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Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark III!


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#67551
Eryri

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LDS Darth Revan wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.[/i]

Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.

I don't get the importance of the second one. What are you pointing at?


I think DD is pointing out that Shepard choosing anything other than destroy is overstepping his authority and mandate as a soldier. He was ordered to stop the reaper threat, not make unilateral, reality-altering decisions, or assume the mantle of galactic God Emperor. At least that's my take.

BTW LDS - I've not watched much anime, but is it worth me starting from the first season of Full Metal Alchemist? I'm looking for stuff to fill my rental list on Lovefilm.

Modifié par Eryri, 15 décembre 2012 - 04:56 .


#67552
Arian Dynas

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byne wrote...

Can we just stop this debate about who is worse? Why cant we all just get along? :crying:


Seconded, that's all I want; If ANYONE in this thread has a personal issue with someone, take it to Private; we don't want to see your dirty laundry.

#67553
BatmanTurian

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DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Nobody seems to give a flying **** about dialogue, but just for the hell of it.

Reposting some recent stuff.

This is after the Rachni mission, the Missing Scouts, Anderson on vidcom:

Anderson: Shepard. So I imagine you've wiped the galaxy clean of Reapers, and we can all come up for air?
Shepard: Not quite. There are a few complications.
Anderson: Aren't there always? Hackett filled me in on the Crucible. Sounds like you've got some knots to untangle.
(...)
Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.


Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.


I care, but a lot of gamers seem to just take game dialogue at face value. I blame Halo and CoD.

#67554
Hanako Ikezawa

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Dwailing wrote...

spotlessvoid wrote...

LDS- go big. Always go big!


Agreed!  Have a flare for the dramatic.  Don't go TOO over the top,  but don't be too conservative, either.

It's a comparison, so I can't really go too over the top, and the only thing I'm leaving out, and might even put in with updates, are specific minor examples of people/places.
As for flare of the dramatic, the most dramatic removal of a contact ever:
Posted Image

#67555
Hanako Ikezawa

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Eryri wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.[/i]

Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.

I don't get the importance of the second one. What are you pointing at?


I think DD is pointing out that Shepard choosing anything other than destroy is overstepping his authority and mandate as a soldier. He was ordered to stop the reaper threat, not make unilateral, reality-altering decisions, or assume the mantle of galactic God Emperor. At least that's my take.

BTW LDS - I've not watched much anime, but is it worth starting from the first season of Full Metal Alchemist?

Oh, ok then.

While I like Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood more than the original Fullmetal Alchemist, both are amazing and i highly reccomend them both. Just remember, the two are alternate realities so they share almost nothing except enviornment and characters.

#67556
Rifneno

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BatmanTurian wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Nobody seems to give a flying **** about dialogue, but just for the hell of it.

Reposting some recent stuff.

This is after the Rachni mission, the Missing Scouts, Anderson on vidcom:

Anderson: Shepard. So I imagine you've wiped the galaxy clean of Reapers, and we can all come up for air?
Shepard: Not quite. There are a few complications.
Anderson: Aren't there always? Hackett filled me in on the Crucible. Sounds like you've got some knots to untangle.
(...)
Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.


Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.


I care, but a lot of gamers seem to just take game dialogue at face value. I blame Halo and CoD.


I blame Udina.  I don't know why.  Just seems like something that'd be his fault.

#67557
BatmanTurian

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LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

spotlessvoid wrote...

LDS- go big. Always go big!


Agreed!  Have a flare for the dramatic.  Don't go TOO over the top,  but don't be too conservative, either.

It's a comparison, so I can't really go too over the top, and the only thing I'm leaving out, and might even put in with updates, are specific minor examples of people/places.
As for flare of the dramatic, the most dramatic removal of a contact ever:
*Ledo*che*

God, I hate and love that magnificent bastard.

#67558
BatmanTurian

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Rifneno wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Nobody seems to give a flying **** about dialogue, but just for the hell of it.

Reposting some recent stuff.

This is after the Rachni mission, the Missing Scouts, Anderson on vidcom:

Anderson: Shepard. So I imagine you've wiped the galaxy clean of Reapers, and we can all come up for air?
Shepard: Not quite. There are a few complications.
Anderson: Aren't there always? Hackett filled me in on the Crucible. Sounds like you've got some knots to untangle.
(...)
Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.


Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.


I care, but a lot of gamers seem to just take game dialogue at face value. I blame Halo and CoD.


I blame Udina.  I don't know why.  Just seems like something that'd be his fault.


Ashley's right up there too. Those two should have just gotten together and been written out.

#67559
Rifneno

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BatmanTurian wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

I blame Udina.  I don't know why.  Just seems like something that'd be his fault.


Ashley's right up there too. Those two should have just gotten together and been written out.


Virmire.  From Ash to ashes.

#67560
Dwailing

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Arian Dynas wrote...

byne wrote...

Can we just stop this debate about who is worse? Why cant we all just get along? :crying:


Seconded, that's all I want; If ANYONE in this thread has a personal issue with someone, take it to Private; we don't want to see your dirty laundry.



Thirded.  It's amazing how quickly we went from mutual love and respect to hate again.  It's time to put this to An End Once And For All (Seriously, will someone post a link to AEOAFA?).

Modifié par Dwailing, 15 décembre 2012 - 05:06 .


#67561
Eryri

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LDS Darth Revan wrote...

While I like Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood more than the original Fullmetal Alchemist, both are amazing and i highly reccomend them both. Just remember, the two are alternate realities so they share almost nothing except enviornment and characters.


OK. Thanks for the tip.

#67562
Rifneno

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Dwailing wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

byne wrote...

Can we just stop this debate about who is worse? Why cant we all just get along? :crying:


Seconded, that's all I want; If ANYONE in this thread has a personal issue with someone, take it to Private; we don't want to see your dirty laundry.



Thirded.  It's amazing how quickly we went from mutual love and respect to hate again.  It's time to put this to An End Once And For All (Seriously, I'm will someone post a link to AEOAFA?).


How can AEOAFA be a popular track around here?

#67563
DoomsdayDevice

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LDS Darth Revan wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Nobody seems to give a flying **** about dialogue, but just for the hell of it.

Reposting some recent stuff.

This is after the Rachni mission, the Missing Scouts, Anderson on vidcom:

Anderson: Shepard. So I imagine you've wiped the galaxy clean of Reapers, and we can all come up for air?
Shepard: Not quite. There are a few complications.
Anderson: Aren't there always? Hackett filled me in on the Crucible. Sounds like you've got some knots to untangle.
(...)
Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.


Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.

I don't get the importance of the second one. What are you pointing at?


It's a reference to not doing what you were sent to do (destroying the Reapers), but getting sidetracked by the catalyst's diplomacy.

That's the cool thing about many of these references that we're finding, you can interpret them as if the story already happened, as if the story is on some infinite loop, and Anderson is asking you if you picked destroy in the end, or got sidelined by the catalyst trying to talk you out of it.

It's the kind of foreshadowing you can't notice on a first playthrough, but when replaying, these things just stand out.

Like this one:

Turian: Listen, honey, please... This is how it has to be. Everyone is going through this.
Asari: I know, and I'm sure you'll be fine, but it's just so damn inconvenient. It's like we're pre-spaceflight all of a sudden.


(As if they just had to go through the experience of the ending - the relays getting destroyed, etcetera. It's a way of telling the players - don't worry: everybody's going through this.)

James Vega: It's... not right. It looks pretty, calm and peaceful, but it's not right. It's all just an illusion. (...)
Shepard: I can hardly believe it, myself. Like everything back on Earth was some kind of nightmare.


Back on Earth is literally referring to the beginning of the game, but you can also interpret it as if talking about the last time you played the ending - and then it becomes interesting.

#67564
BatmanTurian

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Dwailing wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

byne wrote...

Can we just stop this debate about who is worse? Why cant we all just get along? :crying:


Seconded, that's all I want; If ANYONE in this thread has a personal issue with someone, take it to Private; we don't want to see your dirty laundry.



Thirded.  It's amazing how quickly we went from mutual love and respect to hate again.  It's time to put this to An End Once And For All (Seriously, will someone post a link to AEOAFA?).

okay, well anyone want to look at my hobbit council scene and discuss the parallels or are we just all going to nod and agree?

#67565
Hanako Ikezawa

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Lokanaiya wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Question:
I'm almost done with text part of my comparison, but I haven't started pictures/gifs(which would you like btw, pics, gifs, or combo of the two) yet. Do you want just the text, in which case I can probably get it done in 2-4 hours, or do you want the full thing, in which case it won't be up for a couple more days since I have a wedding to go to tomorrow? Which would you guys prefer?
Also note that full version will be it's own thread too.


I'd really like you guys to answer this, please. It will basically determine my next few days for me.


What are comparison you referring to?


I'm comparing Mass effect to Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood, specifically the Reapers to the Homunculi. It goes without saying that it will have MASSIVE spoilers for those who haven't seen it, to which I apologize for spoiling (I'll put a warning post out about half an hour before I post it here), but it is just to good to ignore making it anymore.

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 15 décembre 2012 - 05:08 .


#67566
Dwailing

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Rifneno wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

byne wrote...

Can we just stop this debate about who is worse? Why cant we all just get along? :crying:


Seconded, that's all I want; If ANYONE in this thread has a personal issue with someone, take it to Private; we don't want to see your dirty laundry.



Thirded.  It's amazing how quickly we went from mutual love and respect to hate again.  It's time to put this to An End Once And For All (Seriously, I'm will someone post a link to AEOAFA?).


How can AEOAFA be a popular track around here?


Well, for one thing, I think it's a beautiful piece of music, despite where it's played.

#67567
byne

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Rifneno wrote...

How can AEOAFA be a popular track around here?


I dont know. The endings become infinitely better when you replace the music.

#67568
Hanako Ikezawa

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Eryri wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

While I like Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood more than the original Fullmetal Alchemist, both are amazing and i highly reccomend them both. Just remember, the two are alternate realities so they share almost nothing except enviornment and characters.


OK. Thanks for the tip.

How do you feel about spoilers, because said comparison will be full of them, at least for Brotherhood?

#67569
DoomsdayDevice

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LDS Darth Revan wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Question:
I'm almost done with text part of my comparison, but I haven't started pictures/gifs(which would you like btw, pics, gifs, or combo of the two) yet. Do you want just the text, in which case I can probably get it done in 2-4 hours, or do you want the full thing, in which case it won't be up for a couple more days since I have a wedding to go to tomorrow? Which would you guys prefer?
Also note that full version will be it's own thread too.


I'd really like you guys to answer this, please. It will basically determine my next few days for me.


What were you doing again? IIRC correctly you were doing something I'm not familiar with, so I probably have no opinion. :D

#67570
Hanako Ikezawa

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DoomsdayDevice wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Nobody seems to give a flying **** about dialogue, but just for the hell of it.

Reposting some recent stuff.

This is after the Rachni mission, the Missing Scouts, Anderson on vidcom:

Anderson: Shepard. So I imagine you've wiped the galaxy clean of Reapers, and we can all come up for air?
Shepard: Not quite. There are a few complications.
Anderson: Aren't there always? Hackett filled me in on the Crucible. Sounds like you've got some knots to untangle.
(...)
Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.


Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.

I don't get the importance of the second one. What are you pointing at?


It's a reference to not doing what you were sent to do (destroying the Reapers), but getting sidetracked by the catalyst's diplomacy.

That's the cool thing about many of these references that we're finding, you can interpret them as if the story already happened, as if the story is on some infinite loop, and Anderson is asking you if you picked destroy in the end, or got sidelined by the catalyst trying to talk you out of it.

It's the kind of foreshadowing you can't notice on a first playthrough, but when replaying, these things just stand out.

Like this one:

Turian: Listen, honey, please... This is how it has to be. Everyone is going through this.
Asari: I know, and I'm sure you'll be fine, but it's just so damn inconvenient. It's like we're pre-spaceflight all of a sudden.


(As if they just had to go through the experience of the ending - the relays getting destroyed, etcetera. It's a way of telling the players - don't worry: everybody's going through this.)

James Vega: It's... not right. It looks pretty, calm and peaceful, but it's not right. It's all just an illusion. (...)
Shepard: I can hardly believe it, myself. Like everything back on Earth was some kind of nightmare.


Back on Earth is literally referring to the beginning of the game, but you can also interpret it as if talking about the last time you played the ending - and then it becomes interesting.

Oh, cool.

#67571
BatmanTurian

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DoomsdayDevice wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Nobody seems to give a flying **** about dialogue, but just for the hell of it.

Reposting some recent stuff.

This is after the Rachni mission, the Missing Scouts, Anderson on vidcom:

Anderson: Shepard. So I imagine you've wiped the galaxy clean of Reapers, and we can all come up for air?
Shepard: Not quite. There are a few complications.
Anderson: Aren't there always? Hackett filled me in on the Crucible. Sounds like you've got some knots to untangle.
(...)
Shepard: It's what you hired me to do.
Anderson: Mostly you were hired to kill Reapers. I hope you haven't been sidetracked by all the politics.
Shepard: Nothing I can't handle.


Also, Omega ending foreshadowing - for those who may have missed it.

I don't get the importance of the second one. What are you pointing at?


It's a reference to not doing what you were sent to do (destroying the Reapers), but getting sidetracked by the catalyst's diplomacy.

That's the cool thing about many of these references that we're finding, you can interpret them as if the story already happened, as if the story is on some infinite loop, and Anderson is asking you if you picked destroy in the end, or got sidelined by the catalyst trying to talk you out of it.

It's the kind of foreshadowing you can't notice on a first playthrough, but when replaying, these things just stand out.

Like this one:

Turian: Listen, honey, please... This is how it has to be. Everyone is going through this.
Asari: I know, and I'm sure you'll be fine, but it's just so damn inconvenient. It's like we're pre-spaceflight all of a sudden.


(As if they just had to go through the experience of the ending - the relays getting destroyed, etcetera. It's a way of telling the players - don't worry: everybody's going through this.)

James Vega: It's... not right. It looks pretty, calm and peaceful, but it's not right. It's all just an illusion. (...)
Shepard: I can hardly believe it, myself. Like everything back on Earth was some kind of nightmare.


Back on Earth is literally referring to the beginning of the game, but you can also interpret it as if talking about the last time you played the ending - and then it becomes interesting.


I know you mean well, DD, and I respect and agree with your stuff, but almost everyone outside this thread subscribes to "badd riting thery" so it just falls on deaf ears.

#67572
Hanako Ikezawa

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DoomsdayDevice wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Question:
I'm almost done with text part of my comparison, but I haven't started pictures/gifs(which would you like btw, pics, gifs, or combo of the two) yet. Do you want just the text, in which case I can probably get it done in 2-4 hours, or do you want the full thing, in which case it won't be up for a couple more days since I have a wedding to go to tomorrow? Which would you guys prefer?
Also note that full version will be it's own thread too.


I'd really like you guys to answer this, please. It will basically determine my next few days for me.


What were you doing again? IIRC correctly you were doing something I'm not familiar with, so I probably have no opinion. :D

I'm comparing Mass effect to Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood, specifically the Reapers to the Homunculi. It goes without saying that it will have MASSIVE spoilers for those who haven't seen it, to which I apologize for spoiling (I'll put a warning post out about half an hour before I post it here), but it is just to good to ignore making it anymore.

#67573
Eryri

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DoomsdayDevice wrote...

That's the cool thing about many of these references that we're finding, you can interpret them as if the story already happened, as if the story is on some infinite loop, and Anderson is asking you if you picked destroy in the end, or got sidelined by the catalyst trying to talk you out of it.

It's the kind of foreshadowing you can't notice on a first playthrough, but when replaying, these things just stand out.

Like this one:

Turian: Listen, honey, please... This is how it has to be. Everyone is going through this.
Asari: I know, and I'm sure you'll be fine, but it's just so damn inconvenient. It's like we're pre-spaceflight all of a sudden.


(As if they just had to go through the experience of the ending - the relays getting destroyed, etcetera. It's a way of telling the players - don't worry: everybody's going through this.)

James Vega: It's... not right. It looks pretty, calm and peaceful, but it's not right. It's all just an illusion. (...)
Shepard: I can hardly believe it, myself. Like everything back on Earth was some kind of nightmare.


Back on Earth is literally referring to the beginning of the game, but you can also interpret it as if talking about the last time you played the ending - and then it becomes interesting.


This time-loop stuff is really interesting, if a bit trippy. Certainly hadn't occured to me. Do you think some sort of time paradox thing might be what Bioware really has in mind? 

#67574
spotlessvoid

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LDS:

I changed my mind. No pictures.

#67575
Hanako Ikezawa

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spotlessvoid wrote...

LDS:

I changed my mind. No pictures.

Why'd you change your mind?