80611 réponses à ce sujet

[Paulinesh]

The Crucible is rubbish. The united Galaxy would have defeated them in any case. People believed that Crucible is a weapon just because they needed something to believe in.

In fact it is obvious that the only true purpose of the device is make the synthesis, i.e. complete the Reapers' main objective.

The Crucible was invented by Reapers the same as the Citadel and the Mass relays. They just needed a person who would agree to jump into the beam. First they wanted this person to be Saren. But Shepard talked Saren out of it. And then they tried to indoctrinate Shepard. That's why the synthesis choice looks so appealing.

[spotlessvoid]

Paulinesh wrote...

The Crucible is rubbish. The united Galaxy would have defeated them in any case. People believed that Crucible is a weapon just because they needed something to believe in.

In fact it is obvious that the only true purpose of the device is make the synthesis, i.e. complete the Reapers' main objective.

The Crucible was invented by Reapers the same as the Citadel and the Mass relays. They just needed a person who would agree to jump into the beam. First they wanted this person to be Saren. But Shepard talked Saren out of it. And then they tried to indoctrinate Shepard. That's why the synthesis choice looks so appealing.

The thing about that is if thats all they wanted I doubt theywouldnt have found a way to get that done in a previous cycle. I do like the crucible as trap concept though

[Paulinesh]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

401 Kill wrote...

@BansheeOwnage- Nice catch with control also controlling EDI and the geth. I didn't even think of that possible outcome regarding that dicision. (However you spell dicision)

It's "decision" and thanks. I also caught something else about EDI, if you missed it.

EDI: Objective Symbology
I’m actually very surprised no one has brought this up before, (or at least not that I’ve seen) but whatever, I will.

So basically, the first time I played through ME3 I was all like:

“Huh. EDI’s visor is orange/red, and Eva’s was blue. That’s weird. Most colour symbology has the opposite colours. Whatever.”

After seeing the extended cut however, it became blatantly obvious. The colour of her visor reflects her goals – her objectives. Dr. Eva was in TIM’s control, and TIM wanted control. After EDI takes over the body, it changes to destroy’s colour. Likewise, in the EC, if you pick synthesis it changes to green, the colour of synthesis. What is so interesting about that though, is that you have to have beaten the game to notice it. Yet more evidence that Bioware is not bad at writing, or implementing subtleties. In my opinion, this also supports that EDI indeed favours destroy, even though it includes her death in a literal ending, since if she didn’t, why is it orange? Meaning, if the writers didn’t want her to favour destroy, why is it orange?

What do you all think of this?

A very good point. Thanks.

[Paulinesh]

spotlessvoid wrote...

The thing about that is if thats all they wanted I doubt theywouldnt have found a way to get that done in a previous cycle. I do like the crucible as trap concept though

Well, if Leviathans didn't know anything about the Crucible and it was being built during every cycle but never finished. Since it was actually finished only in our cycle (thanks to our efforts), I assume that Shepard is really an anomaly.

Plus the Catalyst/Intelligence mentioned that they'd tried the solution before but failed.

[SubAstris]

Paulinesh wrote...

The Crucible is rubbish. The united Galaxy would have defeated them in any case. People believed that Crucible is a weapon just because they needed something to believe in.

In fact it is obvious that the only true purpose of the device is make the synthesis, i.e. complete the Reapers' main objective.

The Crucible was invented by Reapers the same as the Citadel and the Mass relays. They just needed a person who would agree to jump into the beam. First they wanted this person to be Saren. But Shepard talked Saren out of it. And then they tried to indoctrinate Shepard. That's why the synthesis choice looks so appealing.

It is heavily implied that it is Crucible or bust in the game; I seem to remember a quote somewhere from BW saying that a conventional without it was impossible, although I could be wrong.

If so, what's the point of something like control? Do the Reapers not want that? If so, why does a clearly indoctrinated TIM want it then?

[RavenEyry]

It's pretty clear to me the crucible is either highly suspicious or an epitome of bad writing.

[Paulinesh]

SubAstris wrote...


It is heavily implied that it is Crucible or bust in the game; I seem to remember a quote somewhere from BW saying that a conventional without it was impossible, although I could be wrong.

If so, what's the point of something like control? Do the Reapers not want that? If so, why does a clearly indoctrinated TIM want it then?

Well if you ask the boy about rejecting Control option he would say something like "I'm also not very happy about the idea you replacing me".

So Control as they describe it is obviously impossible. The intelligence won't allow it  and Shepard will become a husk.

I was wondering about other thing. At the Cerberus base when you speak to Illusive man, he says that Shepard is not ready for the choice that lies ahead.

So what he was talking about? Why did he know about some kind of choice and Shepard didn't? May it be so that the Illusive man already passed the trial with the Intelligence?

[SubAstris]

Paulinesh wrote...

SubAstris wrote...


It is heavily implied that it is Crucible or bust in the game; I seem to remember a quote somewhere from BW saying that a conventional without it was impossible, although I could be wrong.

If so, what's the point of something like control? Do the Reapers not want that? If so, why does a clearly indoctrinated TIM want it then?

Well if you ask the boy about rejecting Control option he would say something like "I'm also not very happy about the idea you replacing me".

So Control as they describe it is obviously impossible. The intelligence won't allow it  and Shepard will become a husk.

I was wondering about other thing. At the Cerberus base when you speak to Illusive man, he says that Shepard is not ready for the choice that lies ahead.

So what he was talking about? Why did he know about some kind of choice and Shepard didn't? May it be so that the Illusive man already passed the trial with the Intelligence?

So if that's the real outcome, as you describe it, why wouldn't the Catalyst want it?

Regardless of the Crucible-Catalyst ending scene, Shepard does have a decision to make; go it alone, stick to his guns but potentially fall where all other cyclic races have done before, or fight with fire and sink to the level of the Reapers and be greedy. I think BW was just hinting that we have big choices to make in ME3, and we did depending on how you wanted the galaxy to be.

[spotlessvoid]

To me, synthesis is becoming a husk, and control is being indoctrinated.

[SubAstris]

RavenEyry wrote...

It's pretty clear to me the crucible is either highly suspicious or an epitome of bad writing.

*reviews the plot of ME2* Yeah it's the second one

[Paulinesh]

If I was writing the story. Shepard wouldn't go the Earth. She had a stealth ship and could board the Citadel with all the best commandos she gathered while the galactic fleet was distracting reapers in battle.
Synthesis is okay for me as long as Shepard drops someone else into the beam. For instance Illusive man is quite a candidate. :-)

[SubAstris]

Paulinesh wrote...

If I was writing the story. Shepard wouldn't go the Earth. She had a stealth ship and could board the Citadel with all the best commandos she gathered while the galactic fleet was distracting reapers in battle.
Synthesis is okay for me as long as Shepard drops someone else into the beam. For instance Illusive man is quite a candidate. :-)

"Battle for Earth" sounds better than "Battle for Unknown-Planets-We-Haven't-Heard-Of". EA thought that it would be much more enticing for newcomers to the game if they could fight for something they cared about

[Paulinesh]

SubAstris wrote...

Paulinesh wrote...

If I was writing the story. Shepard wouldn't go the Earth. She had a stealth ship and could board the Citadel with all the best commandos she gathered while the galactic fleet was distracting reapers in battle.
Synthesis is okay for me as long as Shepard drops someone else into the beam. For instance Illusive man is quite a candidate. :-)

"Battle for Earth" sounds better than "Battle for Unknown-Planets-We-Haven't-Heard-Of". EA thought that it would be much more enticing for newcomers to the game if they could fight for something they cared about

Newcomers-newcomers... who cares for them?<_<
In ME1 you could chose what planet Shepard was born on. And my Shepard wasn't from Earth.

Anyway I think battle for the Galaxy is quite more enticing than Earth :-)

[Ace7]

Paulinesh wrote...

If I was writing the story. Shepard wouldn't go the Earth. She had a stealth ship and could board the Citadel with all the best commandos she gathered while the galactic fleet was distracting reapers in battle.
Synthesis is okay for me as long as Shepard drops someone else into the beam. For instance Illusive man is quite a candidate. :-)

Why? I thought the whole point of synthesis was that Shepards DNA was the most desirable? The reapers would have commanded TIM to jump in himself if that's what they really wanted.

[Paulinesh]

Ace7 wrote...

Why? I thought the whole point of synthesis was that Shepards DNA was the most desirable? The reapers would have commanded TIM to jump in himself if that's what they really wanted.

I don't think that it was about Shepard's DNA. It was about DNA of a person who really believes that synthetics and organics can co-exist.

[RavenEyry]

Paulinesh wrote...

Ace7 wrote...

Why? I thought the whole point of synthesis was that Shepards DNA was the most desirable? The reapers would have commanded TIM to jump in himself if that's what they really wanted.

I don't think that it was about Shepard's DNA. It was about DNA of a person who really believes that synthetics and organics can co-exist.

Why would your opinions affect your DNA?

[Ace7]

Paulinesh wrote...

In ME1 you could chose what planet Shepard was born on. And my Shepard wasn't from Earth.

While that's a valid point, he is human afterall and Earth is the Human "homeworld". Why wouldn't he want to give up his life for it?

[Ace7]

Paulinesh wrote...

Ace7 wrote...

Why? I thought the whole point of synthesis was that Shepards DNA was the most desirable? The reapers would have commanded TIM to jump in himself if that's what they really wanted.

I don't think that it was about Shepard's DNA. It was about DNA of a person who really believes that synthetics and organics can co-exist.

But synthesis rules this co-existing out althogether. It's basically saying it will never happen, so we have now to meld the two together.
everyone from then on to infinity are carrying shepards super resilient DNA or part of it. I don't know how this is supposed to work for non-humans but hey it's Bioware's vision not mine. 

[Gwyphon]

I don't even understand this whole "co-existing" idea anyway. If synthetics and organics become the same thing, then they still need tools (screw drivers, calculators, computers, etc.), so wouldn't they just build a calculator which would then be old-time synthetic? Like the crazy magic beam altered DNA but it didn't alter materials, so you would just be building more tools that would want sentience as well so then you just have the whole synthetics vs organics (+geth) again. So it seems like it's just delaying the problem (well really all 3 endings seem to just be delaying this revolting organics vs synthetics business, but synthesis the least of all). From a practical stand point I just don't under stand how it helps us at ALL, except make the geth our snuggle buddies...

[Ace7]

Gwyphon wrote...

I don't even understand this whole "co-existing" idea anyway. If synthetics and organics become the same thing, then they still need tools (screw drivers, calculators, computers, etc.), so wouldn't they just build a calculator which would then be old-time synthetic? Like the crazy magic beam altered DNA but it didn't alter materials, so you would just be building more tools that would want sentience as well so then you just have the whole synthetics vs organics (+geth) again. So it seems like it's just delaying the problem (well really all 3 endings seem to just be delaying this revolting organics vs synthetics business, but synthesis the least of all). From a practical stand point I just don't under stand how it helps us at ALL, except make the geth our snuggle buddies...

bahaha, I immediately thought of this..........



But yeah, it's beyond our comprehension

Modifié par Ace7, 10 septembre 2012 - 09:48 .

[Gwyphon]

Ace7 wrote...

Gwyphon wrote...

I don't even understand this whole "co-existing" idea anyway. If synthetics and organics become the same thing, then they still need tools (screw drivers, calculators, computers, etc.), so wouldn't they just build a calculator which would then be old-time synthetic? Like the crazy magic beam altered DNA but it didn't alter materials, so you would just be building more tools that would want sentience as well so then you just have the whole synthetics vs organics (+geth) again. So it seems like it's just delaying the problem (well really all 3 endings seem to just be delaying this revolting organics vs synthetics business, but synthesis the least of all). From a practical stand point I just don't under stand how it helps us at ALL, except make the geth our snuggle buddies...

bahaha, I immediately thought of this..........

Ahah
That's pretty much it!

[Ace7]

:o:o

I just stumbled upon this......quite an interesting read, and created over three years ago.

Check out the top two "mysteries".

http://social.biowar.../index/708722/1  

Modifié par Ace7, 10 septembre 2012 - 09:54 .

[gunslinger_ruiz]

Ace7 wrote...

:o:o

I just stumbled upon this......quite an interesting read, and created over three years ago.

Check out the top two "mysteries".

http://social.biowar.../index/708722/1  

Good lord, the speculations started 3 years ago.... Bring it on Bioware!

[Icinix]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Ace7 wrote...

:o:o

I just stumbled upon this......quite an interesting read, and created over three years ago.

Check out the top two "mysteries".

http://social.biowar.../index/708722/1  

Good lord, the speculations started 3 years ago.... Bring it on Bioware!

"
Planet Altaaya - Once had an atmosphere.  It was violently and quickly stripped away by some unknown cataclysm of extreme magnitude.  What ever happened had to be BIG. "

...that race chose Destroy with low EMS.

Poor bastards.

Edit: Actually there are a couple that had their atmosphere stripped away....lots of poor bastards.

Modifié par Icinix, 10 septembre 2012 - 10:30 .

[Paulinesh]

Ace7 wrote...

:o:o

I just stumbled upon this......quite an interesting read, and created over three years ago.

Check out the top two "mysteries".

http://social.biowar.../index/708722/1  

That's big... big-big universe to speculate about