80611 réponses à ce sujet

[GethPrimeMKII]

This isn't an elaborate start up to a joke about Bioware's writing ability, is it?

[FreddyCast]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

Did I just witness a ITiest convert to ITianity? HAHAHA
But seriously, are you serious Heretic, that you finally believe in IT?
Puttting aside whether BW intended IT or not, do you finally believe in the merits of IT?

Well whatever happened to Shepard in ME3, he definitely wasn't my Shepard anymore. He said and did all kinds of stuff my Shepard from ME1 and ME2 would never say or do. So that must mean he's indoctrinated right? From the very start of ME3 my Shepard already was full-blown indoctrinated.

That's not what IT states. IT doesn't say that Shepard is already indoctrinated, IT states that throughout ME3 Shepard is being attacked with indoctrination attempts on his mind (the Dreams, the meeting with the Catalyst). It's only at the end if you choose Control or Synthesis that Shepard is finally indoctrinated.
But yes, TIM has lost it. Even Shepard himself says that TIM has forgotten what Cerberus once stood for.
"You were suppose to be Humanity's sword, not a dagger on our backs"

[desert_beagle]

Here is the problem I have with ME3's construction as far as ending this story is concerned. I also mean a final ending whether it be IT or EC is real, or what have you.  Based on the entire overall game, there is no other way for it to end except at the Crucible.  One way or another IT or not it ends there.

The Crucible is obviously a trap, but I don't think that it was one that the Reapers intended to use, because, in all honesty, I don't think they knew about it until TIM told them. Does it have the power to destroy the Reapers? Yes. They know that if the power of the Crucible is actually harnessed then they are finally going the way of the dinosaur.

They also know that it is this cycle's only hope of stopping them. Since it is the only chance the galaxy has, and no other options were ever presented for destroying the Reapers (it is pretty clear that in conventional combat the Reapers outmatch everyone) the Reapers then use the Citadel to draw out the remaining military might of the galaxy to finish them off. Just like in Return of the Jedi. The Emperor laid out his trap at the second Death Star, but there was still a chance of success by the Rebel Alliance.

A gamble, since the Reapers know that the galaxy is trying to get someone onto the Citadel to activate the Crucible. It all comes down to self preservation. One side, or the other. Harbinger didn't exactly make it easy to get to the transport beam. He made sure no one, and I mean no one got to the beam. Major Coates says it. The entire force was decimated. If the Crucible couldn't really do anything to them, why protect the Citadel from it that much?

Well now you say, "Shepard made it though!" That is the point of this thread. Did he REALLY make it? I don't think Harbinger would be dumb enough after making all of that effort to keep anyone from reaching the beam to not make sure that the single biggest thorn in his side, Shepard, is not just mostly dead, but all dead.

As far as the decision chamber is concerned, Shepard never really had any knowledge of what any of the Crucible looked like. As far as a hallucination or dream is concerned, the Reapers could have made it look like anything they wanted that resembled something like what Shepard might expect to find in order to make it look convincing.

I think, for real, that the Crucible is a dark energy converter that opens a worm hole to our century and summons Chuck Norris to destroy the Reapers. That is why they are so afraid.

Modifié par desert_beagle, 22 août 2012 - 11:50 .

[The Heretic of Time]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

This isn't an elaborate start up to a joke about Bioware's writing ability, is it?

I don't know. Is it? Doesn't seem indoctrination like a much better and more sensical explanation to my Shepard's behavior in ME3 than the theory that BioWare is inept at writing?

[The Heretic of Time]

FreddyCast wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

Did I just witness a ITiest convert to ITianity? HAHAHA
But seriously, are you serious Heretic, that you finally believe in IT?
Puttting aside whether BW intended IT or not, do you finally believe in the merits of IT?

Well whatever happened to Shepard in ME3, he definitely wasn't my Shepard anymore. He said and did all kinds of stuff my Shepard from ME1 and ME2 would never say or do. So that must mean he's indoctrinated right? From the very start of ME3 my Shepard already was full-blown indoctrinated.

That's not what IT states. IT doesn't say that Shepard is already indoctrinated, IT states that throughout ME3 Shepard is being attacked with indoctrination attempts on his mind (the Dreams, the meeting with the Catalyst). It's only at the end if you choose Control or Synthesis that Shepard is finally indoctrinated.

Then the IT is wrong. My Shepard clearly is already indoctrinate at the very start of ME3.

But yes, TIM has lost it. Even Shepard himself says that TIM has forgotten what Cerberus once stood for.
"You were suppose to be Humanity's sword, not a dagger on our backs"

True. R.I.P. TIMmy, we'll never forget humanities true hero, we'll always remember him for who he was, not how he died. Rest in peace TIM. 

Modifié par Heretic_Hanar, 22 août 2012 - 11:48 .

[munnellyladt]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

Did I just witness a ITiest convert to ITianity? HAHAHA
But seriously, are you serious Heretic, that you finally believe in IT?
Puttting aside whether BW intended IT or not, do you finally believe in the merits of IT?

Well whatever happened to Shepard in ME3, he definitely wasn't my Shepard anymore. He said and did all kinds of stuff my Shepard from ME1 and ME2 would never say or do. So that must mean he's indoctrinated right? From the very start of ME3 my Shepard already was full-blown indoctrinated.

That's not what IT states. IT doesn't say that Shepard is already indoctrinated, IT states that throughout ME3 Shepard is being attacked with indoctrination attempts on his mind (the Dreams, the meeting with the Catalyst). It's only at the end if you choose Control or Synthesis that Shepard is finally indoctrinated.

Then the IT is wrong. My Shepard clearly is already indoctrinate at the very start of ME3.

But yes, TIM has lost it. Even Shepard himself says that TIM has forgotten what Cerberus once stood for.
"You were suppose to be Humanity's sword, not a dagger on our backs"

True. R.I.P. TIMmy, we'll never forget humanities true hero, we'll always remember him for who he was, not how he died. Rest in peace TIM. 

Ummmmmm.......

I got a feeling this is your favourite show:

[The Heretic of Time]

munnellyladt wrote...

Ummmmmm.......

I got a feeling this is your favourite show:

That is correct. I always watch that show after saying my daily prayers.

Modifié par Heretic_Hanar, 22 août 2012 - 11:53 .

[ZerebusPrime]

I would just point out that if vent boy is fictional from the beginning, then Shepard is suffering the effects of indoctrination from the very beginning.  He's not fully indoctrinated at the start, no, but he's not himself, either.

[munnellyladt]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

munnellyladt wrote...

Ummmmmm.......

I got a feeling this is your favourite show:

That is correct. I always watch that show after saying my prayers.

DAFUQ?

Ok man your starting to freak me out abit.

[The Heretic of Time]

ZerebusPrime wrote...

I would just point out that if vent boy is fictional from the beginning, then Shepard is suffering the effects of indoctrination from the very beginning.  He's not fully indoctrinated at the start, no, but he's not himself, either.

Indeed. Shepard clearly isn't himself as soon as he went to that meeting with the comittee. Shepard would never say extremely dumb crap like "we fight or we die, that's the plan!". Clearly there is some indoctrination going on right there.

[The Heretic of Time]

munnellyladt wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

munnellyladt wrote...

Ummmmmm.......

I got a feeling this is your favourite show:

That is correct. I always watch that show after saying my prayers.

DAFUQ?

Ok man your starting to freak me out abit.

Why? Don't you say your daily prayers to BioWare? You have to, it's in the EULA of Origin. As soon as you agree with the user terms of agreement and install Mass Effect 3 on your computer, your soul belongs to BioWare. Now you have to pray to them at least twice a day or before you start playing a BioWare video-game, or else you'll burn in the fires of hEAll.

Modifié par Heretic_Hanar, 23 août 2012 - 12:03 .

[desert_beagle]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

ZerebusPrime wrote...

I would just point out that if vent boy is fictional from the beginning, then Shepard is suffering the effects of indoctrination from the very beginning.  He's not fully indoctrinated at the start, no, but he's not himself, either.

Indeed. Shepard clearly isn't himself as soon as he went to that meeting with the comittee. Shepard would never say extremely dumb crap like "we fight or we die, that's the plan!". Clearly there is some indoctrination going on right there.

I don't know.  At that point Shepard had been warning the galaxy that the Reapers were coming and they needed to beef up their military might.  Everyone kept telling him, "You're dellusional.  The reapers are a myth.  Sovereign was an isolated incident with Saren.  We don't need to listen to you."  

Then lo and behold the Reapers show up, flat out waste the batarians and move in on the rest.  What is Shepard gonna say?  Really?  At this point he is basically telling them, "Yall can go eat s*** and die.  I told you this was gonna happen, but you really didn't want to listen to me.  No, you said it was in my head.  You said I don't know what I'm talking about.  You ignored me and now look where we are.  It is a bit late to start building fleets and stockpiling weapons.  Its also late to settle greivances with the rest of the galaxy so maybe we all could have a chance.  Nope, we got two options at this point, fight or crawl under a rock until the Reapers find us and die."

Of course Shepard just truncates it down to, "We fight or we die, that's the plan!"

[munnellyladt]

Heritic:

I don't have to,i'm on xbox

[ZerebusPrime]

If IT is true, then I consider Shepard to be suffering from Indoctrination since at least the final battle in the Collector Base, possibly Arrival.  From the reactions we get from squadmates, that protoreaper was definitely giving off an ominous vibe/signal (and I believe another poster her pointed out that there's a spot with many cigarettes on the floor where the protoreaper hangs in Cerberus HQ, indicating that the Illusive Man spent a lot of time in close proximity to that monster during the last six months while trying to find a way to subvert the Reapers).

I do not personally believe that vent boy is real any of the times we see him; I believe that Shepard is already experiencing hallucinations in the opening moments of the game.  James walks in, Shepard stops looking at the imaginary garden.  Anderson walks in, Shepard stops talking to empty ventilation ducts.  Etc.  Having other people around helps Shepard to reground himself in reality, but the damage is already there and is progressing.

[jgibson14352]

heretic hanar is a troll who for some reason has a personal deal with this thread. anything you try to discuss with him will come to him screaming bad writing from the rafters. hes been like this since mark II, please dont feed him.

ALSO, when was the codex wrong? the only thing you could see as misleading is how for relays and citadel is how there "supposedly constructed by the protheans" because its written as a guide for in-universe explorers, not the player in specific, i dont remember anything being wrong

Modifié par jgibson14352, 23 août 2012 - 12:13 .

[The Heretic of Time]

munnellyladt wrote...

Heritic:

I don't have to,i'm on xbox

Lucky you.

[The Heretic of Time]

jgibson14352 wrote...

heretic hanar is a troll who for some reason has a personal deal with this thread. anything you try to discuss with him will come to him screaming bad writing from the rafters. hes been like this since mark II, please dont feed him.

No it's not bad writing, it's clearly indoctrination, I see that now. Indoctrination makes so much more sense than bad writing! How could I not see this before?

[Monster20862]

No, it wasn't.

[munnellyladt]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

jgibson14352 wrote...

heretic hanar is a troll who for some reason has a personal deal with this thread. anything you try to discuss with him will come to him screaming bad writing from the rafters. hes been like this since mark II, please dont feed him.

No it's not bad writing, it's clearly indoctrination, I see that now. Indoctrination makes so much more sense than bad writing! How could I not see this before?

Sarcasim?

[jgibson14352]

yes. go check mark 2 if you want, its the same sh*t.

but again though, where was the codex wrong?

[The Heretic of Time]

munnellyladt wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

jgibson14352 wrote...

heretic hanar is a troll who for some reason has a personal deal with this thread. anything you try to discuss with him will come to him screaming bad writing from the rafters. hes been like this since mark II, please dont feed him.

No it's not bad writing, it's clearly indoctrination, I see that now. Indoctrination makes so much more sense than bad writing! How could I not see this before?

Sarcasim?

Why would I be sarcastic? Are you saying indoctrination ISN'T a better explanation than bad writing to the fact that my Shepard isn't acting like himself anymore in ME3?

[munnellyladt]

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

munnellyladt wrote...

Heretic_Hanar wrote...

jgibson14352 wrote...

heretic hanar is a troll who for some reason has a personal deal with this thread. anything you try to discuss with him will come to him screaming bad writing from the rafters. hes been like this since mark II, please dont feed him.

No it's not bad writing, it's clearly indoctrination, I see that now. Indoctrination makes so much more sense than bad writing! How could I not see this before?

Sarcasim?

Why would I be sarcastic? Are you saying indoctrination ISN'T a better explanation than bad writing to the fact that my Shepard isn't acting like himself anymore in ME3?

No,I just don't trust you.

[The Heretic of Time]

jgibson14352 wrote...

yes. go check mark 2 if you want, its the same sh*t.

It's not the same at all.


Stop being such a douche. I'm finally agreeing with you guys and this is how you welcome me?

[Hrothdane]

I've seen Heretic_Hanar actually attempt to discuss things in a reasonable manner before.

I'm going to do the paragon thing and give him a chance.

[The Heretic of Time]

Hrothdane wrote...

I've seen Heretic_Hanar actually attempt to discuss things in a reasonable manner before.

I'm going to do the paragon thing and give him a chance.

Thank you, that is very kind of you. Glad to see that some of you are more forgiving than others.