80611 réponses à ce sujet

[estebanus]

Norlond wrote...

Aloha people

is it just me or is Origin completely down?

Nope, just you.

EDIT: Finally on top again!

Modifié par estebanus, 11 septembre 2012 - 12:57 .

[Norlond]

estebanus wrote...

Norlond wrote...

Aloha people

is it just me or is Origin completely down?

Nope, just you.

EDIT: Finally on top again!

S***, can't even download Fifa 13 demo  *edit* nvm, it works now

Apparently, "the team had a big victory this weekend"
Is he talking about the Op or work on DLC?

Modifié par Norlond, 11 septembre 2012 - 01:04 .

[demersel]

Maybe the victory is that they took down origin from inside!

[Restrider]

Ace7 wrote...

uummm, a compliation list of primary/important 'unanswered' questions? would that be a big task do you reckon?

I'll try it.
This is a list of the most important questions that need to be answered (in my view):
1. Are the reapers still following the orders of their creator, the AI?
2. Are the AI and/or the reapers unshackled?
3. What is the purpose of the Crucible and who inveted it?
4. Where/When does the breath scene take place? 
The first two are needed to understand the intentions of the reapers. The answer to the third question is needed to further understand how the reapers' plan may unfold ("It's a trap!").
And the fourth question, if the answer is London, would pretty much confirm IT Dream (I know there are some guys out there, arguing that Shepard is some super hero being able to survive a 79 GT explosion, but please...).

Feel free to add more questions. I'd also like to see a short list of all the evidence that exists on IT (but only the blatantly obvious/important stuff), without going to much into detail. I guess many do not really read through the whole entirety of the thread and thus are not really aware of the sheer amount of the hints/evidence and rather start to dismiss IT, ignoring what already has been accomplished (Hell, even I am not aware of all the stuff that has been found and I am watching the docs and lurking/writing in the threads more than a month).

Modifié par Restrider, 11 septembre 2012 - 01:14 .

[pseudonymic]

Jusseb wrote...

So was TIM already planning not to kill Shepard but force him in the direction of Control?
I mean maybe he already knew that he couldn't control the reapers, but Shepard could?

Was that his plan?

add this to that - why shepard? what's so special about him/her that the reapers want him/her, and so does TIM?

non-ITers might claim that shepard is strong-willed, but come on. that makes mass effect sound like sookie stackhouse and the southern vampire mysteries. what, is shep going to turn out to be a faerie or something?

[DoomsdayDevice]

demersel wrote...

My mind is blown. 

  I was rewatching bioware pulse episodes, when something hit me. 

I'm sure we all can agree that ME3 is heavy on symbolism. 
So I was always buffled by a scene in the prologe, with Shepard and Anderson, while they make their way throught the rubble. And the moment Anderson catches Shepard. Why show this? They could have put anything there - why put this and nothing but this? I was never sure, as to what I as a player am supposed to carry out of this scene in relation to the story I'm about to be told (prologue is exposition, exposition is setting the general tone and rules the story is going to play out). What is the message? What is such a crucial piece of info, that it is this particular scene, and only this? 
 I summ up - i could not understand what is it telling me exactly, just like i was buflled by the dreams later in game. Sure they mean something, but what? What am i supposed to feel? 

And then i thought about it this way - what is literally happening? 

Shepard and Anderson are making their way through the mess and chaos and destruction created by reaper invasion, trying to figure out the way to go about thing from now on, and how to deal with this whole situation, to solve it. (that's in the actual dialoge). While doing so they come to a chasm, leading to a dark bottomless pit, with only a thin and treachereous ledge to to cross it. To cross it they need resolve, focus, peresecerance, patience, agility, caution and awerness. Shepard leads the way but is to hasty, and looses grip, and nealry falls into the pit, but at the last moment Anderson holds him, helps him maintain balance, and get his grip back - prevents him from falliing into a dark bottom. They then continue more carefully, and safely cross over which allows them to continue on their way, and fight some real fights.


That is what literally happens there!
And the best part of it - right before Shepard trips, there is a wide shot of the area, giving you a view from above - ands it turnes out the area where this dark bottomless pit, to cross which they require 
resolve, focus, peresecerance, patience, agility, caution and awerness - it has a name! On the wall right across the chasm - there is a huge Number 3 in a distinct ME3 title style!

Here - i made a screen shot of it - 


and here is the link to the source video, you can find it at 5.13 mark there.
masseffect.bioware.com/videos/video/1ebd676a117f893ecdf71eded065820b

Edit: Not to mention that this whole scene has an overall "this time i was there to catch you, but next time i might not be around to do it, so you'll have to watch your step." vibe to it.  

Haven't entirely caught up with the thread, but I like this train of thought. I always wondered what Anderson meant when Shepard says: "I owe you one." and he goes "...more than one."

What is he referring to there, exactly? Could he be foreshadowing the end?

[pseudonymic]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

Haven't entirely caught up with the thread, but I like this train of thought. I always wondered what Anderson meant when Shepard says: "I owe you one." and he goes "...more than one."

What is he referring to there, exactly? Could he be foreshadowing the end?

i think that has more to do with the fact that shepard is a war criminal and anderson keeps him/her out of trouble, seemingly - at least i interpreted it that way based on their introductory conversation prior to the reaper attack.

[DoomsdayDevice]

Also, when playing Leviathan, at some point I went into the cockpit and got this one line of dialogue from EDI that I didn't understand. She's saying "Leviathan's shackles are weird..." and then something else, that I forgot. What could she be talking about? I don't remember anything or anyone mentioning shackles in the DLC.

Does anybody know?

[Jusseb]

pseudonymic wrote...

Jusseb wrote...

So was TIM already planning not to kill Shepard but force him in the direction of Control?
I mean maybe he already knew that he couldn't control the reapers, but Shepard could?

Was that his plan?

add this to that - why shepard? what's so special about him/her that the reapers want him/her, and so does TIM?

non-ITers might claim that shepard is strong-willed, but come on. that makes mass effect sound like sookie stackhouse and the southern vampire mysteries. what, is shep going to turn out to be a faerie or something?

Shepard is ofcourse special, but i doubt he's the only special person in that big galaxy. Maybe TIM was expecting something of that tech which they rebuild Shepard with? Was it Reaper tech? 

I'm still expecting something to come out of that.

[Restrider]

pseudonymic wrote...

Jusseb wrote...

So was TIM already planning not to kill Shepard but force him in the direction of Control?
I mean maybe he already knew that he couldn't control the reapers, but Shepard could?

Was that his plan?

add this to that - why shepard? what's so special about him/her that the reapers want him/her, and so does TIM?

non-ITers might claim that shepard is strong-willed, but come on. that makes mass effect sound like sookie stackhouse and the southern vampire mysteries. what, is shep going to turn out to be a faerie or something?

I'll try to understand this.
TIM knows he cannot control the reapers and in fact he is being controlled by the reapers (as Starbrat confirms later). Because of that knowledge and Shepard's specialty, TIM wants to control Shepard and through Shepard the reapers, which already are controlling TIM? If I am getting this correctly, this is circular logic.
The arrows show, who is in control of whom:
...->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->...
If I'm wrong, feel free to explain it to me.

[Home run MF]

Inspired by Banshee I digged in the Synthesis speech and I found something you might like  

Sovereign speech on Virmire :
"Rudimentary creatures of blood and flesh, you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding. There is a realm of existence, so far beyond your own you cannot even imagine it. I, am beyond your comprehension. I, am Sovereign."

One of the lines in EDI's speech:
"As the line between synthetic and organic disappears, we may transcend mortality itself...
..to reach a level of existence I cannot even imagine."

[demersel]

Home run MF wrote...

Inspired by Banshee I digged in the Synthesis speech and I found something you might like  

Sovereign speech on Virmire :
"Rudimentary creatures of blood and flesh, you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding. There is a realm of existence, so far beyond your own you cannot even imagine it. I, am beyond your comprehension. I, am Sovereign."

One of the lines in EDI's speech:
"As the line between synthetic and organic disappears, we may transcend mortality itself...
..to reach a level of existence I cannot even imagine."

And that is exactly what Omega point is.

[Jusseb]

Restrider wrote...

pseudonymic wrote...

Jusseb wrote...

So was TIM already planning not to kill Shepard but force him in the direction of Control?
I mean maybe he already knew that he couldn't control the reapers, but Shepard could?

Was that his plan?

add this to that - why shepard? what's so special about him/her that the reapers want him/her, and so does TIM?

non-ITers might claim that shepard is strong-willed, but come on. that makes mass effect sound like sookie stackhouse and the southern vampire mysteries. what, is shep going to turn out to be a faerie or something?

I'll try to understand this.
TIM knows he cannot control the reapers and in fact he is being controlled by the reapers (as Starbrat confirms later). Because of that knowledge and Shepard's specialty, TIM wants to control Shepard and through Shepard the reapers, which already are controlling TIM? If I am getting this correctly, this is circular logic.
The arrows show, who is in control of whom:
...->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->...
If I'm wrong, feel free to explain it to me.

The fact is why would TIM say "I don't see Shepard at a totall loss just yet" (or something like that) in the conversation with Kai leng. You can hear this conversation on the Cerberus HQ Base mission. 

At that point he has plans for Shepard. Something is going on, but what was his intention? 

And if the Reapers were controlling TIM, then you can cut TIM out of that cicular logic, because TIM = Reapers. 

But did he really lose all control at the end? Or was this his plan and not that of the Reapers?

Modifié par Jusseb, 11 septembre 2012 - 01:27 .

[pseudonymic]

Restrider wrote...

I'd also like to see a short list of all the evidence that exists on IT (but only the blatantly obvious/important stuff), without going to much into detail.

i'll start in a game-events sequence the best i remember... no EC, no leviathan:

- child running into a locked door
 - reaper noise when shepard talks to kid 
- ventboy appearing alive after explosion
- no one noticing/helping child when he climbs on alliance transporter
- warning signs wherever child appeared
- dream sequences w/ oily shadows, whispers
- shepard complains of headaches
- indoctrination codex entry
- white fade in/outs whenever something dream-like occurs
- anderson being nowhere near shepard during the beam run
- harbinger not shooting down the normandy
- remark about the citadel looking like collector's base (pulled from memory)
- shepard hearing radio comm even though his/her armor is gone
- ashley and kaiden bodies only throughout citadel
- 1 m1 
-  anderson being ahead of shepard even though you never see him
- shepard bleeding from the same place he/she supposedly shot anderson
- mysterious elevator ride up to the catalyst
- control cut scene associated with TIM, destroy with anderson
- gun changing before and after the destroy explosion
- breath scene in destroy, official shepard lives
- saren advocating synthesis
- TIM advocating control 
- Coat's corpse on the Citadel (only seen with flycam though)
- "SO BE IT" (Starbrat obviously siding with reapers)
- Catalyst/AI using image of the kid (so they are messing with your mind, even in a literal POV) 
- the discussion between TIM and Anderson being directed to Shepard (eye contact confirms this)
- Arrival DLC (Object Rho and especially dialogue with Harbinger saying sth like "Your mind will be ours!")
- the beam not killing Shepard, though it certainly is able to oneshot gunships 

please add on, y'all.

Modifié par pseudonymic, 11 septembre 2012 - 01:49 .

[DoomsdayDevice]

The unlimited ammo really shouldn't be there.

It's simply unlimited so you don't end up at the tube with an empty gun.

Most important point of all IT:

- Saren advocating synthesis
- TIM advocating control

Modifié par DoomsdayDevice, 11 septembre 2012 - 01:34 .

[pseudonymic]

Jusseb wrote...

Restrider wrote...

I'll try to understand this.
TIM knows he cannot control the reapers and in fact he is being controlled by the reapers (as Starbrat confirms later). Because of that knowledge and Shepard's specialty, TIM wants to control Shepard and through Shepard the reapers, which already are controlling TIM? If I am getting this correctly, this is circular logic.
The arrows show, who is in control of whom:
...->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->...
If I'm wrong, feel free to explain it to me.

The fact is why would TIM say "I don't see Shepard at a totall loss just yet" (or something like that) in the conversation with Kai leng. You can hear this conversation on the Cerberus HQ Base mission. 

At that point he has plans for Shepard. Something is going on, but what was his intention? 

And if the Reapers were controlling TIM, then you can cut TIM out of that cicular logic, because TIM = Reapers. 

But did he really lose all control at the end? Or was this his plan and not that of the Reapers?

that's why i find it hard to accept that that was the real TIM instead of shepard pulling from memory. while it has never been answered what it was that TIM/miranda did to shepard exactly, if we go by the circular logic, it does make it so that the reapers were already in charge and indirectly controlling shepard. then why would harbinger keep trying, and why would events have escalated to the beam run instead of just deviating shepard in another direction? from a literal standpoint, it could've only meant TIM had to be resisting indoctrination... which is probably the least likely case.

[pseudonymic]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

The unlimited ammo really shouldn't be there.

It's simply unlimited so you don't end up at the tube with an empty gun.

Most important point of all IT:

- Saren advocating synthesis
- TIM advocating control

added, switched ammo for harbinger not shooting the normandy.

[demersel]

 Ha-ha! Guys! 
Check it out!
Project-X! Get it? 

www.ign.com/articles/2012/09/11/obsidian-teasing-mysterious-project-x

[Restrider]

- Coat's corpse on the Citadel (only seen with flycam though)
- "SO BE IT" (Starbrat obviously siding with reapers)
- Catalyst/AI using image of the kid (so they are messing with your mind, even in a literal POV)
to add some more.

[pseudonymic]

Restrider wrote...

- Coat's corpse on the Citadel (only seen with flycam though)
- "SO BE IT" (Starbrat obviously siding with reapers)
- Catalyst/AI using image of the kid (so they are messing with your mind, even in a literal POV)
to add some more.

added!

[Restrider]

Jusseb wrote...

Restrider wrote...

pseudonymic wrote...

Jusseb wrote...

So was TIM already planning not to kill Shepard but force him in the direction of Control?
I mean maybe he already knew that he couldn't control the reapers, but Shepard could?

Was that his plan?

add this to that - why shepard? what's so special about him/her that the reapers want him/her, and so does TIM?

non-ITers might claim that shepard is strong-willed, but come on. that makes mass effect sound like sookie stackhouse and the southern vampire mysteries. what, is shep going to turn out to be a faerie or something?

I'll try to understand this.
TIM knows he cannot control the reapers and in fact he is being controlled by the reapers (as Starbrat confirms later). Because of that knowledge and Shepard's specialty, TIM wants to control Shepard and through Shepard the reapers, which already are controlling TIM? If I am getting this correctly, this is circular logic.
The arrows show, who is in control of whom:
...->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->...
If I'm wrong, feel free to explain it to me.

The fact is why would TIM say "I don't see Shepard at a totall loss just yet" (or something like that) in the conversation with Kai leng. You can hear this conversation on the Cerberus HQ Base mission. 

At that point he has plans for Shepard. Something is going on, but what was his intention? 

And if the Reapers were controlling TIM, then you can cut TIM out of that cicular logic, because TIM = Reapers. 

But did he really lose all control at the end? Or was this his plan and not that of the Reapers?

Ah, so TIM had plans for Shepard before being controlled by the reapers. Later the reapers adopted TIM's idea, after assuming control? Well that could be true, but since Arrival and the dialogue with Harbinger, I think it is safe to assume that the reapers already had this kind of agenda planned.

[Jusseb]

pseudonymic wrote...

Jusseb wrote...

Restrider wrote...

I'll try to understand this.
TIM knows he cannot control the reapers and in fact he is being controlled by the reapers (as Starbrat confirms later). Because of that knowledge and Shepard's specialty, TIM wants to control Shepard and through Shepard the reapers, which already are controlling TIM? If I am getting this correctly, this is circular logic.
The arrows show, who is in control of whom:
...->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->Reapers->TIM->Shepard->...
If I'm wrong, feel free to explain it to me.

The fact is why would TIM say "I don't see Shepard at a totall loss just yet" (or something like that) in the conversation with Kai leng. You can hear this conversation on the Cerberus HQ Base mission. 

At that point he has plans for Shepard. Something is going on, but what was his intention? 

And if the Reapers were controlling TIM, then you can cut TIM out of that cicular logic, because TIM = Reapers. 

But did he really lose all control at the end? Or was this his plan and not that of the Reapers?

that's why i find it hard to accept that that was the real TIM instead of shepard pulling from memory. while it has never been answered what it was that TIM/miranda did to shepard exactly, if we go by the circular logic, it does make it so that the reapers were already in charge and indirectly controlling shepard. then why would harbinger keep trying, and why would events have escalated to the beam run instead of just deviating shepard in another direction? from a literal standpoint, it could've only meant TIM had to be resisting indoctrination... which is probably the least likely case.

I always found TIM quite intelligent and he was also very carefull with himself. Always by himself, never out in the open. He knew alot about the Reapers and knew the risks of becoming Indoctrinated. 

So how did he become Indoctrinated and how did he fall for that? Was it his lust for power? Was is the Reaper tech that infected him?

He knew the risks of Reaper tech, so why did he take the risk? It's just all to convenient...

[Paulinesh]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...

The unlimited ammo really shouldn't be there.

It's simply unlimited so you don't end up at the tube with an empty gun.

Most important point of all IT:

- Saren advocating synthesis
- TIM advocating control

I agree with this. There are 3 most charismatic and powerful people in the Galaxy who were in contact with the Reapers: Saren, TIM and Shepard. 

All of them aimed at different things: Synthesis, Control, Destroy.

I have some more questions to add to the list.

Why after you select Destroy, the Normandy is damaged, but other ships in the fleet not? You can see them departuring in the finale movie?

How did Normandy managed to take off after repairs if you destroyed EDI with Destroy option? The ship was only possible to operate with her on board, that's how Cerberus designed it.

[Restrider]

pseudonymic wrote...

added!

Right, I came up with more stuff:
- the discussion between TIM and Anderson being directed to Shepard (eye contact confirms this)
- Arrival DLC (Object Rho and especially dialogue with Harbinger saying sth like "Your mind will be ours!")
- Beam run and Harbinger saying sth like "Serve us!"
- the beam not killing Shepard, though it certainly is able to oneshot gunships

[SubAstris]

pseudonymic wrote...

Jusseb wrote...

So was TIM already planning not to kill Shepard but force him in the direction of Control?
I mean maybe he already knew that he couldn't control the reapers, but Shepard could?

Was that his plan?

add this to that - why shepard? what's so special about him/her that the reapers want him/her, and so does TIM?

non-ITers might claim that shepard is strong-willed, but come on. that makes mass effect sound like sookie stackhouse and the southern vampire mysteries. what, is shep going to turn out to be a faerie or something?

He has always been the one who has stood up against the Reapers when everyone thought they were a myth. The one who knows how their true nature, and the only one who has the ability to unite the disputing alien races to take on the Reapers. No other person in the galaxy comes close to his symbolic and practical importance