and losses he has already gone through, especially if you pick the sole survivor background. At the very least he has watched Jenkins, Kaidan or Ashley, Thane (either at the suicide mission or on the Citadel), most likely Mordin and Legion die allready, all people way closer to him than a random child on Earth.

[demersel]

Linkforlife wrote...

The trigger event could have been Horizon, or Shepard dying in ME2, or how about Thessia? There are a lot of parts that could have triggered it, or how about even going so far back as ME1 when you picked Shepard's background and military history: Sole Survivor, s/he watched their whole unit get wiped out by a Thresher Maw.

- Dying in ME2 is actually a good trigger point - but why didn't it come through right away - in ME2? 
- Thessia - to late into the story - by that point most of the ME3 already happened, including two out of three dreams. So no. 

- Background events - they actually disprove the PTSD theory. Even before ME1 started shepard had already had terrible events happen to him - and he was fine. 

Don't forget - Shepard is an N7  - and the training for that is alredy brutal enough to give regular people PTSD - only the strongest of the strongest come through. That is the most difinitive prove that Shepard can't have PTSD - if he could, if he had a psycologycal capability of having them at all - he would have been a shell of a man WAY before even the background events took place. The N7 training alone would have broken him. 

N7 - basicly means  no PTSD. 

Modifié par demersel, 30 octobre 2012 - 02:12 .

[CmdrShep80]

demersel wrote...

Linkforlife wrote...

The idea of it is to go back to the dreams, and how they "could" be just that, dreams. PTSD victims also have dreams similiar to the ones Shepard was having. Although, the rest of the IT theory is still up for debate. I would also like to point out that I agree with the poor writing aspect for some parts.

PTSD victims have a trigger event. What was the trigger event for shepard? Say the answer to that qiestion out loud to hear how stupid it sounds.

if you start with the beginning of the game and take it from a literal point of view the trigger was watching the kid he couldn't save die then be got progressively worse as more and more individuals died on him that he couldn't save

[DoomsdayDevice]

This again?

Bioware deliberately put two cases of PTSD in ME3: Kelly Chambers and the Asari at Huerta Memorial. The most important symptom of PTSD is that the victim will avoid at all costs any situation that will lead him/her to relive the trauma.

That's why Kelly doesn't want to be back on the Normandy, it makes her relive being in the Reaper tube on the Collector base.

Shepard doesn't exhibit this symptom at all, so no. No PTSD.

Edit: Ninja'd by RM.

Modifié par DoomsdayDevice, 30 octobre 2012 - 02:13 .

[CmdrShep80]

SwobyJ wrote...

inko1nsiderate wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

So you see the large letters first?
Fascinating...

You saw the little letters first too?

People see the large letter first?  I don't believe it.

I saw the large letter first.

i saw the large left FT first followed by the right. The last thing I saw was the non matched little letters to the big letters. I saw the left first that they were matched

[Rifneno]

Linkforlife wrote...

demersel wrote...

 And what  the exact couse for the PTSD would be? 
After rewatching videos by smudboy, I just realized that there could be an explanation other that the Indoctrination Theory, I am not sure if it has been brought up before, but the idea is that Mass Effect 3, along with Mass Effect 2, and some parts of Mass Effect 1 is just written badly. 

Here is an article about it, there are some similarities between the examples and some plot points and conversations in ME1, ME2 and ME3:
instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/writsamp0.htm

The idea of it is to go back to the dreams, and how they "could" be just that, dreams. PTSD victims also have dreams similiar to the ones Shepard was having. Although, the rest of the IT theory is still up for debate. I would also like to point out that I agree with the poor writing aspect for some parts.

I have a fever.  A fever is a symptom of the black plague.  I have no other symptoms of the black plague.  By your logic, I have the black plague.

Spoiler: I don't have the black plague.  And Shepard doesn't have PTSD.

[DoomsdayDevice]

Sareth Cousland wrote...

starlitegirlx wrote...

- use clues to pinpoint the exact location of an objective (Leviathan had the clues and search part)

Thoughts?

You know what's interesting in light of IT? This achievement is called "conspiracy theorist". Its definition is as you quoted. IT fans are often labeled "conspiracy theorists", and the achievement description is nothing but a definition of pure logic.

[demersel]

CmdrShep80 wrote...

if you start with the beginning of the game and take it from a literal point of view the trigger was watching the kid he couldn't save die then be got progressively worse as more and more individuals died on him that he couldn't save

Bull****. That is not enough. Arrival is the trigger event - And Shapard is fine with death and sucrifice after it and in ME3. (whole batarian system, anyone?)  - the one thing that is changed - Shepard gets captured and knoked out by a powerfull reaper artifact. - the next thing you know - he's seeing some child. The child IS the thing that ME3 starts with. He is not real AT ALL. It is a planted image. Nothing about the child makes sense. Even shepard's own dreams tell him that child is a bad thing. 

[Linkforlife]

demersel wrote...

Linkforlife wrote...

The trigger event could have been Horizon, or Shepard dying in ME2, or how about Thessia? There are a lot of parts that could have triggered it, or how about even going so far back as ME1 when you picked Shepard's background and military history: Sole Survivor, s/he watched their whole unit get wiped out by a Thresher Maw.

- Dying in ME2 is actually a good trigger point - but why didn't it come through right away - in ME2? 
- Thessia - to late into the story - by that point most of the ME3 already happened, including two out of three dreams. So no. 

- Background events - they actually disprove the PTSD theory. Even before ME1 started shepard had already had terrible events happen to him - and he was fine. 

Don't forget - Shepard is an N7  - and the training for that is alredy brutal enough to give regular people PTSD - only the strongest of the strongest come through. That is the most difinitive prove that Shepard can't have PTSD - if he could, if he had a psycologycal capability of having them at all - he would have been a shell of a man WAY before even the background events took place. The N7 training alone would have broken him. 

N7 - basicly means  no PTSD. 

Just because someone is an N7, does not mean they are immune to psychological effects. Case in point: Kai Leng, he was an N7 soldier before he become indoctrinated.

[demersel]

Linkforlife wrote...

Just because someone is an N7, does not mean they are immune to psychological effects. Case in point: Kai Leng, he was an N7 soldier before he become indoctrinated.

PTSD =/= indoctrination. Are you stupid? 

[Rifneno]

I can't believe literalists are still claiming PTSD. And they say we're grasping at straws?

[Linkforlife]

demersel wrote...

Linkforlife wrote...

Just because someone is an N7, does not mean they are immune to psychological effects. Case in point: Kai Leng, he was an N7 soldier before he become indoctrinated.

PTSD =/= indoctrination. Are you stupid? 

Yes, I realized that it was an indoctrination point after I typed it, I was considering editing it, but I thought you would have been smart enough to see that. Instead you have to resort to attacking someone.

And back to my original point, I said "could" I never said that he HAD PTSD, I said it was a possibility, all you had to do was prove me wrong and I would have stopped right there.

[Rifneno]

demersel wrote...

CmdrShep80 wrote...

if you start with the beginning of the game and take it from a literal point of view the trigger was watching the kid he couldn't save die then be got progressively worse as more and more individuals died on him that he couldn't save

Bull****. That is not enough. Arrival is the trigger event - And Shapard is fine with death and sucrifice after it and in ME3. (whole batarian system, anyone?)  - the one thing that is changed - Shepard gets captured and knoked out by a powerfull reaper artifact. - the next thing you know - he's seeing some child. The child IS the thing that ME3 starts with. He is not real AT ALL. It is a planted image. Nothing about the child makes sense. Even shepard's own dreams tell him that child is a bad thing. 

Oh yeah, Arrival... that DLC that they told us is a bridge to ME3, and where they put in logs from indoctrination victims complaining about screwed up dreams.

Sounds like PTSD to me!

[demersel]

I did prove you wrong.