80611 réponses à ce sujet

[estebanus]

masster blaster wrote...

Estebanus I was not talking about the Reapers, I was talking about the racies of this cycle. Do you honestly believe that Javik would allow for this to happen, and everyone else to be nice to the Reapers, after killing/harvesting their loved onces, burning their home'Ghome worlds, and for the deaths of trillions in each cycle.

What other options are there? They can't defeat the reapers, now can they?

[Humakt83]

MaximizedAction wrote...
But who knows what Bioware's target audiences was with ME3, because that ending didn't satisfy any of them.

Edit: well, it did satisfy some players...but according to my observations that requires putting not the attention to the ending it needs to be fully comprehended.

Speculators got something to feed upon.

[masster blaster]

I meant that Shepard does jack s*** to end the Reapers. Liara is the one that helped the next cycle win, not Shepard, so again Shepard did not end the Reaper threat, he only allowed the next cycle to continue the fight, and let trllions of more suffer.

Plus can you explain the Stargazer scene at the end when the kid ask " tell me another story about the Shepard."

Do you honestly think that that's it, no there is more to come, but you have to wait.

[masster blaster]

Really Estebanus you would rather let the galaxy live in fear just to live/ be friends with the Reapers. I think Destroy sounds better, than Synthesis, and Control, because people won't have to live in fear, and also what are the orphans going to think, when they find out that their mommy and daddy died because of the Reapers BS of a logic.

[estebanus]

masster blaster wrote...

I meant that Shepard does jack s*** to end the Reapers. Liara is the one that helped the next cycle win, not Shepard, so again Shepard did not end the Reaper threat, he only allowed the next cycle to continue the fight, and let trllions of more suffer.

Plus can you explain the Stargazer scene at the end when the kid ask " tell me another story about the Shepard."

Do you honestly think that that's it, no there is more to come, but you have to wait.

What does that have to do with what I said? Nothing.

"Another story" probably refers to DLC.

Modifié par estebanus, 07 août 2012 - 07:06 .

[KneeTheCap]

Speaking of which, does the stargazer scene appear if Shepard refuses?

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

masster blaster wrote...

I meant that Shepard does jack s*** to end the Reapers. Liara is the one that helped the next cycle win, not Shepard, so again Shepard did not end the Reaper threat, he only allowed the next cycle to continue the fight, and let trllions of more suffer.

Plus can you explain the Stargazer scene at the end when the kid ask " tell me another story about the Shepard."

Do you honestly think that that's it, no there is more to come, but you have to wait.

Yeah if taken litterally there is no another story about Shepard, unless you go way, way back to before he joined the Systems Alliance...oh wait even that was covered in the Origin Stories we choose in ME1. There is no "another story" to tell in the litteral ending.

Edit: Unless we are refering to the DLC, but would be a strange way to tell a story if he cut out a middle part...

Modifié par Raistlin Majare 1992, 07 août 2012 - 07:11 .

[estebanus]

masster blaster wrote...

Really Estebanus you would rather let the galaxy live in fear just to live/ be friends with the Reapers. I think Destroy sounds better, than Synthesis, and Control, because people won't have to live in fear, and also what are the orphans going to think, when they find out that their mommy and daddy died because of the Reapers BS of a logic.

They're gonna have to live with it. There's nothing they can do about it. The reapers are helping them, whether they like it or not.

[Simon_Says]

KneeTheCap wrote...

Speaking of which, does the stargazer scene appear if Shepard refuses?

It does, but it's a different Stargazer.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 07 août 2012 - 07:07 .

[Home run MF]

KneeTheCap wrote...

Speaking of which, does the stargazer scene appear if Shepard refuses?

Yes, and it has an unknown species.

Edit: damm you people are fast 

Modifié par Home run MF, 07 août 2012 - 07:09 .

[Norlond]

KneeTheCap wrote...

Speaking of which, does the stargazer scene appear if Shepard refuses?

kind of www.youtube.com/watch

*edit* 'ed by homerun

Modifié par Norlond, 07 août 2012 - 07:09 .

[MaximizedAction]

KneeTheCap wrote...

Speaking of which, does the stargazer scene appear if Shepard refuses?

In case of Refuse, this is the version for the Stargazer scene.

Oddly, here Bioware decided to put in an actual kid and something like an Asari, while they kept the giant + human-with-kid's-voice in the other endings.

Edit: Argh, 'd three times. Fatal!

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 07 août 2012 - 07:09 .

[Simon_Says]

estebanus wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Really Estebanus you would rather let the galaxy live in fear just to live/ be friends with the Reapers. I think Destroy sounds better, than Synthesis, and Control, because people won't have to live in fear, and also what are the orphans going to think, when they find out that their mommy and daddy died because of the Reapers BS of a logic.

They're gonna have to live with it. There's nothing they can do about it. The reapers are helping them, whether they like it or not.

Helping them... what? Ascend? Zing!

[estebanus]

Simon_Says wrote...

estebanus wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Really Estebanus you would rather let the galaxy live in fear just to live/ be friends with the Reapers. I think Destroy sounds better, than Synthesis, and Control, because people won't have to live in fear, and also what are the orphans going to think, when they find out that their mommy and daddy died because of the Reapers BS of a logic.

They're gonna have to live with it. There's nothing they can do about it. The reapers are helping them, whether they like it or not.

Helping them... what? Ascend? Zing!

...

[Arian Dynas]

JesseLee202 wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Nothing about Post-ending or bridging DLC which is what I think will come.

I really don't see how BW could continue ME with the original endings... Too many variables.

They shot themselves in the foot.

I was one of the people that used to like IT, until EC was not letting you play as Shep. IT would of been a good escape route for them to take IMO, but they didn't, and I accept the endings as they are.

There will be no "ending" DLC as far as I am concerned.

That does not, however say a word about EPILOGUE DLC.

Do you consider The Arrival, the "true ending" to Mass Effect 2? Certainly not, it's the epilogue, the bridging bit between ME1 and ME2.

They didn't have an issue introducing plot critcal elements in The Arrival (assuming IT, otherwise it's pointless) why not do it again?

[Humakt83]

"The crash site's a nightmare."

"This nightmare never ends." - Liara

"I am starting to understand what the word "nightmare" means to organics. And why you feel trapped when you can't wake up." - EDI

"As a child, I always had nightmares about geth attacking me in my sleep.The worst horror I could imagine. Until now." -Tali

"The only thing Cerberus gave me that I'm grateful for.A precaution if I was ever captured by the enemy.Or couldn't wake from my nightmare." - Dr. Gavin Archer


"After your intervention, the Illusive Man insisted I find another test subject. Someone who shared my brother David's "abilities."I couldn't bear the thought of reliving the nightmare." - Dr. Gavin Archer

"Not a monster who tortured his own brother.I told him if his intention was to work with the devil, he only had to look in the mirror. I wanted out of his nightmare."
- Dr. Gavin Archer


"Believe me, it's a nightmare I re-live every night. He went berserk -- his mind became a computer virus that infected all our systems." - Dr. Gavin Archer

"Now I can have all-new nightmares about them."

"Well, anyone who lives through this war won't be short on nightmares." -Garrus

"I still have slime to clean off my armor.What a nightmare."

"Sounds like it was a nightmare down there."

"Now it's mutated asari. The Reapers are just a giant nightmare factory that never ends." -Garrus

"Tonight: A nightmare on Earth. Human leaders using military force on their own people." -Diana Allers

"It'll be the last one if I have anything to say about it. This nightmare finally ends today." - Commander Shepard

"I can hardly believe it, myself. Like everything back on Earth was some kind of nightmare." - Commander Shepard

"I think all the reports are starting to sink in. You can only live in denial so long.You either wake up or die. Either way..."

"If they're lucky, they grew up thinking the galaxy is basically a decent place.Some rough spots here and there, but for the most part, life makes sense. Now they find out it was all a lie.They wake up to see these things in the dark that just want to destroy everyone they ever cared about.If they survive, there'll be a lot of angry orphans out there looking for answers."

"Rila's not one of them yet. She can't be. She just needs to wake up! Look -- Rila's alive! She's not a monster.Please, let me wake her up. Then we can leave." - Samara's Daughter

"The hell it won't. We get to this artifact, and we can all wake up." - Commander Shepard.

"Wake up." - Catalyst

Modifié par Humakt83, 07 août 2012 - 07:24 .

[Arian Dynas]

Dr JaMiN wrote...

Since the thread is going slow right now I figured I'd post this. Many literalists don't believe the IT based largely on a lack of concrete evidence. While I think there is plenty of evidence when examined with context, it just simply isn't enough for some people. A good way to continue debating with those that ignore or refuse the evidence is to try using logic on how the series could possibly continue without the IT. Here is an argument I gave in another thread.

"To create a new Mass Effect game with such radical variances would require quite a bit of effort, and while I know Bioware is capable of such a feat, it just isn't cost effective. Yes Bioware has stated that there is no real canon to the story, but there is. The universe itself must have a set timeline of events in order to create new books, comics, and movies (all excluding prequels). Since those mediums cannot reflect player choice, there must be a set canon to base them on. Synthesis, Control, and Refuse do not allow this since they change the universe too radically.

On a more in-depth note, if the endings are to be interpreted literally, then a new conflict would be impossible. In Synthesis, everyone becomes at peace and one with each other. In Control, the reapers would become the peacekeepers of the galaxy, preventing any truly threatening conflicts. Refuse ends the council cycle. In short, no conflict = no new plot. Furthermore, all works of fiction must at least somewhat be relatable to our own reality. By removing conflict, we can no longer relate to the fiction. Even though it's unpleasant, conflict is part of our nature. Try to name some stories about a truly perfect and realistic utopian society. It is impossible, but there are countless stories about dystopian societies because it just makes more sense.

Although Destroy is the most realistic of the endings, it too creates too many inconsistencies for the narrative to follow. An example of this would be the Crucible. A good writer cannot simply create an ultimate conflict off switch, or else future conflict resolution will always have less impact, so it just can't be that simple. If none of the endings can be used to continue the series, then the only option left open is a non-literal interpretation, aka Indoctrination Theory."

Since none of the existing endings allow for continuation of the series, Indoctrination is not just a preferred option, it is the only possible option. Two of my personal friends were completely discouraged from IT once the EC came out, but after giving them this argument, they regained some confidence. Hopefully this post helps someone.

Good argument.

Did it work?

Modifié par Arian Dynas, 07 août 2012 - 07:24 .

[Arian Dynas]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

I wonder if we'll see any DLC concerning planet Klencory and the "beings of light". Something like that could swing things even more heavily in IT's favor if done well.

How?

Its a common argument used to debunk IT. The literalists like to use it as evidence that the Ghost child catalyst was forshadowed and is therefore real. It would be interesting if this dlc destroyed the notion that beings of light exist. 

I still say that the Beings of Light are a symptom of Indoctrination. The Reapers play good cop to themselves, appearing as benevolent godlike beings attempting to convince people to turn to them in desperation.

[RavenEyry]

@Humankt: Is that foreshadowing? It looks like foreshadowing.

[Humakt83]

RavenEyry wrote...

@Humankt: Is that foreshadowing? It looks like foreshadowing.

Sure is. I think there are other references besides these. Those quotes were from incomplete spoiler from last November.

"Wake up" by Catalyst wasn't in that spoiler for instance.

[Simon_Says]

RavenEyry wrote...

@Humankt: Is that foreshadowing? It looks like foreshadowing.

What do you mean? It's obviously bad writing!

[KneeTheCap]

Totally off-topic: When does the game count the EMS? Can I, for example, save before the beam, play multiplayer and raise the ems or does it need to be at the required level before cerberus base for instance?

Totally on-topic: Is it 100% certain that the piles of Kaidan/Ashley are not there when you run for it?

One other thing, and this is just probably nothing, but how come I get the feeling that the run as well is not really...there? It feels kinda odd...

[ThisOneIsPunny]

smokingotter1 wrote...

leonia42 wrote...

ThisOneIsPunny wrote...
I think it would have been more than harbinger playing the ego if they made the ending like this. I know I remember multiple people saying they felt as if the final confrontation with Anderson and TIM was Shepard's mind in turmoil. Has anyone done a write up on this?

If I recall, Otter had a really in-depth analysis about the Freudian trio. 

That's in Mark II, if I find it I'll link to it. Bioware really needs to improve their search forum function btw.

Please do! I'd very much love to read it.

[masster blaster]

So Estebanus aby word from Chris yet?

[Humakt83]

Anyone else considered the possibility that the third nightmare never ended?

KneeTheCap wrote...
Totally on-topic: Is it 100% certain that the piles of Kaidan/Ashley are not there when you run for it?

One other thing, and this is just probably nothing, but how come I get the feeling that the run as well is not really...there? It feels kinda odd...

They are there when you are running towards the beam. But the water streams uphill, and I don't think the wind is powerful enough there to do that.

Modifié par Humakt83, 07 août 2012 - 07:43 .