Ce sujet est ferméModifié par spotlessvoid, 22 novembre 2012 - 05:00 .
Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark III!
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byne
, juil. 30 2012 07:09
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#49627
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:00
estebanus
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No. This thread is a zombie, come to eat yout brains!MissLiya wrote...
IT still alive? О_о
Ooooooooh! Flee in terror, mortal! The dead are coming!
#49628
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:03
MegumiAzusa
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If that's the only point you are seemingly able to attack I'm content with that.spotlessvoid wrote...
@Megumi
You're confusing me pointing out your misuse of that quote with arguing against the point you were trying to make with it. I don't even feel like debating what you are saying. All I was saying was that using a quote pointing out the inherent fallibility of the intellect in this situation is absurd. That quote could be used in any debate on any topic and still be true, but that wouldn't make it pertinent. Saying using mental constructs creates misconceptions during a debate of fiction, which is by definition a mental construct, is utterly pointless. And if you truly saw the meaning in it, you should have sat your butt down to meditate.
#49629
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:08
ElSuperGecko
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MegumiAzusa wrote...
If all that doesn't make a difference why have 2 versions at all? You are ignoring my points and say they have no relevance because you don't want to hear them. You basically say "it's not my headcanon so it's wrong".
Now we have a clear case of the pot calling the kettle black. I acknowledged that the Refuse Stargazer scene being different was interesting in my second post. Chances are the Refusal scene being different is simply in keeping with the rest of the Refusal ending - making it absolutely clear that there is NO chance WHATSOEVER of the current cycle surviving when you choose inaction. But how many of my points have you addressed? None - because you have no answers for the questions I've posed. We have little to no conxtext for the Stargazer epilogue scene when choosing Control, Synthesis and Destroy, and no explanation for it being the same in all cases, so it is irrelevant to Shepard's decision.
#49630
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:10
spotlessvoid
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Attacking? No, correcting.
You're overall point that we may be approaching the whole thing wrong, or that even assuming there is a valid single interpretation could be wrong, is a valid one to make. The quote doesn't make that point. It's message would be stop thinking about the game and clear your mind of such things. How is that appropriate for this discussion?
You're overall point that we may be approaching the whole thing wrong, or that even assuming there is a valid single interpretation could be wrong, is a valid one to make. The quote doesn't make that point. It's message would be stop thinking about the game and clear your mind of such things. How is that appropriate for this discussion?
#49631
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:31
MegumiAzusa
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Uhm read my posts, I thought I made it clear enough to understand.spotlessvoid wrote...
Attacking? No, correcting.
You're overall point that we may be approaching the whole thing wrong, or that even assuming there is a valid single interpretation could be wrong, is a valid one to make. The quote doesn't make that point. It's message would be stop thinking about the game and clear your mind of such things. How is that appropriate for this discussion?
Think about your points again please.ElSuperGecko wrote...
[...] I acknowledged that the Refuse Stargazer scene being different was interesting in my second post. Chances are the Refusal scene being different is simply in keeping with the rest of the Refusal ending - making it absolutely clear that there is NO chance WHATSOEVER of the current cycle surviving when you choose inaction [...] so it is irrelevant to Shepard's decision.
Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 22 novembre 2012 - 05:33 .
#49632
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:34
Davik Kang
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So the troll's gone but the infighting resumes...
at least I have 70 pages to get through (eeeuuuuggghhhhh) before I get to this bit...
at least I have 70 pages to get through (eeeuuuuggghhhhh) before I get to this bit...
#49633
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:39
lex0r11
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MissLiya wrote...
IT still alive? О_о
#49634
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:43
CmdrShep80
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dorktainian wrote...
spotlessvoid wrote...
Full blown transformation of humanity into a new cybernetic/human framework. This is sponsored by the UN. They are advocating straight up synthesis. And they want to rush us into it.
holy gigantic pi**flaps batman.
The only real reason i would see for this is if this planet is doomed and we have to make plans to leave. Orgmenting our bodies with cybernetic tech to enable us to survive for longer in harsher environments. Maybe there is something they are not telling us?
will putting a bag over your head help? No.
looks like who ever said all that played Mass Effect and became indoctrinated lol
#49635
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 05:43
ElSuperGecko
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MegumiAzusa wrote...
Think about your points again please.ElSuperGecko wrote...
[...] I acknowledged that the Refuse Stargazer scene being different was interesting in my second post. Chances are the Refusal scene being different is simply in keeping with the rest of the Refusal ending - making it absolutely clear that there is NO chance WHATSOEVER of the current cycle surviving when you choose inaction [...] so it is irrelevant to Shepard's decision.
If you're going to quote me out of context, shall I assume you still have no answers to the questions I posed, then?
#49636
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:03
CmdrShep80
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Davik Kang wrote...
So the troll's gone but the infighting resumes...
at least I have 70 pages to get through (eeeuuuuggghhhhh) before I get to this bit...
lol thank goodness I was there. When you do get to here, it might be the 27th. If it is he promises to be back
#49637
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:04
CmdrShep80
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Oh they just started the privateer countdown yay
#49638
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:27
Restrider
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He will troll us regardless of Omega's content.CmdrShep80 wrote...
lol thank goodness I was there. When you do get to here, it might be the 27th. If it is he promises to be back
Even if with the Omega DLC the Guardian says in the decision chamber with yellowy glowing eyes :
"WE ARE HARBINGER! ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL! YOUR MIND WILL BE OURS!"
He'd still troll around, saying that BW is only trying to appease the fanbase with a stupid fanfiction theory.
#49639
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:37
Revan87
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Michael Gamble[/b]
@GambleMike
Planned to sit down this morning for a few minutes
and play through a cool feature for a new DLC. 2 hours later...still
playing
Michael Gamble[/b]
@GambleMike
I'm not being a tease on purpose. I just want everyone to know we're still deep in content creation mode
A new DLC? Intresting...
Planned to sit down this morning for a few minutes
and play through a cool feature for a new DLC. 2 hours later...still
playing
Michael Gamble[/b]
I'm not being a tease on purpose. I just want everyone to know we're still deep in content creation mode
A new DLC? Intresting...
Modifié par Revan87, 22 novembre 2012 - 06:37 .
#49640
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:37
masster blaster
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Morning guys, and Meg ....
Control Shepard will wake up. Try to fight his/her Indoctrinated side, and will kill him/herself in the end because it's the only way to save everyone.
Synthesis. Shepard is now one with his/her synthetics parts, and in the end Shepard kills his/her LI, and blows up the Normandy, but activates the crucible, or something in Rio, and dies.
Destroy Shepard wakes up beats the Reapers, can now live with his/her LI, and happy ending.
Refuse Shepard dies, and everyone else dies. The next cycle uses the crucible, but what choice did they pick. Destroy. So to me that's a wink wink from Bioware that you should Destroy the Reapers.
I say they picked Destroy because the Reapers are dead from what the woman is telling the child.
Control Shepard will wake up. Try to fight his/her Indoctrinated side, and will kill him/herself in the end because it's the only way to save everyone.
Synthesis. Shepard is now one with his/her synthetics parts, and in the end Shepard kills his/her LI, and blows up the Normandy, but activates the crucible, or something in Rio, and dies.
Destroy Shepard wakes up beats the Reapers, can now live with his/her LI, and happy ending.
Refuse Shepard dies, and everyone else dies. The next cycle uses the crucible, but what choice did they pick. Destroy. So to me that's a wink wink from Bioware that you should Destroy the Reapers.
I say they picked Destroy because the Reapers are dead from what the woman is telling the child.
#49641
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:39
Restrider
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Clearly no Omega...Revan87 wrote...
Michael Gamble[/b]
@GambleMike
Planned to sit down this morning for a few minutes
and play through a cool feature for a new DLC. 2 hours later...still
playing
Michael Gamble[/b]
@GambleMike
I'm not being a tease on purpose. I just want everyone to know we're still deep in content creation mode
A new DLC? Intresting...
I suppose it is save to assume that he is referring to SP DLC?
#49642
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:40
masster blaster
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Or Meg in Control, and Synthesis Shepard dies either by a gun to the head, or his/her squadmates killing him/her. They end the Reapers, but in honor of Shepard they said Shepard ended the Reaper threat.
#49643
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:46
MegumiAzusa
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Your "questions" don't diminish its relevance and therefor it is not out of context. If there would be only the original one I would agree with you, but the new one makes some of your "questions" pretty pointless as who/when is made clear as in the original one shows humans while the opt out one shows other aliens from another cycle as all humans have been harvested. If it would be so unclear as you say this difference would not be needed.ElSuperGecko wrote...
MegumiAzusa wrote...
Think about your points again please.ElSuperGecko wrote...
[...] I acknowledged that the Refuse Stargazer scene being different was interesting in my second post. Chances are the Refusal scene being different is simply in keeping with the rest of the Refusal ending - making it absolutely clear that there is NO chance WHATSOEVER of the current cycle surviving when you choose inaction [...] so it is irrelevant to Shepard's decision.
If you're going to quote me out of context, shall I assume you still have no answers to the questions I posed, then?
#49644
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:49
MegumiAzusa
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It's quite known they are working on the next sp dlc for some weeks now.Restrider wrote...
Clearly no Omega...Revan87 wrote...
Michael Gamble[/b]
@GambleMike
Planned to sit down this morning for a few minutes
and play through a cool feature for a new DLC. 2 hours later...still
playing
Michael Gamble[/b]
@GambleMike
I'm not being a tease on purpose. I just want everyone to know we're still deep in content creation mode
A new DLC? Intresting...
I suppose it is save to assume that he is referring to SP DLC?
#49645
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:51
DoomsdayDevice
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Guys, I think I found some really interesting clues. Will post later, have to run some errands first.
Also: mind = blown.
Stay tuned.
Also: mind = blown.
Stay tuned.
#49646
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 06:56
401 Kill
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DoomsdayDevice wrote...
Guys, I think I found some really interesting clues. Will post later, have to run some errands first.
Also: mind = blown.
Stay tuned.
Can you post it now?
Pretty pleeeeeaaaaase.
#49647
Guest_starlitegirlx_*
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 07:00
Guest_starlitegirlx_*
Guest_starlitegirlx_*
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Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
AresKeith wrote...
That would have been the case with the Geth if they didn't use the Heretic part
Yeah without the Heretics I could understand mistrusting them more, but with the split up that there was it is not the case.
The Geth siding with the Reapers is something i find understandable given their species is beeing wiped out. As we are told they panicked and turned to the Reapers. But after that they were no longer free as we learn, controlled by the Reapers.
But the primary thing speaking against them still beeing Reapers controlled is the events that follow. If the geth (and by extension Legion since he is the one you ultimately have to trust on this) were still controlled then there is so many places they could have betrayed us and essentially ended the war in a moment.
Hell they have one of the strongest fleets in the galaxy, if they turned on us as we engaged the Reapers over earth that battle would be over long before it began.
As I have said before I look at Legions use of the Reaper code similarly to the Thanix cannon. It wasent technology which was given to use, but an analysis of how the tehcnology worked which led to the creation of our own variety. essentially we recogniced the principals behind the tehcnology and used it ourselves, not the technology itself.
Do i have any poof of this, no, but it all comes down to trusting Legion and the fact that the geth did not trun upon us (or the Quarians) despite ample opputunity to do so.
There is also the information you get from tali in ME1. Basically, she admits that the quarians feared that the geth would attack and start war with them. The root of this is control. They felt they lost control and that loss of control would lead to geth killing quarians. Forget everything Legion tells and shows us and you have geth siding with the reapers and we have geth that the quarians did a preemtive strike against because of their fear and loss of control. That right there is pretty much the whole of it. It comes down to control. having it. Fear of losing it. Fear of what happens when you do lose it. The quarians, quite frankly, didn't like that their slaves evolved because in their desire for the most helpful slaves, they made them too intelligent and built them too well. That says a damn lot more about the quarians than it does the geth. The fact that they strike first at the geth when the geth had done nothing yet according to quarian history as Tali tells it in ME1 is something that as far as I'm concerned puts the quarians in the worst light possible. They're not much different from Illusive man at that point. They could have chosen to have discussions with the geth rather than annhiliate them. They could have let them have their freedom and evolve while asking if they could continue to help with tasks they were designed for until they found a way work through the transition that was good for both parties. Instead of looking at the geth evolution as an amazing thing - sentient life from software and hardware- they chose to destroy it.
Personally, I think the history of the geth and the geth/quarian war as told by tali sums up the entire series. Throughout it, Control is the predominant theme. Even most of the missions in ME2 are about control. Who has it. Who want to keep it. Who abuses it. And that's not counting the loyalty missions which are mostly control related as well.
Fact is that ultimately the geth are a tool that are used for the endings which is why their missions come up so close to the end. That's really all they are by ME3. Everything you see is constructed to manipulate you away from destroy. "Does this unit have a soul?" **** no! Machines don't have souls. They may be sentient but they are not organic. They were built with toaster parts, computer parts and software. They are code. They were not birthed. They weren't even hatched. They were built. How one views them is up to them, but they have no soul no matter how much you might want to say yes to Legion before it shuts down (not dies, shuts down!). All of those missions are in game story emotional manipulations to steer you away from destroy. And they were put as close as possible to the end in order for it to be fresh in your mind.
#49648
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 07:09
Restrider
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Hah, how I would've loved to say to Legion:
"No, you have no soul - the same way organics have no soul."
"No, you have no soul - the same way organics have no soul."
#49649
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 07:17
Raistlin Majare 1992
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Restrider wrote...
Hah, how I would've loved to say to Legion:
"No, you have no soul - the same way organics have no soul."
Loved Nerf NOW´s take on it: www.nerfnow.com/comic/875
#49650
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 07:21
Humakt83
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DoomsdayDevice wrote...
Guys, I think I found some really interesting clues. Will post later, have to run some errands first.
Also: mind = blown.
Stay tuned.
I bet you are not being a tease on purpose,
