162 réponses à ce sujet

[Viglin]

StrangeCat Productions wrote...

God I don't believe it!  This game is winning all these awards and it doesn't even have half the atmosphere that "The Witcher" had.

I walked into Denerim for the first time and Couldn't believe how Blah the Market Place was there was no Minstral Band there wasn't enough detail, it wasn't raining and everything looked pretty boring.  There wasn't enough Folly sounds and Atmospheric sounds of people selling and what not, it just didn't seem alive.

Someone should mod up a Group of Minstrals that we can through in there, I"ll create some music to fit the period and Minstrals. 
Because I really think that is lacking there for atmposphere.

I was just surprised that that would be so dull.  

Being picky maybe but come on a Game that is in development for five years and there isn't even a musicians out playing in the market place, or people yelling to sell, or chickes runing around, or damn Baldur's Gate 2 had more going on even, it sounded Alive!

Shocked that's all. 

No offense, but between...oh l dont know, the massacre at Ostagar, the Blight and a Civil War...lm not to sure ld be happy seeing Ministrals in the street.

And Gorim would debate you on the "no one yelling to sell"...and who needs chickens when theirs kids everywhere?

Now ld like to see the following in an update;
-weather
-Npcs moving about
-Guard patrols.

[Derengard]

Denerim is just a boring kind of place, and they nailed it, that's all.

No, seriously, it's not just about the minstrels, there's really little atmosphere in this game, due to a variety of reasons.

Modifié par Derengard, 20 décembre 2009 - 07:18 .

[Edelwolf]

I think the game could've had a bit more polish, more detail and some ambient sounds.

[blazin130791]

"Also, when compared to Athkathla and Baldur's Gate, Denerim's a bit of a backwater."



agreed

[aries1001]

Yes, the game have been in development for 5 years (or more). At one time, I think they did start over; around the launching of Mass Effect, I think? since they wanted this game (Dragon Age) to use some of the facial tech featured found in the first Mass Effect.



From the look and sound of it, though, it makes sense that the people of Denerim are somewhat

'not happy' with the whole situation and are a little afraid, maybe? It is not fun and no picknik either to slowly wait for an army of Darkspawm - to overrun the place.



Then again, if you think, minstrels should be in Denerim, knock yourselves out. A whole toolset you have, yes. (to paraphrase Yoda)

[TheMadCat]

Eh, I thought it portrayed the realities of the world fairly well, it had that sort of somber and "dead" feel to it that went well considering what was coming their way. My complaint is it felt to small, to caged considering it's supposed size. But as someone said there is most likely only so much that can be done with this engine, reality is this is an "older" game technology wise.

[Oliver Sudden]

Yeah, Denerim was pretty much a letdown for me when my party first entered it. It felt pretty desolate and empty.



I could see the dark and gritty explanation, but I don't remember anyone there talking in those terms. They may have mentioned it, but most of their conversations were about their own wants (just like NPCs is about every game I've played).



There was joking and teasing that I remember, but mostly the town's square and environs were pretty barren, and I would have wanted more people, more hustle, more activity.

[Blue Soul]

Maeves_Child wrote...

I have to disagree. DA is like a painting. Just because there aren't things you personally like in the painting, doesn't mean it isn't as it was intended to be.

Say I make a painting of a woman. And then you tell me it's unfinished because she has a crooked nose and no visible cleavage.

I say I like crooked noses. You argue that I can't possibly like that and so naturally, I did it to ****** you off.

The logic sucks.

No...
That's a bad analogy.

Baldur's Gate is to a painting, as DA is to a sculpture.
It’s like getting an artist to paint a room (+ items in that room) and a sculptor to sculpt a room in the same time frame.
If both are experts in their fields, the painter draw a much larger room, whereas the sculptor has to create a smaller room in order to fit in the same time frame (assuming he/she wants the same item:space ratio as the painter).
I’m not saying which is worst, both have different pros and cons.

As others have mentioned, the reason Denerim doesn’t feel as lively as eg. Athkatla, or as large, is due to limitations of the engine. DA just can’t a large number of 3D objects.
I don’t think it’s possible to add more things into Denerim without increasing the system requirements (more and more CPU).
Unfortunately, some could say that's just a poor excuse for what we see, but that's just the way things are.

[arntson]

well lets look at denerim its full of criminals theres no king a blight is coming i would say minstrials have run for their lives merchants have prolly cleared out and everyones pretty bad off so they pretty much nailed it

[Trajan60]

The downside of a game that's in development for five years is you're suddenly playing a game that's played on a five year old outdated engine. That's also why you will never see bow strings in the game. The engine is too old.

[Trajan60]

arntson wrote...

well lets look at denerim its full of criminals theres no king a blight is coming i would say minstrials have run for their lives merchants have prolly cleared out and everyones pretty bad off so they pretty much nailed it

You're making excuses for poor level design.

[Arbiter Libera]

I really have no problem with how Denerim looks like... hell, it's killing my FPS already as it is for some reason. I dread how it would run if they added even more scripts/activators to it.

[knarayan]

As others have mentioned, the reason Denerim doesn’t feel as lively as eg. Athkatla, or as large, is due to limitations of the engine. DA just can’t a large number of 3D objects.
I don’t think it’s possible to add more things into Denerim without increasing the system requirements (more and more CPU).
Unfortunately, some could say that's just a poor excuse for what we see, but that's just the way things are.

I'm not so sure about that. There were certainly a huge number of 3D objects moving around in Redcliffe the night of the undead attack.  And anyway, the buildings - the Gnawed Noble, Wade's and the others are separate locations - and will not add to the objects in the Marketplace. I didn't notice too much difference in terms of performance between Redcliffe and Denerim.

[StrangeCat Productions]

There is simply to much that I can list that would improve the games atmosphere. Starting with that city. I am not game designer nor do I wish to be. I would never have the time to even work with the said tool set. I have friends in game industry though. I am sure all of this was a choice by the devs to make the game work on more systems. In other words there probably really pushing the engine as it is. Denerim dark? yea not!

Someone out there will make a mod and when they do it will Rock the House! Later Gents and Ladies.

[phordicus]

you want atmosphere? check out how dedicated a hawker the dwarf (no spoilers, no name here!) merchant is: every single time you walk past him he yells the exact same thing, nevermind that no other random NPCs are scripted to walk near him so he can only be yelling at you.

[hkthui]

Keep in mind that Bioware's target is to support of wide range of hardware specs. They could have made the market place as atmospheric as possible, but then it would run poorly on lower end systems. I think the current state is just a compromise they made. I doubt that this is a limitation of the engine itself.

Modders can always improve the atmosphere by making addons (like the Oblivion ones that redesign the cities, but those require high end PC to run more than 10 - 15 fps) for high end systems.  

[SpoonMan]

I agree with the overall opinions on Denerim. I was initially confounded and thought that I missed something when I didn't see at LEAST some sort of short cinematic introduction when it came to the first time I was visiting the place. I enjoyed that about BG, it had some sort of introduction as to what really transpired in the city.



I'm not going to complain about the overall game because I think it is AWESOME, but the depth and atmosphere is definitely lacking some sort of detail. I think there were a total of around 3-5 people standing around, and although they don't do anything for the game they added some sort of comfort in knowing I was in a city and not some desolate and abandoned ghost town.



Overall, a lot of the places could use some more liveliness to it, and I'd buy the DLC if there is going to be one to help this out, but honestly it should have come with the game.

[Dasim4]

THe whole game world feels that way to me. I got to Lothering the first time, which was sort of ok, but it looked pretty bland. Then I get a quest to go take care of some bandits and I head out of town expecting some sort of distance to explore and low and behold they are standing in groups right outside of town. And the landscape is very bland, that hit me right off the bat. Thankfuly there are some areas where the game redeems itself and the story is extremely good. Also the character acting is top notch. But yea the towns were all a huge disappointment. Very low scale, not many people around, everyone frozen in place. It's just not what I was hoping for really.

[Legion-001]

The reasons for not adding more NPCs and details to different locations are more then likely not about the engine and are instead similar reasons to why the child of a Human and an Elf always produces a pure blood human... They just couldn't be bothered to add in Half-Elves and the accompanying lore.

I think this game was going the way of Duke Nukem Forever, they HAD a great idea to start with but no real ideas on how to properly flesh it out and rapidly ran out of steam. I agree they probably started over with the Mass Effect engine and then ran out of steam again and rather then make a loss on the whole idea they decided to fix what they could and release a partially finished game, thus we have Dragon Age: Origins not really thought through nor completed.

- To the OP: games rarely if at all win awards from major magazines based on how good they are (if they did Gothic 3 would have been lucky to score 20%), instead they win awards and high percentages based on how much the publishers pay the magazine to give it a good rating.

Modifié par Legion-001, 21 décembre 2009 - 02:17 .

[Maeves_Child]

Blue Soul wrote...

Maeves_Child wrote...

I have to disagree. DA is like a painting. Just because there aren't things you personally like in the painting, doesn't mean it isn't as it was intended to be.

Say I make a painting of a woman. And then you tell me it's unfinished because she has a crooked nose and no visible cleavage.

I say I like crooked noses. You argue that I can't possibly like that and so naturally, I did it to ****** you off.

The logic sucks.

No...
That's a bad analogy.

Baldur's Gate is to a painting, as DA is to a sculpture.
It’s like getting an artist to paint a room (+ items in that room) and a sculptor to sculpt a room in the same time frame.
If both are experts in their fields, the painter draw a much larger room, whereas the sculptor has to create a smaller room in order to fit in the same time frame (assuming he/she wants the same item:space ratio as the painter).
I’m not saying which is worst, both have different pros and cons.

As others have mentioned, the reason Denerim doesn’t feel as lively as eg. Athkatla, or as large, is due to limitations of the engine. DA just can’t a large number of 3D objects.
I don’t think it’s possible to add more things into Denerim without increasing the system requirements (more and more CPU).
Unfortunately, some could say that's just a poor excuse for what we see, but that's just the way things are.

You missed my point.

But hey, if you guys don't like the game, then don't play it.

Although I must admit, I'm not sure why you'd waste the time posting in a Dragon Age forum just to complain and do nothing about it.  It was mentioned before, but the game does have a toolset.  You don't like it?  Fix it.

[Dieover]

phordicus wrote...

you want atmosphere? check out how dedicated a hawker the dwarf (no spoilers, no name here!) merchant is: every single time you walk past him he yells the exact same thing, nevermind that no other random NPCs are scripted to walk near him so he can only be yelling at you.

LOL! i was about to said the same thing. That dwarf is so annoying, i tried to avoid trigger his sales preach every time i went shopping.

I guess it has it good and bad at the market place. I however enjoy the quiet feel while chit chating with other NPC.

[Xeper84]

hmm yeah DA is like a picture! In every bad aspect you could think of. It's a viedogame so i really expected more movement from NPCs but a picture describes it perfectly. Sometimes i just wish it would be more like a video game ^^.
What DA is really missing is life! I'am not talking about happy citizens that jump around. I'am talking about NPCs that actually move around and talk which each other or stuff like that. In DA everything besides the dialogues feels dead. another point is the whole stealing system it just lacks "life" and there is no risk in it. For me citys and stealing destroyed a lot of the good atmosphere of DA.

Modifié par Xeper84, 21 décembre 2009 - 02:27 .

[deathwing200]

StrangeCat Productions wrote...

God I don't believe it!  This game is winning all these awards and it doesn't even have half the atmosphere that "The Witcher" had.

Can't believe you're comparing this game to the failure that Witcher was. The so called "realism" was nothing but frustration. 99% of the time you'd be wasting time because some ****** who's important for a quest will be there at certain times of day.

[orpheus333]

My only problem with Denerim is the lack of scale. Their is basically just a single district or hub and then various smaller districts for fighting and story arcs. It feels a bit shallow. I'm not sure there is much of a difference between Denerims lack of NPCs to the Witchers abundance of cardboard cut outs but at least its not necessary to wait for them.



Why people think its great design to have a player frustrated I don't know.

[RetrOldSchool]

True, there is very little going on in the areas except what you have going on and that's a shame.

I have to admit that this is one of (the very few) gripes I have with the game:
Too little area presentation.

I love the game, but it lacks in that departement ant that's a quick win for DA:O2. (I hope some devs checks this thread )

In Mass Effect you always had the landing sequence and when landing on the story planets you were always presented with a bit of a short cutscene, which is missing in DA:O. Not in all areas, but in a lot.
 
When you travel to Denerim you should be greeted with a cinematic short presentation of your party going through the city gates (or something similar), a small sweep over the market district etc. Just a short introduction to every area once you get there for the first time,that would ad to the immersion a lot IMO.

The same when you arrive at WK, you are told of the windling cave/tunnels (more than once even), but you never get to neither play nor see those tunnels... (I dont consider that a spoiler, since that's directly at arriving at WK, before even starting the quest in WK)