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[demersel]

SwobyJ wrote...

demersel wrote...

If you look really carefull at all of this - it is as if your crew is going through all the same stuf that is shepard going through (they all fight their personal battle with indoctrination) - but somehow they are better at it (as in they don't need your help by now) - and they see and recognise what is shepard going through - but they can only hope that he'll prevail, since it is a battle each one must fight for himsefl - they can only help you with words.

Agreed here.

Shepard starts with relative confidence (as seen as when he assures Liara on Mars), but over the course of the game, the squadmates really start to come into their own (when it comes to knowing they want to destroy the Reapers, not just stop them like Shepard indicates with his script), and Shepard gradually loses confidence.

My idea is that Bioware is leading up to a moment in the story (DLC, expansion?) where your squadmates literally and mentally pick you up from the rubble.

No- I think it will be up to us to pick shepard up - then he'll join his squadmates - they'll be like - glad you made it to the other side - no let's really get it on with killing the reapers. 

[BleedingUranium]

Related to the radio discussion, the beam is interfering with all comms, right? Remind me again, what does Shepard do in the evac scene?  Also, Joker gets there in less than three seconds...

byne wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

HOLY SHISNO! I just watched the last seven or so episodes of RvB, and it was INCREDIBLE! And that fight scene with all of them. That was just... woah!

I think 19 was the best episode this season, but last night's was pretty good too.

I was suprised to see Caboose animated, since from what they're always said, they never intended to animate Caboose.

Finale next week!

Modifié par BleedingUranium, 30 octobre 2012 - 04:55 .

[LazyTechGuy]

One of the main complaints of IT is that it doesn't provide an ending and it's not clear how you might end it. Someone mentioned an idea in the clevern00b forums which I thought was clever. Probably mentioned here at one point. Dunno.

The idea is with Shepard now awake, the bold decision can come down to destroying the Citadel/Crucible. With IT, it's questionable about what you really know about the Crucible and if the AI is really housed on the Citadel. With Leviathan, the AI is likely real to some degree and the Citadel makes the most sense. Shepard could realize that and make the decision to blow that mother. I'm willing to bet no other civilization in the past has ever considered destroying the Citadel because it's their own base of operations, which is the perfect defense to protect it. The Protheans started to get it right but they only went so far as to sabotage it, but no, it needs to be destroyed. It's where the controller/AI/RieperBieber is at. There could be Renegade and Paragon options since there are people still on the Citadel. Do you give time for evacuations? Maybe your EMS provides more opportunity for time since you have more ships keeping the Reapers busy.

So you blow the Citadel and the Reapers are now rudderless; unsure of what to do. Some are confused, some still fight and maybe some flee. And your EMS determines how many you clean up. Less ships, more casualties on Sword Fleet. So AI kid gets blown to hell, you get a conventional victory and there can be different outcomes depending on both how you destroy the Citadel and the ensuing space battle with the AI-less Reapers.

[demersel]

Thank you BlUr. Exactly.

[BleedingUranium]

LazyTechGuy wrote...

One of the main complaints of IT is that it doesn't provide an ending and it's not clear how you might end it. Someone mentioned an idea in the clevern00b forums which I thought was clever. Probably mentioned here at one point. Dunno.

The idea is with Shepard now awake, the bold decision can come down to destroying the Citadel/Crucible. With IT, it's questionable about what you really know about the Crucible and if the AI is really housed on the Citadel. With Leviathan, the AI is likely real to some degree and the Citadel makes the most sense. Shepard could realize that and make the decision to blow that mother. I'm willing to bet no other civilization in the past has ever considered destroying the Citadel because it's their own base of operations, which is the perfect defense to protect it. The Protheans started to get it right but they only went so far as to sabotage it, but no, it needs to be destroyed. It's where the controller/AI/RieperBieber is at. There could be Renegade and Paragon options since there are people still on the Citadel. Do you give time for evacuations? Maybe your EMS provides more opportunity for time since you have more ships keeping the Reapers busy.

So you blow the Citadel and the Reapers are now rudderless; unsure of what to do. Some are confused, some still fight and maybe some flee. And your EMS determines how many you clean up. Less ships, more casualties on Sword Fleet. So AI kid gets blown to hell, you get a conventional victory and there can be different outcomes depending on both how you destroy the Citadel and the ensuing space battle with the AI-less Reapers.

Except is makes no sense for the AI to actually be on the Citadel, and from a story telling perspective, we already blew up the Crucible and Citadel, so waking up to do it again would be like waking up, going to the Crucible, and finding the three choices really do exist.

Whatever we do, it will have nothing to do with something we did or saw in the current end sequence.

[LazyTechGuy]

AI's gotta be somewhere. Maybe Harbinger's the AI. So you have to stick a nuke up his thermal exhaust port.

The bare bones outline could be: 1) Find AI, 2) Destory AI, 3) Kill Reapers

[demersel]

LazyTechGuy - the whole relay network and the citadel needs to be destroyed. And really it is exactly what used to happen in ALL of the original endings. Since the ending sequence is constructed out of shepards memory and ideas, and at no point in game he has an idea of destroying the citadel and the relay network, i always thought that it was actually reapers having slipped and accidently showing shepard the real way how to go about destroyig them. (Since you know, they have to construct the illusion out of something - they use shepards memories and knowledge BUT they also tuse some of their own (the Ai. the catalyst, etc.) so when they show him the result of crucible - they actually show what is believable to THEM as the way to destroy them.

Remember the outcry, and the one thing that EC did change? (after which everyone become happy with the ending) - Crucible no longer destroys the citadel AND the releays in ALL the endings once and for all.

It wasn't that EDI and the geth were said to die in Destroy that made it so unpopular - it is the fact that in all of the endings the citadel and the relays are gone for good. (and thus the shackles of reapers over the galaxy are broken and the stargazer's scene make sense).

The truth is that the out cry was BECAUSE we didn't want it to end and be destroyed - we didn't want to be freed of the reapers. )))))

[Eryri]

demersel wrote...

Remember the outcry, and the one thing that EC did change? (after which everyone become happy with the ending) - Crucible no longer destroys the citadel AND the releays in ALL the endings once and for all. 

It wasn't that EDI and the geth were said to die in Destroy that made it so unpopular - it is the fact that in all of the endings the citadel and the relays are gone for good. (and thus the shackles of reapers over the galaxy are broken and the stargazer's scene make sense).

The truth is that the out cry was BECAUSE we didn't want it to end and be destroyed - we didn't want to be freed of the reapers. )))))

That's partly true, but the main problem was that Arrival established that rupturing a relay causes a supernova. It wouldn't just be the relays that were gone, Earth, Tuchanka, Surkesh - every populated world near a relay would be toast.

Or at least should have been toast before the retcon. I don't know what the literal reason for the relays suddenly not obliterating everything would be.

Modifié par Eryri, 30 octobre 2012 - 05:07 .

[spotlessvoid]

" The truth is that the out cry was BECAUSE we didn't want it to end and be destroyed - we didn't want to be freed of the reapers. )))))"

No, people were mad because it seemed the ending
1.Made no sense
2.Palette swap
3. Starchild
4. Destroyed Relays...which didn't mean people didn't want to a. cause massive death and b. end galactic travel which kills the IP

[Arashi08]

From the Codex:
"After destroying Earth's comm buoys, smaller Reaper destroyers wiped out all GPS and communications satellites in Earth's orbit and cut the undersea fiber-optic cables that linked the continents. Earth's resistance now relies on outdated radio towers and a few quantum entanglement communicators whose matched pairs happen to be on other continents or outside the Sol system. Communication is so limited that the fate of entire nations remains unknown. "

So clearly they can still use radio towers...

Darn it 'd  It seems all the biggest arguments happen while I'm sleeping

Modifié par Arashi08, 30 octobre 2012 - 05:08 .

[Rifneno]

The biggest argument against the AI being on the Citadel is the fact that entire first game would make no sense whatsoever if it was in the Citadel.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Well, I completed my "see it as an ITer" playthrough, and I have a few things to say. I'll admit that it is a very interesting playstyle, though I had to strain myself at parts to not look at it literally and instead see it as symbolism, but overall I see why you guys support it and I may now as well (the me from six months ago would punch current me right now for saying that). Now, I'm not going to support it so much as to preach it everywhere, and will not get rid of my Synthesis sig because: Synthesis is still my favorite literal ending, it's uniqueness helps me find my posts since that custom pic doesn't work for me for some reason, and it has Madaraki Fran from the manga Franken Fran on it so yay. Overall, I guess I'm not fully into IT, since there's points I still disagree with, which leaves me in a position of a) if IT becomes a reality via DLC, it will be my new choice or if IT isn't real, I won't be dissapointed, so actually rather fortuitous for me but I hope it comes true for you guys and gals. 
As side notes:
Hackett gives great speeches ( I see where Shepard learned that skill from)
Seeing my idea of a Reaper crushing a ship in EC always makes me smile

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 30 octobre 2012 - 05:09 .

[demersel]

@Eryri, @Spotlessvoid - yes, and the supernova thing. )))

[BleedingUranium]

spotlessvoid wrote...

" The truth is that the out cry was BECAUSE we didn't want it to end and be destroyed - we didn't want to be freed of the reapers. )))))"

No, people were mad because it seemed the ending
1.Made no sense
2.Palette swap
3. Starchild
4. Destroyed Relays...which didn't mean people didn't want to a. cause massive death and b. end galactic travel which kills the IP

That's why one of the ideas I had for the Rio facility would be that we build own own Relay, just like the one on Ilos, it would take us somewhere useful, maybe the same place, maybe not. But it would be awesome themeatically because not only would we have finally build our own relay and gotten rid of the need to advance along the paths the Reapers desire, it would also be the instrument of their destruction!

Part of the Rio map is called "Relay Station", though I'm fully aware it's because there's a radio tower and server farm there

[demersel]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Well, I completed my "see it as an ITer" playthrough,

You played through the whole game in like six hours??

Modifié par demersel, 30 octobre 2012 - 05:13 .

[BleedingUranium]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Well, I completed my "see it as an ITer" playthrough, and I have a few things to say. I'll admit that it is a very interesting playstyle, though I had to strain myself at parts to not look at it literally and instead see it as symbolism, but overall I see why you guys support it and I may now as well (the me from six months ago would punch current me right now for saying that). Now, I'm not going to support it so much as to preach it everywhere, and will not get rid of my Synthesis sig because: Synthesis is still my favorite literal ending, it's uniqueness helps me find my posts since that custom pic doesn't work for me for some reason, and it has Madaraki Fran from the manga Franken Fran on it so yay. Overall, I guess I'm not fully into IT, since there's points I still disagree with, which leaves me in a position of a) if IT becomes a reality via DLC, it will be my new choice or if IT isn't real, I won't be dissapointed, so actually rather fortuitous for me but I hope it comes true for you guys and gals. 
As side notes:
Hackett gives great speeches ( I see where Shepard learned that skill from)
Seeing my idea of a Reaper crushing a ship in EC always makes me smile

I'm glad you had an open mind enough to try, I think what you did is a first here. At least, I can't remember anyone else doing that.

[Eryri]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Well, I completed my "see it as an ITer" playthrough, and I have a few things to say. I'll admit that it is a very interesting playstyle, though I had to strain myself at parts to not look at it literally and instead see it as symbolism, but overall I see why you guys support it and I may now as well (the me from six months ago would punch current me right now for saying that). Now, I'm not going to support it so much as to preach it everywhere, and will not get rid of my Synthesis sig because: Synthesis is still my favorite literal ending, it's uniqueness helps me find my posts since that custom pic doesn't work for me for some reason, and it has Madaraki Fran from the manga Franken Fran on it so yay. Overall, I guess I'm not fully into IT, since there's points I still disagree with, which leaves me in a position of a) if IT becomes a reality via DLC, it will be my new choice or if IT isn't real, I won't be dissapointed, so actually rather fortuitous for me but I hope it comes true for you guys and gals. 
As side notes:
Hackett gives great speeches ( I see where Shepard learned that skill from)
Seeing my idea of a Reaper crushing a ship in EC always makes me smile

Wow that was fast! Glad you enjoyed it though. And thanks for the support.  

[Hanako Ikezawa]

demersel wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Well, I completed my "see it as an ITer" playthrough,

You played through the whole game in like six hours??

No, I played from Horizon onward. I've played the campaign about 17 times now, so I have most up it in my head by now.

[BleedingUranium]

starlitegirlx wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Related to the radio discussion, the beam is interfering with all comms, right? Remind me again, what does Shepard do in the evac scene?  Also, Joker gets there in less than three seconds...

Is this the opening evac scene? if so, he/she uses an older radio. What am I missing?

Joker couldn't have been far if that's what you're talking about because VS is on the normandy and it just took off which we know based on the discussion with joker/EDI about getting control of it and not throwing the guards off the ship when the reapers hit. It was act fast. Kaidan was there. James was there. They took off ASAP. No?

No, the beam run one.

Damn, I'm not sure you could pick dumber people for this scene than Javik and James

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Eryri wrote...
Wow that was fast! Glad you enjoyed it though. And thanks for the support.  

Like I said in another post, since I have the game basically memorized by now I just played fron Horizon onward. Also, no problem.

BleedingUranium wrote...
I'm glad you had an open mind enough to try, I think what you did is a first here. At least, I can't remember anyone else doing that.

Really? I can see why, my curiosity and literal centers felt like they were at war for dominance while I was doing it.

[paxxton]

Haha! Blur, you've been Collectorified.

Modifié par paxxton, 30 octobre 2012 - 05:27 .

[Andromidius]

I'm wondering if the beam itself is more significant.

i.e. I'm wondering if it might be the very startings of a new Human Reaper. Maybe underneith the beam, and the beam is actually a power conduit of some kind.

Main reason I'm pondering this is because of the tube you shoot for Destroy. Its a similar concept to shooting the tubes of the Human Reaper in ME2. And then Control - maybe its a direct interface with the Reaper's AI core, and it wants to use Shepard as the template for the Human Reaper personality.

There's not much to back it up, but its an interesting idea. Could also lead to having a Reaper bursting out of the ground to combat if there's ever any DLC set after the breath scene.

Maybe its far fetched. But hey. Would be interesting, and would lead more credit to the whole 'the hallucination is on Earth and how Shepard interacts with the beam'.