80611 réponses à ce sujet

[401 Kill]

Eryri wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

hey, everybody. I'm back from my Christmas trip. Have I missed anything in the past few days?

Not really, unfortunately. If Bioware really want us to keep "speculating" they really should "accidentally" leak some more details of the next DLC. Otherwise we're just running on fumes.

That is probobly why the thread is slow, that and it is Christmas break. Let the DLC news fly!

[Rifneno]

Man. Going through Leviathan again, I can't fathom how anyone can see Shepard being pulled out of his mind by the squids and not realize what the ending is. It's blindingly obvious. But all they do is latch onto "Cthulhu described something like the Catalyst! It must be real! IT disproven lulz!" I mean I typically suck at symbolism and all that, but they're beating us over the head with it here.

[CoolioThane]

IKR Rif. The leviathans can create visions from your own memories, and HArbinger, who is made out of LEviathans, can't according to them

[Andromidius]

Rifneno wrote...

Man. Going through Leviathan again, I can't fathom how anyone can see Shepard being pulled out of his mind by the squids and not realize what the ending is. It's blindingly obvious. But all they do is latch onto "Cthulhu described something like the Catalyst! It must be real! IT disproven lulz!" I mean I typically suck at symbolism and all that, but they're beating us over the head with it here.

Yep.  And they ignore the whole "The Intelligence" not being confirmed as being "The Catalyst", Leviathans apperently know nothing about the Crucible other then what we already know.

Sure, if the Reapers can read Shepard's mind of course they'll play along with the information Shepard already has and create a being they call "The Catalyst" to manipulate him/her.  Its basic deception.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Rifneno wrote...

Man. Going through Leviathan again, I can't fathom how anyone can see Shepard being pulled out of his mind by the squids and not realize what the ending is. It's blindingly obvious. But all they do is latch onto "Cthulhu described something like the Catalyst! It must be real! IT disproven lulz!" I mean I typically suck at symbolism and all that, but they're beating us over the head with it here.

I agree. I have never really gotten into the Cthulhu stuff, but I will agree that anyone who denies that the Catalyst doesn't have the powers his creators have, and which they state he perfected, is ignoring Mass Effect lore. Though if they never got Leviathan or watched it then I can't fault them for their conclusions. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I know this has been asked before, but how was everyone's Christmas/other holidays?

[umadcommander]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

I know this has been asked before, but how was everyone's Christmas/other holidays?

it was great, not often my entire family gets together (farcry 3 is also awesome )

[DaveTheRave05]

Rifneno wrote...

Man. Going through Leviathan again, I can't fathom how anyone can see Shepard being pulled out of his mind by the squids and not realize what the ending is. It's blindingly obvious. But all they do is latch onto "Cthulhu described something like the Catalyst! It must be real! IT disproven lulz!" I mean I typically suck at symbolism and all that, but they're beating us over the head with it here.

I've only played Leviathan once through my Paragon playthrough. Have only started my Paragade playthrough, so looking forward to playing it again. Either way, I'm assuming you mean the way Leviathans can conjur people from memory to communicate with Shepard points to how The Catalyst is not who we think, right?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

DaveTheRave05 wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

Man. Going through Leviathan again, I can't fathom how anyone can see Shepard being pulled out of his mind by the squids and not realize what the ending is. It's blindingly obvious. But all they do is latch onto "Cthulhu described something like the Catalyst! It must be real! IT disproven lulz!" I mean I typically suck at symbolism and all that, but they're beating us over the head with it here.

I've only played Leviathan once through my Paragon playthrough. Have only started my Paragade playthrough, so looking forward to playing it again. Either way, I'm assuming you mean the way Leviathans can conjur people from memory to communicate with Shepard points to how The Catalyst is not who we think, right?

Basically that is what he means, yes.

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 28 décembre 2012 - 06:54 .

[DaveTheRave05]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

DaveTheRave05 wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

Man. Going through Leviathan again, I can't fathom how anyone can see Shepard being pulled out of his mind by the squids and not realize what the ending is. It's blindingly obvious. But all they do is latch onto "Cthulhu described something like the Catalyst! It must be real! IT disproven lulz!" I mean I typically suck at symbolism and all that, but they're beating us over the head with it here.

I've only played Leviathan once through my Paragon playthrough. Have only started my Paragade playthrough, so looking forward to playing it again. Either way, I'm assuming you mean the way Leviathans can conjur people from memory to communicate with Shepard points to how The Catalyst is not who we think, right?

Basically that is what he means, yes.

Cool, just checking. It was something that I thought about after playing through the first time, but was immediately confused when the Leviathan said they created The Catalyst and so on.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

umadcommander wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

I know this has been asked before, but how was everyone's Christmas/other holidays?

it was great, not often my entire family gets together (farcry 3 is also awesome )

I'm glad you had a great holiday season.

[Rifneno]

DaveTheRave05 wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

Man. Going through Leviathan again, I can't fathom how anyone can see Shepard being pulled out of his mind by the squids and not realize what the ending is. It's blindingly obvious. But all they do is latch onto "Cthulhu described something like the Catalyst! It must be real! IT disproven lulz!" I mean I typically suck at symbolism and all that, but they're beating us over the head with it here.

I've only played Leviathan once through my Paragon playthrough. Have only started my Paragade playthrough, so looking forward to playing it again. Either way, I'm assuming you mean the way Leviathans can conjur people from memory to communicate with Shepard points to how The Catalyst is not who we think, right?

Among other things.  Both of them have Shepard starting out in this strange place on his hands and knees, confused, when the manipulator walks up and tells him something like "breathe" or "get up."  Then there's a bunch of over the top symbolism for things.  When Leviathan says it must understand why the Reapers perceive Shepard as a threat, it walks over to a microscope that's there for no reason and looks in it.  Symbolically studying.  Look at the destroy option in the ending.  It's one of those injection tubes we had to destroy on the human Reaper back in ME2.  Why the holy hell is there one just sitting there on the Crucible?  It makes less than no sense.  Because it's symbolic for destroying Reapers.  Just like the microscope.

I don't believe the child was ever real in Vancouver.  There's too much weirdness to it.  And it's definitely, 100% not just us reading too much into it.  That's proven simply by the fact that BSN had "that kid's not real, is he?" topics when the demo of ME3 was released and all we had was Vancouver.  We had no idea about the ending and the role he would play in it, and people still realized he wasn't really there.  Kid's not real, never was.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Rifneno wrote...
Among other things.  Both of them have Shepard starting out in this strange place on his hands and knees, confused, when the manipulator walks up and tells him something like "breathe" or "get up."  Then there's a bunch of over the top symbolism for things.  When Leviathan says it must understand why the Reapers perceive Shepard as a threat, it walks over to a microscope that's there for no reason and looks in it.  Symbolically studying.  Look at the destroy option in the ending.  It's one of those injection tubes we had to destroy on the human Reaper back in ME2.  Why the holy hell is there one just sitting there on the Crucible?  It makes less than no sense.  Because it's symbolic for destroying Reapers.  Just like the microscope.

I don't believe the child was ever real in Vancouver.  There's too much weirdness to it.  And it's definitely, 100% not just us reading too much into it.  That's proven simply by the fact that BSN had "that kid's not real, is he?" topics when the demo of ME3 was released and all we had was Vancouver.  We had no idea about the ending and the role he would play in it, and people still realized he wasn't really there.  Kid's not real, never was.

I agree with the first prgraph but not the second. Not saying you are wrong, just stating that I personally believe the boy is real on Earth and the Reapers manipulate his memory rather than he was never real to begin with.

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 28 décembre 2012 - 07:09 .

[Andromidius]

Rifneno wrote...Why the holy hell is there one just sitting there on the Crucible?  It makes less than no sense. 

Its not even on the Crucible.  Its part of the Citadel.  The Crucible never actually 'touches' the central pylon of the Citadel, and is connected only via the Synthesis beam.

Which makes even less sense!

[dorktainian]

arms?

[Andromidius]

dorktainian wrote...

arms?

Connect to the Presidium.

http://social.biowar...3/index/7581223

Here's a thread I dug up mentioning the kid in the trailer.  Already there are people denying Shepard might be undergoing indoctrination

And yeah, its from over a year ago.  Before even the demo came out.

[dorktainian]

indoctrination is imo not in question anymore. it's the interpretation of the ending garbage.

[MaximizedAction]

Rifneno wrote...
I don't believe the child was ever real in Vancouver.  There's too much weirdness to it.  And it's definitely, 100% not just us reading too much into it.  That's proven simply by the fact that BSN had "that kid's not real, is he?" topics when the demo of ME3 was released and all we had was Vancouver.  We had no idea about the ending and the role he would play in it, and people still realized he wasn't really there.  Kid's not real, never was.

I wonder, had we never been confronted with something that looks like that kid in the ending or the dreams, would the players still assume that the kid in Vancouver was real?

I mean, I don't want to offend anyone, but arguing that the kid in Vancouver (at least as seen after the Reapers attack and possibly destroy that rooftop) is real is giving Bioware too much credit for using the cheapest movie trick ever for possibly non-real characters: show person A talking to character B, then let person C suddenly interrupt the dialog without commenting on the dialog, show person A looking to person C then back at where character B was and he's gone.
I mean, this is not Batman, the kid probably doesn't have any secret training in deception.

But I think it's a minority of players who truly, honestly think that Ventboy is real. Otherwise it must be people who only watched like 3 movies in their lives.

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 28 décembre 2012 - 07:39 .

[dorktainian]

ventboy real?

''you can't help me..!''

grrrr....

[Rifneno]

Ventboy is real, I'm polite, and Sevial is smart.

[Andromidius]

MaximizedAction wrote...

Rifneno wrote...
I don't believe the child was ever real in Vancouver.  There's too much weirdness to it.  And it's definitely, 100% not just us reading too much into it.  That's proven simply by the fact that BSN had "that kid's not real, is he?" topics when the demo of ME3 was released and all we had was Vancouver.  We had no idea about the ending and the role he would play in it, and people still realized he wasn't really there.  Kid's not real, never was.

I wonder, had we never been confronted with something that looks like that kid in the ending or the dreams, would the players still assume that the kid in Vancouver was real?

I mean, I don't want to offend anyone, but arguing that the kid in Vancouver (at least as seen after the Reapers attack and possibly destroy that rooftop) is real is giving Bioware too much credit for using the cheapest movie trick ever for possibly non-real characters: show person A talking to character B, then let person C suddenly interrupt the dialog without commenting on the dialog, show person A looking to person C then back at where character B was and he's gone.
I mean, this is not Batman, the kid probably doesn't have any secret training in deception.

But I think it's a minority of players who truly, honestly think that Ventboy is real. Otherwise it must be people who only watched like 3 movies in their lives.

Hard to say.  Opinion was divided before we even saw the dreams, and then saw 'The Catalyst' and the kid right at the end.

There's a similar situation with that sort of conversation, though.  Shepard talking to the Rannoch Reaper, Tali and Legion are there and neither comment on what the Reaper just said.  Also implies the conversation may have been 100% in Shepard's head?

[Rifneno]

Andromidius wrote...

Hard to say.  Opinion was divided before we even saw the dreams, and then saw 'The Catalyst' and the kid right at the end.

There's a similar situation with that sort of conversation, though.  Shepard talking to the Rannoch Reaper, Tali and Legion are there and neither comment on what the Reaper just said.  Also implies the conversation may have been 100% in Shepard's head?

There's also a weird pulsating screen effect.  But yeah, I call bull**** on Legion and Tali not having anything to say on the topic of organics and synthetics coexisting.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Rifneno wrote...

Ventboy is real, I'm polite, and Sevial is smart.

In my opinions: yes to the first, variable to the second, and no to the third(at least on Mass Effect matters).

[MaximizedAction]

Andromidius wrote...
Hard to say.  Opinion was divided before we even saw the dreams, and then saw 'The Catalyst' and the kid right at the end.

There's a similar situation with that sort of conversation, though.  Shepard talking to the Rannoch Reaper, Tali and Legion are there and neither comment on what the Reaper just said.  Also implies the conversation may have been 100% in Shepard's head?

TBH I only found out about the possibility that that convo wasn't real on the internet. But there also never was a visual wink as huge as the ventboy vanishing when Shepard looks at the same place.

I'm sorry but that was instinct concluding he wasn't real. In case of the Destroyer on Rannoch, I see it as a possibilty but nothing as obvious to me, nothing I've seen countless times in movies or series.

So no, not 100%, but possible because Tali doesn't say anything about it....as does nobody else throughout the rest of the game.

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 28 décembre 2012 - 08:01 .

[DoomsdayDevice]

Let's see:

Ventboy:

- opens a door that is visibly marked as locked
- hides in a building that is blown up by a Reaper moments later
- emerges from a vent only moments later, not a scratch on him
- disappears without a trace in a classic "this character is a hallucination" scenario, accompanied by dreamy sounds and Reaper growl on top

And then I'm not even touching upon 'how did the boy get there so quickly', how he got to the shuttles, and how nobody pays any attention to him, just sticking with the most obvious stuff for now.

I really can't see how anyone can believe for a moment that he's real.

Perhaps he was real only in the very first scene, when playing with the toy, but even that is doubtful, considering the fact that everything about that scene just symbolically screams that it's an illusion (the optical -and auditory!- illusion of the space ship being a toy, the boy controlling it, etcetera)

------------------------------

As far as Leviathan goes, let's not forget the Leviathan even tells us that all Reapers have the power to influence organics, but over countless cycles they have perfected it to indoctrination.

The Reapers can do what the Leviathans can do x1000.