80611 réponses à ce sujet

[Drewton]

For some more serious discussion: what would you think it was confirmed that you can control the Reapers through the Crucible? Could the IT still survive?

[spotlessvoid]

Lok,
Yeah I remember that thing about Coates disappearing right after his Shepard chat and nobody but Anderson and Shepard responding or even making eye contact. But it's such a shall sample size it's pretty hard to make any assumptions from that

[TJBartlemus]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...
What does it matter? Indoctrinated / Being Indoctrinated. Both are illogical for the ending. It would make more sense for it to be near the end instead of being the end. Really it's just all bad writing and bad planning. And BioWare wonders why they have such low ratings...

- JT the Troll Master  

Man TJ, it's kind of hard to argue the bad writing simply because it would take hours to include all of the evidence that it wasn't have you replay all of the games lol.

Also, I see what you did there - reversing your name JT.

You wouldn't be answering like that if you saw my original post. Now go and look at the post, then we'll talk. 

- JT the Troll Master 

[spotlessvoid]

Drewton

I guess the argument could remain they are trying to fool you into synthesis or that you still never made it to the citadel.

It's more a point in favor of literal than a point against IT

[Drewton]

spotlessvoid wrote...

Lok,
Yeah I remember that thing about Coates disappearing right after his Shepard chat and nobody but Anderson and Shepard responding or even making eye contact. But it's such a shall sample size it's pretty hard to make any assumptions from that

I assume the video of the infrasound when you're around Coates has already been posted?

[BansheeOwnage]

[quote]BansheeOwnage wrote...

[quote]TJBartlemus wrote...

 The endings are clearly either badly written or are purposely written to cause speculation but not to impliment IT. IT just makes the endings even worse than they are and is just a major insult to BioWare with all their work on the game. If the endings were to impliment IT and have Shepard not have done anything in the RW would cause BioWare to become liars. They promised us an end to the trilogy and the end to Shepard's story. The only way to end the trilogy is to end the Reaper threat. The only way to end Shepard's story is for him/her to die. With IT these two don't happen and BioWare could be potentially sued. Effectively the IT is almost like a retcon device in the RW plot. It would mean that we have yet to make a final confronation, the Reapers are still a threat and that would mean the series is not done. BioWare even went on to say they won't change the endings. Even an "Arrival" type DLC is unlikely. Why create a DLC to spoil the plot for ME4? Why even connect the games? It would be a new series with a new plot. Connecting doesn't seem logical. 

If IT was true and was to be the plot of ME4, why would they do that? Definitely not enough plot for an entire game. No an entire new plot would be needed to be successful. 

Oops. BansheeOwnage wrote: Well, once again, you fall for the common misconception that IT is a retcon. Quite the opposite in fact. You need alter nothing for it to be true. Hell, in some interpretations of IT, the game actually ends because Shepard manages to activate the crucible.

Modifié par BansheeOwnage, 18 août 2012 - 04:24 .

[Lokanaiya]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

@ Lokanaiya It was you who brought up the absolutely amazing point that Firebase Rio seems to have been designed for simply moving forward and not covering your back right?

Yes, though it was pretty easy to figure out. Why?

[BansheeOwnage]

Lokanaiya wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

@ Lokanaiya It was you who brought up the absolutely amazing point that Firebase Rio seems to have been designed for simply moving forward and not covering your back right?

Yes, though it was pretty easy to figure out. Why?

Gotta give credit where credit's due. That's all. It helped me with my Rio analysis a bit.

[TJBartlemus]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

 The endings are clearly either badly written or are purposely written to cause speculation but not to impliment IT. IT just makes the endings even worse than they are and is just a major insult to BioWare with all their work on the game. If the endings were to impliment IT and have Shepard not have done anything in the RW would cause BioWare to become liars. They promised us an end to the trilogy and the end to Shepard's story. The only way to end the trilogy is to end the Reaper threat. The only way to end Shepard's story is for him/her to die. With IT these two don't happen and BioWare could be potentially sued. Effectively the IT is almost like a retcon device in the RW plot. It would mean that we have yet to make a final confronation, the Reapers are still a threat and that would mean the series is not done. BioWare even went on to say they won't change the endings. Even an "Arrival" type DLC is unlikely. Why create a DLC to spoil the plot for ME4? Why even connect the games? It would be a new series with a new plot. Connecting doesn't seem logical. 

If IT was true and was to be the plot of ME4, why would they do that? Definitely not enough plot for an entire game. No an entire new plot would be needed to be successful.

 

Oops. BansheeOwnage wrote: Well, once again, you fall for the common misconception that IT is a retcon. Quite the opposite in fact. You need alter nothing for it to be true. Hell, in some interpretations of IT, the game actually ends because Shepard manages to activate the crucible.

You still don't see. I am done with you IT'ers ignoring me. I will be back. Beware...

- JT the Troll Master 

[spotlessvoid]

You mean the one from hellish fiend Lok?

[TJBartlemus]

 Good God I was getting annoyed at myself. I couldn't do any more of that JT stuff. It was fun at the beginning ... now it's just plainly annoying. <_< I am up for real speculations now.  

(I also got to admit I did make some good points at the beginning of when I acted as JT....) 

EDIT - Great. Now I have a headache.  

Modifié par TJBartlemus, 18 août 2012 - 04:32 .

[BansheeOwnage]

Drewton wrote...

For some more serious discussion: what would you think it was confirmed that you can control the Reapers through the Crucible? Could the IT still survive?

Well it's a bit of a non-issue really. How would it be confirmed? If Leviathan told you, that would ruin the whole "no one knows what it does" aspect of the game from potentially the very beginning. Plus, it would render the whole game-long debate with TIM that you can't control the reapers pointless. As well, the "surprise" that starkid tells you TIM was right wouldn't make any sense. In addition to that, all of the Shepards who want to stay true to the original goal of destroy would then have to try and finish a device that is confirmed to control them? No. Not even worth considering.

Modifié par BansheeOwnage, 18 août 2012 - 04:34 .

[legaldinho]

Drewton wrote...

For some more serious discussion: what would you think it was confirmed that you can control the Reapers through the Crucible? Could the IT still survive?

yes, but not in the sense it was originally understood ("DLC is coming" to finish the fight, or as i consistently called it - to much derision in this thread's predecessors, I hasten to add- the "psyke" DLC)

IT will have to exist as an alternative- and valid- interpretation of the ending.

But it's very inelegant, and that's the fault of the designers. Who thought an incomplete narrative would work? If Leviathan helps close the gap between the game and the ending, it might have made that ending more palatable. More would have accepted it, and then maybe a few would have wondered if we are hallucinating the end.

I just don't like it. Let's wait until it comes. The "truth" DLC was never coming. Allow me to say I told you so. But that doesn't mean the IT is invalid as an alternative reading of the story. I think many clues will confirm its validity.

[BansheeOwnage]

TJBartlemus wrote...

 Good God I was getting annoyed at myself. I couldn't do any more of that JT stuff. It was fun at the beginning ... now it's just plainly annoying. <_< I am up for real speculations now.  

(I also got to admit I did make some good points at the beginning of when I acted as JT....) 

Seems like you successfully broke indoctrination! Great job!  I bet it wasn't fun to be thrown out of your own mind.

[spotlessvoid]

IT provides a way to take the narrative further without trivializing what the player has already experienced. That is definitely not a retcon device

[masster blaster]

Why are you ITers still around. I thought that the EC got rid of your horrific theory for good. Everything you saw happed. So deal with it. I can know save everyon by Controlling the Reapers, and my Shepard can protect the many.

[TJBartlemus]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

 Good God I was getting annoyed at myself. I couldn't do any more of that JT stuff. It was fun at the beginning ... now it's just plainly annoying. <_< I am up for real speculations now.  

(I also got to admit I did make some good points at the beginning of when I acted as JT....) 

Seems like you successfully broke indoctrination! Great job!  I bet it wasn't fun to be thrown out of your own mind.

Funny thing is...I literally suddenly now do have a headache.  100% serious. PS. No it wasn't fun. Really sucked. Expecially since I had a counter to all I posted. 

Modifié par TJBartlemus, 18 août 2012 - 04:37 .

[BansheeOwnage]

masster blaster wrote...

Why are you ITers still around. I thought that the EC got rid of your horrific theory for good. Everything you saw happed. So deal with it. I can know save everyon by Controlling the Reapers, and my Shepard can protect the many.

Please be kind and provide all of the evidence that the EC disproved IT. (You actually make a very convincing troll Masster )

[spotlessvoid]

Well legaldinho just proved us all wrong, tune to close up shop

[Lokanaiya]

spotlessvoid wrote...

Lok,
Yeah I remember that thing about Coates disappearing right after his Shepard chat and nobody but Anderson and Shepard responding or even making eye contact. But it's such a shall sample size it's pretty hard to make any assumptions from that

That's not all the evidence, there's a fair amount more. Here's some I can think of off the top of my head:

He teleports around while and after your shuttle lands at the FOB. I believe one of Prettz's videos shows it.
He doesn't just disappear, he walks straight toward a pit. Why didn't he just go behind Shepard?
He moves in unison with another soldier after Anderson hands out orders at the FOB. Same exact movements, same time, same direction, too, I believe.
There's infrasound when he is near you in the FOB, and it goes away when he leaves.

He's also the only Alliance soldier in the entire FOB, including Anderson, that doesn't wear a hat, and many people have noted that there just seems to be something... off about him. I wouldn't include those with the evidence, but they're worth noting. I know that there's sutff that i missed, too.

[ZerebusPrime]

I think the faux trolling would be funnier in Elcor.

[Lokanaiya]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Lokanaiya wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

@ Lokanaiya It was you who brought up the absolutely amazing point that Firebase Rio seems to have been designed for simply moving forward and not covering your back right?

Yes, though it was pretty easy to figure out. Why?

Gotta give credit where credit's due. That's all. It helped me with my Rio analysis a bit.

Well, thanks.

[TJBartlemus]

ZerebusPrime wrote...

I think the faux trolling would be funnier in Elcor.

Questioning sarcastically: What is this faux trolling you speak of? 

[Drewton]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Drewton wrote...

For some more serious discussion: what would you think it was confirmed that you can control the Reapers through the Crucible? Could the IT still survive?

Well it's a bit of a non-issue really. How would it be confirmed? If Leviathan told you, that would ruin the whole "no one knows what it does" aspect of the game from potentially the very beginning. Plus, it would render the whole game-long debate with TIM that you can't control the reapers pointless. As well, the "surprise" that starkid tells you TIM was right wouldn't make any sense. In addition to that, all of the Shepards who want to stay true to the original goal of destroy would then have to try and finish a device that is confirmed to control them? No. Not even worth considering.

Great points. 

[LT123]

ZerebusPrime wrote...

I think the faux trolling would be funnier in Elcor.

With conviction: There is no evidence for IT.

...

Hey, it is funnier.

Edit: Listened to the Reaper horn and "the child lies" whisper. Creepy!

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Priss Blackburne wrote...

yeah
started fooling around with the sound files trying to see what Harby
says during the EC scene. Got no where with that but got me speeding up
or slowing down other sounds and found it.

The dream sequence sounds even have lines from previous mass effect games,
said by I'm guessing if they are dead squadmates. I was hoping for
something better from the dream files but couldn't find anything.

Think I even tried reversing some sounds from reapers and husk speak but didn't find anything.

The
most interesting part of this IMO (and I don't think anyone else
mentioned it) is that all of the lines are rerecorded for the dreams.
That's quite a bit of effort for just some reused lines in a dream. I
think this disproves the idea that the dreams are meaningless - like we
need to anyway.

Yes,
I noticed this. They're lines you've heard in the past, but they're
delivered very differently, some are really extreme... like crazy
whispers.

Also, female and male Shepard hear the same whispers, so male Shepard can hear, for example, Thane's "You are a great protector, siha" and one of Kaidan's ME 1 romance lines. FemShep can hear one of Ash's ME 1 romance lines.

Modifié par LT123, 18 août 2012 - 04:43 .