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[MegumiAzusa]

TJBartlemus wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Even after waking up the same stargazer scene plays, therefor it's real, because sooner or later all choices you do lead to this, but if you choose opt out (again if it were not then no new scene would be there in the first place). You just cannot have it a dream planet once and then a real planet. One of these assumptions are wrong and direct evidence from the game and files say it's real.

You know what's funny. By using your assumptions, it is more logical to assume the entire ME universe is a sham. The entire trilogy was a story being told by a grandfather to grandson much like J.R. Tolkein did. The refuse version is explained away as another one of the grandfather's stories.

No. It's a legend (as the datapad says, and the namings everywhere else). And you know what legends include? At least some kind of truth. And Opt Out even mentions archives, which I don't think is a pointer to a library of fairytales.

So the ending datapad (equivalent to an extention to the ending credits) is now proof. Who knew? No, we've done away of using that as definite proof. As to "archives" ... if it's a story by the grandfather than it doesn't matter.

(positions rook to B5) You're move. 

I just used what the game gives me. It's you who made things up from thin air. Also as said not only the datapad calls it a legend but also the other files. Even the achievement
Your "more logical" isn't as logical.

[BansheeOwnage]

Dwailing wrote...

I'm going to make a crazy suggestion. Maybe the only time we can assume the Stargazer scene is real is Breath Scene Destroy since it's the only ending in which we see the SG scene after Shepard awakens.

Ha! I actually discussed it with Blur. Nice thought!

[MegumiAzusa]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

401 Kill wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

paxxton wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...


Did you see my video?

Yeah! Loved it, of course!

What video?

This video is mine!
For anyone who missed it.

That was epic.


And I mean that.

 Thanks. By the way, I know it was hard to hear, so I'll explain the Harbinger thing at the end of the video. We all know he's been... interested in Shepard for quite some time. So, he wrote her/him a poem!

Seriously, it does rhyme. (I know it sucks.)

Shepard: ಠಠಠ_ಠಠಠ

Your species has the attention of those infinitely your greater
We are the beginning, you will be the end
You are called; you must answer
You insult a future you cannot comprehend

One must not destroy the nation
You are the one wasting lives
The void awaits your ascension
Organic life will not survive

ಠಠಠ_ಠಠಠ

Oh wow, I didn't realize/notice it rhymed!

Great job!

Because there are actually only 2 pairs which rhyme. The other 2 pairs don't.

[TJBartlemus]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

You're point is that Shepard dies before we see this scene. But how is it we are seeing this scene at all? We after all are in essence "Shepard". We see through Shepard into the universe, so it is only possible that we see this scene if Shepard is alive. So thus Shepard must not be dead before seeing this scene.

[MegumiAzusa]

TJBartlemus wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

You're point is that Shepard dies before we see this scene. But how is it we are seeing this scene at all? We after all are in essence "Shepard". We see through Shepard into the universe, so it is only possible that we see this scene if Shepard is alive. So thus Shepard must not be dead before seeing this scene.

There are multiple instances of scenes which cannot be seen by Shepard. Worst argument you had so far :[

[Dwailing]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

How do you know when Shepard dies?  You know that he dies at some point, but it never tells you when.  The only time that Shepard actually does anything other than lay around having visions is the Breath Scene.  If Shepard doesn't wakr up, then how do we know he's dead by the time the SG Scene takes place?  We don't, not really.  We merely know that Shepard dies at SOME point, but we're never shown when.

[TJBartlemus]

byne wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

So the ending datapad (equivalent to an extention to the ending credits) is now proof. Who knew? No, we've done away of using that as definite proof. As to "archives" ... if it's a story by the grandfather than it doesn't matter.

(positions rook to B5) You're move. 

You are move indeed.

I always found the idea that somehow a 4th-wall breaking message counts as proof one way or another to be pretty weird.

Spell Check strikes again with bad grammar. CURSES!!!! 

[byne]

TJBartlemus wrote...

byne wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

So the ending datapad (equivalent to an extention to the ending credits) is now proof. Who knew? No, we've done away of using that as definite proof. As to "archives" ... if it's a story by the grandfather than it doesn't matter.

(positions rook to B5) You're move. 

You are move indeed.

I always found the idea that somehow a 4th-wall breaking message counts as proof one way or another to be pretty weird.

Spell Check strikes again with bad grammar. CURSES!!!! 

You also did it again on this page, but I wasnt going to point that one out.

[MegumiAzusa]

Dwailing wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

How do you know when Shepard dies?  You know that he dies at some point, but it never tells you when.  The only time that Shepard actually does anything other than lay around having visions is the Breath Scene.  If Shepard doesn't wakr up, then how do we know he's dead by the time the SG Scene takes place?  We don't, not really.  We merely know that Shepard dies at SOME point, but we're never shown when.

Shepard dies when the cam goes black when the door opens, the game files tell you as much and it fits perfectly.

[DoomsdayDevice]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Because there are actually only 2 pairs which rhyme. The other 2 pairs don't.

Which is very common in poetry. Not everything has to sound like a children's rhyme.

[acidic-ph0]

TJBartlemus wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

You're point is that Shepard dies before we see this scene. But how is it we are seeing this scene at all? We after all are in essence "Shepard". We see through Shepard into the universe, so it is only possible that we see this scene if Shepard is alive. So thus Shepard must not be dead before seeing this scene.

Well, in ME2, if Shepard dies, we still see an extended conversation between joker and TIM afterwards.

[TJBartlemus]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

You're point is that Shepard dies before we see this scene. But how is it we are seeing this scene at all? We after all are in essence "Shepard". We see through Shepard into the universe, so it is only possible that we see this scene if Shepard is alive. So thus Shepard must not be dead before seeing this scene.

There are multiple instances of scenes which cannot be seen by Shepard. Worst argument you had so far :[

Had to give it a shot.  Give me a moment...

[MegumiAzusa]

byne wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

byne wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

So the ending datapad (equivalent to an extention to the ending credits) is now proof. Who knew? No, we've done away of using that as definite proof. As to "archives" ... if it's a story by the grandfather than it doesn't matter.

(positions rook to B5) You're move. 

You are move indeed.

I always found the idea that somehow a 4th-wall breaking message counts as proof one way or another to be pretty weird.

Spell Check strikes again with bad grammar. CURSES!!!! 

You also did it again on this page, but I wasnt going to point that one out.

And I quoted them all!
Like a baws.

[MegumiAzusa]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Because there are actually only 2 pairs which rhyme. The other 2 pairs don't.

Which is very common in poetry. Not everything has to sound like a children's rhyme.

I know, but then they use rhythms to connect them. As it's just pieced together it's impossible I know, still it's the key that is missing here and the reason why it doesn't work. Not that I don't appreciate the thought, but it just doesn't work.

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 07 décembre 2012 - 03:01 .

[hukbum]

So, the old "now go out there and buy DLC" message ... what does it tell us about about Shepards story?
Looks like that datapad is really important storywise. And it showed up in low EMS as well, so it has to be more than really important.

[Dwailing]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

How do you know when Shepard dies?  You know that he dies at some point, but it never tells you when.  The only time that Shepard actually does anything other than lay around having visions is the Breath Scene.  If Shepard doesn't wakr up, then how do we know he's dead by the time the SG Scene takes place?  We don't, not really.  We merely know that Shepard dies at SOME point, but we're never shown when.

Shepard dies when the cam goes black when the door opens, the game files tell you as much and it fits perfectly.

How do you KNOW that's when Shepard dies?  If :wub:the epilogue is considered part of the illusion, then Shepard cannot be dead as the epilogue takes place after the Normandy scene.

P.S. Ignore the love smilely.  I'm on my phone and cannot delete it.

[TJBartlemus]

@Megumi - Really all I have left at this time is that that particular ending scene is unclear at this time. As I said earlier this is a grey area, and there are many different ways to take it, as I showed with the grandfather/grandson example, just like the rest of the game.

[MegumiAzusa]

hukbum wrote...

So, the old "now go out there and buy DLC" message ... what does it tell us about about Shepards story?
Looks like that datapad is really important storywise. And it showed up in low EMS as well, so it has to be more than really important.

The message even if not that great fits perfectly with the literal interpretation while it doesn't with IT, which is a fact, yes. If it would be the only instance it could be waved away, but it is not, thus it is basically a statement of intention.

[401 Kill]

hukbum wrote...

So, the old "now go out there and buy DLC" message ... what does it tell us about about Shepards story?
Looks like that datapad is really important storywise. And it showed up in low EMS as well, so it has to be more than really important.

*beats game and sees pre EC endings*
*Bioware: You win. Buy more dlc*

Looking back on that, it is hilarious. But at the time, it was insulting.

It tells us Shepards Story is not over yet.

[DoomsdayDevice]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Because there are actually only 2 pairs which rhyme. The other 2 pairs don't.

Which is very common in poetry. Not everything has to sound like a children's rhyme.

I know, but then they use rhythms to connect them. As it's just pieced together it's impossible I know, still it's the key that is missing here and the reason why it doesn't work. Not that I don't appreciate the thought, but it just doesn't work.

Oh come on, it's just a fun little thing. Do you have to point out the flaws in everything? Even in innocent, fun stuff that's simply supposed to be enjoyable? I can't imagine you make a lot of friends that way.

[MegumiAzusa]

Dwailing wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Um, did anyone take the time to stop arguing and read my post?

And low EMS destroy because Shep is since long dead. Point being it's real in any case.

How do you know when Shepard dies?  You know that he dies at some point, but it never tells you when.  The only time that Shepard actually does anything other than lay around having visions is the Breath Scene.  If Shepard doesn't wakr up, then how do we know he's dead by the time the SG Scene takes place?  We don't, not really.  We merely know that Shepard dies at SOME point, but we're never shown when.

Shepard dies when the cam goes black when the door opens, the game files tell you as much and it fits perfectly.

How do you KNOW that's when Shepard dies?  If the epilogue is considered part of the illusion, then Shepard cannot be dead as the epilogue takes place after the Normandy scene.

P.S. Ignore the love smilely.  I'm on my phone and cannot delete it.

The epilog being considered part of the illusion is problematic as it's the same as when Shep wakes up, which you said so yourself. Having the same illusion as reality you think that is happening?

[401 Kill]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

hukbum wrote...

So, the old "now go out there and buy DLC" message ... what does it tell us about about Shepards story?
Looks like that datapad is really important storywise. And it showed up in low EMS as well, so it has to be more than really important.

The message even if not that great fits perfectly with the literal interpretation while it doesn't with IT, which is a fact, yes. If it would be the only instance it could be waved away, but it is not, thus it is basically a statement of intention.

Im sorry, I must have missed the part where you explained how this is a fact. Please elaborate.

[hukbum]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

hukbum wrote...

So, the old "now go out there and buy DLC" message ... what does it tell us about about Shepards story?
Looks like that datapad is really important storywise. And it showed up in low EMS as well, so it has to be more than really important.

The message even if not that great fits perfectly with the literal interpretation while it doesn't with IT, which is a fact, yes. If it would be the only instance it could be waved away, but it is not, thus it is basically a statement of intention.

So, what the meaning behind it? Who is (or was) this DLC and what did he do to Sheperd that he's worth mentioning in that datapad?

[MegumiAzusa]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Because there are actually only 2 pairs which rhyme. The other 2 pairs don't.

Which is very common in poetry. Not everything has to sound like a children's rhyme.

I know, but then they use rhythms to connect them. As it's just pieced together it's impossible I know, still it's the key that is missing here and the reason why it doesn't work. Not that I don't appreciate the thought, but it just doesn't work.

Oh come on, it's just a fun little thing. Do you have to point out the flaws in everything? Even in innocent, fun stuff that's simply supposed to be enjoyable? I can't imagine you make a lot of friends that way.

On its own it's nice. The "it even rhymes" stuff was just not needed.

[TJBartlemus]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

hukbum wrote...

So, the old "now go out there and buy DLC" message ... what does it tell us about about Shepards story?
Looks like that datapad is really important storywise. And it showed up in low EMS as well, so it has to be more than really important.

The message even if not that great fits perfectly with the literal interpretation while it doesn't with IT, which is a fact, yes. If it would be the only instance it could be waved away, but it is not, thus it is basically a statement of intention.

Ever think of the possibility that we haven't seen all there is yet? Until the last DLC is released, we cannot make a definite statement if the IT is true or not.