80611 réponses à ce sujet

[GethPrimeMKII]

If anything, Leviathan DLC strengthens the claim that every aspect of the end is drawn from Shepard's memory. We now have proof that Shepard learns of an AI that later created Reapers and that this knowledge is being used against him.

Modifié par GethPrimeMKII, 04 septembre 2012 - 01:19 .

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

hangmans tree wrote...

Watch the ending again and pay more attention. What does the debris do just before the beam light up? Oh - noes its pulled toward presidium!, and whole chunks of SOMETHING are falling onto wards... or am I blind and making thiu up playing ME3 through brile keyboard?

Like I said and posted before, damaged Citadel with its wing missing and all is mostly fine in the center ring after the explosion, THE RING IS WHOLE inthe pic I posted after the major explosion! Why are you trying to DISMISS that claim? I wonder.

And yes, Shep could have survived the explosion cause it was added just for the cool/wow factor... there is no physics behind that scene.

I ask again if you wanna stick to the theme - how do you explode something, with black smoke, in vacuum of space? Absolute zero and all that.
BTW to my mind there is not not enough amount of o2 in the presidum to justify that king of explosion. The explosion would be really small and die in a manner of seconds. Plus it would be a blue bulb of fire, if any. That what  no gravity and vacuum does.

Maybe you should watch the ending again with glasses on this time.

A pciture shows the Presidium ring is battered with a massive hole in its right side in the picture along with several holes along its edges, are you denying that? Not that it matters because as such a hundred times yet never adressed by you, there is nothing protecting Shepard in the area where he is. It is completely open to space with only a Mass Effect field keeping in the air.

Also the Crucible as it activates indeed pulls in some debris but it is very small causing minor explosions and nothing of it is near the wards, it is all pulled towards the gathering energy and then knocked away as the beam happens. Moments before that the big red wave of energy even pushes away any major debris and reapers near the Citadel, even vaporizing some of it if you look carefully.

There is simply no debris to hit the wards and certainly nothing of the size that would cause the miles wide explosions by the end.

Also if that massive explosion several miles across is so unreal, then what caused it? Can you answer that? Or are you saying it never happened? Because in that case we can add another point to the Indoctrination Theory.

Also I am certain  you are an absolute expert on space physics especially in regards to fire in space (not saying I am), you shouldnt happen to be attached to the ressearch division of Nasa experimenting with fire on a Space station under different conditions just this last Febuary, are you?

But even if the explosion is inaccurately portrayed that is the fault of those who made the vid, not the story writers, story writer who so far have gone to great leaps to insure Mass Effect followed many known physics theories in allmost all aspects. The most Space Magic (beyond the litteral endings) is the fact that they added Element Zero to explain how those physics theories were put to use.

Any Sci-fi series is gonna have a material or explanation like that, what makes it plausible is how well the "kicker" element is explained and how it relates to known physics theories and that is where Mass Effect has been quite plausible.

Modifié par Raistlin Majare 1992, 04 septembre 2012 - 01:16 .

[UrgentArchengel]

Leviathan helps prove my idea...which apperently turned out to be the Project X rumor. That's what happens when your out if the loop for a while. Now we just need wait for Omega to release, and we can see if it adds more to that ending.

[pseudonymic]

Ace7 wrote...

pseudonymic wrote...

by the end of the first hour, i couldn't bring myself to continue. to me, it has become very pointless to play anything that changes nothing of the ending

but the ending of the DLC is the most important part! How can you judge it if you didn't sit it out to the end? Even disregarding the info revealed in it, I thought it was very enjoyable. But then, I did actually play it which would be more enjoyable than watching someone else play on youtube.

i did finish. i should've worded that better. it was just an excruciating several days playthrough, as opposed to my typical devour-in-an-hour approach to all things mass effect to date. my interest just wasn't there, knowing this "middle" didn't justify the ending.

[BatmanTurian]

-he'd be burned to a crisp

- no, he's not harmed because the presidium is fine

-the presidium is engulfed in, at the most, a nuclear fusion explosion and at least, it's using the oxygen that is at the epicenter where Shepard is and the oxygen from the wards.

- no, go back to school

- I'm not the one claiming a living being survives a 79 gigaton explosion

-well you're wrong just because, don't throw numbers at me because the explosion can't be real

-but you just said IT can't be true, saying the explosion isn't real supports IT

- no, it's just not real because the video guys screwed up or something

- in a game where everyone pays atttention to real world physics down to the last electron?

-yes

and this is why I stopped arguing with Hangman.

Modifié par BatmanTurian, 04 septembre 2012 - 01:40 .

[GethPrimeMKII]

pseudonymic wrote...

Ace7 wrote...

pseudonymic wrote...

by the end of the first hour, i couldn't bring myself to continue. to me, it has become very pointless to play anything that changes nothing of the ending

but the ending of the DLC is the most important part! How can you judge it if you didn't sit it out to the end? Even disregarding the info revealed in it, I thought it was very enjoyable. But then, I did actually play it which would be more enjoyable than watching someone else play on youtube.

i did finish. i should've worded that better. it was just an excruciating several days playthrough, as opposed to my typical devour-in-an-hour approach to all things mass effect to date. my interest just wasn't there, knowing this "middle" didn't justify the ending.

Replay the trilogy without the "devour-in-an-hour" approach. You might be surprised what you find.

[hangmans tree]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
[...]

Hey. I was refering to the cutscene where the presidium circle is unscratched. After. The. Explosion.
No holes in it. The other picture of damaged Citadel is work of a 2D artist (both cases) not a render. Why the discrepancy? Because BW dosnt giva a **** about little details and whatever explanations gamers make up themselves. This whole ending is a mess, and there is no IT behind it in my opinion.
Here I had my glasses this time on...
http://youtu.be/Sukngb6r-W8?t=2m50s debris causes major explosions without actually destroying anything, the same goes for centre ring - no holes in it. If you will still insist on massive destruction and all the space magic heaving actual effect I quit. Either you see it or you are lying there is no place for interpretation of an image.
heres the ring for you.

Modifié par hangmans tree, 04 septembre 2012 - 01:57 .

[pseudonymic]

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

Replay the trilogy without the "devour-in-an-hour" approach. You might be surprised what you find.

oy...  am i really that unclear and open for misinterpretation? what i meant was that i had no actual desire to continue playing leviathan knowing that whatever i did would not affect RGB. learning about the reapers became silly to me. learning about AI starbrat - couldn't care less. what did that knowledge really do for my campaign? nothing, other than add 400 war asset points to my already 8,000+ score. 

i've played ME1 well over 8, maybe 10 times. ME2 a little less but still a lot and enough to get into the little nooks and crevices of the game. what i've been trying to communicate is that after ME3's fiasco of an ending - if taken literally -, my fascination for the series faded, and leviathan proved to make that a blunt statement.

i'll return to my original question though. what did you guys make of the fact that the entire dlc pack, if you will, was indoctrinated and shepard leaves as if nothing had happened but a nose bleed? and, you know. with a potential new ability.

[byne]

pseudonymic wrote...

i've played ME1 well over 8, maybe 10 times. ME2 a little less but still a lot and enough to get into the little nooks and crevices of the game

I've beaten both 30+ times and still find new stuff now and then.

i'll return to my original question though. what did you guys make of
the fact that the entire dlc pack, if you will, was indoctrinated and
shepard leaves as if nothing had happened but a nose bleed? and, you
know. with a potential new ability.

I think you're just assuming Shepard isnt indoctrinated. If Leviathan can just control anyone at any time, why doesnt it? 

Modifié par byne, 04 septembre 2012 - 01:56 .

[demersel]

Hi everyone. I take it nothing special happened while i was asleep.

[demersel]

Byne, have you seen my theory on the nature of reapers, and the A.I. that leviathans created?
it starts at page 739 and goes on until 745 in various posts.

[byne]

demersel wrote...

Byne, have you seen my theory on the nature of reapers, and the A.I. that leviathans created?
it starts at page 739 and goes on until 745 in various posts.

I shall check it out in a bit. Dont really have time to sift through 6 pages right now.

[BatmanTurian]

pseudonymic wrote...

GethPrimeMKII wrote...

Replay the trilogy without the "devour-in-an-hour" approach. You might be surprised what you find.

oy...  am i really that unclear and open for misinterpretation? what i meant was that i had no actual desire to continue playing leviathan knowing that whatever i did would not affect RGB. learning about the reapers became silly to me. learning about AI starbrat - couldn't care less. what did that knowledge really do for my campaign? nothing, other than add 400 war asset points to my already 8,000+ score. 

i've played ME1 well over 8, maybe 10 times. ME2 a little less but still a lot and enough to get into the little nooks and crevices of the game. what i've been trying to communicate is that after ME3's fiasco of an ending - if taken literally -, my fascination for the series faded, and leviathan proved to make that a blunt statement.

i'll return to my original question though. what did you guys make of the fact that the entire dlc pack, if you will, was indoctrinated and shepard leaves as if nothing had happened but a nose bleed? and, you know. with a potential new ability.

Fun Fact: Puzzle Theory is a companion of I.T. and predicts that Leviathan, and other SP DLC's being released within the skipping timeline during ME3 along with the MP ops in real time, could make the Refuse ending the actual ending, where we win through unconventional means through the allies and weapons gained in the upcoming SP DLC. It's quite fascinating and is kind of the same as Arian Dynas' assertion that SP and MP DLC and OPs is going to be released on a timeline and none of us has seen the true ending until the last SP DLC comes out.

[Rifneno]

hangmans tree wrote...

Why the discrepancy? Because BW dosnt giva a **** about little details and whatever explanations gamers make up themselves. This whole ending is a mess, and there is no IT behind it in my opinion.

Durrr dey bad righters.  me sure der noo otter xplaintin.  Ooo shiny!

[pseudonymic]

byne wrote...

I think you're just assuming Shepard isnt indoctrinated. If Leviathan can just control anyone at any time, why doesnt it? 

you're right, i am. but considering dlc packs by definition are optional, it can't be held pertinent to the main storyline, correct? thus, shepard goes on to attack cerberus and all of the IT hope is washed off with a powerpoint-like presentation of slides in the end. don't get me wrong, i support IT. all i'm saying is that to me, leviathan felt nothing but disconnected. and given everything else we were given, it's difficult not to take everything else at face value. which, in that case, why is it that one minute leviathan is this omni-like creature and the next it succums to shepard's plea? again, face value. and at face value, it just makes no sense. running around and seeing all of these people under the control of this being, seeing what this being does to the reapers on shore, but then not being able to "win" in the end is like saying 2+2=22.

[Dwailing]

hangmans tree wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
[...]

Hey. I was refering to the cutscene where the presidium circle is unscratched. After. The. Explosion.
No holes in it. The other picture of damaged Citadel is work of a 2D artist (both cases) not a render. Why the discrepancy? Because BW dosnt giva a **** about little details and whatever explanations gamers make up themselves. This whole ending is a mess, and there is no IT behind it in my opinion.
Here I had my glasses this time on...
http://youtu.be/Sukngb6r-W8?t=2m50s debris causes major explosions without actually destroying anything, the same goes for centre ring - no holes in it. If you will still insist on massive destruction and all the space magic heaving actual effect I quit. Either you see it or you are lying there is no place for interpretation of an image.
heres the ring for you.

I should point out that while there are a LOT of explosions, the lack of serious damage could be explained by the fact that the Citadel would take an absolutely MASSIVE ammount of energy to destroy.  And I should also point out that the great majority of the damage that comes from an explosive is kinetic energy from the shockwave.  Without enough air for the shockwave to propagate, the ammount of energy that the explosion would deliver would be severely reduced.  However, that still wouldn't explain how Shepard could survive the HEAT from the explosions.  There may not be enough kinetic energy to cause significant damage to the Citadel, but there would definitely be enough heat from the explosions that, since he's in the MIDDLE OF ONE OF THE FRAKKING BLASTS, he'd be burned to a crisp

Modifié par Dwailing, 04 septembre 2012 - 02:04 .

[Ace7]

pseudonymic wrote...

i'll return to my original question though. what did you guys make of the fact that the entire dlc pack, if you will, was indoctrinated and shepard leaves as if nothing had happened but a nose bleed? and, you know. with a potential new ability.

To be honest, I kind of have a fear that the ending should be taken literally along with the leviathan DLC but even though the DLC wasn't earth shattering, I am holding out and hoping that it's all leading up to something.

About your question, this would be interesting, if a little wild on the speculation side. By ability I presume you mean indoctination?

[BatmanTurian]

hangmans tree wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
[...]

Hey. I was refering to the cutscene where the presidium circle is unscratched. After. The. Explosion.
No holes in it. The other picture of damaged Citadel is work of a 2D artist (both cases) not a render. Why the discrepancy? Because BW dosnt giva a **** about little details and whatever explanations gamers make up themselves. This whole ending is a mess, and there is no IT behind it in my opinion.
Here I had my glasses this time on...
http://youtu.be/Sukngb6r-W8?t=2m50s debris causes major explosions without actually destroying anything, the same goes for centre ring - no holes in it. If you will still insist on massive destruction and all the space magic heaving actual effect I quit. Either you see it or you are lying there is no place for interpretation of an image.
heres the ring for you.

So your argument is a still that is milliseconds AFTER the explosion and that Bioware is **** at getting the details right. Whether the Presidium is fine is moot. Shepard isn't made of the material that the Presidium is. Presidium melts or outside is carbonized, but Shepard is toast, literally.

[byne]

pseudonymic wrote...

you're right, i am. but considering dlc packs by definition are optional, it can't be held pertinent to the main storyline, correct?

I dont know if I'd agree with that. It can be held as pertinent to the main story if BioWare wants it to be.

[Rifneno]

byne wrote...

pseudonymic wrote...

you're right, i am. but considering dlc packs by definition are optional, it can't be held pertinent to the main storyline, correct?

I dont know if I'd agree with that. It can be held as pertinent to the main story if BioWare wants it to be.

Indeed.  Arrival says hi.

[Ace7]

jeez, that explosion argument you guys are having really is getting old fast. for the sake of the thread please give it up!

[BatmanTurian]

Ace7 wrote...

pseudonymic wrote...

i'll return to my original question though. what did you guys make of the fact that the entire dlc pack, if you will, was indoctrinated and shepard leaves as if nothing had happened but a nose bleed? and, you know. with a potential new ability.

To be honest, I kind of have a fear that the ending should be taken literally along with the leviathan DLC but even though the DLC wasn't earth shattering, I am holding out and hoping that it's all leading up to something.

About your question, this would be interesting, if a little wild on the speculation side. By ability I presume you mean indoctination?

There are elements of Mass Effect 3 that are meant to have
non-literal interpretations. The hope is that these things provide
thought-provoking discussion about the themes of the story and the
motivations of characters. As such, we would prefer not to comment on
players’ interpretations of these elements, since it would ruin the
enjoyment of such discussion by suggesting there is a single, concrete
way of viewing them. Tully Ackland

[Restrider]

BatmanTurian wrote...

hangmans tree wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...
[...]

Hey. I was refering to the cutscene where the presidium circle is unscratched. After. The. Explosion.
No holes in it. The other picture of damaged Citadel is work of a 2D artist (both cases) not a render. Why the discrepancy? Because BW dosnt giva a **** about little details and whatever explanations gamers make up themselves. This whole ending is a mess, and there is no IT behind it in my opinion.
Here I had my glasses this time on...
http://youtu.be/Sukngb6r-W8?t=2m50s debris causes major explosions without actually destroying anything, the same goes for centre ring - no holes in it. If you will still insist on massive destruction and all the space magic heaving actual effect I quit. Either you see it or you are lying there is no place for interpretation of an image.
heres the ring for you.

So your argument is a still that is milliseconds AFTER the explosion and that Bioware is **** at getting the details right. Whether the Presidium is fine is moot. Shepard isn't made of the material that the Presidium is. Presidium melts or outside is carbonized, but Shepard is toast, literally.

Lol, how a bunch of bad@ass/@ass turians tries to convince this one stubborn quarian. lol

[BatmanTurian]

Ace7 wrote...

jeez, that explosion argument you guys are having really is getting old fast. for the sake of the thread please give it up!

No kidding it's getting old. That's why we wish he'd shut up. None of his arguments stand up to scrutiny.

[Ace7]

BatmanTurian wrote...

There are elements of Mass Effect 3 that are meant to have
non-literal interpretations. The hope is that these things provide
thought-provoking discussion about the themes of the story and the
motivations of characters. As such, we would prefer not to comment on
players’ interpretations of these elements, since it would ruin the
enjoyment of such discussion by suggesting there is a single, concrete
way of viewing them. Tully Ackland

Nice. Thanks Batman...