80611 réponses à ce sujet

[umadcommander]

dorktainian wrote...

don't forget coates on the citadel (supposedly) hang on he's still on earth isn't he? Oh and you cannot shoot the keepers looting human corpses....which all look exactly the same?    

edit - yay top again.

something they added in the EC

[dorktainian]

BleedingUranium wrote...

Fur28 wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

TheProtheans wrote...

Fur28 wrote...

For what The Protheans said
How different is reaper technology like the IFF, from the Mass relays and the Citadel?

If the Reaper tech was built with slaves and stolen resources.
Is it really that different?

How different is using parts of a Reaper to advance your race than using the Mass relay network, not very different.
They both have the same origins.

Right, it's the same.

They could try to replicate some of the reaper technology, like Liara´s dad said with the relays
But if we get rid of the reapers and their tech no longer indoctrinates, i really dont see the problem of using it

Using the relays until we can build our own is fine, they couldn't indoctrinate even if they gave off an indoctrination signal.

 



The answer to that is in the codex itself - along with an answer to anyone who thinks indoctrination is not a gradual thing.     

''Reaper "indoctrination" is an insidious means of corrupting organic minds, "reprogramming" the brain through physical and psychological conditioning using electromagnetic fields, infrasonic and ultrasonic noise, and other subliminal methods. The Reaper's resulting control over the limbic system leaves the victim highly susceptible to its suggestions. 

Organics undergoing indoctrination may complain of headaches and buzzing or ringing in their ears. As time passes, they have feelings of "being watched" and hallucinations of "ghostly" presences. Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals, manifesting as "alien" voices in the mind.

Indoctrination can create perfect deep cover agents. A Reaper's "suggestions" can manipulate victims into betraying friends, trusting enemies, or viewing the Reaper itself with superstitious awe. Should a Reaper subvert a well-placed political or military leader, the resulting chaos can bring down nations.

Long-term physical effects of the manipulation are unsustainable, Higher mental functioning decays, ultimately leaving the victim a gibbering animal. Rapid indoctrination is possible, but causes this decay in days or weeks. Slow, patient indoctrination allows the thrall to last for months or years.''

[Arian Dynas]

Hey folks, long time no see.

[umadcommander]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Hey folks, long time no see.

i remember your gigantic walls of text from when i was lurking on this thread

[CoolioThane]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Hey folks, long time no see.

Arian! So good to see you back 

How've you been?

[Arian Dynas]

Been getting hammered with finals, and was feeling a bit guilty for not being here.

And glad to see someone remembers the things I'm famous for. 

Modifié par Arian Dynas, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:52 .

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Restrider wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

TheProtheans wrote...

If it is established(established where) Shepard isn't indoctrinated before the ending.
That means the kid is real and a retard.
But also the Rachni thoughts on what happened to her people is worthless.

If the Reapers can put stuff into your mind to make you lose focus, you be pretty indoctrinated.
Unless you don't believe that.

Being in the process of being indoctrinated is not the same as actually being indoctrinated.

"the process of being indoctrinated" is a concept purely created by fans.

Didn't Rana and Benezia explain it as a process and not an off/on-style thing?

It has always been explained and displayed as such.

The people on board the Derelict Reaper dident go from normal to Indoctrinated in the span of a second, no they showed a range of symptoms as displayed by their logs.

Same pattern repeats in Arrival where the logs reveal the people slowly starting to have doubts even as they also started to have recurring nightmare. It wasent just "we will destroy the Relay" to "we dont know enough about the Reapers" in the span of a second.

There quite clearly is a process where the victim exhibits symptoms before beeing fully Indoctrinated.

Modifié par Raistlin Majare 1992, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:55 .

[CoolioThane]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Been getting hammered with finals, and was feeling a bit guilty for not being here.

And glad to see someone remembers the things I'm famous for. 

Feel they've gone well? 

[Arian Dynas]

Hmm, still got a 3000 word essay to knock out, some discussion questions to catch up on, and then I'm done.

Not sure how my math one went, that's the only one got me scared. I hate math.

[umadcommander]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Been getting hammered with finals, and was feeling a bit guilty for not being here.

And glad to see someone remembers the things I'm famous for. 

well it would have been difficult to miss them

[The Heretic of Time]

Thing is, that we know exactly what being indoctrinated is like, in very close detail from a first person perspective. Mass Effect Retribution shows us this.

What is experienced by Paul Grayson is absolutely nothing like anything Shepard experiences through the trilogy. It's completely different. Nothing that Shepard experiences comes even close to what Paul Grayson experienced when undergoing indoctrination. Anything the ITers put forward as "Shepard under influence of indoctrination" is nothing like what we see happening to Paul Grayson.

Granted, Paul Grayson was being indoctrinated by nanites and not by a reaper signal, though whether there actually is any difference between the two is completely unknown. As far as I understood these nanites in Graysons brain also used a signal to influence his brain and indoctrinate him.

[gunslinger_ruiz]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Hmm, still got a 3000 word essay to knock out, some discussion questions to catch up on, and then I'm done.

Not sure how my math one went, that's the only one got me scared. I hate math.

/salute

Good to see you again Arian, hope all is well with the finals. Unfortunatley speculations for me are drawing to a close, sleep calls.

Night everyone.

[TheProtheans]

Restrider wrote...

dorktainian wrote...

Consider it added to the list...

What exactly does this prove, other that everything is positioned differently and the shapes are different.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

Thing is, that we know exactly what being indoctrinated is like, in very close detail from a first person perspective. Mass Effect Retribution shows us this.

What is experienced by Paul Grayson is absolutely nothing like anything Shepard experiences through the trilogy. It's completely different. Nothing that Shepard experiences comes even close to what Paul Grayson experienced when undergoing indoctrination. Anything the ITers put forward as "Shepard under influence of indoctrination" is nothing like what we see happening to Paul Grayson.

Granted, Paul Grayson was being indoctrinated by nanites and not by a reaper signal, though whether there actually is any difference between the two is completely unknown. As far as I understood these nanites in Graysons brain also used a signal to influence his brain and indoctrinate him.

I havent read the comic, but wasent Paul Grayson allready at the point where he dident really ahve control of his own actions any longer?

[CoolioThane]

It shows the breath scene is on Earth

[TheProtheans]

CoolioThane wrote...

It shows the breath scene is on Earth

Because there is concrete and a metal object in the background that look completely different?

[hukbum]

TheProtheans wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

It shows the breath scene is on Earth

Because there is concrete and a metal object in the background that look completely different?

Maybe it looks diffrent because the camera position is diffrent?

[umadcommander]

TheProtheans wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

It shows the breath scene is on Earth

Because there is concrete and a metal object in the background that look completely different?

looks more like earth than the citadel

[WolfyZA]

.... Doesnt matter anymore.... Time for some head cannoning 101

Modifié par WolfyZA, 12 décembre 2012 - 01:33 .

[TheProtheans]

hukbum wrote...

TheProtheans wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

It shows the breath scene is on Earth

Because there is concrete and a metal object in the background that look completely different?

Maybe it looks diffrent because the camera position is diffrent?

Of the metal object.
In the breathing scene it looks cylinder instead of the rectangular shape in the run down to the beam.
There is also a greater angle of spacing between the polls.
In the breath scene it looks like some sort of covered pipes that were exposed in the destroy ending.

And it doesn't make much sense for Shepard to be lying there.
And the angle which the photo is taken in the breath scene appears impossible to achieve in the image from the run down.

[hukbum]

TheProtheans wrote...

And it doesn't make much sense for Shepard to be lying there.

Ah, there's the problem ...

Btw. - where did all the concrete on the citadel suddenly come from?

[The Heretic of Time]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

Thing is, that we know exactly what being indoctrinated is like, in very close detail from a first person perspective. Mass Effect Retribution shows us this.

What is experienced by Paul Grayson is absolutely nothing like anything Shepard experiences through the trilogy. It's completely different. Nothing that Shepard experiences comes even close to what Paul Grayson experienced when undergoing indoctrination. Anything the ITers put forward as "Shepard under influence of indoctrination" is nothing like what we see happening to Paul Grayson.

Granted, Paul Grayson was being indoctrinated by nanites and not by a reaper signal, though whether there actually is any difference between the two is completely unknown. As far as I understood these nanites in Graysons brain also used a signal to influence his brain and indoctrinate him.

I havent read the comic, but wasent Paul Grayson allready at the point where he dident really ahve control of his own actions any longer?

First of al: It's not a comic, but a book.

Second: No. We see the process of indotrination in Grayson from the very start to finish, all from a first-person perspective from Grayson. We see how it all starts with a subtile tingling in the back of his skull and strange ringing in his ears, then he hears indistinct whispers, noises, coming from inside his head. The voices become louder and eventually he can even understand them. The voices talk to him, give him suggestions, tell him what to do, what to feel, what to think. The voices are creepy and Grayson doesn't trust them at first, but over time the voices become more familiar and start to sound more reasonable. Most of all, the voice that talk to him start to sound and feel like his own voice, his own thoughts. He can no longer make a clear distinction between the alien voices and his own thoughts. Over time, there is no longer such distinction. The voices are now his voice, their thoughts are now his thoughts, their goal is now his goal, their reasoning is now his reasoning. He tries to resist, but resisting only hurts like hell. The pain is unbearable. The only way to make the pain go away is by giving in.


Grayson is pretty impressible. He manages ot resist indoctrination up to the point where he's almost completely entralled. Even when he's physically a complete monster with synthetic parts growing out of his body, he still manages to stay in control of his own thoughts to some extent. This results in bipolar and schizophrenic behavior. It's a battle of willpower. What is interesting is that the reapers try to use Graysons past against him. Grayson did a lot of horrible stuff and he was a good for nothing red sand addict. He tried to become a better person, a better father and not a red sand addict. The reapers tried to convince Grayson that he can't change who he truly is, that he should just accept that he's a dirty good-for-nothing red sand addict and a horrible father. I think the reapers do this to tear down Graysons willpower, so he becomes easier to control.

Modifié par Heretic_Hanar, 12 décembre 2012 - 01:59 .

[Eryri]

Hi IT folk,

Was there any news on why Jennifer Hale was using a motion capture suit? Did it turn out to be ME related or one of her many, many other gaming roles? Anybody know if Mark Meer has been doing the same?

Modifié par Eryri, 12 décembre 2012 - 01:45 .

[dorktainian]

1M1 structures (i'm assuming they are earth tech) on sheps long walk to the control room. wtf?



edit.......top yet again...  

Modifié par dorktainian, 12 décembre 2012 - 01:49 .

[TheProtheans]

hukbum wrote...

TheProtheans wrote...

And it doesn't make much sense for Shepard to be lying there.

Ah, there's the problem ...

Btw. - where did all the concrete on the citadel suddenly come from?

Well I don't know what the buildings on the citadel are made of.
It seem possible that the concrete was exposed after the outer layers of whatever covered the dirty concrete was destroyed.
Or it is just different concrete.