80611 réponses à ce sujet

[RavenEyry]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Now you're just saying what the ending tells you like it makes sense or something. Next you're going to say that jumping into a beam of energy can alter everything in the galaxy at the most basic level, just because that's what's said.

If you want to defend a position other than IT, you must do it without using space magic.

What? Where is something getting rearranged by a program space magic? It's even the same principle the weapons use when unfolding, which seems to work without space magic.

...green light giving everything organic in the galaxy a new DNA and machines an 'understanding' isn't space magic because guns fold?

Right, I'm with Rifneno, Megumi's just trolling now.

[MegumiAzusa]

RavenEyry wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Now you're just saying what the ending tells you like it makes sense or something. Next you're going to say that jumping into a beam of energy can alter everything in the galaxy at the most basic level, just because that's what's said.

If you want to defend a position other than IT, you must do it without using space magic.

What? Where is something getting rearranged by a program space magic? It's even the same principle the weapons use when unfolding, which seems to work without space magic.

...green light giving everything organic in the galaxy a new DNA and machines an 'understanding' isn't space magic because guns fold?

Right, I'm with Rifneno, Megumi's just trolling now.

I was merely stating that some points that are called "impossible" are in fact very plausible. For synthesis you would need a leap of faith, yes, but that doesn't make anything else less viable.
Just look at some arse pulls Star Trek does. Synthesis is nothing against that.

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 12 décembre 2012 - 04:33 .

[paxxton]

Howdy!

[Dwailing]

RavenEyry wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Now you're just saying what the ending tells you like it makes sense or something. Next you're going to say that jumping into a beam of energy can alter everything in the galaxy at the most basic level, just because that's what's said.

If you want to defend a position other than IT, you must do it without using space magic.

What? Where is something getting rearranged by a program space magic? It's even the same principle the weapons use when unfolding, which seems to work without space magic.

...green light giving everything organic in the galaxy a new DNA and machines an 'understanding' isn't space magic because guns fold?

Right, I'm with Rifneno, Megumi's just trolling now.

I think Megumi is talking about how the Citadel is shifting and changing though, not Synthesis...

[DoomsdayDevice]

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

[TheProtheans]

TIM being indoctrinated or not is a debate on what it is to be indoctrinated.
If you say TIM was indoctrinated and that Shepard wasn't indoctrinated despite the both of them having the same goals they always had until the end it doesn't make sense.
If Shepard is only indoctrinated when he makes the final decision, doesn't that mean both Saren and TIM are only indoctrinated when they make the final decision, on where the see themselves.
Which is the same as the decision Shepard has to where he sees himself.

If you saying that them starting with different opinions to Shepard about how to deal with the Reapers makes them indoctrinated then you would be misguided and very much a fool because people have different opinions all the time.

Actually ignore the TIM part, as you guys believe it never happened, use Saren instead.
TIM might not actually be indoctrinated at all in IT, he might be in the same position as Shepard.

Modifié par TheProtheans, 12 décembre 2012 - 04:38 .

[MegumiAzusa]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

Semi true. For everything BW said the story should be over. And if it's not we are "waiting" 9 months now, everything they do now that confirms IT can and will be interpreted by most of the fans as a try to appease.

[MegumiAzusa]

TheProtheans wrote...

TIM being indoctrinated or not is a debate on what it is to be indoctrinated.
If you say TIM was indoctrinated and that Shepard wasn't indoctrinated despite the both of them having the same goals they always had until the end it doesn't make sense.
If Shepard is only indoctrinated when he makes the final decision, doesn't that mean both Saren and TIM are only indoctrinated when they make the final decision, on where the see themselves.
Which is the same as the decision Shepard has to where he sees himself.

If you saying that them starting with different opinions to Shepard about how to deal with the Reapers makes them indoctrinated then you would be misguided and very much a fool because people have different opinions all the time.

Actually ignore the TIM part, as you guys believe it never happened, use Saren instead.
TIM might not actually be indoctrinated at all in IT, he might be in the same position as Shepard.

Oh I would so want a DLC now where Cerberus comes to rescue, controlling Reaper forces here and there, TIM scrapping Shep from the rubble and help her set off the Crucible
(Best with Shep being confused about how TIM is there and TIM explaining something along the lines of "I told you Shepard, I am fighting the Reapers longer then you can even imagine.")

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 12 décembre 2012 - 04:41 .

[MaximizedAction]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

Semi true. For everything BW said the story should be over. And if it's not we are "waiting" 9 months now, everything they do now that confirms IT can and will be interpreted by most of the fans as a try to appease.

If they happen to release post-ending DLC revealing that Shepard was indeed only hallucinating, what will be remembered is a twist, not how the twist came together, not every player is so hardcore that he spends a long time thinking about how he has to feel about Bioware and what "they probably did in reallity", like "only appeasing".

In other words, that'll only be the nerds who spend 9 months on this forum still expressing how they feel.

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 12 décembre 2012 - 04:43 .

[acidic-ph0]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

Semi true. For everything BW said the story should be over. And if it's not we are "waiting" 9 months now, everything they do now that confirms IT can and will be interpreted by most of the fans as a try to appease.

Agreed actually...

No company in their right mind would wait 9 months to reveal the "real" ending and say that it was all intended from the beginning, while a huge ****storm contimues to rage and DLC sales suffer for it. If they had anything planned, they would've said something within a couple of months stating that there will be more to the end. Cryptic tweets about keeping our save files didin't really help soothe the anger much.

If Bioware does do any kind of major IT reveal, it will only be because they adopted it from fans. Which I'm totally okay with so long as it gives the game a rewarding and sensible conclusion!

[TheProtheans]

dorktainian wrote...

ok then now for the  big question.   

When shep is staggering through the 'citadel' he goes past several structures on an as yet undiscovered part of the citadel.....  including areas of the citadel apparently 'changing' for some unknown reason.  on his way 'up the ramp' there are clearly 'human' structures on a part of the citadel that no living creature (apart from the keepers) has (as far as we know because he is 'underneath' the presidium tower in a secret chamber) ever visited.  How did it get there?  There is no way any human has been there before (unless they are corpses) so what gives then?

 
Was the Catalyst talking about the area of the Citadel never reached before.
Or was he talking about the stage into the cycle and what was achieved before that moment.

It's clear organics were at that location before, but were they at that place at such an important time.

[paxxton]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Now you're just saying what the ending tells you like it makes sense or something. Next you're going to say that jumping into a beam of energy can alter everything in the galaxy at the most basic level, just because that's what's said.

If you want to defend a position other than IT, you must do it without using space magic.

What? Where is something getting rearranged by a program space magic? It's even the same principle the weapons use when unfolding, which seems to work without space magic.

...green light giving everything organic in the galaxy a new DNA and machines an 'understanding' isn't space magic because guns fold?

Right, I'm with Rifneno, Megumi's just trolling now.

I was merely stating that some points that are called "impossible" are in fact very plausible. For synthesis you would need a leap of faith, yes, but that doesn't make anything else less viable.
Just look at some arse pulls Star Trek does. Synthesis is nothing against that.

Fancy BS may still be just BS. Explanation: you can't apply the rule that a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to everything. It would make things impossible to understand, evaluate or dismiss. I'm not saying Synthesis is impossible but it feels like a bit of a cop-out to make it the way it is.

[DoomsdayDevice]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

Semi true. For everything BW said the story should be over. And if it's not we are "waiting" 9 months now, everything they do now that confirms IT can and will be interpreted by most of the fans as a try to appease.

It makes sense to wait until the very last to reveal it.

They could easily straighten things out by releasing a 'making of' in which they explain exactly what was and was not intended, how they planned everything, etcetera.

The way I see, the trick they pulled (IT) is just a huge PR stunt. They have said for years that Shepard's story will be three games. It's drilled into everybody's mind. It is a stunt to give us a 4th game with Shepard.

As for what Bioware says, if this is indeed an attempt to fool people, it would only make sense that they lie.

[Dwailing]

acidic-ph0 wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

Semi true. For everything BW said the story should be over. And if it's not we are "waiting" 9 months now, everything they do now that confirms IT can and will be interpreted by most of the fans as a try to appease.

Agreed actually...

No company in their right mind would wait 9 months to reveal the "real" ending and say that it was all intended from the beginning, while a huge ****storm contimues to rage and DLC sales suffer for it. If they had anything planned, they would've said something within a couple of months stating that there will be more to the end. Cryptic tweets about keeping our save files didin't really help soothe the anger much.

If Bioware does do any kind of major IT reveal, it will only be because they adopted it from fans. Which I'm totally okay with so long as it gives the game a rewarding and sensible conclusion!

Who says the devs are in their right minds?  If they had honestly intended the original endings to be taken literally, and had thought people would like them, then they're just as crazy as they would be to wait a year for a reveal if not more so.

[acidic-ph0]

MaximizedAction wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

Semi true. For everything BW said the story should be over. And if it's not we are "waiting" 9 months now, everything they do now that confirms IT can and will be interpreted by most of the fans as a try to appease.

If they happen to release post-ending DLC revealing that Shepard was indeed only hallucinating, what will be remembered is a twist, not how the twist came together, not every player is so hardcore that he spends a long time thinking about how he has to feel about Bioware and what "they probably did in reallity", like "only appeasing".

In other words, that'll only be the nerds who spend 9 months on this forum still expressing how they feel.

To be fair, I think it will upset a LOT more people than just us forum posters... Paying for an actual ending 9 months after the games release is a very bad business practice. 

And although I hate to say this... I think it would set a very VERY bad precedence if they released said content for a price. It will probably spark another wave of venom and controversy.

[MaximizedAction]

paxxton wrote...
Fancy BS may still be just BS. Explanation: you can't apply the rule that a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to everything. It would make things impossible to understand, evaluate or dismiss. I'm not saying Synthesis is impossible but it feels like a bit of a cop-out to make it the way it is.

Agreed. The codex is there for a reason. And I'd rather not assume (anymore) that they only kept it for "old times sake" without taking it serious anymore and abolish the basic concept for developing and maintaining serious fantasy/scifi stories....because that is something a 4 year old from kindergarten would do.
A professional writer not so much.

Also, Mike Gamble has tweeted that they will not update the codex on the ending choices and the Catalyst on how they work.

[MegumiAzusa]

MaximizedAction wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I think Megumi can't make sense of IT because she isn't willing to entertain the possibility that the story isn't over.

(It's just a guess, not a personal attack.)

Semi true. For everything BW said the story should be over. And if it's not we are "waiting" 9 months now, everything they do now that confirms IT can and will be interpreted by most of the fans as a try to appease.

If they happen to release post-ending DLC revealing that Shepard was indeed only hallucinating, what will be remembered is a twist, not how the twist came together, not every player is so hardcore that he spends a long time thinking about how he has to feel about Bioware and what "they probably did in reallity", like "only appeasing".

In other words, that'll only be the nerds who spend 9 months on this forum still expressing how they feel.

The Command and Conquer community disagrees. If you ask anyone who played TS, TW, and KW about why there are Cyborgs and Walkers in KW the response would be the fans wanting it that way. Just the same thing.

[MaximizedAction]

acidic-ph0 wrote...
To be fair, I think it will upset a LOT more people than just us forum posters... Paying for an actual ending 9 months after the games release is a very bad business practice. 

And although I hate to say this... I think it would set a very VERY bad precedence if they released said content for a price. It will probably spark another wave of venom and controversy.

No, I myself would rather have them release post-ending material that affects the main story significantly for free. Not as in "free is good" but for those reasons you wrote.

[MegumiAzusa]

paxxton wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Now you're just saying what the ending tells you like it makes sense or something. Next you're going to say that jumping into a beam of energy can alter everything in the galaxy at the most basic level, just because that's what's said.

If you want to defend a position other than IT, you must do it without using space magic.

What? Where is something getting rearranged by a program space magic? It's even the same principle the weapons use when unfolding, which seems to work without space magic.

...green light giving everything organic in the galaxy a new DNA and machines an 'understanding' isn't space magic because guns fold?

Right, I'm with Rifneno, Megumi's just trolling now.

I was merely stating that some points that are called "impossible" are in fact very plausible. For synthesis you would need a leap of faith, yes, but that doesn't make anything else less viable.
Just look at some arse pulls Star Trek does. Synthesis is nothing against that.

Fancy BS may still be just BS. Explanation: you can't apply the rule that a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to everything. It would make things impossible to understand, evaluate or dismiss. I'm not saying Synthesis is impossible but it feels like a bit of a cop-out to make it the way it is.

Not being impossible means it's just improbable. That's everything the literal explanation needs to make sense and you basically just confirmed it.
The Wrath of Kahn is based on space magic, it's still widely seen as the best Star Trek movie there is.

[MaximizedAction]

MegumiAzusa wrote...
The Command and Conquer community disagrees. If you ask anyone who played TS, TW, and KW about why there are Cyborgs and Walkers in KW the response would be the fans wanting it that way. Just the same thing.

Well of course there will be such fans. I'm not sure about C&C's Cyborgs and Walkers but IT isn't exactly something that BW would have to develop from scratch to appease fans. It's already there, burried etc.

[MegumiAzusa]

MaximizedAction wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...
The Command and Conquer community disagrees. If you ask anyone who played TS, TW, and KW about why there are Cyborgs and Walkers in KW the response would be the fans wanting it that way. Just the same thing.

Well of course there will be such fans. I'm not sure about C&C's Cyborgs and Walkers but IT isn't exactly something that BW would have to develop from scratch to appease fans. It's already there, burried etc.

Walkers, at least in scrap metal form, are still in TW too, doesn't change that you cannot build them. (Though you can build certain ones, but if you know a bit about C&C you also know what I mean)

[TheProtheans]

paxxton wrote...

Fancy BS may still be just BS. Explanation: you can't apply the rule that a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to everything. It would make things impossible to understand, evaluate or dismiss. I'm not saying Synthesis is impossible but it feels like a bit of a cop-out to make it the way it is.

Forget Synthesis, the Crucible itself makes no sense and is complete and utter space magic device developed by species with a low level of tech and they supposedly made the most advanced thing ever.
The crucible is a cop out.

I wonder how IT would end without the use of this space magic.

[paxxton]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

paxxton wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Now you're just saying what the ending tells you like it makes sense or something. Next you're going to say that jumping into a beam of energy can alter everything in the galaxy at the most basic level, just because that's what's said.

If you want to defend a position other than IT, you must do it without using space magic.

What? Where is something getting rearranged by a program space magic? It's even the same principle the weapons use when unfolding, which seems to work without space magic.

...green light giving everything organic in the galaxy a new DNA and machines an 'understanding' isn't space magic because guns fold?

Right, I'm with Rifneno, Megumi's just trolling now.

I was merely stating that some points that are called "impossible" are in fact very plausible. For synthesis you would need a leap of faith, yes, but that doesn't make anything else less viable.
Just look at some arse pulls Star Trek does. Synthesis is nothing against that.

Fancy BS may still be just BS. Explanation: you can't apply the rule that a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to everything. It would make things impossible to understand, evaluate or dismiss. I'm not saying Synthesis is impossible but it feels like a bit of a cop-out to make it the way it is.

Not being impossible means it's just improbable. That's everything the literal explanation needs to make sense and you basically just confirmed it.
The Wrath of Kahn is based on space magic, it's still widely seen as the best Star Trek movie there is.

In terms of good storytelling it is impossible because it suddenly introduces a device of unknown function that surpasses every other tech in the series (both Reaper and Organic) by lightyears. And it was built by "lesser species". Don't forget that the schematics were conveniently comprehendible for them, not something you would expect from a plan of a device with such extraordinary capabilities.

[paxxton]

TheProtheans wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Fancy BS may still be just BS. Explanation: you can't apply the rule that a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to everything. It would make things impossible to understand, evaluate or dismiss. I'm not saying Synthesis is impossible but it feels like a bit of a cop-out to make it the way it is.

Forget Synthesis, the Crucible itself makes no sense and is complete and utter space magic device developed by species with a low level of tech and they supposedly made the most advanced thing ever.
The crucible is a cop out.

I wonder how IT would end without the use of this space magic.

IT is not based on space magic but on denying that the ending was real. Space Magic is used in the hallucination precisely because it is a hallucination.

[TheProtheans]

paxxton wrote...

TheProtheans wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Fancy BS may still be just BS. Explanation: you can't apply the rule that a sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic to everything. It would make things impossible to understand, evaluate or dismiss. I'm not saying Synthesis is impossible but it feels like a bit of a cop-out to make it the way it is.

Forget Synthesis, the Crucible itself makes no sense and is complete and utter space magic device developed by species with a low level of tech and they supposedly made the most advanced thing ever.
The crucible is a cop out.

I wonder how IT would end without the use of this space magic.

IT is not based on space magic but on denying that the ending was real. Space Magic is used in the hallucination precisely because it is a hallucination.

Ok.... how would it end without using this space magic?