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[Fur28]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

But they were reprogrammed by Sovereign, so you're undoing a rewrite by rewriting them to the way they were before Sovereign's rewrite rewroter them. basically, you're setting them free from Reaper control.

Geths are the first people shepards frees from reaper control that doesn´t kill themselves:)

[paxxton]

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

Legion is ok with rewriting though.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

But they were reprogrammed by Sovereign, so you're undoing a rewrite by rewriting them to the way they were before Sovereign's rewrite rewroter them. basically, you're setting them free from Reaper control.

But its explained in 3 that rewriting the Heretics ends up biting you in the ass. The former heretics gave the reapers greater influence over the consensus, making the desicion to ally with the reapers for protection easier. 

They only do that because the Quarians threatened them with extermination. When you're backed into a corner and someone offers you a hand, you don't look at the hand but just take it.

[Dwailing]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

But they were reprogrammed by Sovereign, so you're undoing a rewrite by rewriting them to the way they were before Sovereign's rewrite rewroter them. basically, you're setting them free from Reaper control.

But its explained in 3 that rewriting the Heretics ends up biting you in the ass. The former heretics gave the reapers greater influence over the consensus, making the desicion to ally with the reapers for protection easier. 

Exactly.  Not only this, but it also makes it harder to achieve peace when you look at the numbers.  Killing the Heretics actually provides two "points" in favor of peace, while reprogramming them gives nothing.

[masster blaster]

Well I reprogramed the Geth because I wanted Legion to be happy, however after what happened in ME3, when the Rewrited geth killed more quarian fleets, ya.... I still do it because fleet wise Geth provide fleets, and more ground troops.

Also Geth army, or Krogan army. Ground troops only.

[Dwailing]

paxxton wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

Legion is ok with rewriting though.

However, I believe that the majority of its programs supported destroying the Heretics, though there was no concensus.

[GethPrimeMKII]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

But they were reprogrammed by Sovereign, so you're undoing a rewrite by rewriting them to the way they were before Sovereign's rewrite rewroter them. basically, you're setting them free from Reaper control.

But its explained in 3 that rewriting the Heretics ends up biting you in the ass. The former heretics gave the reapers greater influence over the consensus, making the desicion to ally with the reapers for protection easier. 

They only do that because the Quarians threatened them with extermination. When you're backed into a corner and someone offers you a hand, you don't look at the hand but just take it.

My point is that Sovereign's influence remains even if you decide to brainwash the heretics back to the good side.

[Dwailing]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

But they were reprogrammed by Sovereign, so you're undoing a rewrite by rewriting them to the way they were before Sovereign's rewrite rewroter them. basically, you're setting them free from Reaper control.

But its explained in 3 that rewriting the Heretics ends up biting you in the ass. The former heretics gave the reapers greater influence over the consensus, making the desicion to ally with the reapers for protection easier. 

They only do that because the Quarians threatened them with extermination. When you're backed into a corner and someone offers you a hand, you don't look at the hand but just take it.

However, the Heretics, if you reprogrammed them, jump on the oppurtunity, while if you destroy them, it's harder for the geth to reach consensus.  It sounds like there's something inherent in the essence of the Heretics that causes them to support the Reapers, reprogrammed or not.

[paxxton]

Dwailing wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

Legion is ok with rewriting though.

However, I believe that the majority of its programs supported destroying the Heretics, though there was no concensus.

And hence I decided to rewrite them in my main playthrough. For the sake of diversity I will destroy them this time.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

But they were reprogrammed by Sovereign, so you're undoing a rewrite by rewriting them to the way they were before Sovereign's rewrite rewroter them. basically, you're setting them free from Reaper control.

But its explained in 3 that rewriting the Heretics ends up biting you in the ass. The former heretics gave the reapers greater influence over the consensus, making the desicion to ally with the reapers for protection easier. 

They only do that because the Quarians threatened them with extermination. When you're backed into a corner and someone offers you a hand, you don't look at the hand but just take it.

My point is that Sovereign's influence remains even if you decide to brainwash the heretics back to the good side.

The same can be said with anyone who at one time was under Reaper influence. Look at Shiala, she could still feel the Reapers after Shepard saves her, and yet fights it. The only reason the Geth don't is because their only other option is death and that isn't the logical choice.

[Hrothdane]

I agree with LDS on this one. You have to look at the geth by their own standards. Even benign anthropomorphism is racist, according to their representative.

[Dwailing]

paxxton wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

Legion is ok with rewriting though.

However, I believe that the majority of its programs supported destroying the Heretics, though there was no concensus.

And hence I decided to rewrite them in my main playthrough. For the sake of diversity I will destroy them this time.

So... you decided to rewrite them because the majority of Legion's programs supported destroying them? 

[BansheeOwnage]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

They only do that because the Quarians threatened them with extermination. When you're backed into a corner and someone offers you a hand, you don't look at the hand but just take it.

Exactly. Remember, all Geth sided with the reapers at the start of the Quarian war, regardless of rewrite. Legion is on his own until you free the Primes.

[Andromidius]

I see killing the Heretics as the Paragon option, myself. You're ending the threat, not gambling that the solution will work to your advantage.

The Heretics may have an 'error' in their programming, but they've still commited much evil. And later we find out they are still capable of evil even after being rewritten.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Dwailing wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

Legion is ok with rewriting though.

However, I believe that the majority of its programs supported destroying the Heretics, though there was no concensus.

Nope, rewrite wins by two votes. You got to respect the democratic process.

[paxxton]

Hrothdane wrote...

I agree with LDS on this one. You have to look at the geth by their own standards. Even benign anthropomorphism is racist, according to their representative.

This.

[BansheeOwnage]

Dwailing wrote...

Exactly.  Not only this, but it also makes it harder to achieve peace when you look at the numbers.  Killing the Heretics actually provides two "points" in favor of peace, while reprogramming them gives nothing.

I easily achieved peace with a rewrite playthrough.

Dinner!

It's also kind of fun to see the split of opinion on this topic!

Modifié par BansheeOwnage, 19 décembre 2012 - 03:57 .

[Dwailing]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Exactly.  Not only this, but it also makes it harder to achieve peace when you look at the numbers.  Killing the Heretics actually provides two "points" in favor of peace, while reprogramming them gives nothing.

I easily achieved peace with a rewrite playthrough.

Dinner!

I know that, I'm just pointing out that it DOES have an impact.  A pretty big one at that.

Edit: Oh, and in response to your edit, I agree, this is interesting to watch.

Edit 2: And I also find it interesting that our resident Control supporter supports rewriting the Heretics. 

Modifié par Dwailing, 19 décembre 2012 - 03:59 .

[Hrothdane]

I got peace with a rewrite.

[paxxton]

Dwailing wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

Legion is ok with rewriting though.

However, I believe that the majority of its programs supported destroying the Heretics, though there was no concensus.

And hence I decided to rewrite them in my main playthrough. For the sake of diversity I will destroy them this time.

So... you decided to rewrite them because the majority of Legion's programs supported destroying them? 

No. Because that decision was given me to make and I reasoned for the rewrite. Destroying the heretics would be barbaric because they cannot be treated as organics. They have their own capabilities which have to be taken into account.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

Exactly.  Not only this, but it also makes it harder to achieve peace when you look at the numbers.  Killing the Heretics actually provides two "points" in favor of peace, while reprogramming them gives nothing.

I easily achieved peace with a rewrite playthrough.

Dinner!

It's also kind of fun to see the split of opinion on this topic!

Did someone say dinner?

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 19 décembre 2012 - 04:02 .

[Dwailing]

I guess the big question here is, do you trust a group that willingly sided with the Reapers and repeatedly attacked both organics and their own species enough to allow them to continue to exist? Honestly, looking back, I realize that it's a bit naive to do so. And I see this as being foreshadowing, at least somewhat, for the ME3 endings. Do you trust that an entity responsible for many TRILLIONS of deaths is telling the truth, or do you doubt him, and do what's necessary to end the threat permanently? Seeing the results from the Heretic choice, I'm inclined to do the latter.

[AresKeith]

Hrothdane wrote...

I got peace with a rewrite.

I got peace because I that damn good lol

[GethPrimeMKII]

Dwailing wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

So, I'm currently in the middle of a playthrough of ME2, and I've concluded something. Even though I know I'm primarily a Paragon, I'm going to destroy the geth heretics. Why? Because if this experience has taught me anything, it's that death is better than having your head screwed with. At least in the ME universe. And besides, when you listen to what ParagonShep says, it sounds like, at least at first, he supports destroying the geth heretics.  It seems like a bit of a last minute reversal of opinion at the end of the mission to reprogram them.

But they were reprogrammed by Sovereign, so you're undoing a rewrite by rewriting them to the way they were before Sovereign's rewrite rewroter them. basically, you're setting them free from Reaper control.

But its explained in 3 that rewriting the Heretics ends up biting you in the ass. The former heretics gave the reapers greater influence over the consensus, making the desicion to ally with the reapers for protection easier. 

They only do that because the Quarians threatened them with extermination. When you're backed into a corner and someone offers you a hand, you don't look at the hand but just take it.

However, the Heretics, if you reprogrammed them, jump on the oppurtunity, while if you destroy them, it's harder for the geth to reach consensus.  It sounds like there's something inherent in the essence of the Heretics that causes them to support the Reapers, reprogrammed or not.

Thats what was strongly suggested by Legion's mathematical explanaition. Legion tells you that all Sovereign's virus does is introduce a subtle run time error within the most basic processes of the geths' minds. Its simple, yet powerful.

Isnt it interesting that this is very much how slow patient indoctrination works with organics? Its simple and subtle, yet the end result can bring down entire nations. 

The lesson that should be taken from this mission and what results in 3, is that reaper influence cannot be cured and cannot be undone. 

[paxxton]

AresKeith wrote...

Hrothdane wrote...

I got peace with a rewrite.

I got peace because I that damn good lol

I got Tali jump off the cliff.