851 réponses à ce sujet

[Achire]

Thanks for the combat roll advice. I tried that on Platinum and it works really well.

[curly haired boy]

i have, on occasion, charged into krogan heavy melee by accident

it looks crazy cool, i thought it was just a bug

now i'm going to try and get better at it

[MAGlKARP]

Destructo-Bot wrote...

I've uploaded two videos to youtube highlighting one of the killer bugs of the class: Instant loss of shields after a charge and being targeted immediately out of a charge. It happens with all factions. You charge a target and your barrrier is gone before the screen is even done shaking. This effect completely negates any benefits of charge. I was the host, so no lag related glitches here.

http://youtu.be/q2e6_h1ylpk?hd=1
http://youtu.be/2DeJefLNRBU?hd=1

This definitely needs addressing because it's not avoidable, no matter what your skill level is.

Off host there are also a lot of situations where no matter how hard you mash the charge or nova button it won't work as well. The class needs to be able to survive at close quarters if played correctly, but it's too riddled with glitches to work properly.

While you're at it get rid of stun locking, not only for the benefit of vanguards but for all classes. If there's a situation where you die and it's unavoidable it only causes frustration.

[FlowCytometry]

Like I've said before, VGs really really need some frontal stagger resistance (like the KV has- he can still get staggered from behind, unlike the Destroyer w/ Devastator who never gets stunned by anything afaik) and SK resistance. For a game really hell bent on punishing CQC players w/ OHKO grabs, you'd think they'd build its shock trooper class to be somewhhat resistant to these grabs.

I was trying to host again w/ the HV on gold, and geezus the effort is not worth the payoff at all for this class!
Potentially infinite invuln frames is amazing, sure, but actualizing that is not feasible due to staggers, lag, charge bugs (lack of shield restore being the worst when hosting), and enemies that like to do their thing- come hell or high-water - regardless if ur colliding into them at light speed. Most those matches were vs. Reapers, and you know what actually got me to just quit? Not Banshees..

Brutes.

Countless times a simple roar staggered me out of a charge (really? a f-ing growl?). Twice I got SK'd by them and at that point I just had to throw my hands up in the air at the game and say 'what the hell you want me to do w/ the class, BioWare?'. I felt real bad cause one of the matches it was just me and a good, random BSo and we duo'd gold upto wave 9 till that happened (didn't plan on that but that's how it goes). And unlike the other SKs, w/ the brute I still have no real idea how it even happens. Its one thing to punish a player for a big mistake, but how am I supposed to learn if I dun even know what hit me or how I could stop it? Well, save for 'don't play around that thing' - ala Banshees - Yeah, that's a great solution! Don't play ur class properly, just shoot and stay away like it has herpes- totally what a frontliner should be.. running away cause OMG GRABS!

And in a match vs. Cerb at one point I was doing my thing tanking/evading phantoms while my team primed em.. when an atlas missiles staggers me into a phantom SK- I had invuln frames the whole time since it was right at a nova-cancel anim. Like.. really? Really, game? Come the f- on. How does BW expect even the avg gold player to tolerate the crap they put this class through?

I'd like to think that I can play the HV pretty well, but christ one slight muck up or bug and it turns into a disaster and a huge disservice to the rest of ur team. The damage ptoential isn't even close to being there either above silver. Just not worth it- not worth it at all.

Sry, had to vent a bit. I didn't mean to take away from better discussion, but VGs could be so good just argh.. the game just isn't designed w/ them in mind to me (save I guess the KV, who only can pull it off cause of extremes in his design that other VGs dun have, and even then he's kinda a dull reegar/piranha turret that laughs and teleports- yay).

Modifié par FlowCytometry, 04 août 2012 - 08:35 .

[Destructo-Bot]

You know what an AWESOME ability for the novaguard would be? The Justicar's Biotic Bubble.

You would get an additional damage reduction in the bubble, plus you get to setup biotic explosions. HOWEVER! You must first get into melee range to set the bubble, so this balances things greatly. You'd biotic charge, drop a bubble (taking advantage of the bubble DR) while you wait for charge/nova/shockwave to come off of cooldown and only then do you get to set off a biotic explosion.

Simply replacing one of his powers (*cough* shockwave) with the bubble would dramatically empower the class while maintaining it's CQC role. And it would allow them to bubble up allies during hacks and such, which is another common complaint... Plus the bubble could be warping enemies causing teammates to do more damage as well.

Make it happen!

Modifié par Destructo-Bot, 04 août 2012 - 08:27 .

[ShortestTallGuy]

 Couln't agree more with the OP. The Vanguard class is really weak for higher difficulties. Not being able to effectively play an entire class due to the Vanguard glitch is complete crap. To top it off, BioWare give the middle finger to melee classes everywhere with boss executions. If you miss a sniper shot at a boss - the cost? One fewer thermal clips or in extreme cases sometimes getting dropped. If one of your biotic combos doesn't detonate on a boss? Cooldown time reset, worst cases gettting dropped. The cost of charge not going off on a boss or nearby enemy, or melee-ing a boss at the wrong moment? Instant grab kill, killing you instantly. Call me crazy but this really penalises melee classes and particularly vanguards, designed to be up close and personal. Why play them at all?

[Achire]

I think we're best off asking for buffs than can be implemented in balance changes. The most they've done in patches is fix bugs and do small changes like adding more invulnerability frames to charge. Not to mention balance changes are weekly, and patches come every three months.

Modifié par Achire, 04 août 2012 - 10:09 .

[Dabal Hayat]

thegamefreek78648 wrote...

First let me hit weapon weight.

If you want to take a heavier weapons load but still maintain a high cool down you should look at the Power Efficiency Modules which can help off set the reduced cool down bonus you get from heavier weapons.  Also, there are several peices of gear that also increase power cool downs, some of them also giving bonuses to weapons as well [such as the Expert package which increase cool downs and smg damage]

Yes, certainly you're right: there are many kind of gears to use to improve a vanguard's damage. But, as I'm sure you know, using one gear to achieve a higher cooldown, prevents the same vanguard to equip better shield, or higher mobility. If, as a Vanguard, you choose better defense, you're lowering your role of damage dealer, and vice- versa: It's a vicious circle, that yet again only show the disparity between a Vanguard and every other class.

Modifié par Dabal Hayat, 04 août 2012 - 10:27 .

[LiarasShield]

Krogan vanguard is the ultimate defense and very gold and platnium optional if you use him wisely in gold and platnium but it is kinda annoying that you have the host every map or you will fall victim to the vanguard glich

[Elotana]

Achire wrote...

Thanks for the combat roll advice. I tried that on Platinum and it works really well.

Wave 3 is the farthest I've ever gotten on a Platinum solo. Drellguard, if you can believe it. He's really great against Cerberus so the first two waves aren't that bad! Then Reapers show up 

Modifié par Elotana, 04 août 2012 - 10:24 .

[Achire]

Very impressive. I just can't get Drellguard to work on Platinum. I know there's people who can (sy7ar, GP, you?) but I'm going to stick to novaguarding.

[tonnactus]

GiroX- wrote...
What can the Asariguard do on Platinum? Stasis a phantom every so often? Lob a grenade that does laughable damage and that has a limited supply?

What? Lift Grenades are the most damaging grenades in the game. And actually Phantoms and Hunters are plenty in Platinum and the most dangerous enemy types aside of the Banshee.

Modifié par tonnactus, 04 août 2012 - 11:08 .

[Elotana]

Achire wrote...

Very impressive. I just can't get Drellguard to work on Platinum. I know there's people who can (sy7ar, GP, you?) but I'm going to stick to novaguarding.

Nah, you definitely can't make him work on Platinum. I can't even do Gold Reapers or Gold Geth with Drellguard, I just play him a ton on Random/Cerberus/Gold so the first two waves of Platinum were just like the last few waves of Gold.

EDIT: I also had the Hurricane and a ton of SMG gear, 1200 DPS will carry almost anything for at least a while!

Modifié par Elotana, 04 août 2012 - 11:16 .

[Achire]

tonnactus wrote...

GiroX- wrote...
What can the Asariguard do on Platinum? Stasis a phantom every so often? Lob a grenade that does laughable damage and that has a limited supply?

What? Lift Grenades are the most damaging grenades in the game. And actually Phantoms and Hunters are plenty in Platinum and the most dangerous enemy types aside of the Banshee.

A lift grenade does around 1700 damage, a bit more with Charge Power Synergy. A Platinum Phantom has 3997.5 Barrier and 2194 Health. A Hunter has 2961.5 Shields and 2632.5 Health. A Pyro has 3422 Shields and 3991 Armor. Not really seeing the greatness here but if someone plays Asari Vanguards on Platinum, feel free to comment on this.

Asari Vanguard is awesome against Cerberus on Gold. But you can't play just Cerberus on Platinum, and there really aren't that many mooks to kill.

Modifié par Achire, 04 août 2012 - 11:29 .

[Elotana]

It's a little disingenuous to compare grenades to a single enemy's HP when they have an generous AoE radius, and AVs can prime extra booms with stasis.

I agree AV isn't that great on Platinum for all the reasons stated itt, but Lift Grenades are a solid power.

[Destructo-Bot]

Modifié par Destructo-Bot, 05 août 2012 - 01:55 .

[IllusiveManJr]

I love the Vanguard class. In particular, Smashguard, Drellguard, and Novaguard.
It's a shame that the Vanguard Glitch is here to stay, despite their attempts to fix it.

[Pedro Costa]

Dabal Hayat wrote...
Yes, certainly you're right: there are many kind of gears to use to improve a vanguard's damage. But, as I'm sure you know, using one gear to achieve a higher cooldown, prevents the same vanguard to equip better shield, or higher mobility. If, as a Vanguard, you choose better defense, you're lowering your role of damage dealer, and vice- versa: It's a vicious circle, that yet again only show the disparity between a Vanguard and every other class.

This is very true.
Being only average at defense/offense and extremely power dependant with low carry capacity to boot, the vanguard doesn't have anything you can easily forsake when choosing what equipment to take. And this is just for gold, since for Platinum it doesn't matter much what gear you take, you'll die anyway because, again, you have average protection (even with charge which replenishes shields, it is buggy and sometimes takes just a bit more than it should to recharge so you can get out of a tight spot) and low-to-average damage output, whether from powers or from weapons.

As usual, excluding the kroguard.

[Pedro Costa]

Destructo-Bot wrote...

I say, old bean, why not Annihilation Field, like some other fine gentleman proposed?

That said, I disagree with changing the power loadout of any class. Tweaks to the power themselves, most certainly, in fact, I see no other way to make the vanguards not suck. But changing their power loadout? I'll have to pass on the offer.

[Maker MEDA]

All I know is, no body uses Vanguard charge ability on Platinum.

[Methew]

Thoughts on Drellguard using Acolyte?

Strips shields to allow you to Pull freely with a Biotic Charge follow up. Just pulled 81k on Silver. 50 Biotic Kills, 75 Kills, 25 Pistol Kills.

It's utterly worthless against armor though.

[Elotana]

Methew wrote...

Thoughts on Drellguard using Acolyte?

Strips shields to allow you to Pull freely with a Biotic Charge follow up. Just pulled 81k on Silver. 50 Biotic Kills, 75 Kills, 25 Pistol Kills.

It's utterly worthless against armor though.

Tried it, went back to simply charging and meleeing. It's faster and the weapon switching / charge mechanic is just too frustrating.

[Destructo-Bot]

DarkLord_PT wrote...

I say, old bean, why not Annihilation Field, like some other fine gentleman proposed?

That said, I disagree with changing the power loadout of any class. Tweaks to the power themselves, most certainly, in fact, I see no other way to make the vanguards not suck. But changing their power loadout? I'll have to pass on the offer.

The additional damage reduction for the bubble is the interesting part of it, along with the bubble being more team oriented (a common complaint towards vanguards).

I really doubt we'll ever see a power loudout changed though... but I still like the idea of a bubbleguard. 

Modifié par Destructo-Bot, 05 août 2012 - 07:05 .

[LULZferBAKON]

I just want the Vanguard to have some more weapon love. I remember choosing them when I started the Mass Effect series from the beginning because back then they were the magic knights of the ME universe. Now they're the gimped wizards.

[corporal doody]

only vanguard i like is the Asari Vanguard. 5/6/6/5/4.

i chuck nades and lug the saber.

i can outscore just about anyone on gold with this build

Modifié par corporal doody, 05 août 2012 - 11:00 .