351 réponses à ce sujet

[Core_Commander]

The Waffle Cat wrote...

Screens is something different than a gold solo... Nice try thou as well I dont want this gun to be nerfed so I honestly don't know why you tell me Bull**** I already know:blush:

I'm pointing out that the guy who said : hurr durr it is still good at long range is wrong as the guy in the video is constantly in CQC range and hes using snap freeze to freeze the damn mobs and spamming energy drain for staggers this + CQC makes phantoms and all other mook easy kills. 

Is this so hard to understand for some of you? Also you thinking I want this gun to be nerfed is just wow

I never said you want this gun nerfed. It's pretty obvious that it's the opposite.

I don't represent any party or group, so I wouldn't know about what "some of you" might think. I just find it funny how people in this thread are showering the OP with praises about how "awesome" and thought out his post was while it's just dry theorycrafting, not even skimming the actual problem (the reason all classes use Piranha and some classes make it utterly broken are weight and DPS, not the range or lack thereof).

Phantoms neither freeze nor stagger to Paladin's ranged abilities, by the way, and it takes four energy drains to strip their shields. And I already said that any class can get into CQC easily, or enemies will do it for them (the only enemies that don't rush are Nemeses, Rocket Troopers and huge-ass Ravagers, the rest enter Piranha's killzone all the time). The spread isn't as huge of an issue as people make it out to be on the forums, as any actual gameplay video readily demonstrates.

[Zero132132]

FearTheCompany wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Man, for such a "terribly ineffective" weapon you sure do see it a lot. And I seem to score really well with it too. Weird. Maybe I'm just that awesome.

Are you always on Glacier? 
Are you always using it on a Turian Soldier, Geth Infiltrator, or Destroyer? Because that would explain it. Bring it to Hydra or Rio with a Vorcha Sentinel, tell me how that goes.

Why would you use the weapon on a less effective class?

No. Which is exactly the point. The weapon is good on very specific builds. Nerfing a weapon because it's good when you do absolutely everything you can to exploit its benefits is just stupid. In this case, that means using the right class at short range, attaching a smart choke, and using the right gear and consumables. 
I don't get why nerfers hate synergy so damned much. Why is it wrong for a gun to be good when used properly? Why is it better for the game to be dumbed down, so that there are no combinations that are highly effective?

[FearTheCompany]

The Waffle Cat wrote...

FearTheCompany wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...
You're shooting a shotgun at 30 meters expecting accuracy?
The only gun that can is the crusader the GPS.
Bogus.

I expected a lot of things - hitting targets was not one of them. It does however seem that a lot of people on these forums give this gun much more credit than due is, hence i proved that it is not accurate at mid or long range.

That doesn't matter. It is a close range shotgun that is overpowered and it will meet its doom.

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

You don't even have to be that close to use it. Just use a shield mod if you die to much.(Not applying directly towards you)

Modifié par FearTheCompany, 31 juillet 2012 - 12:13 .

[ABjerre]

The Waffle Cat wrote...

FearTheCompany wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...
You're shooting a shotgun at 30 meters expecting accuracy?
The only gun that can is the crusader the GPS.
Bogus.

I expected a lot of things - hitting targets was not one of them. It does however seem that a lot of people on these forums give this gun much more credit than due is, hence i proved that it is not accurate at mid or long range.

That doesn't matter. It is a close range shotgun that is overpowered and it will meet its doom.

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

Yeah i was going to say something like that, but The Waffle Cat beat me to it. In the fact that you need to get so close with it, as i said before, you risk gimping the team if you dont play a class that was designed for it.

Again, the class - not the weapon. And god (or game designers) phorbid that weapon dependant classes would ever become effective with... weapons.

[DivineAtropos]

The Waffle Cat wrote...

FearTheCompany wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...
You're shooting a shotgun at 30 meters expecting accuracy?
The only gun that can is the crusader the GPS.
Bogus.

I expected a lot of things - hitting targets was not one of them. It does however seem that a lot of people on these forums give this gun much more credit than due is, hence i proved that it is not accurate at mid or long range.

That doesn't matter. It is a close range shotgun that is overpowered and it will meet its doom.

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

I use a Piranha on my Shadow to great effect. Works great to finish off pyros if my Shadow Strike doesn't kill them, and it gives me some sort of usefulness against bosses. Primes are a joke. And I play tactically so as not to ever go down outside of some crazy happenings.

And don't forget the Kroguard, you can comfortably get close to anything that's not a charged up Banshee without fear of dying.

[Atrumitos]

FearTheCompany wrote...

Why would you use the weapon on a less effective class?

While the demolishers grenades are fearsome, once I run out I doubt the AI will stop shooting at me because I have boobs.

It's great at close range since it usually takes an enemy down in one clip. Usually not before the enemy takes you down but if you get a lucky stagger...

[BoomDynamite]

They should just take away the buff they issued.

[deathgazer2]

TehPwnzor52 wrote...

The main thing is that the piranha doesn't need a stat nerf. It just needs a weight increase so that it's mainly on weapon focused classes like it should be, instead of everyone running around with it.

This.

[BouncyFrag]

Based on this fine work, I demand a buff! Agreed?

[Zero132132]

DivineAtropos wrote...

The Waffle Cat wrote...

FearTheCompany wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...
You're shooting a shotgun at 30 meters expecting accuracy?
The only gun that can is the crusader the GPS.
Bogus.

I expected a lot of things - hitting targets was not one of them. It does however seem that a lot of people on these forums give this gun much more credit than due is, hence i proved that it is not accurate at mid or long range.

That doesn't matter. It is a close range shotgun that is overpowered and it will meet its doom.

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

I use a Piranha on my Shadow to great effect. Works great to finish off pyros if my Shadow Strike doesn't kill them, and it gives me some sort of usefulness against bosses. Primes are a joke. And I play tactically so as not to ever go down outside of some crazy happenings.

And don't forget the Kroguard, you can comfortably get close to anything that's not a charged up Banshee without fear of dying.

Or phantoms. But the Kroguard still does substantially better with the Reegar, so I don't know why you'd bother with the Piranha.

[Asebstos]

Zero132132 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Man, for such a "terribly ineffective" weapon you sure do see it a lot. And I seem to score really well with it too. Weird. Maybe I'm just that awesome.

Are you always on Glacier? 
Are you always using it on a Turian Soldier, Geth Infiltrator, or Destroyer? Because that would explain it. Bring it to Hydra or Rio with a Vorcha Sentinel, tell me how that goes.

Ok. Since you're also on Xbox would you care to join? Rio/U/Gold?

[DivineAtropos]

Zero132132 wrote...

DivineAtropos wrote...

The Waffle Cat wrote...

FearTheCompany wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

Mgamerz wrote...
You're shooting a shotgun at 30 meters expecting accuracy?
The only gun that can is the crusader the GPS.
Bogus.

I expected a lot of things - hitting targets was not one of them. It does however seem that a lot of people on these forums give this gun much more credit than due is, hence i proved that it is not accurate at mid or long range.

That doesn't matter. It is a close range shotgun that is overpowered and it will meet its doom.

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

I use a Piranha on my Shadow to great effect. Works great to finish off pyros if my Shadow Strike doesn't kill them, and it gives me some sort of usefulness against bosses. Primes are a joke. And I play tactically so as not to ever go down outside of some crazy happenings.

And don't forget the Kroguard, you can comfortably get close to anything that's not a charged up Banshee without fear of dying.

Or phantoms. But the Kroguard still does substantially better with the Reegar, so I don't know why you'd bother with the Piranha.

Phantoms aren't a big deal either. Bio charge generally staggers them (except for those rare times where they shrug it off) and you can finish them with the gun of choice. I used to use the Reegar but I found the lack of ammo/armor damage to be a problem. I've scored higher (I know, points don't matter, just using it for reference) since switching to the Piranha so it's more effective for me.

I don't really play the Kroguard anymore anyway because it's an instant win button on gold, so I rock other classes these days.

[ABjerre]

Core_Commander wrote...
I don't represent any party or group, so I wouldn't know about what "some of you" might think. I just find it funny how people in this thread are showering the OP with praises about how "awesome" and thought out his post was while it's just dry theorycrafting, not even skimming the actual problem (the reason all classes use Piranha and some classes make it utterly broken are weight and DPS, not the range or lack thereof).

I'd like to correct you on that one - i hate theory crafting, so i did the opposite: I opened a game and looked at what it actually does instead of pulling numbers and charts out of a hat.

The problem i am trying to adress here is not its efficiency on sertain classes, or lack thereof - it is that sertain people on these forums aree giving this gun much more credit that it is due, effectively creating a negative mindset towards it. "You can snipe with it", "You destroy everything on any difficulty and any class" and so on.

I think that i proved that in order to "destroy everthing" you need to be very close to the target, which only a few classes are designed for, also that only sertain classes can use the gun outside close range, and even they cant come close to sniping with it.

[Seargent_Braken]

The Waffle Cat wrote...

joker_jack wrote...

The Waffle Cat wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

ABjerre wrote...

Asebstos wrote...
But if its so "terribly ineffective" why is it "your baby"? Clearly its a bad and situational gun, as the OP points out.

I never said that it was a bad gun.

I did however say that it is only effective under startain circumstances and i presented evidence to support my claim. If you disagree, i would appreciate it if you would care do the same.

I can't record vids, but here's a vid of a dude Soloing Gold with it on a character that doesn't get any inherent accuracy bonuses. Definitely has no issue killing things that aren't right in his face, especially not Altases. It just happens that things that are in his face die even faster.

 

Wow man, easiest faction and a freeze which owns mook troops combined with him going CQC range.

Interesting video got something else that doesnt screws up the logic you are trying to point out?

Trying to change the mind of an idiot is impossible to do once their mind is set. Just look at the Westboro Church.

Those people really got the mental abilities of monkeys.

Now that's just downright insulting to monkeys.

Anyway, back on topic:

Thanks for posting this, OP. Though, sadly, people will STILL claim it's great at "medium to long range" despite this. <_<

Modifié par Seargent_Braken, 31 juillet 2012 - 12:25 .

[Zero132132]

Asebstos wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Man, for such a "terribly ineffective" weapon you sure do see it a lot. And I seem to score really well with it too. Weird. Maybe I'm just that awesome.

Are you always on Glacier? 
Are you always using it on a Turian Soldier, Geth Infiltrator, or Destroyer? Because that would explain it. Bring it to Hydra or Rio with a Vorcha Sentinel, tell me how that goes.

Ok. Since you're also on Xbox would you care to join? Rio/U/Gold?

Sure. I kinda want to bring a stupidtastic class, though. Will you be pissed if I want to try Drellguarding on gold again? I got a bit rusty for a while, but it was always the funnest for me. Just hope to hell we don't get the Geth...

[Mythiic]

Great post.

I'm sure this won't stop the nerfducks since they don't listen to reason, but still a great post.

Nice job OP.

[ABjerre]

Zero132132 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Man, for such a "terribly ineffective" weapon you sure do see it a lot. And I seem to score really well with it too. Weird. Maybe I'm just that awesome.

Are you always on Glacier? 
Are you always using it on a Turian Soldier, Geth Infiltrator, or Destroyer? Because that would explain it. Bring it to Hydra or Rio with a Vorcha Sentinel, tell me how that goes.

Ok. Since you're also on Xbox would you care to join? Rio/U/Gold?

Sure. I kinda want to bring a stupidtastic class, though. Will you be pissed if I want to try Drellguarding on gold again? I got a bit rusty for a while, but it was always the funnest for me. Just hope to hell we don't get the Geth...

I know that Asbestos cant record vids, so can someone else please record this fight? I really want to see it.

[DVS27t]

Asebstos wrote...

Mason IIv wrote...

Good job OP, I don't want to see this gun get ner... re-balanced. Its my baby!

But if its so "terribly ineffective" why is it "your baby"? Clearly its a bad and situational gun, as the OP points out.

The game gives many options to spec out guns in an effort to make them more effective.  This creates a gun vs. build argument.  If you do not believe me, I would love to see you make a video running the piranha with no attachments or consumables/gear on a power drell adept using only your weapon, on U,U,P.  If the gun is as you say it is, this should be a cake walk for you.

[Core_Commander]

The Waffle Cat wrote...

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

On Gold, reliably? Assuming even a tiniest bit of cover that all maps possess?

Any Infiltrator (cloak)
Any Soldier besides turian (damage reduction, grenade cover, extra speed of krogan and batarian, ballistic blades)
Asari Justicar (reave spam), N7 Fury (www.youtube.com/watch - that's a 6/6/6/4/4 build with no mods, mere 700 hp/shields with Piranha)
Any Sentinel (shield and power spam)
Vanguards (duh)

Do you not play the game, or are just a horrible player who cannot imagine getting into CQC without "dieing"?

Right back at you about "idiotic statements". Armchair gamers on these forums...

ABjerre wrote...

I'd like to correct you on that one - i hate theory crafting, so i did the opposite: I opened a game and looked at what it actually does instead of pulling numbers and charts out of a hat.

The problem i am trying to adress here is not its efficiencyon sertain classes, or lack thereof - it is that sertain people on these forums aree giving this gun much more credit that it is due, effectively creating a negative mindset towards it. "You can snipe with it", "You destroy everything on any difficulty and any class" and so on.

I think that i proved that in order to "destroy everthing" you need to bevery close to the target, which only a few classes are designed for, also that only sertain classes can use the gun outside close range, and even they cant come close to sniping with it.

Fair enough. I however would like to point out that "You destroy everything on any difficulty and any class" is a gross exaggeration (don't know if on your part, or is it an actual quote).

The issue here, in my opinion, is that with the way ME3 MP works (enemies keep rushing into close range on their own volition, where the gun excels) you end up with a few classes that indeed destroy everything, and nearly all others for whom Piranha is the best option considering its firepower, weight and not-so-shabby range (seriously, "broad side of the barn"?), considering that it is a shotgun after all.

Modifié par Core_Commander, 31 juillet 2012 - 12:37 .

[Zero132132]

ABjerre wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Man, for such a "terribly ineffective" weapon you sure do see it a lot. And I seem to score really well with it too. Weird. Maybe I'm just that awesome.

Are you always on Glacier? 
Are you always using it on a Turian Soldier, Geth Infiltrator, or Destroyer? Because that would explain it. Bring it to Hydra or Rio with a Vorcha Sentinel, tell me how that goes.

Ok. Since you're also on Xbox would you care to join? Rio/U/Gold?

Sure. I kinda want to bring a stupidtastic class, though. Will you be pissed if I want to try Drellguarding on gold again? I got a bit rusty for a while, but it was always the funnest for me. Just hope to hell we don't get the Geth...

I know that Asbestos cant record vids, so can someone else please record this fight? I really want to see it.

Personal testimony isn't good enough? I can't record.

Probably shouldn't have said VoSent, since he's one of those that's built for CQC, and bloodlust gives a speed bonus, but I didn't want to say something like "Asari Adept" and see warp/throw spam killing every damned thing.

On that note, yeah, weight increase might be a good idea. 

[Seargent_Braken]

Core_Commander wrote...

The Waffle Cat wrote...

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

On Gold, reliably? Assuming even a tiniest bit of cover that all maps possess?

Any Infiltrator (cloak)
Any Soldier besides turian (damage reduction, grenade cover, extra speed of krogan and batarian, ballistic blades)
Asari Justicar (reave spam), N7 Fury (www.youtube.com/watch - that's a 6/6/6/4/4 build with no mods, mere 700 hp/shields with Piranha)
Any Sentinel (shield and power spam)
Vanguards (duh)

Do you not play the game, or are just a horrible player who cannot imagine getting into CQC without "dieing"?

Right back at you about "idiotic statements". Armchair gamers discussing "balance"...

Also Vorcha with full bloodlust stack.

[The Waffle Cat]

Core_Commander wrote...

The Waffle Cat wrote...

Which classes can actually go that close without dieing.

There goes your idiotic statement.

On Gold, reliably? Assuming even a tiniest bit of cover that all maps possess?

Any Infiltrator (cloak)
Any Soldier besides turian (damage reduction, grenade cover, extra speed of krogan and batarian, ballistic blades)
Asari Justicar (reave spam), N7 Fury (www.youtube.com/watch - that's a 6/6/6/4/4 build with no mods, mere 700 hp/shields with Piranha)
Any Sentinel (shield and power spam)
Vanguards (duh)

Do you not play the game, or are just a horrible player who cannot imagine getting into CQC without "dieing"?

Right back at you about "idiotic statements". Armchair gamers discussing "balance"...

LOL , I like how many people cant see the Captain Obvious kind of damn retorical question in my posts but anyway you got idiotic statements you PoS, you assume I dont know how to play lol and I actually know I'm probably miles ahead of you. 

All of these classes I do know but I'm not talking about facerolling gold, the piranha is a gun made to scale on platinum. Everything curbstomps gold atm 

Try again thou 

Modifié par The Waffle Cat, 31 juillet 2012 - 12:32 .

[Core_Commander]

The Waffle Cat wrote...

LOL , I like how many people cant see the Captain Obvious kind of damn retorical question in my posts but anyway you got idiotic statements you PoS, you assume I dont know how to play lol and I actually know I'm probably miles ahead of you. 

All of these classes I do know but I'm not talking about facerolling gold, the piranha is a gun made to scale on platinum. Everything curbstomps gold atm 

Try again thou 

First of all, you are a very cool person, offending strangers on the internet like that. Tough and cool. Sorry for insinuating you're a bad player, kind of assumed that based on the combination of your statements, half-baked forum bully behavior, grammar, spelling etc. As well as the logic fail, since if your statement was meant to be rhetorical with the answer being "nearly all classes", then considering its weight/power it gives a case for a Piranha nerf. Thanks for that, I guess?

Second, nice job advocating power creep, and revealing your omniscient knowledge of Bioware's intentions in one cool post, mr. cool tough guy. I think we're done here.

Modifié par Core_Commander, 31 juillet 2012 - 12:42 .

[The Waffle Cat]

Core_Commander wrote...

The Waffle Cat wrote...

LOL , I like how many people cant see the Captain Obvious kind of damn retorical question in my posts but anyway you got idiotic statements you PoS, you assume I dont know how to play lol and I actually know I'm probably miles ahead of you. 

All of these classes I do know but I'm not talking about facerolling gold, the piranha is a gun made to scale on platinum. Everything curbstomps gold atm 

Try again thou 

First of all, you are a very cool person, offending strangers on the internet like that. Tough and cool.

Second, nice job advocating power creep, and revealing your omniscient knowledge of Bioware's intentions in one cool post, mr. cool tough guy. I think we're done here.

Power creep is done by many companies tbh, It's what all companies do to reach the thing known as  "money"

actually quoted from an interview with an EA CEO :

For people to use real money we need to put in good items into our random system since they will invest their money into us, only to reach their items.




It's not BW, it's EA

Do you not play the game, or are just a horrible player who cannot imagine getting into CQC without "dieing"?

First of all, you are a very cool person, offending strangers on the internet like that. Tough and cool. 

Problem?

Modifié par The Waffle Cat, 31 juillet 2012 - 12:42 .

[Lord Rosario]

Stop arguing about whether it's viable to get within the range the piranha requires to actually do it's damage and just take the point that that is the damn gun's weakness. An op gun has NO weaknesses and is good or great in every situation. I'm sure you aren't going to be running up to phantoms or banshees trying to shoot them int he face with the thing. It will end very badly. Also, with it's rate of fire and clip, it requires you to stand there and shoot, making you vulnerable. I'm pretty sure on gold or platinum being vulnerable is a bad thing for any class. The enemy's guns do far superior damage, so sitting there, at point blank range, unloading a clip into something's face, is not going to work unless there is only one enemy there and it promptly dies before it can do much to you. Claymore [the gun everyone insists on comparing the Piranha's damage to] does not have that problem. You shoot, get back in cover, reload, shoot. It has far more accuracy, and instead of wasting all your consumables on the accuracy you need to make the Piranha do what everyone calls overpowered, you could be spending that on crap-tons of damage on the Claymore for much higher dps [which everyone also seems to think is so important.]

So lets see, Every weakness that the Piranha has is covered by the claymore and the Claymore can deal a solid chunk of that damage faster and generally does it better too. If the Piranha is so overpowered people, then the Claymore needs some serious reductions too, and I'm sure it doesn't.