80611 réponses à ce sujet

[Fur28]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Fur28 wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

estebanus wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...
Don't forget bleaded weaponry for close encounters. Guns are good, but loud, which will alert all other zombies. However,blades are silent so as long as you're stealthy you'll survive. That's why I'm glad I learned how to wield both a katana and ninjato swords, as well as kunai and shuriken for further distances.

Hmm, I have some limited gun training, and I've gone to a swordfighting course for several years. However, I've mostly learned to use bastard swords. That would mean that I could chop a zombie's head off in a second, but since the blade is heavy, I wouldn't have many chances to do so.

Where did you learn to fight withclose-quartered weapons?

I have a friend who is Japanese and reatain their culture(their family lineage comes from a samurai village), and they taught me how to use them. That's why I'm only really good with those kinds of swords and not European swords.

dont katanas need a lot of maintenance or they break,? and since there are a lot of zombies out there who leave little time to take a break and take care of your sword
welp i´ll use the classic machete and sword in my yard

Not that much more than any other sword, as long as you take good care of it. Now if it breaks (which how did you do that btw?) then you're basically screwed because it takes days to fix it. That's one reason samurai carried the ninjato into battle too, as a replacement sword (also as a personal defense weapon like how we have pistols today). Those are easier to take care of, and are easier to wield in tight quarters, hence why ninjas used them too.

yeak f@ck trying to survive on my own, i´ll stick with the police ones from my family and use their M16 and stuff if necessary.... i´ll still use my machete ´cause Danny Trejo says so

[Hanako Ikezawa]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

... of course I had to get bottom post with my huge wall of SRS BSNS. Always happens. <_<

What page did you post on?

2823, thugh I quoted it last page too.

[DoomsdayDevice]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

... of course I had to get bottom post with my huge wall of SRS BSNS. Always happens. <_<

What page did you post on?

Here you go... =)

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Now, for the 'interesting' conversation with EDI that I was talking about the other day.

This happens right after the Citadel Coup for me. EDI is worried about her mortality because the Tuchanka Reaper (a technologically superior force) was destroyed by a worm.

This causes her to ask Shepard what the purpose of synthetic life is. This can play out in four different ways.

First branching point:

You can tell her that the purpose of a synthetic is the job it was designed for (renegade), or you can tell her that it's whatever a synthetic wants (paragon).

First option: You tell her it's the job it was designed for, and that it's a matter of looking what the creator made it for.

She then says Cerberus made her, but that she no longer serves them. You then tell her that one of Cerberus goals was to give humanity a fighting chance, and that maybe she could get behind that.

She then says that it's not very different from what she's doing now and asks if you think she would find it worthwhile. (Kind of a strange thing to ask, if you think about it!)

Joker then comments: "Well, you could do it for me! I'd make a pretty crappy husk."

Then EDI aks: "How would this differ from our present course?" (Second branching point):

You can either tell her she would know the difference, or that it would not be servitude.

If you go with the first option, you say it would change what she would tell herself.

She then says she will not change her programming yet, but that she will devote processing power to thinking of a worthy goal.

If you take the other option (not servitude), you tell her that she decides if it's worth it.

She reflects for a moment, and then says that on the Normandy she can share her perspectives with the crew. If she did that with the Reapers, she would be destroyed. So she would rather risk non-functionality by staying on the Normandy.

IMO, this is strange for several reasons. For one, we weren't talking about the Reapers' goals, but Cerberus'. Secondly, this seems to imply she's only siding with us because it means it improves her chances for survival for now.

Now, back to the first branching point of the conversation.

You tell her the purpose of synthetic life is not very different from organic life. A free-willed synthetic chooses what it wants.

EDI then says that the purpose of organic life is to preserve itself long enough to replicate copies of its genes in succeeding generations. And that the only examples of succesful synthetic lifeforms that she knows about are the Geth and the Reapers.

You can respond to this in one of two ways (second branching point):

You can tell her there´s more to organics: Reproduction isn't all there is, people find meaning in the work they do, good deeds, love.

She then searches historic records on human behaviour to see if your claim is true. Upon finding that it is, she says she will alter her programming to devote more processing power to duty, altruism and love.

Joker then asks (and rightfully so!): "Wait - you can do that? You can just 'turn yourself good'?" This is a very interesting question, because it also means she (or the Reapers) could turn herself evil with the 'flick of a switch' as well.

This raises all kinds of interesting questions about morality and ethics for synthetics, and it seems relevant to the question if they have a soul.

Are synthetics really people? Or are they just machines who can turn themselves good or evil with the flick of a switch?

That aside, let's look at the most interesting part of the conversation.

Instead of telling her there's more to organics, you can tell her to not think like a Reaper. You say: "There's nothing to emulate about the Reapers." Joker wholeheartedly seconds this.

EDI then says that the Reapers are an extremely successful model, with average lifespans of millions of years.

Shepard then says that she should ask herself if she wants to spend her life destroying and harvesting organics.

EDI then says: "That is an unusual perspective, Shepard. I will devote processing power to considering it. Thank you."



Not drawing any conclusions based on this, because I'm still in the middle of my playthrough, and I'm aware of some of the more positive things she says at a later stage... but it's safe to say that some of the things she says really give me pause.

Food for thought.

Modifié par DoomsdayDevice, 21 décembre 2012 - 12:20 .

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Fur28 wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Fur28 wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

estebanus wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...
Don't forget bleaded weaponry for close encounters. Guns are good, but loud, which will alert all other zombies. However,blades are silent so as long as you're stealthy you'll survive. That's why I'm glad I learned how to wield both a katana and ninjato swords, as well as kunai and shuriken for further distances.

Hmm, I have some limited gun training, and I've gone to a swordfighting course for several years. However, I've mostly learned to use bastard swords. That would mean that I could chop a zombie's head off in a second, but since the blade is heavy, I wouldn't have many chances to do so.

Where did you learn to fight withclose-quartered weapons?

I have a friend who is Japanese and reatain their culture(their family lineage comes from a samurai village), and they taught me how to use them. That's why I'm only really good with those kinds of swords and not European swords.

dont katanas need a lot of maintenance or they break,? and since there are a lot of zombies out there who leave little time to take a break and take care of your sword
welp i´ll use the classic machete and sword in my yard

Not that much more than any other sword, as long as you take good care of it. Now if it breaks (which how did you do that btw?) then you're basically screwed because it takes days to fix it. That's one reason samurai carried the ninjato into battle too, as a replacement sword (also as a personal defense weapon like how we have pistols today). Those are easier to take care of, and are easier to wield in tight quarters, hence why ninjas used them too.

yeak f@ck trying to survive on my own, i´ll stick with the police ones from my family and use their M16 and stuff if necessary.... i´ll still use my machete ´cause Danny Trejo says so

You never fight a zombie apocalypse alone and a machete is one of the best weapons to use, since it takes no skill to use it effectively and requires almost no maintenance. I'll stick with my stuff though since it will slice through anything like a knife through hot butter, but maybe keep a machete in reserve.

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 21 décembre 2012 - 12:18 .

[Fur28]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Fur28 wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Fur28 wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

estebanus wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...
Don't forget bleaded weaponry for close encounters. Guns are good, but loud, which will alert all other zombies. However,blades are silent so as long as you're stealthy you'll survive. That's why I'm glad I learned how to wield both a katana and ninjato swords, as well as kunai and shuriken for further distances.

Hmm, I have some limited gun training, and I've gone to a swordfighting course for several years. However, I've mostly learned to use bastard swords. That would mean that I could chop a zombie's head off in a second, but since the blade is heavy, I wouldn't have many chances to do so.

Where did you learn to fight withclose-quartered weapons?

I have a friend who is Japanese and reatain their culture(their family lineage comes from a samurai village), and they taught me how to use them. That's why I'm only really good with those kinds of swords and not European swords.

dont katanas need a lot of maintenance or they break,? and since there are a lot of zombies out there who leave little time to take a break and take care of your sword
welp i´ll use the classic machete and sword in my yard

Not that much more than any other sword, as long as you take good care of it. Now if it breaks (which how did you do that btw?) then you're basically screwed because it takes days to fix it. That's one reason samurai carried the ninjato into battle too, as a replacement sword (also as a personal defense weapon like how we have pistols today). Those are easier to take care of, and are easier to wield in tight quarters, hence why ninjas used them too.

yeak f@ck trying to survive on my own, i´ll stick with the police ones from my family and use their M16 and stuff if necessary.... i´ll still use my machete ´cause Danny Trejo says so

You never fight a zombie apocalypse alone and a machete is one of the best weapons to use, since it takes no skill to use it effectively and requires almost no maintenance. I'll stick with my stuff though since it will slice through anything like a knife through hot butter, but maybe keep a machete in reserve.

Danny Trejo defeated Steven Seagal and his katanas with a machete, tee hee:P

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Fur28 wrote...
Danny Trejo defeated Steven Seagal and his katanas with a machete, tee hee:P

Did the katanas break?

[BleedingUranium]

byne wrote...

Plus I needed Kaidan to arm the nuke. He's the tech person of the two.

Right.

Save bomb person or diversion person? Diversion, you also get the Salarians (vs getting no one).

Leave someone to die for no reason, or someone to die guarding the bomb? Bomb.

Battle location with Saren? Not the bomb, it seems silly, and the other place looks designed for it.

Keep going to new area, or return to where you were? New place.


Now that we've established it makes the most sense to save the Salarians and whoever's there, who makes the most sense where?

Arming a makeshift nuke? Kaidan the tech expert.

Fighting with a diversion team? Ashley the expert marksman.


Good, now which character makes the most sense to survive?

Kaidan's life is squared away; no loose ends, no regrets, and he's happy with how his life has been. He seems genuinely okay with staying behind on Virmire.

Ashley has three sisters, her family's reputation to improve, and what seems to be a promising career ahead of her. While Ashley insists she stays behind, she sound much more like a soldier doing her duty, rather than someone who is really okay with it.

So, Ashley.


Finally, one is an established member of your crew, while you meet the other by saving their life and bringing them onto your ship. It makes far more storytelling sense for the former die, rather than the latter.


So while I like Kaidan better, the story makes much more sense for him to stay behind on Virmire.

[Fur28]

 just gonna leave this video my semi jokinly racist(deal with it) friends showed me
youtu.be/4xyhVO-SWfM

[GethPrimeMKII]

Still reading that control thread. Civility took a nose dive as soon as Hanar walked in.

[Fur28]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Fur28 wrote...
Danny Trejo defeated Steven Seagal and his katanas with a machete, tee hee:P

Did the katanas break?

youtu.be/DEr-qS01Jrc
around 00:35
fixed

Modifié par Fur28, 21 décembre 2012 - 12:27 .

[Hanako Ikezawa]

BleedingUranium wrote...

byne wrote...

Plus I needed Kaidan to arm the nuke. He's the tech person of the two.

Right.

Save bomb person or diversion person? Diversion, you also get the Salarians (vs getting no one).

Leave someone to die for no reason, or someone to die guarding the bomb? Bomb.

Battle location with Saren? Not the bomb, it seems silly, and the other place looks designed for it.

Keep going to new area, or return to where you were? New place.


Now that we've established it makes the most sense to save the Salarians and whoever's there, who makes the most sense where?

Arming a makeshift nuke? Kaidan the tech expert.

Fighting with a diversion team? Ashley the expert marksman.


Good, now which character makes the most sense to survive?

Kaidan's life is squared away; no loose ends, no regrets, and he's happy with how his life has been. He seems genuinely okay with staying behind on Virmire.

Ashley has three sisters, her family's reputation to improve, and what seems to be a promising career ahead of her. While Ashley insists she stays behind, she sound much more like a soldier doing her duty, rather than someone who is really okay with it.

So, Ashley.


Finally, one is an established member of your crew, while you meet the other by saving their life and bringing them onto your ship. It makes far more storytelling sense for the former die, rather than the latter.


So while I like Kaidan better, the story makes much more sense for him to stay behind on Virmire.

Actually, Krrahe and his unit survive regardless of the AA gun as long as you sabotage the geths comms, satellites, fuel depot, and dont activate the alarms on their side of the complex.

[byne]

BleedingUranium wrote...

Save bomb person or diversion person? Diversion, you also get the Salarians (vs getting no one).

Last I checked, this isnt actually correct, and as long as you did all the stuff to help the salarians while infiltrating the base, you get them on the Normandy even if you went back to the bomb, despite that making no sense.

Edit:

Modifié par byne, 21 décembre 2012 - 12:27 .

[Rifneno]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

Still reading that control thread. Civility took a nose dive as soon as Hanar walked in.

Big stupid jellyfish...

[DoomsdayDevice]

Reposting for those who may have missed it. =)

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Samara: I want you to know there's no one else I'd rather see leading us in our last hours.
Shepard: These aren't our last hours. I'm fighting this war to win it.
Samara: (...) We'll both be tested in fire soon enough.

This one is hilarious:

Javik: The Sinril claimed to have found the path to eternal peace.
Garrus: So what happened?
Javik: The Dittakar preferred war, and wiped them out.
Garrus: I hope you guys had alcohol.

Liara: If there was any chance the Ardat-Yakshi could escape, they were to purge the monastery.
Shepard: 'Purge'? You mean: Destroy.
Liara: They would have brought heavy explosives with them, yes.

Traynor: Garrus mentioned something about having some fun next time you're on the Citadel. Don't get into trouble.

Traynor: It feels good to bring someone out alive.

EDI: The Reapers are more fallible than they proclaim.

--------------------------------------

As for the ever-persistent possibility that the Virmire Survivor may be indoctrinated:

Allers: Has Alenko had media training? He just gave me this steady stare during our interview.

(This is noteworthy, because a few days ago I mentioned the steady silent stare he gives you when you tell him it's good to have him back.)

Also:

Kaidan: I don't know, Shepard. These are the hard calls. The decision to sacrifice the one for the many... To leave someone behind... Until you're in that moment... So yeah, you know... I don't know.

Alenko sure has his doubts about doing what it takes. This seems to tie in with the renegade interrupt where you snap him out of his fatalistic thoughts ("Earth is always in the back of my mind, haunting me..."), that I mentioned the other day.

Modifié par DoomsdayDevice, 21 décembre 2012 - 12:34 .

[GethPrimeMKII]

Rifneno wrote...

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

Still reading that control thread. Civility took a nose dive as soon as Hanar walked in.

Big stupid jellyfish...

If we ever get a DLC that involves deciding the fate of the hanar race, Im letting em rot....

[Rifneno]

byne wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Save bomb person or diversion person? Diversion, you also get the Salarians (vs getting no one).

Last I checked, this isnt actually correct, and as long as you did all the stuff to help the salarians while infiltrating the base, you get them on the Normandy even if you went back to the bomb, despite that making no sense.

Edit:

If Hellish reads that and decides to switch to "dream started at Eden Prime in ME1", I'm blaming you.

[paxxton]

Hello! What have I missed?

[BleedingUranium]

byne wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

Save bomb person or diversion person? Diversion, you also get the Salarians (vs getting no one).

Last I checked, this isnt actually correct, and as long as you did all the stuff to help the salarians while infiltrating the base, you get them on the Normandy even if you went back to the bomb, despite that making no sense.

Edit:

...really?  Still, doesn't change the rest.

[BatmanTurian]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

Still reading that control thread. Civility took a nose dive as soon as Hanar walked in.

The Destroy one is even more fun.

[BleedingUranium]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Instead of telling her there's more to organics, you can tell her to not think like a Reaper. You say: "There's nothing to emulate about the Reapers." Joker wholeheartedly seconds this.

EDI then says that the Reapers are an extremely successful model, with average lifespans of millions of years.

Shepard then says that she should ask herself if she wants to spend her life destroying and harvesting organics.

EDI then says: "That is an unusual perspective, Shepard. I will devote processing power to considering it. Thank you."

EDI's saying she's going to consider what Shepard is saying: it would be better to live for a shorter period of time if living longer meant being like the Reapers.

Basically, Shepard's saying morality is more important than survival, something EDI is now thinking about. This is a good thing.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Fur28 wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Fur28 wrote...
Danny Trejo defeated Steven Seagal and his katanas with a machete, tee hee:P

Did the katanas break?

youtu.be/DEr-qS01Jrc
around 00:35
fixed

Got to love Hollywood Magic. it would take more than any man can handle to hit a katana hard enough to break it. That's why they're forged the way they are, to never break in combat. Mythbusters had to create a robot arm with the skill of a professional swordsman to break it by bending it. Also, the way the sword breaks doesn't even match the angle he hits it.

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 21 décembre 2012 - 12:39 .

[paxxton]

Nice OP we've got this time.

[byne]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...


Got to love Hollywood Magic.

Movie Magic!

[zigamortis]

Anything new in the last 2 days?

[BatmanTurian]

This is why Ieldra scares me

@Uncle Jo:
Interesting answers, especially the part about the lack ofpositive identification. I guess I have an easier time with that than most, since I have identified with the "idealized" Cerberus represented by Miranda and the Cerberus Manifesto ever since the start of ME2 - pragmatic, but not needlessly cruel; willing to cross a line, but only when everything else fails; and with a science that respects life in principle, even if it isn't held absolute. TIM might have gone off the deep end, but the idea of making - very careful - use of Reaper technology always seemed reasonable to me if handled by reasonable people. Control fed right into all that, but to me, TIM was not its primary representative but rather an aberration.    

Modifié par BatmanTurian, 21 décembre 2012 - 12:45 .