264 réponses à ce sujet

[Lord Rosario]

FeralJester616 wrote...

Ok... I've just tested the Typhoon and compared it to What I Know the Revenant can do...

The thing still chews through Atlas's like a hot knife through butter...
So it doesn't do it like the butter is sat on a hotplate in the middle of death valley?
Is that really that big a deal?

What? On Bronze? On Platinum, pre-nerf, it took a clip and a half from my destroyer [214 round clips, about 300 total rounds] to take it out, ammounting to about 25-30 seconds of pure shooting with the class made specifically for weapons while standing in a demolisher's supply pylon, and the atlas was targeted by a Male Quarian. Now... I might just be nuts, but that doesn't seem op to me on a gun that heavy with a slow charge up that leaves you exposed for that long.

[darkblade]

Rifneno wrote...

darkblade wrote...

- as it should be.

- i consider that a boon, instead of spraying bullets from the get go you get 4 warmup shots to get on target, each with a chance to stumble the target. I use this gun on a demolisher with a 0 in fitness on gold and im not scared to pop up and put them rounds down range. Half the time im not even in cover im walking forward towards the enemy. 

- As intended, its for soldiers whose powers are either grenades or the occasional CC power like CS or PM. This gun was basically made for the soldier the only one who who have a problem with it is the turian. And as said above its even great on a demolisher on targets no even if they arent debuffed by HG.

You lost any credibility when you tried to sell "it's a ****ty phalanx for the first second and a half" as a good thing.

You wish it was that easy to take ones credibility seeing as I havent said anything fallacious or wrong my credibility is still fine. Yours, however is faultering seeing as how you didn't bring a real rebuttal to what I said.

Just to further my point, The particle rifle and the striker both have a warm up phase. In the particle rifle tips thread using the warm up phase to lead targets and be primed for max DPS was a legit tactic as is using ther warm up shots on the Typhoon for the same purpose. 

So tell me "oh great one", how im wrong for not crying about a slight nerf? Is it because i have the audacity to consider a feature of a gun in a different way from you and suggest that what was percieved as a weakness can be used as a strength as demonstrated with a weapon using a similar firing mechanic?

[darkblade]

JakobBloch wrote...

Couple of things that needs to be said:

- The rev time on the Typhoon is less than a second (0.75 seconds I believe).

- The Typhoon actually don't increase in damage per shot but rather in ROF (If I am wrong please give me a source). This is worth noting. The RoF starts out at a respectable 650 shots per minute (I believe. Rifneno said 250 but did not mention a source. I got my numbers from here). This will then be multiplied by 1.5 bringing it up to 975 rof or 16 shots per second. In total not as much damage as the Harrier but significantly more that the revenant (unless I am completely wrong).

- When we say that the Typhoon has an inate Armor Damage Reduction modifier we are not talking about the cover pentration that it also has. The nerf last week was to the cover penetration while the Armor DR modifier remained unmodified. In case of the Typhoon I believe the Armor reduction modifier is 0.5 (effectively halving the armor damage reduction). For a full explanation go here.

- That you don't have the Typhoon is irellevant to it being nerfed. That it has only been out for 2 weeks is also irellevant. BW has a limited number of people to test any item so thier sample sizes will be small, however when they release said items that sample size gets larger and they get better data. This will most likely be the reason for nerfs that occure soon after launch and not anything posted in the forums (The things in the forum may give them more perspectives on what to nerf or change but whether something needs a change will probably be based on numbers rather than anything written on here).

- When compairing one weapon to another be mindfull of comparing the entier weapon and not just some select stats (like damage per shot). The Revenant deals more damage per shot than the typhoon and has the same RoF. By these numbers we might call the Revenant superior. However, we left out the other stats here. The Typhoon is significantly more accurate and it has the rev up RoF. It also carries significantly more ammo (though this is undermined by the higer RoF) and it has inate armor and cover penetration.

- The Typhoon is a supression weapon with powerfull anti-boss capabilities. To get to its fullest potential it needs to rev up so you need to stay out of cover for longer times. If you pick a class that is not able to remain out of cover you have no business wielding the Typhoon. classes that excell with the Typhoon include (but may not be limited to): Destroyer, Krogan Soldier, Krogan Sentinel, Batarian Soldier (if specced for grenades).

Is the nerf a bit heavy handed? perhaps. Time will tell. Is it enough to render the gun useless? Probably not.

Oh and on the word useless: The word useless is a big word. Just because something does not work in every situation does not make it useless. Just because something is not viable on gold and platinum does not make it useless. Pull for example is not useless. It is perfect at what it is ment to do. It is ment to debilitat weak enemies for an extended time to give you time to deal with greater threats. On gold and Platinum this is not really useful but that does not make it useless. That being said with the new buffs to Pull I am not really sure what to make of it. It is suddenly very powerful but it still only hits unprotected targets.

well that was a bit of a rant so I will end here. Have fun folks.

That you for being a voice of reason.

Also a class like Demolisher who has a strong defense debuff work well with the typhoon.

[Rifneno]

You can tell how bad it is by the fact TWO of the "it's not so bad!"'er's have tried to use the Prothean Laser Pointer as an example.

[DJepic112]

Horrible, horrible move. Two weeks in a row you nerf a good gun. I hate you, Bioware MP team.

[darkblade]

So you have no argument?

I used a feature of the PPR, a feature that someone who plays the game learned to fit into the meta of the weapon. To demonstrate a point, but you cant see that because you've made up your mind.

How do you manage to miss the point so easily?

Modifié par darkblade, 01 août 2012 - 01:00 .

[Kiernin]

Seargent_Braken wrote...

Of all the nerfs BW has done over the course of this game, this Typhoon nerf makes the least sense...

A 25% reduction in overall damage is insane! Why did they do this? There was no valid reason for this. Hardly anyone has the blasted thing in the first place, for goodness sake!

It's not overall damage. It's base damage I believe if I have the mechanics correct. Base damage would be 44(Typhoon I) and when ramped up, the base damage would be 66(Used to be 88). After you apply the various bonuses, that gap just gets bigger and bigger since they are all additive percentages. Too lazy to do the math to see what the overall reduction is but you can really notice the difference between pre and post nerf.

[darkblade]

Kiernin wrote...

Seargent_Braken wrote...

Of all the nerfs BW has done over the course of this game, this Typhoon nerf makes the least sense...

A 25% reduction in overall damage is insane! Why did they do this? There was no valid reason for this. Hardly anyone has the blasted thing in the first place, for goodness sake!

It's not overall damage. It's base damage I believe if I have the mechanics correct. Base damage would be 44(Typhoon I) and when ramped up, the base damage would be 66(Used to be 88). After you apply the various bonuses, that gap just gets bigger and bigger since they are all additive percentages. Too lazy to do the math to see what the overall reduction is but you can really notice the difference between pre and post nerf.

Yea its noticable, but its definitely not unusable. Now you just have to some sort of debuff to get the same level of damage on a boss. Which is fine because this IS suppose to be a TEAM game. Its not bad by any definition of the word.

I hope the piranha doesnt get nerfed though, since its not very good outside of CQC on anything but a turian.

Modifié par darkblade, 01 août 2012 - 01:04 .

[Killmoves37]

GroverA125 wrote...

robarcool wrote...

AbhijitSM wrote...

GroverA125 wrote...

is 1.5x really that much on the Typhoon? Considering that it has about half the damage of the Harrier per bullet, and 100 per mag unmodified, that still seems pretty effective to me. Mind you, still don't have the damn thing, so can't really say much. the decrease in damage is theoretically only 25% (except it's less than that, most likely) and if it was apparently mashing up bosses like no tomorrow before, I feel that it'll still leave a dent in them.

If someone could get some proper numbers on-scene, that would make this a lot easier to understand, as both an external observer and an internal observer.

What do you mean by "only 25%" ???????

He probably wanted 75%. That would be enough for him I guess.

Like I said before: If a weapon is twice as good as the others, and it gets a 25% debuff, you're still over 100%. I suppose it will be a noticable amount worse now, but it's a worse version of one of the best. Looking at it that way, it kinda cancels it out.

That's not exactly how it is. Without the 2x multiplier it has damage comparable to an Avenger X. Lowering the multiplier cuts into your damage output more than you would think.

Proof:
Avenger X - 48 damage per bullet
Typhoon IV - 48 damage without charge up multiplier

[Kiernin]

darkblade wrote...

its THAT guy wrote...

darkblade wrote...

its THAT guy wrote...

Any of you guys check out the most recent nerf to the N7 Typhoon? "2x damage multplier has gone down to 1.5x"

It's pretty bad. Let's compare it to the revenant, the AR most similar to it, in detail. At rank 1 of the Typhoon, the gun does 44 damage per round that goes up to 61.6 damage per round. Which is, coincidentally LESS damage than a similar rank 1 revenant (63.6 damage) per round. It takes several upgrades for the Typhoon to outdamage the revenant, and does 83.25 damage per round at level 10, ONLY 3.75 more damage than a revenant 10. And that's only when the Typhoon is full revved up....

And please tell me, who around here actually thinks they'll get a lvl 10 Typhoon anytime soon?

Well.... that sucks. The piranha remains as the most damaging weapon in the game, and the ASSUALT RIFLE, ONE OF THE FEW ACTUALLY GOOD ARs IN THE GAME, gets a damage nerf.

/facepalm

You appear to be some sort of uninformed person.

The typhoon recieved a multiplier nerf for its fully revved damage. It still outclasses the revenant in everyway and still stands as one of the best ARs stop crying. The only difference now is that now weapon classes without damage debuffs can melt atlases in 3 seconds like my demolisher was. Now the team actually gets to help me.

Yes. And what I'm saying at fully revved damage, the Typhoon STILL does less damage than the Revenant at most levels. Less. Damage. Understand? The Typhoon, an UR LMG, now does LESS damage per shot, EVEN when fully revved up, than the revenant when shooting normally at almost every level. And, even when you get the Typhoon to a level where its fully revved damage per shot is higher than the revenant, the difference becomes so minor that the main disadvantage of the Typhoon kicks in (the rev up time), leaving you exposed longer to more incoming fire for longer as you try to burn down you're targets.

For the record, the Typhoon pre-nerf had a fully revved up 88.8 damage per shot, ACTUALLY BEATING the revenant 1 in terms of damage.

And? The weapon is still has more accuracy, more stablility, larger clip size, more reserve, and natural penetration over revenant while still dealing respectable DPS on all difficulties. Especially on weapon master classes.

Considering the Revenants and the typhoon natural stats the Typhoon allows one to use mods to cover its single weakness in comparion to the Revenant while at the same time using whatever other mod you want. The typhoon is still leagues ahead of the Revenant and because it had so much over the revenant it had to lose a little something and that something is barely even noticable on the classes meant to rock the weapon.

So again, stop crying. Put a damage mod on. Gun is still one of the most deadly ARs in the game. 

Only because most ARs suck hairy donkey balls.

[its THAT guy]

darkblade wrote...

Kiernin wrote...

Seargent_Braken wrote...

Of all the nerfs BW has done over the course of this game, this Typhoon nerf makes the least sense...

A 25% reduction in overall damage is insane! Why did they do this? There was no valid reason for this. Hardly anyone has the blasted thing in the first place, for goodness sake!

It's not overall damage. It's base damage I believe if I have the mechanics correct. Base damage would be 44(Typhoon I) and when ramped up, the base damage would be 66(Used to be 88). After you apply the various bonuses, that gap just gets bigger and bigger since they are all additive percentages. Too lazy to do the math to see what the overall reduction is but you can really notice the difference between pre and post nerf.

Yea its noticable, but its definitely not unusable. Now you just have to some sort of debuff to get the same level of damage on a boss. Which is fine because this IS suppose to be a TEAM game. Its not bad by any definition of the word.

That might be the case for a normal weapon that had its damage based on the flat value of its damage per shot. However, the Typhoon requires it to rev up fully to reach its maximum potential with the innate damage modifier it comes with to do any decent amount of damage.

    Let's see an example of how a debuff would bump up damage on Typhoon (level 1 in this instance). Say, for instance, a target is proximity-mined to take 20% more damage from all sources. You would be firing your gun for the first .75 seconds at (44*1.2)=52.8 damage, at which time the gun reaches its revved up damage potential of (66*1.2)= 79.2 damage. Much less than the Typhoon would have done normally.

    Now, look at the Typhoon pre-nerf. (44*1.2)=52.8 damage would have jumped up to (88*1.2)=105.6 damage per round. See the difference between the two? The nerfed version of the gun nowhere near approaches the damage of the pre-nerf version or, hell, the normal damage of the Typhoon WITHOUT the debuff.

[Zjarcal]

The nerf wasn't necessary, the gun already weighs like a brick and it really wasn't OP (except on the destroyer, and even then I wouldn't say it was crazy OP). Piranha is the one that should've been nerfed.

With that out of the way... Typhoon still kicks ass. I used it on gold a while ago, it's still a beast of a weapon. Anyone who says that it's "useless"... right, whatever.

Main issue is that it's no longer that much more appealing over the Revenant. It still has many perks over it, like innate cover piercing, innate armor damage reduction, much larger clip size, way more accurate and stable, but it's not like those things can't be countered for the Revenant with the right equipment.

I say they should buff the damage on the Typhoon a bit to make a more attractive option compared to the Revenant (it already is more attractive for certain characters in my eyes, but not by much).

[Rokayt]

Zjarcal wrote...


With that out of the way... Typhoon still kicks ass. I used it on gold a while ago, it's still a beast of a weapon. Anyone who says that it's "useless"... right, whatever.

THAANANNNNNNKKKK YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU 

Someone understand me.  *Sniff*

[Anders028]

 I don't think you understand how inacurate the Revenant is on when sustaining fire.

[Jetblackmoon]

Disappointed to see it nerfed again, but no use complaining about it. Bioware isn't known for changing things back.

I'll still rock the Typhoon on my Destroyer because it's fun!

[DHKany]

Rifneno wrote...

I wouldn't bother wasting words on someone who doesn't have any earth weapons yet.

I don't have any Earth weapons yet cause my pS3 is 6000 miles away.
But I've played with them a fair amount at my friends, and the typhoon has been downgraded by quite a bit. QQQQ.

[TheExile1]

Why does everything Bioware touch die?

[RGZ Archer]

TheExile1 wrote...

Why does everything Bioware touch die?

Because they were infected by the EA virus lol

[DHKany]

TheExile1 wrote...

Why does everything Bioware touch die?

Because they own a copy of the Death Note.

[WARMACHINE9]

It could be worse oh wait it is 8 second cooldown for slam? really? can you say super suck. plus if memory serves right this debuff is the undoing of a buff from a couple of balances earlier. stupid just stupid.

[Xaijin]

Millafan4526 wrote...

Works fine with the destroyer..don't use it with any others

Uhh the destroyer took like a 35% reduction in damage output. Meanwhile farming with the demolisher is still completely brain free.

You have to wonder what folks am thinking.

[DHKany]

WARMACHINE9 wrote...

It could be worse oh wait it is 8 second cooldown for slam? really? can you say super suck. plus if memory serves right this debuff is the undoing of a buff from a couple of balances earlier. stupid just stupid.

seems a bit off topic talking about smash in a typhoon thread (even though it got nerfed at the same time as the typhoon)

But about that, I don't mind the smash nerf, I found that it was being spammed too much anyway.

[Xaijin]

Rokayt wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...


With that out of the way... Typhoon still kicks ass. I used it on gold a while ago, it's still a beast of a weapon. Anyone who says that it's "useless"... right, whatever.

THAANANNNNNNKKKK YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU 

Someone understand me.  *Sniff*

Uhh, no, no it doesn't. The nerfs combined mean output on a turian or geth is both higher and more accurate. Like the falcon, the typhoon is now a gimmick weapon for gimmick builds. You can't win platinum with gimmick builds unless you're an inf or demolisher.

[WARMACHINE9]

Yup june 12th balance Smash cooldown reduced from 8 seconds to 5 seconds. now heres the question boys and asari, why change it if your just going to change it back. stupid. Well maybe it means hope for the krysea and typhoon.

[DHKany]

Xaijin wrote...

Rokayt wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...


With that out of the way... Typhoon still kicks ass. I used it on gold a while ago, it's still a beast of a weapon. Anyone who says that it's "useless"... right, whatever.

THAANANNNNNNKKKK YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU 

Someone understand me.  *Sniff*

Uhh, no, no it doesn't. The nerfs combined mean output on a turian or geth is both higher and more accurate. Like the falcon, the typhoon is now a gimmick weapon for gimmick builds. You can't win platinum with gimmick builds unless you're an inf or demolisher.

How is a guaranteed stagger a gimmick?