80611 réponses à ce sujet

[Rifneno]

RavenEyry wrote...

Rifneno wrote...
I'm surprised the numbnuts haven't claimed the Protheans invented stars.

I think the hanar do.

It seems carbon dating has fallen out of favour in the future. "There's no evidence Sovereing was anything more than a geth vessel."

The only part of that conversation that didn't make me want to weep with hate was that if you have Legion with you, he'll call them on their BS.

[Revan87]

Omega is clearly more than just a mining facility.
Reaper intrest in omega:
1. Collectors wanted to "conquer" omega with a virus that killes all but humans.
2. Indoctrinated Cerberus conquers Omega (Why?)
3. Retribution: Reapers "tell" Grayson that they built Omega
4. Crucible and omega look similar
5. Catalyst tells us that synthesis has been tried before (with the omega crucible?) but it failed, because a.) the crucible
wasn't improved enough b.) the races were not "good" enough.
Through the entire series humanity is always featured as the special race, the one with the special DNA or somewhat like that (difficult to explain with my english...).
(In one of the early scprits the prothean created the humans as a perfect slave race. I don't know if that is (was ever) true, but I have read it somewhere)

[ivenoidea]

Guys, i just realized something. Check this out.

1 Can you pull in the leviathan with a fishhook or tie down his tongue with a rope?
2 Can you put a cord through his nose or pierce his jaw with a hook?
3 Will he keep begging you for mercy? Will he speak to you with gentle words?
4 Will he make an agreement with you for you to take him as your slave for life?
...
8 If you lay a hand on him, you will remember the struggle and never do it again!
9 Any hope of subduing him is false; the mere sight of him is overpowering.
10 No-one is fierce enough to rouse him. Who then is able to stand against me?
...
15 His back has rows of shields tightly sealed together;
...
18 His snorting throws out flashes of light; his eyes are like the rays of dawn.
19 Firebrands stream from his mouth; sparks of fire shoot out.
20 Smoke pours from his nostrils as from a boiling pot over a fire of reeds.
21 His breath sets coals ablaze, and flames dart from his mouth.
...
24 His chest is hard as rock, hard as a lower millstone.
25 When he rises up, the mighty are terrified; they retreat before his thrashing.
26 The sword that reaches him has no effect, nor does the spear or the dart or the javelin.
..
33 Nothing on earth is his equal— a creature without fear.

Someone at Bioware read the christian Bible it seems.

The "flames from his mouth" might very well be the reaper laser. (Maybe the leviathans have something similar.) Remember in ME1 during the hallucination where shepard takes over the thoughts of a primitive life form it is described as a finger of fire (or something like that.)

Also to the guy above: OK, I'll accept it, it does make sense now that you put it that way.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leviathan

Modifié par ivenoidea, 29 août 2012 - 12:28 .

[RavenEyry]

There's other appropriate biblical references. Like something about Satan tempting Jesus to jump off a cliff, promising it was a good idea.

[ivenoidea]

RavenEyry wrote...

There's other appropriate biblical references. Like something about Satan tempting Jesus to jump off a cliff, promising it was a good idea.

To be honest, i don't know **** about the bible. Not much of a religious guy. Someone in here who could help?

[RavenEyry]

I don't know much about the bible either, I was passing on what someone told me ages ago.

I can't be sure, but I'm guessing Jesus didn't make the jump because it was freaking Satan that suggested it.

[ivenoidea]

RavenEyry wrote...

I don't know much about the bible either, I was passing on what someone told me ages ago.

I can't be sure, but I'm guessing Jesus didn't make the jump because it was freaking Satan that suggested it.

Guess Jesus wasn't a raging 14 year old complaining about "bad writing" then.

Edit: Not counting DLC Shepard also had 12 crew members = followers in ME2. The plot is thickening.

Edit2: "
The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything in it will be laid bare. "
....a roar?

OK, I'll admit, I'm looking too far into this. I probably sound like some crazy person by now.

Modifié par ivenoidea, 29 août 2012 - 12:45 .

[Revan87]

I like those bible references! Either way, I don't know much about the bible, I'm not a religious guy.
But speaking of the devil: "May you be in heaven half hour before the devil knows you're dead."
Harbinger = Devil ?
Heaven = Citadel ?
Hmm.. Let's see if there are more bible references in the game.

Modifié par Revan87, 29 août 2012 - 12:46 .

[Rifneno]

ivenoidea wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

I don't know much about the bible either, I was passing on what someone told me ages ago.

I can't be sure, but I'm guessing Jesus didn't make the jump because it was freaking Satan that suggested it.

Guess Jesus wasn't a raging 14 year old complaining about "bad writing" then.

10/10

[lex0r11]

ivenoidea wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

I don't know much about the bible either, I was passing on what someone told me ages ago.

I can't be sure, but I'm guessing Jesus didn't make the jump because it was freaking Satan that suggested it.

Guess Jesus wasn't a raging 14 year old complaining about "bad writing" then.

You rang?

[ivenoidea]

More stuff:

The kid in the stargazer scene calls Shepard "The Shepard"
A common name for Jesus.

It's pretty obvious they want Shepard to *be* Jesus in this story.

Edit2: Forgot the most obvious one. If he dies during the end he literally dies to destroy the results of the "sins" of the Leviathans.

Edit3: Was anyone else reminded of Adam and Eve in the jungle scene during the end with Joker and EDI? The paradise was some kind of jungle right? I mean it had a snake.

Edit4: Also the whole "die and come back from the dead" thing.

Edit5: The club names. Afterlife, Eternity, and in ME3 Purgatory.

Edit6: The created will rebel against the creators? Now if that ain't Adam and Even i don't know.

Edit7: Yes, i realize it's common for media to take themes from the bible (the bible did the same from older sources after all), but the sheer amount of references is amazing.
Also: Shepard = Space Jesus

Edit8: Speaks for itself: 
As a Shepherd looks after his scattered flock when he is with them, so will I look after my sheep. I will rescue them from all the places where they were scattered on a day of clouds and darkness. [...] I will search for the lost and bring back the strays. I will bind up the injured and strengthen the weak, but the sleek and the strong I will destroy. I will Shepherd the flock with justice.  

Edit9: Hah, guy below me, Ninja'd you with Edit7.

Edit10: The Charon relay. The boatman Charon helped cross people a river to the underworld after they died according to the greek, if i remember correctly.

Edit 11: Chronos station: Chronos, in greek mythology created from the chaos, created the other gods. Also god of time.

Edit12: I'm stopping now. Sorry guys

Modifié par ivenoidea, 29 août 2012 - 01:05 .

[StElmo]

^ the christian mythos is formed from a variety of different pre-existing tropes of older religions. I'm not surprised a hero story has elements of it in there. It's not uncommon.

[RavenEyry]

StElmo wrote...

^ the christian mythos is formed from a variety of different pre-existing tropes of older religions. I'm not surprised a hero story has elements of it in there. It's not uncommon.

Having biblical references is very common, what's intereting here is some less obvious ones that fit well, such as the leap I mentioned.

[StElmo]

RavenEyry wrote...

StElmo wrote...

^ the christian mythos is formed from a variety of different pre-existing tropes of older religions. I'm not surprised a hero story has elements of it in there. It's not uncommon.

Having biblical references is very common, what's intereting here is some less obvious ones that fit well, such as the leap I mentioned.

I have a feeling thats just a false positive, but maybe if the writers actually said more then"we wanted speculation" i'd be inclined to give them credit.

[MegumiAzusa]

In my opinion both sources, the Leviathans and the Reapers, aren't trustworthy. They take a truth and spin lies around it.
Some of them are already mentioned:

LoD was organic.
The orbs seem too similar to the ones we find in ME1 and ME2, even have one in the Cabin after Firewalker.
Leviathans don't agree at one point with the Reapers but state that they are really doing their job and the harvest has to continue.
Later Shepard tells the Guardian "the Leviathan said you betrayed them".
They give indoctrinating orbs to us to distribute them to any point in the galaxy.
They tell Shepard the Reapers will pay with blood but only disable the one like they disabled the shuttle.
Shepard never got it herself the people were controlled and needed EDI to point that out.

From what it looks like I think this:
The LoD is a Leviathan, so we don't have a dead Reaper but a Leviathan defeated by Reaper forces.
The Leviathans tried to cover it up, like they did with the mining facility etc
as a result the Batarians may just have been weakened by it so it was easier for Reaper forces to indoctrinate key personnel.
The Leviathans built the pre Reaper AI to fight the other AIs created by the lesser races, this means it also had either a huge fleet or took them over, resulting in enough power to even start to harvest the Leviathans.
In letting Shepard go who goes on and distributes the indoctrination orbs she actually does exactly what they want and maybe even wanted in the first place. Indoctrination isn't always to assume direct control like they did, they basically forced Shepard to still obey their will without direct control.

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 29 août 2012 - 01:16 .

[MegumiAzusa]

ivenoidea wrote...

It's pretty obvious they want Shepard to *be* Jesus in this story.

This story? There are references to that in ME1 and ME2...

ivenoidea wrote...

Edit3: Was anyone else reminded of Adam and Eve in the jungle scene during the end with Joker and EDI? The paradise was some kind of jungle right? I mean it had a snake.

It's even named Paradise in one or two points.

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 29 août 2012 - 01:08 .

[EpyonX3]

Hrothdane wrote...

GUYS AND DOLLS. Check out this screenshot and tell me what the f--- I'm seeing.

I was near the end of the mission to rescue Ann and I was trying to take screenshots of the cave paintings while getting shot at and noticed this when I was looking through my screenshots later.

It looks awfully like oily shadows to me.

Every explosion has this black stuff to it. It's not just in the Levy DLC.

[Rifneno]

I'm sad that Leviathan won't come to Earth. I wanted to see Harbinger there with it for the Leviathan vs. Behemoth showdown.

[MegumiAzusa]

Rifneno wrote...

I'm sad that Leviathan won't come to Earth. I wanted to see Harbinger there with it for the Leviathan vs. Behemoth showdown.

Why should they? From what we see they are in agreement with the Reapers as long as the Reapers don't harvest them. Also people are spreading their indoctrination orbs. Win/Win.

[Rifneno]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

I'm sad that Leviathan won't come to Earth. I wanted to see Harbinger there with it for the Leviathan vs. Behemoth showdown.

Why should they? From what we see they are in agreement with the Reapers as long as the Reapers don't harvest them. Also people are spreading their indoctrination orbs. Win/Win.

Oh I know they wouldn't.  I was just hoping to see it before we found out what Leviathan truly was.  Lots of people were.  Wasn't there something in the mythology about Leviathan and Behemoth battling at the end of the world?

[Revan87]

Rifneno wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

I'm sad that Leviathan won't come to Earth. I wanted to see Harbinger there with it for the Leviathan vs. Behemoth showdown.

Why should they? From what we see they are in agreement with the Reapers as long as the Reapers don't harvest them. Also people are spreading their indoctrination orbs. Win/Win.

Oh I know they wouldn't.  I was just hoping to see it before we found out what Leviathan truly was.  Lots of people were.  Wasn't there something in the mythology about Leviathan and Behemoth battling at the end of the world?

Jop! The great creature of the water against the creature of land.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leviathan#In_later_Jewish_literature

Modifié par Revan87, 29 août 2012 - 01:28 .

[pseudonymic]

so... i haven't played leviathan and i don't intend to spend the money with it either. while i may have missed the discussion here since this thread moves so fast, has anyone been able to attach it to IT somehow? if so, how? it would be the only thing piquing my curiosity enough to look at the DLC.

[MegumiAzusa]

pseudonymic wrote...

so... i haven't played leviathan and i don't intend to spend the money with it either. while i may have missed the discussion here since this thread moves so fast, has anyone been able to attach it to IT somehow? if so, how? it would be the only thing piquing my curiosity enough to look at the DLC.

Nothing has really changed, both take a common truth and spin lies around it.
Interesting is how similar the first word "breathe" when inside the Leviathan illusion is to the "wake up".

[Leonia]

I also noted that one of the squad-mates (or LI in my case) tells Shepard to wake-up on the shuttle. She's certainly developed a habit for getting knocked out on a regular basis.

Also random thought based on conjecture: if Shepard had been indoctrinated or mind controlled or whatever by Leviathan this whole time, perhaps that is why the Reapers are so interested in her.

At any rate, there's new stuff to look for given how different the Leviathan's method of indoctrination is from what we've seen of the Reaper's methods.

Modifié par leonia42, 29 août 2012 - 01:36 .

[CoolioThane]

I'm kinda religious

The Temptation of Christ is kinda fitting with the ending of MassEffect 3:

1. Stones into bread
2. Tower
3. Mountain

One could easily say that the Citadel is akin to Jerusalem, in that it is the centre of the Universe (world)

1. Right, Satan attempts to tempt Jesus, wondering in the wilderness alone, whilst fasting, to have stones turned into bread to eat. One could say that by doing so Jesus would be going back on his task. His task is to fast 40 days, 40 nights and obviously eating bread means he fails.

You could say this could be linked to Shepard and how his goal has been to destroy the Reapers, but I think the journey of Jesus during this temptation is more akin to the struggles of Shep. I say this because the Desert Jesus is wandering around, between Jerusalem and Jericho I think, which links with the game.

I like this part, kind of a leap, but Jerusalem=Citadel, Jericho (One of the first continuously settled cities in the history of mankind, thus maybe because it's first settlements, Humanity's first settlement is Eart)=Earth. The journey between the Citadel and Earth where this temptation takes place. We are on Earth when we are hit with the beam, we aim to get to the Citadel. Whilst we lie there on Earth unconscious, our mind is still wandering and this is where a link could be possible.

2. As Raven says, Satan tempts Jesus to prove he is the son of God by jumping off this tower in Jerusalem (Citadel). Obvious links to Synthesis here as in the tower. Interestingly, the Citadel tower is supposedly not where we are! Starkid tries to say "Prove you are the hero, do what is needed, prove to me. Synthesis is the only way, do it" is very Satany.

3. The mountain. "Bow down to me and all of this will be yours" Wow, if that is not control, I don't know what the **** is! Starkid says the Reapers will be yours, and with the Reapers you obviously have control over the rest of the Galaxy! Very nice link here. Notice the "act of worship" when you approach the ALTAR of the Reapers and you're bowing down to him when he tells you towake

So yeah, I guess this kind of makes sense?