851 réponses à ce sujet

[Lucrece]

For once I'm tired of getting an elbow to the face before charge even ends from a Prime. And rocket troopers machine gunning rockets that knock off my shield as soon as charge replenishes them. Of course, the Kroguard does not need to worry about it since a rocket only takes a quarter or fifth of his shields, but for nonkroguards a fix to these irregularities would be a huge quality of life improvement.

[Destructo-Bot]

Hey, now we agree

[MP-Ryan]

Lucrece wrote...

For once I'm tired of getting an elbow to the face before charge even ends from a Prime. And rocket troopers machine gunning rockets that knock off my shield as soon as charge replenishes them. Of course, the Kroguard does not need to worry about it since a rocket only takes a quarter or fifth of his shields, but for nonkroguards a fix to these irregularities would be a huge quality of life improvement.

Quarter to fifth?  What difficulty are you playing on?  Unless you're using shield booster V (which I do not have) or a cyclonic modulator, a single rocket takes fully half a kroguard's shield even with a Stronghold V on Gold.  On platinum, it's worse.  That's after charge's DR has worn off.

[megawug]

MP-Ryan wrote...

Quarter to fifth?  What difficulty are you playing on?  Unless you're using shield booster V (which I do not have) or a cyclonic modulator, a single rocket takes fully half a kroguard's shield even with a Stronghold V on Gold.  On platinum, it's worse.  That's after charge's DR has worn off.

I think the kroguard is being deified... LOL.  When I play kroguard, geth hunters stun-lock themselves.

[RamsenC]

Anyone with a PPR X or close try it on Kroguard. Use the enemies stagger time after charging to heat up the beam then melt everything. Being stagger proof certainly helps with this, but at level 3 my PPR is too heavy.

[Lucrece]

MP-Ryan wrote...

Lucrece wrote...

For once I'm tired of getting an elbow to the face before charge even ends from a Prime. And rocket troopers machine gunning rockets that knock off my shield as soon as charge replenishes them. Of course, the Kroguard does not need to worry about it since a rocket only takes a quarter or fifth of his shields, but for nonkroguards a fix to these irregularities would be a huge quality of life improvement.

Quarter to fifth?  What difficulty are you playing on?  Unless you're using shield booster V (which I do not have) or a cyclonic modulator, a single rocket takes fully half a kroguard's shield even with a Stronghold V on Gold.  On platinum, it's worse.  That's after charge's DR has worn off.

I use shields, not stronghold, and use cyclonic modulators. Have plenty of them, and if you're playing Platinum reliably, you are bathed in consumables anyways since Gold credit rewards suck by comparison. 

[Tybo]

Anyone else here had a great time with the Acolyte Novaguard? Tried it with cryo ammo yesterday and had an extremely easy time. I wasn't even playing that well, and I topped the scoreboard with 2 other pretty excellent players on a cerberus gold.

By holding the fire button down the entire game, I would automatically charge the Acolyte during every nova, and fire it in the direction of my charge with every charge. Great damage output, since it was almost always hitting shields, and because of the aoe I had a pretty decent hit rate. Used cryo ammo 3, and noticed (I think, can't be certain) the acolyte working something like a lightweight falcon, applying ammo powers to a wide aoe and staggering. Further, it would almost always auto reload during my novas and charges.

In short, I found it to be an excellent novaguard gun. Don't know why I hadn't tried it before.

Modifié par tyhw, 08 septembre 2012 - 05:35 .

[thegamefreek78648]

Ill have to try that some time

[Achire]

Aye, you can charge Acolyte while using nova or nova canceling exactly like Graal or GPS. I tried it momentarily to deal with Platinum Phantoms before the buffs, but I ended up using a Scorpion X instead. It does strip the barrier off a Phantom on Platinum in one shot if you use Pistol Amps. I can see it being quite useful on Gold, but on Platinum you have a lot more bosses to deal with.

Wrote a Novaguard mini-guide of sorts.

[JShepppp]

 Don't know if the Kroguard is popular in this thread, but I recently wrote a mega guide for the character.

[Destructo-Bot]

[Pedro Costa]

Destructo-Bot wrote...

This. Sooooooo much this.

And I'm starting to really, really, really, really hate Geth. Every time I'm hit by the Prime's gun I can't charge nor nova, which means I get hit by all three shots and then die by some random geth trooper/hunter/rocket in the background... Compared to that rocket machine gun troopers are nothing.

[Destructo-Bot]

Glad you like the gif. That is one hyper cat.

[Pedro Costa]

Hey, it fits the playstyle.

[disappearingone11]

JShepppp wrote...

 Don't know if the Kroguard is popular in this thread, but I recently wrote a mega guide for the character.

Oh, the Krogan's popular, he's our poster child because he can fight like a true vanguard, no tricks. Most of this thread is about making other vanguards half as viable as he is. Not that any of the others should be as tough as a Krogan, mind you, but just the way he plays: being able to take some punishment, not having to sacrifice melee for health/barriers, suffering less of a penalty for toting a heavy shotgun, etc. About the only thing people complain about is the relative weakness of carnage, but that's hardly a major concern. His lack of mobility can be an issue, but only if you're too reckless or get cornered by a mob of banshees.

I haven't read your guide yet, but I'll look it over. I could use tips for platinum if you have any.

Modifié par disappearingone11, 12 septembre 2012 - 07:16 .

[JShepppp]

disappearingone11 wrote...

JShepppp wrote...

 Don't know if the Kroguard is popular in this thread, but I recently wrote a mega guide for the character.

Oh, the Krogan's popular, he's our poster child because he can fight like a true vanguard, no tricks. Most of this thread is about making other vanguards half as viable as he is. Not that any of the others should be as tough as a Krogan, mind you, but just the way he plays: being able to take some punishment, not having to sacrifice melee for health/barriers, suffering less of a penalty for toting a heavy shotgun, etc. About the only thing people complain about is the relative weakness of carnage, but that's hardly a major concern. His lack of mobility can be an issue, but only if you're too reckless or get cornered by a mob of banshees.

I haven't read your guide yet, but I'll look it over. I could use tips for platinum if you have any.

It's actually a Gold guide for casuals that focuses on a melee-based build with low-level weapons and little to no equipment (can be used to solo Gold a well).

Platinum however can't be done with a melee based build because certain things that you can do on Gold - such as kite - don't work on Platinum, and the enemy density is higher (not to mention constant synchkill threats). Kroguard Platinum builds have to be weapon-based, and you need high-level rare/UR weapons, gear, and mods for that - you have to go all out.

So unfortunately it's not exactly a Platinum guide. But it is true that the Kroguard, even if played as a soldier, has enough survivability and durability that combined with a good weapon you can wreck enemies on Platinum.

[TheLukerez]

I fell in love with the N7 Slayer due to it's utilities as a one-man army. I solo'd silver first try after waking up not ten minutes before putting the disc in the tray. That's not extraordinary but you get the point. However! Other Vanguards (while they still all have their utilities) ultimately are not outfitted for really helping a team. Granted a lot of what happens in a Vanguards time of battle is dependent on the player's habits when they play, as well as their weapon/mods and consumables/gear.. but I just find that most of the Vanguards are lacking in overall utility. The only one's I can take seriously are the Drell, Ex-Cerberus, and the Slayer. I'm not a huge Vanguard person but I'm very much into this game and how to be effective, so it bothers me not knowing what to do with some of these other classes; All but spamming specific powers, which isn't fun.

EDIT:  Herpderp I forgot the Kroguard, which is my favorite actually, I've just only recently played as an N7. 

Modifié par TheLukerez, 13 septembre 2012 - 01:36 .

[disappearingone11]

JShepppp wrote...

It's actually a Gold guide for casuals that focuses on a melee-based build with low-level weapons and little to no equipment (can be used to solo Gold a well).

Platinum however can't be done with a melee based build because certain things that you can do on Gold - such as kite - don't work on Platinum, and the enemy density is higher (not to mention constant synchkill threats). Kroguard Platinum builds have to be weapon-based, and you need high-level rare/UR weapons, gear, and mods for that - you have to go all out.

So unfortunately it's not exactly a Platinum guide. But it is true that the Kroguard, even if played as a soldier, has enough survivability and durability that combined with a good weapon you can wreck enemies on Platinum

I read it, and it's a very good guide, so kudos for writing it. Regarding platinum, I tend to agree: the Kroguard is at his best when charging and using heavy melee (or light in many cases, people underestimate the value of his headbutt) because when bloodrage is active, he's a killing machine. The problem is that this tactic isn't well suited for boss killing, and that's what's needed for platinum. I typically equip mine with the Reegar X  (no backup weapon) because I find it to be a good damage/weight ratio shotgun with decent capacity and reload time. The lack of range on it is an issue at times, though, especially when I have to be very careful about when and what to charge, and if I spec out of carnage (which I usually do), then I literally have no long ranged attack.

I'll keep toying with him on platinum and see what I can do to improve. The melee heavy build does work well against geth, and the charge/heavy melee combo will send phantoms flying. But for most bosses, yeah...just being in melee range is too dangerous.

[dzero]

I scored something like 140k+ on an Asari Vanguard on Gold today, and I don't tend to ever score that much.

Not gonna read over the thread to see where everyone is up to in this discussion but just thought I'd add that in there!

[Pedactor]

dzero wrote...

I scored something like 140k+ on an Asari Vanguard on Gold today, and I don't tend to ever score that much.

Not gonna read over the thread to see where everyone is up to in this discussion but just thought I'd add that in there!

Asari Vanguards are walking death:

Self Priming Biotic Explosions.

Spawn clearing grenades.

Stasis sniping from range.



I love them.  The Vanguard buffs a few weeks back turned these beautiful blue bottoms into a serious pain train.  It's amazing, that buff made them function as they actually are supposed to.

[Shampoohorn]

Next plan for my drellguard:

Respec to weapon synergy and melee synergy. (+25/+25% weapon bonus)
Equip Hurricane II with AP IV, HC barrel, Magazine.
SMG III, Combatives Upgrade V
>200/bullet

Charge it, punch it, shoot it.

Agreed?

Modifié par Shampoohorn, 13 septembre 2012 - 08:06 .

[disappearingone11]

TheLukerez wrote...

I fell in love with the N7 Slayer due to it's utilities as a one-man army. I solo'd silver first try after waking up not ten minutes before putting the disc in the tray. That's not extraordinary but you get the point. However! Other Vanguards (while they still all have their utilities) ultimately are not outfitted for really helping a team. Granted a lot of what happens in a Vanguards time of battle is dependent on the player's habits when they play, as well as their weapon/mods and consumables/gear.. but I just find that most of the Vanguards are lacking in overall utility. The only one's I can take seriously are the Drell, Ex-Cerberus, and the Slayer. I'm not a huge Vanguard person but I'm very much into this game and how to be effective, so it bothers me not knowing what to do with some of these other classes; All but spamming specific powers, which isn't fun.

EDIT:  Herpderp I forgot the Kroguard, which is my favorite actually, I've just only recently played as an N7. 

We may have different ideas about what constitutes utility, but I'd argue that all vanguards are lacking in this area, and two of the worst are the Drell and Phoenix. They're carbon copies of their adept counterparts except that they have charge slapped on in place of a biotic power (and swapping reave for the Drell's particularly weak BC is not a good tradeoff). I'm guessing that by choosing these two, you're placing a lot of value on pull and lash, which are very situationally useful (especially pull). They can be used as BE primers, but not very good ones, and they're terrible for priming BE's that you're going to detonate yourself. The Phoenix is actually designed to use smash before lash for maximum damage BE's, which makes no sense at all. And while cluster grenades certainly have their uses, they don't add much to the Drellguard's repertoire. Now, feel free to disagree and tell me why: I'm not blanket saying that I'm right and you're wrong. I'm saying that I don't understand why you'd choose those two as good examples of either utility or of vanguards in general.

As for the Slayer, I do credit him with having more utility than most vanguards, and I think it's unfortunate that so many people tend to just spam biotic slash and ignore phase disruptor. My problems with him stem from BC and PD not synergizing well even though they theoretically should, and while BS (much like the Phoenix smash) packs a punch and can hit through walls, it's too slow to be useful for much of anything other than hitting through walls because he's not durable enough to live through the animation otherwise.

[najzere]

disappearingone11 wrote...
My problems with him stem from BC and PD not synergizing well even though they theoretically should

I'm interested to know why you think they don't synergize well? PD uses up shields and BC restores them. PD doesn't compete for cooldown and by the time I'm done shooting off my three PD shots as fast as I can, I'm ready to charge again. Plus I get 40% damage increase to PD after each charge. I actually think BC/PD have some of the best synergy in the game.

[disappearingone11]

najzere wrote...

I'm interested to know why you think they don't synergize well? PD uses up shields and BC restores them. PD doesn't compete for cooldown and by the time I'm done shooting off my three PD shots as fast as I can, I'm ready to charge again. Plus I get 40% damage increase to PD after each charge. I actually think BC/PD have some of the best synergy in the game.

In a word, durability. If the Slayer had more, then this could work well, but because of his weak health/barriers, using PD is extremely risky when exposed; even with the barrier drain reduction evo, the Slayer doesn't have enough barriers to expend in order to consistently use PD. Compare this to the Novaguard, who uses BC and Nova in a similar fashion: on paper it carries the same risk as the Slayer's combo because both characters have the same amount of health/barriers. However, the Novaguard gets away with his because he gains invincibility frames, while the Slayer does not. Effective survivability, therefore, is much higher for the Novaguard. The only way for the Slayer to compensate is to mix in light melee because he gains significant DR while performing those quick sword slashes, and this can buy some precious time while waiting on the BC cd. But that's not the same as being invincible for a few seconds, and it shows on gold and platinum matches.

That said, I do like PD, especially because of its range, and using it before charging is very useful. The problem is with repeating PD x2 or 3 after charging: the Slayer needs to be more durable for this to work on higher difficulties.

[zRz Tyr]

They really need to boost up the vanguards in this game. Specifically how much damage they do in close combat. A vanguard should rival a phantom in melee.

Modifié par zRz Tyr, 13 septembre 2012 - 09:56 .