80611 réponses à ce sujet

[MegumiAzusa]

CoolioThane wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

As said in my opinion it's the part to make the victim believe that was changed the most, not necessarily how strong the illusions are because we have zero evidence pointing to that.

But it's just as much a leap to suggest the illusions weren't improved as the ability to convince the victim was improved.

If one was improved, I'd suggest it was more likely the other was too. That's what perfecting aims to do.

The difference is that the approach also changed. Leviathans just take over the bodies, Reapers influence your mind to think the way they want you to think by stimulating your body chemicals.

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

[CoolioThane]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

As said in my opinion it's the part to make the victim believe that was changed the most, not necessarily how strong the illusions are because we have zero evidence pointing to that.

Actually that's backwards, but I won't waste time explaining why.

Ah yes, very well structured argument. Now that I see where you're coming from I really should rethink. If only everyone would make his/her argument in such detail.

Pot/Kettle. Seriously.

[BleedingUranium]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Modifié par BleedingUranium, 04 janvier 2013 - 06:31 .

[draconian139]

I REALLY need to get around to watching Leviathan...

[BansheeOwnage]

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Overlord. Geth Consensus. Hell, Arrival.

[BleedingUranium]

draconian139 wrote...

I REALLY need to get around to watching Leviathan...

It's very good! My third favourite, after Arrival and Overlord.

[CoolioThane]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

As said in my opinion it's the part to make the victim believe that was changed the most, not necessarily how strong the illusions are because we have zero evidence pointing to that.

But it's just as much a leap to suggest the illusions weren't improved as the ability to convince the victim was improved.

If one was improved, I'd suggest it was more likely the other was too. That's what perfecting aims to do.

The difference is that the approach also changed. Leviathans just take over the bodies, Reapers influence your mind to think the way they want you to think by stimulating your body chemicals.

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Precedence for what? That the mind is affected by chemicals? That's simple biology. That there are hallucinations? Leviathan proves there are. That they take place inside Shepard's mind which are affected by chemicals? Leviathan proves that. That the enthrallment has been improved to allow greater access to people's minds (inception-style)? This is what you're arguing.

you say there is no precedence for the ability for the illusions to be improved as well?

Seriously, what you're saying needs more of a leap in logic, that the Reapers have only improved one part of the enthrallment whilst not improving another...They are uber-intelligent.

My point takes less of a leap than yours. Easy

[demersel]

Sadly, you guys don't get how great Omega really is... (((

[MegumiAzusa]

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

As said in my opinion it's the part to make the victim believe that was changed the most, not necessarily how strong the illusions are because we have zero evidence pointing to that.

Actually that's backwards, but I won't waste time explaining why.

Ah yes, very well structured argument. Now that I see where you're coming from I really should rethink. If only everyone would make his/her argument in such detail.

This has been debated and dealt with long ago, I'm not going furthur into it because we've already established why you're wrong and you're not bringing up anything new.

You know you could at least refresh the memory, of what the conclusion was or why? Or at least a link to such a discussion?
Also may I remind you that it wouldn't be the first occasion where something was established where later it was brought up and pointed out it didn't work that well?
Also again you refuse to talk about stuff that is fixed in your opinion and you're unwilling to change. Not the best example of open mindedness...

[BleedingUranium]

Megumi's trying to argue that because we didn't see literally the exact same thing before, it can't be remotely similar. Like the people who claim Synthesis is "a different kind of ascension" and had no foreshadowing.

[CoolioThane]

I think I've just shown you Megumi. You're such a troll

[Rifneno]

BleedingUranium wrote...

Megumi's trying to argue that because we didn't see literally the exact same thing before, it can't be remotely similar. Like the people who claim Synthesis is "a different kind of ascension" and had no foreshadowing troll.

Fixed.

[BleedingUranium]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

You know you could at least refresh the memory, of what the conclusion was or why? Or at least a link to such a discussion?
Also may I remind you that it wouldn't be the first occasion where something was established where later it was brought up and pointed out it didn't work that well?
Also again you refuse to talk about stuff that is fixed in your opinion and you're unwilling to change. Not the best example of open mindedness...

We the thread, not just me personally.

As Banshee said: Overlord, Arrival, Geth Consensus, Leviathan, End. That's just Shepard personally, there's also the Cerberus team on the Reaper that see things, like Shepard sees the kid in Vancouver, and the Project team in Arrival who all have the same nightmare, like Shepard has nightmares.

This is fiction, things don't have to be identical to work together.

Modifié par BleedingUranium, 04 janvier 2013 - 06:38 .

[MegumiAzusa]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Overlord. Geth Consensus. Hell, Arrival.

In none of those were illusions of Reaper origin but Arrival, and what was the illusion there? Right flashes of something that is happening. No consistent minutes long interactive hallucination.

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 04 janvier 2013 - 06:39 .

[CoolioThane]

Megumi do you go into literal threads and argue with them constantly at every single point? If not then it's being a hypocrite as they're both as valid as each other...

[CoolioThane]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Overlord. Geth Consensus. Hell, Arrival.

In none of those were illusions of Reaper origin but Arrival, and what was the illusion there? Right flashes of something that is happening. No consistent minutes long interactive hallucination.

Are you just ignoring everything? You're the one making a bigger leap here...

[dorktainian]

so what we see ain't real and that galaxy map showing the different coloured light spreading after the relays go kapput is actually sheps mind becoming indoctrinated?

oh god.....what if you can apply the whole trilogy to this observation? the mass effect trilogy being a case study showing the route to indoctrination?

[BleedingUranium]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Overlord. Geth Consensus. Hell, Arrival.

In none of those were illusions of Reaper origin but Arrival, and what was the illusion there? Right flashes of something that is happening. No consistent minutes long interactive hallucination.

That's being beyond excessively specific.

You should watch all of the "supports IT" section of my sig. It's not about showing two things to be 100% identical, it's about pattern recognition and such.

Modifié par BleedingUranium, 04 janvier 2013 - 06:45 .

[Rifneno]

CoolioThane wrote...

Megumi do you go into literal threads and argue with them constantly at every single point? If not then it's being a hypocrite as they're both as valid as each other...

Nope.  I brought that up earlier.  Dwailing's hormones went into overdrive and he jumped on the grenade.

[CoolioThane]

Rifneno wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Megumi do you go into literal threads and argue with them constantly at every single point? If not then it's being a hypocrite as they're both as valid as each other...

Nope.  I brought that up earlier.  Dwailing's hormones went into overdrive and he jumped on the grenade.

Your signature is literally perfect

[BansheeOwnage]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...
Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Overlord. Geth Consensus. Hell, Arrival.

In none of those were illusions of Reaper origin but Arrival, and what was the illusion there? Right flashes of something that is happening. No consistent minutes long interactive hallucination.

It's a precedent. A Precedent for alternate-realities in ME. And the fact that Shepard is no more immune to being forced into them than anyone else. Furthermore, it shows that even Shep can be 100% convinced it is reality. (Shepard didn't realize the leviathan hallucination was fake until Ann spoke in Leviathan's voice.)

[draconian139]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

In none of those were illusions of Reaper origin but Arrival, and what was the illusion there? Right flashes of something that is happening. No consistent minutes long interactive hallucination.

Who do you think would be better at creating illusions?  Geth or Reapers?

[MegumiAzusa]

CoolioThane wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Overlord. Geth Consensus. Hell, Arrival.

In none of those were illusions of Reaper origin but Arrival, and what was the illusion there? Right flashes of something that is happening. No consistent minutes long interactive hallucination.

Are you just ignoring everything? You're the one making a bigger leap here...

Not really, as for a fact the only things we that are proven indoctrination hallucinations are inconsistent and non-interactive flashes. There is no proven long term hallucination, only assumed.

[Rifneno]

CoolioThane wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Megumi do you go into literal threads and argue with them constantly at every single point? If not then it's being a hypocrite as they're both as valid as each other...

Nope.  I brought that up earlier.  Dwailing's hormones went into overdrive and he jumped on the grenade.

Your signature is literally perfect

I know, right?  Norlond made it.  It is pure krogan banner.  I am in awe.

[MegumiAzusa]

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

BleedingUranium wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Yeah? The illusion takes place in Shepard's mind...which is stimulated by the Reaper-affected body chemicals.

Over the course of all games there is just no precedence for that, but quite a few for what I wrote.

Leviathan. Not that we needed that.

Overlord. Geth Consensus. Hell, Arrival.

In none of those were illusions of Reaper origin but Arrival, and what was the illusion there? Right flashes of something that is happening. No consistent minutes long interactive hallucination.

That's being beyond excessively specific.

You should watch all of the "supports IT" section of my sig. It's not about showing two things to be 100% identical, it's about pattern recognition and such.

And the pattern of 100% inconsistent, non-interactive illusions/hallucinations say I'm right.