80611 réponses à ce sujet

[RavenEyry]

Rifneno wrote...

If it wasn't for the fact that this all started with a dead Reaper capital ship, I'd be very suspicious that Shepard didn't just accidentally stumble onto the Reaper's hidden masters.

As in... the leviathans are the intelligence behind them vendetta references, not the catalyst?

I find this idea... intruiging.

[DoomsdayDevice]

pseudonymic wrote...

but it remains nonsensical why the leviathan didn't wipe out the reapers immediately upon their turning and why they didn't destroy the AI. following their own presented timeline, if the intelligence turned and went to create harbinger, that was one reaper against the remaining 3 leviathans. seeing as how they took down the reaper like it was nothing and how they claim that "your civilization can be wiped with a single thought", it's silly to accept that they allowed for the expansion of the reapers without any interest attached.

I actually thought that the "your civilization can be wiped out with a single thought" was foreshadowing the end. As in, if Shepard goes "I want to control the Reapers!", or  "I choose synthesis!".

Modifié par DoomsdayDevice, 05 septembre 2012 - 03:21 .

[demersel]

Rifneno wrote...

If it wasn't for the fact that this all started with a dead Reaper capital ship, I'd be very suspicious that Shepard didn't just accidentally stumble onto the Reaper's hidden masters.

He may have done exactly that. As far as I can remember - the dead reaper didn't even factor into search patterns. 

[paxxton]

demersel wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

If it wasn't for the fact that this all started with a dead Reaper capital ship, I'd be very suspicious that Shepard didn't just accidentally stumble onto the Reaper's hidden masters.

He may have done exactly that. As far as I can remember - the dead reaper didn't even factor into search patterns. 

They were hidden, after all.

[paxxton]

RavenEyry wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

If it wasn't for the fact that this all started with a dead Reaper capital ship, I'd be very suspicious that Shepard didn't just accidentally stumble onto the Reaper's hidden masters.

As in... the leviathans are the intelligence behind them vendetta references, not the catalyst?

I find this idea... intruiging.

Yeah, intriguing but do you think they'd willingfully stop venturing in the sky just to have the cycle started? Or does the harvest is what "serving their needs" (aka strengthening them) means and they wanted to be harvested in an experiment to transcend their nature?

But all this is speculation. More probably, the Reapers have similar thinking to Leviathans because the Intelligence was developed by them (and educated) and the Reapers are based on their form.

Modifié par paxxton, 05 septembre 2012 - 04:00 .

[paxxton]

Where's everybody?

[Norlond]

Here

Everyone else (edit: except demersel )... doing stuff/sleeping?

Modifié par Norlond, 05 septembre 2012 - 04:27 .

[demersel]

Here.

[pseudonymic]

paxxton wrote...

Where's everybody?

pssst, lunch time for some. 

[paxxton]

Here and there. You guys post if you don't want this thread dead.

Modifié par paxxton, 05 septembre 2012 - 04:30 .

[Norlond]

I could repost something from yesterday, nothing really new to add right now, sry:P

Norlond wrote...

You ever noticed that sleep researchers
say that emotions in dreams are mainly negative? Besides from the
destroy epilogue, nothing in the end part is really positive
I checked this site and just scrolled down reading what emotions are listed, seems to confirm that

Quote from that site:
"Devotion
To
dream that you are showing your devotion to your beliefs, serves as a reminder
that nothing will be gained by deceit."
Kind of fits destroy [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]
"devotion to your beliefs" - destroying the reapers
"deceit" - control and synthesis, because noone wants Shepard to do that

Norlond wrote...

Found another one

"Confusion
To
dream that you are confused, may reflect your true confused state of mind and
the nonsensical events of your dream.  Isolate the single element in your
dream that is confusing to you and analyze the meaning of that particular
symbol. Alternatively, dreams of confusion signifies that you are being pulled
in opposite directions or do not know which viewpoint is right"

[pseudonymic]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

I actually thought that the "your civilization can be wiped out with a single thought" was foreshadowing the end. As in, if Shepard goes "I want to control the Reapers!", or  "I choose synthesis!".

which stands true, it definitely connects with the ending. but if we interpret that statement in a literal manner, that just amplifies the strength of leviathans to infinite notions, thus still leaving the question "why didn't they do away with the reapers" unanswered. one leviathan took down one reaper. 3, under that light, could've wiped harbinger and indoctrinated enough people/civilizations to destroy the AI - under their all-mighty claim.

however, as i typed this it occurred to me... if we could take that statement about the single thought as foreshadowing, it validates IT further as support for the theory that it all is happening in shepard's mind.

[paxxton]

Norlond wrote...

I could repost something from yesterday, nothing really new to add right now, sry:P

Norlond wrote...

You ever noticed that sleep researchers
say that emotions in dreams are mainly negative? Besides from the
destroy epilogue, nothing in the end part is really positive
I checked this site and just scrolled down reading what emotions are listed, seems to confirm that

Quote from that site:
"Devotion
To
dream that you are showing your devotion to your beliefs, serves as a reminder
that nothing will be gained by deceit."
Kind of fits destroy
"devotion to your beliefs" - destroying the reapers
"deceit" - control and synthesis, because noone wants Shepard to do that

Norlond wrote...

Found another one

"Confusion
To
dream that you are confused, may reflect your true confused state of mind and
the nonsensical events of your dream.  Isolate the single element in your
dream that is confusing to you and analyze the meaning of that particular
symbol. Alternatively, dreams of confusion signifies that you are being pulled
in opposite directions or do not know which viewpoint is right"

Interesting. There was a mention some time ago of a train sound in Control symbolizing losing control.

[Norlond]

Yes, that one

pseudonymic wrote...
however, as i typed this it
occurred to me... if we could take that statement about the single
thought as foreshadowing, it validates IT further as support for the
theory that it all is happening in shepard's mind.

+1

Modifié par Norlond, 05 septembre 2012 - 04:40 .

[paxxton]

Norlond wrote...

Yes, that one

pseudonymic wrote...
however, as i typed this it
occurred to me... if we could take that statement about the single
thought as foreshadowing, it validates IT further as support for the
theory that it all is happening in shepard's mind.

+1

+2 Yes, because "if we lose Shepard, humanity might well follow."

[Rifneno]

Could the train sound be because... welll... you know... it's a trainwreck?

[paxxton]

Rifneno wrote...

Could the train sound be because... welll... you know... it's a trainwreck?

Hmm... After all, he's tripping balls so it might as well be the cause.

Modifié par paxxton, 05 septembre 2012 - 04:50 .

[Norlond]

I'm not sure what's up with that train sound thing but yeah, Shepards mind is a train wreck if s/he chooses control or synthesis

[paxxton]

Norlond wrote...

I'm not sure what's up with that train sound thing but yeah, Shepards mind is a train wreck if s/he chooses control or synthesis

I think the train sound sends a contradictory message to what Control stands for, and that should raise suspicion.

Modifié par paxxton, 05 septembre 2012 - 04:56 .

[Rifneno]

Hmm. Well I meant that the endings are a trainwreck, but that works too.

[Big_Boss9]

Operation Vigilance's squad goal is ... interesting. I don't trust randoms to not use consumables. Solo time.

[paxxton]

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Operation Vigilance's squad goal is ... interesting. I don't trust randoms to not use consumables. Solo time.

Looks like another easy goal.

[Norlond]

Rifneno wrote...

Hmm. Well I meant that the endings are a trainwreck, but that works too.

Ooo, that's inadequate




From a literal perspective, the endings are worse than that 

*sigh* oh that sick humor..

Modifié par Norlond, 05 septembre 2012 - 05:05 .

[Rifneno]

That squad goal is dumber than Conrad Verner.

[Eryri]

Hi guys.

Going back to the "Indoctrination as an intelligent force in its own right" idea for a minute - it does fill in one of the plot holes in Leviathan. Namely that these supposedly hyper intelligent creatures were all surprised when the synthetic they created to stop the inevitable rebellion of synthetics - inevitably rebelled.

If the "Intelligence" Leviathan spoke of is the indoctrination mind virus, then it wouldn't be a traditional silicon-chip, gears and cogs synthetic as we would know it. It would be a sort of "meta-organic" using the brains of the thrall species, networked together with quantum entanglement, as the substrate for its computations.

It would be quite unlike the other "robotic" synthetics like the Geth equivalents of the time, and so the Leviathans wouldn't associate it with what they considered to be the dangerous sort of synthetics.

The Leviathans would believe themselves quite capable of controlling this sort of intelligence, as controlling organic minds is pretty much their bag. So when it evolved beyond them it came as a genuine shock.

Modifié par Eryri, 05 septembre 2012 - 05:20 .