351 réponses à ce sujet

[MWaHa]

Rokayt wrote...

Lofrof wrote...

Tired of nerfers? Join No Nerfducks.

You spam sperm harder then most Viagra salesmen.

Fixed

[L.ast L.ife]

MWaHa wrote...

Rokayt wrote...

Lofrof wrote...

Tired of nerfers? Join No Nerfducks.

You spam sperm harder then most Viagra salesmen.

Fixed

...HOT.

Plus you can't exactly argue with results.  Well... you can, but that's just what haters do.

[Rebel_Raven]

death_for_sale wrote...

Rebel_Raven wrote...

Ya know what pisses me off most about the pirahna situation? People are trying to SCRERW THINGS UP FOR CASTERS by using screaming, bleeding edge equipment and weapon platform classes to illustrate why something is "OP."

At this rate casters will never have a decent gun! Any light weight weapon that can do take more than a block of armor off a boss with a clip will be snatched up by weapon classes, and abused!

It pisses me off so damned much, I'd rather see the classes death is using nerfed for making weapons so broken.

Casters have these neat things called powers that they kill stuff with. Weapons are not supposed to be their primary method of killing things.

Yeah, they use weapons to suppliment their powers, though. Ever consider that? And that they might want a weapon that suppliments decently?

Powers vs boss units suck more oft than not, and casters might actually wanna be able to hurt them.

Not everyone is an n7 fury that can make rapid fire biotic explosions to tear up armor, or bosses.

[Lord Rosario]

death_for_sale wrote...

Far be it from me to rain on your parade, OP, but there have been extensive tests and videos showing the accuracy of the Piranha when used correctly. However, I thought I would take some new ones on FBW, for perspective.

This is from the camp counter, in cover, with Marksman.



But, that is still pretty close right?

So I took these from cover at the big box near the LZ.

Marksman again...



and just for the heck of it, Destroyer in Devastator mode from the same distance....



4 shots on that one, I count 10 pellets outside of any boss hitbox in the game.

Oh, just in case you want a closer look, right click and choose view image. You can even zoom for full size 1080p.

/thread

Great job. You proved that the pellets hit within a small area, on one class, with one race, with one character... And also, that the accuracy on it did not get any better, only the spread of pellets got smaller. Show us what that turian does without marksman too. :]

[ABjerre]

death_for_sale wrote...

Far be it from me to rain on your parade, OP, but there have been extensive tests and videos showing the accuracy of the Piranha when used correctly. However, I thought I would take some new ones on FBW, for perspective.
*snip*

4 shots on that one, I count 10 pellets outside of any boss hitbox in the game.

Oh, just in case you want a closer look, right click and choose view image. You can even zoom for full size 1080p.

/thread

I'm not going to argue that the Tsol makes good work of it - it does however lack in every other way, so lets call that even?

Just before, you said 3 shots and 8 pellets, but scince you corrected your statement, lets look at 10 miss out of 4 * 8 pellets = 31,25% decrease of the guns effective damage at the givnen distance across the landing pad (id guess 35yds?) or 1775-549 DPS.

Thats equivalent to the Mattock X or Cerberus Harrier I, which incidently does that trick at all ranges.

Modifié par ABjerre, 31 juillet 2012 - 01:54 .

[Rebel_Raven]

death_for_sale wrote...

On casters it is only truly OP at short to medium short range. But it weighs so little that it is effectively a short range boss killer for when the bosses get close enough, whittle bosses with powers, they get close, wham bam. I posted a caster vid showing what it can do to an Atlas once you get close enough. Casters are not supposed to be weapon platforms, but this weapon allows them to do exactly that.

I call shens. Using high end addons doesn't reflect the people, who're likely the vast majority, that don't HAVE the mods, and high end ammo.

death_for_sale wrote...

So give them an OP close range weapon for those moments when they can't use their powers correctly and let bosses get too close. I see....

Some bosses are pretty immune to some biotics what with having no health as opposed to barriers/shields armor.

They might wanna use it so they can hurt bosses when they can't make biotic explosions.

If they gotta get close to do it, then so be it. At least they're a bit more viable vs boss units.

Modifié par Rebel_Raven, 31 juillet 2012 - 01:23 .

[Asebstos]

DVS27t wrote...

Asebstos wrote...

Mason IIv wrote...

Good job OP, I don't want to see this gun get ner... re-balanced. Its my baby!

But if its so "terribly ineffective" why is it "your baby"? Clearly its a bad and situational gun, as the OP points out.

The game gives many options to spec out guns in an effort to make them more effective.  This creates a gun vs. build argument.  If you do not believe me, I would love to see you make a video running the piranha with no attachments or consumables/gear on a power drell adept using only your weapon, on U,U,P.  If the gun is as you say it is, this should be a cake walk for you.

I'm arguing that the gun is notably better than the rest (especially in its weight class), to the degree that it is often the best choice for many classes. I'm not aruging that it can do all the work for you. More than half the people I run into in PUGs are using this gun, if it were as "limited" as the OP wants people to believe you can be sure it'd see less use.

[Dream-Maker]

Yeah it's no secret that the pirhana is damn inaccurate. Taking a screen of just one shot isn't gonna prove much however. In the first screen in the OP for example if you continue shooting and aiming roughly between them, both geth would be dead in a few secs. The Piranha's ROF more than compensates for its lack of accuracy at mid range and everyone who actually uses this gun regularly knows that. The spread also plays in its favor in this kind of situation allowing to kill multiple targets at once.

The second screen for sure you wouldn't be able to kill anything at that range, but to be honest I'm not sure. I never use the Destroyer, so my experience with this shotgun is limited to classes like Batarian Soldier, Paladin, Phoenix Vanguard and Krogan Soldier without any accuracy bonuses.

Modifié par Dream-Maker, 31 juillet 2012 - 01:29 .

[AresKeith]

as I said its the people who uses the weapon, not the weapon itself

[tonnactus]

ABjerre wrote...


Off the top of my head, incoming fire would be one thing.

As i said, using this gun for its maximum potential, the player risks becoming a liability instead of an asset.

Its a ideal weapon for a Vanguard.

[DNC Protoman]

Asebstos wrote...

Man, for such a "terribly ineffective" weapon you sure do see it a lot. And I seem to score really well with it too. Weird. Maybe I'm just that awesome.

this. All you have to do is look up a match with 4 piranha users.  It's brokenly powerfull, you people just want the game breaking crutch. 

It'll go.  trust me.

[Boopitty]

death_for_sale wrote...

The Waffle Cat wrote...

death_for_sale wrote...

snip

Marksman..../facepalm

Boss hitbox are you even serious about this, even the bloody pre-nerf hurricane can hit all shots within the boss hitboxes -.-

I was addressing the OP's comment -

"In comes the relentless horde of re-balancers: "You can spec for
accuracy and put a smart choke on it! That makes you able to frikkin
snipe with it." If you can show me someone actually sniping with this
weapon, i would be very pleased, but untill you do, allow me to show you
what it does at range:"

Marksman answers his request. Now to address the real issue, you would have to look at one simple thing. At medium range on weapon classes, this weapon destroys things.

On casters it is only truly OP at short to medium short range. But it weighs so little that it is effectively a short range boss killer for when the bosses get close enough, whittle bosses with powers, they get close, wham bam. I posted a caster vid showing what it can do to an Atlas once you get close enough. Casters are not supposed to be weapon platforms, but this weapon allows them to do exactly that.

Doesn't the Hurricane accomplish something similar, with less of an armor penalty? 

[sobbos]

Asebstos wrote...

Mason IIv wrote...

Good job OP, I don't want to see this gun get ner... re-balanced. Its my baby!

But if its so "terribly ineffective" why is it "your baby"? Clearly its a bad and situational gun, as the OP points out.

It's only shines on a couple of classes out of the many.

[tonnactus]

DNC Protoman wrote...


this. All you have to do is look up a match with 4 piranha users.  It's brokenly powerfull, you people just want the game breaking crutch. 

This only woorks on small maps like glacier where accuracy doesnt matter anyway. Try to be effective with this weapon on a non soldier/infiltrator class choosing Vancouver, London or Hydra as a map. Good luck...

Modifié par tonnactus, 31 juillet 2012 - 01:34 .

[Eugenesys]

Good Job ABJerre

For those who don't use the Piranha, the weapon fires in a spread larger than its ammo clip
On FBW, at the end of the interior hallway where you fire looking up the stairs, to get a target hiding behind the wall requires you to properly aim your shot till only 1 or 2 pellets firing the circular pattern can hit the target.

This weapon is only useful in

With smart choke in the hands of a normal char not having accuracy / damage bonus
10m or less ( think of this as the distance between the 1st counter to the front, or the usual back counter, to the front of the first counter when enemies jump over the counter

Without smart choke
Clumps of enemies bunched up together ( like 2 pyros and 2 rocketer walking down the narrow corridor beside the front and rear counter. )
Right in front of BIG targets ( We're talking magnet hand range or Prime punching range.
Now tell me your squishy chars can survive long at that range.

The only thing saving you at that range is the rapid firing nature of the Piranha...

[DHKany]

I find it to be fine really. Shreds at close range and does worse at range than the claymore on the same character with the same build. Also, whilst the damage to weight ratio is VERY good, I find the claymore's damage done to time spent out of cover ratio MUCH better. Imho.

[Eugenesys]

tonnactus wrote...

DNC Protoman wrote...


this. All you have to do is look up a match with 4 piranha users.  It's brokenly powerfull, you people just want the game breaking crutch. 

This only woorks on small maps like glacier where accuracy doesnt matter anyway. Try to be effective with this weapon on a non soldier/infiltrator class choosing Vancouver, London or Hydra as a map. Good luck...

You forgot to add Platinum / Gold
It is murder, especially with oh so accurate Nemesis / phantom / Ravager / Rocketeers.  By the time you reach firing range, you would have eaten a hearty meal of whatever the above enemies dished out. ..

[Grunt_Platform]

Thank you for this, OP.

The Piranha is currently stupidly strong on platinum, but that's just because Platinum is populated almost entirely of tight packs of enemies and giant bosses. Change that, and you "nerf" the piranha without nerfing it.

In a real situation, the Piranha loses most of its damage to its terribad accuracy—especially since only one or two pellets go in the middle of the group. In most situations it's either the bulk of the target or the power of the N7 Destroyer doing most of the work.

[ABjerre]

death_for_sale wrote...
4*1774=7112
Missed shots 10, each pellet does 221.75 for a total loss of 2217.5 for a percentage loss of 31.17%

1774 * .3117 =  552.95

1774 - 552.95 = 1221.05

Vindicator DPS at X, and the vindicator is not a bad weapon since the last buff.

499.81

Crusader at X

811.07

The lowered DPS does not factor in RoF boosts from class abilities, but even with the missed pellets, it is the second strongest shotgun DPS in the game, with the Claymore sitting at 1648 DPS.

When you figure in clip size and reload speed with reload cancel, the claymore does 833 DPS. The Piranha sustained dps with reload cancel is 1338.

1338 * .3117 = 417.05

1338 - 417.05 = 920.95

So, even with missed pellets, sustained DPS is the highest of all shotguns. These facts cannot be denied no matter how you want to tilt the evidence. Sorry, but it is OP.

Scratch that, i read it as you had 10 hits and not 10 miss. That brings the gun up to Mattock X or Harrier I level. And they still do that trick at much longer ranges, and on all size targets. It is no OP.

Modifié par ABjerre, 31 juillet 2012 - 01:57 .

[A Wild Snorlax]

FearTheCompany wrote...

N7 Piranha
- Damage decreased from [70.9-88.7] to [63.6-79.6]
- Rate of fire decreased from [150] to [120]
- Recoil increased from [2.18] to [2.62]
- Zoom recoil increased from [2.5] to [3.1]
- Spare ammo decreased from [48-64] to [32-48]...

A wild retard appears! His balancing attempt reflects his mental disability!

Seriously 98% of the playerbase sucks at the game and should be happy there are good weapons availiable. Considering the above there's a large likelhood the quoted poster is one of them and he probably can't compete gold without getting carried.

[ryoldschool]

ABjerre wrote...

death_for_sale wrote...
4*1774=7112
Missed shots 10, each pellet does 221.75 for a total loss of 2217.5 for a percentage loss of 31.17%

1774 * .3117 =  552.95

1774 - 552.95 = 1221.05

Vindicator DPS at X, and the vindicator is not a bad weapon since the last buff.

499.81

Crusader at X

811.07

The lowered DPS does not factor in RoF boosts from class abilities, but even with the missed pellets, it is the second strongest shotgun DPS in the game, with the Claymore sitting at 1648 DPS.

When you figure in clip size and reload speed with reload cancel, the claymore does 833 DPS. The Piranha sustained dps with reload cancel is 1338.

1338 * .3117 = 417.05

1338 - 417.05 = 920.95

So, even with missed pellets, sustained DPS is the highest of all shotguns. These facts cannot be denied no matter how you want to tilt the evidence. Sorry, but it is OP.

Scratch that, i read it as you had 10 hits and not 10 miss. That brings the gun up to Mattock X or Harrier I level. And they still do that trick at much longer ranges. It is no OP.

I'm trying to follow this calculation, and what is death_for_sale actually saying hits the target, and what does not.  So do 30% of the pellets hit, or do 30% of the pellets miss?