12 réponses à ce sujet

[Kipferl]

I would like to make the best possible DPS + Crowd Control Mage and would need help for choosing spells and stats (magic/willpower).

Modifié par Kipferl, 20 décembre 2009 - 04:47 .

[Tirigon]

there are multiple ways of doing it.

My mage has Fire and Ice magic and the hex school that weakens resistances. Spec is AW, BM will come later, therefore only as many willpower as you really need, (if you dont mind drinking many potions no willpower at all). Every other stat in magic, nothing in other stuff, except for a little cunning to get the persuade talent (1 is enough if you do the magi´s quest early) So far this mage is quite strong and fun to play.

For Crowd control I recommend to add the sleep spelltree or maybe the stun tree. CP and FF were very useful before the patch, dunno if they still are.

[Tiniuc]

Uhhhh...



Get Blizzard, Tempest, Spell Wisp, Spell Might, and Affliction Hex.



1) Spell Wisp -> Spell Might -> Spell Wisp (this increases spell wisp's effect, doesnt work the other way around)

2) Blizzard -> Affliction Hex -> Tempest

3) Then proceed to run like hell.



You'll also want to pump your magic score as high as you possibly can, 70ish or more if you can manage.



Of course, if you manage to get enough gear to force your lightning resist over 90%, then you may as well just stand in the middle and chug potions. The spell will be doing damage roughly equivilant to your spellpower per second. If you want to keep them in place prior or during, try Sleep, Waking Nightmare, or the Glyph Combo (just try not to paralyze yourself).

[dkjestrup]

Stats wise, just go pure magic.



Spells wise, take Fireball, Cone of Cold, and Chain Lightning first. I personally never use Blizzard etc, but that's just me.



For crowd control, take the Mass Paralyze line, and the Crushing Prison line, and that should be plenty. After that, you'll have about 6 or 7 talents left, depending on your final level.



Take Bloodmage, and take all of the skills in that line. You can do what ever you wish with the last points. I personally spec Spirit Healer, and take Heal, Group Heal and Revive. But that's just me, MANY people prefer Arcane Warrior, but I've never really specced it much.

[DragoonKain3]

Read up on http://social.biowar...66/index/448867

Copy pasta from that thread...

Stats: Max magic
Origin: Arcane Bolt
1) Winter's Grasp, Frost Weapons
2) Cone of Cold (if you have CE, else switch with 3)
3) Lightning
4) Blizzard
5) Mana Drain
6) Mana cleanse
Ostagar) Spell Might
7) Mana clash
8) Mind Blast
9)  Force Field (this is going to help you a lot in Redcliffe defense in keeping everyone alive... FF those militiamen who's going to die, while mindblast helps in stunning opponents)
10) Shock (if you're not done Redcliffe defense yet, change this to Drain life and push everything one level after. Helps to have another nuke there)
11) Tempest
12) Flameblast
13) Flame Weapons
14) Fireball

(save before desire demon in Redcliffe story line, unlock Blood mage, reload save, and get talent tome instead. This can be done as early as lvl 10'ish, but I'm putting it at 14 just in case people do sidequests first. Also buy 3 arcane tomes)

Desire tome) Blood Magic (Take bloodmage/spirithealer specs)
Arcane tome 1) Blood Sacrifice
Arcane tome 2) Blood Wound
Arcane tome 3) Telekinetic Weapons
Redcliffe Talent) Crushing Prison

15) Drain Life
16) Blood Control
17) Spell wisp
18) Arcane Shield
19) Staff Focus
20) Arcane Mastery
21) Walking Bomb
22) Death Syphon
Landsmeeet talent) Virulent Walking Bomb
23 if you get to it) Animate Dead  


All this is assuming that Wynne is going to do your healing. For details on how to build her, look up my post in that thread.

[Khumak]

I'm surprised you put Virulent Walking Bomb so far down the list. That 1 spell has the potential to out damage everything else in the game, bar none.  This includes the combo spells like Storm of the Century.  When the first mob explodes it can infect up to 3 others. So with 1 spell you cab do 150 + 1.5SP to everything nearby plus potentially another 450 + 4.5SP for a total of 600 + 6SP to all nearby enemies. All for 3 talent points. You can meet the requirement by level 2.

For best results, hit your target with a Crushing Prison or other CC to make sure he stays where you want him to explode. FF is also extremely handy, especially if you send a tank in first to draw everything into a nice big group. Let him build some aggro, immobilize the target with something, VWB him, and make sure to FF the tank before he blows up.

In fact, I find VWB so powerful that I'm able to devote the majority of my points to CC and leave VWB as my primary damage dealer with the blood mage line as a backup that doesn't inflict friendly fire. The big downside is that it absolutely requires micromanagement. My mage has almost as much friendly fire damage as the total damage output of my other 3 party members combined.

This is also a great spell for bosses because it does decent single target damage with zero friendly fire risk as long as it expires before the boss dies.  The downside is that your mage will have to either kite, FF himself, or switch to AW/defense mode.

Edit: minor correction, you can't get VWB at level 2, an Elf can get it at 4 and a Human can get it at 5.

Modifié par Khumak, 21 décembre 2009 - 03:34 .

[Kipferl]

Tiniuc wrote...


1) Spell Wisp -> Spell Might -> Spell Wisp (this increases spell wisp's effect, doesnt work the other way around)

Sorry but I don't understand that.
You can take Spell Wisp only once.

[SpockLives]

He is talking about casting them in that order, not about getting a spell more than once. Spell wisp's power stacks if you recast it in the order he described.

[Solistus1]

Kipferl: he means the order you cast them in, not the order you get the spells in. Cast Spell Wisp, then cast Spell Might (which will be boosted because Spell Wisp is on while you cast it), then cast Spell Wisp again (which will be boosted even more now that the boosted Spell Might is up) to get both of them at higher than normal effectiveness. Does that make sense?



OP: Others have given you cookie cutter builds. I'll offer some advice.



As for stats, it's quite simple. Magic is the only one that boosts your DPS. Willpower is irrelevant since you can make unlimited lyrium pots and should have enough mana to keep spamming over the very short pot cooldown without wasting points. For a non-minmaxer playthrough it can be worthwhile to put a few points in Will just because it's annoying to be 100% dependent on potions, but if your focus is minmaxing the ideal DPS mage then potions it is. Ditto with stamina - the game is easier and less frustrating if you put a few points here so you're less of a total glass cannon, but if you are trying to max out DPS then you don't have points to spare. Every single solitary stat point should go to Magic, no exceptions.



As for skills... I'll leave it to others to calculate which spell has the highest potential DPS in ideal situations. Beyond that, there are so many good DPS and CC spells that you can't possibly get all the good ones, so it depends what you mean by "best possible" in this context. If you want the Mage who will do the best at the fights generally seen as hardest, then others have given some advice here about specific spells that help with specific battles. It also depends heavily on how you want to manage your DPS output - any idiot can make a ridiculously high DPS mage on Easy by spamming AOE spells, but if you play on a real difficulty then AOE spells are situational (you can only use them in the right context). The Fire line of spells pretty much reigns supreme on that front. As for single target DPS, I usually leave that to non-Mages since it's pretty much all Rogues are good at anyway. Fireball's damage is insane, so a direct hit from a Fireball is a pretty damn good single target DPS skill even though it's primarily used for its AOE.



The CC spells every party should have access to, IMHO, are Crushing Prison (best single target disable by far), Force Field (great to disable a boss while killing his helpers, or to abuse with your own tank, or even to save a party member in an emergency), Cone of Cold (AOE crowd control is always nice) and the Glyph series (Paralysis alone is insane, but the combo can win fights on its own when placed well.



Spell Wisp, Spell Might and the Arcane line are pretty obvious as they buff the damage output of all your spells. For a minmaxer, it's better to have half the spells that do way more than usual damage rather than having all the spells at normal damage, so always get these if you're minmaxing. Plus, Arcane Bolt is a decent single target DPS spell to add to your arsenal.





Ultimately, if 'best possible' means most effective at completing the game, a lot of the advice on this thread isn't that practical. Any Mage designed with the primary goal of doing well should grab some spells like Heal. Mages' biggest strength in DA:O has to be their versatility, so trying to make the best possible Mage at a specific subset of spells won't necessarily be the most effective build for beating the game easily, unlike most RPGs. The handful of spells that boost other spells mostly boost ALL other spells, and there are a variety of specific spells that probably belong on every Mage, regardless of role. While DPS and CC sums up 90% of what Mages do, an example of a spell I think every Mage should have that helps with neither is good old Heal. One single skill point turns your Mage into a decent healer and, combined with one or two lines of tactics early on telling your Mage to cast that Heal on anyone under 50% health, will make far more of a difference in your playthrough than any other single skill point you will ever spend.

[Kipferl]

Solistus1 wrote...

Kipferl: he means the order you cast them in, not the order you get the spells in. Cast Spell Wisp, then cast Spell Might (which will be boosted because Spell Wisp is on while you cast it), then cast Spell Wisp again (which will be boosted even more now that the boosted Spell Might is up) to get both of them at higher than normal effectiveness. Does that make sense?

Yes, it does. Thank you.

[termokanden]

I don't understand why people get Spell Might or even Spell Wisp.



Spell Might seems to drain mana way too quickly, and with all your points in Magic, your spellpower really is high enough. Spell wisp doesn't seem to do very much and just adds another annoying sustained spell. I would find that annoying.



Perhaps it's worth casting Spell Might-affected Spell Wisp and removing Spell Might subsequently. I don't know if this works though. Honestly I thought they both added a flat spellpower bonus.

[DragoonKain3]

 I agree with Spell Might. Don't use it unless you cast Storm, or bursting down the enemy is your main concern (ala you have 'blue circle' allies who will potentially steal your kill). Not enough oomph for your typical trash mob to be used all the time (plus it has a hefty upkeep), and against bosses I'd take the +4 mana regen in most situations.

Disagree though for spellwisp. Fact is its pretty much 'free' spellpower, since the increase in spell effectiveness will always pay for the increased fatigue. You get to 'frontload' your spells and have better checks for your CCs, which is doubly important against bosses. Sure Wisp is quite useless against trash mobs, but I like it against bosses as its essentialyl 'free'.

As for Virulent Walking Bomb, between Storm, Fireball, and Blood Wound, that's actually overkill in the AoE department. VWB is only there to give you another nuke against the final boss. Plus, I don't like accidentally killing my tank, since I don't gear him with SR equips, and the fact that 1.02 blizzard is not WAI (only has intiial 4 second freeze and no subsequent refreezes when it should after every 2 seconds) so using VWB is much harder.

That said, if you really are proficient with VWB, then I suggest taking out Fireball to get it that early. It's very powerful, but I find its TOO unwieldly as well (at least Storm stays in one place). I've had times when I VWB an enemy on one end of the screen only to kill my tank on the other end of the screen due to the chain effect lol.

Though now that I think about it, the build really needs an effecient single target nuke against bosses, especially with the loss of Entropic Death combo. So for those who like high risk, high rewards type of play (or be willing to shell out some dough for 100% SR gear for your tank)...

Stats: Max magic
Origin: Arcane Bolt
1) Winter's Grasp, Frost Weapons
2) Cone of Cold
3) Walking Bomb
4) Blizzard
5) Lightning
6) Drain Life
Ostagar) Death Syphon
7) Virulent Walking Bomb
8) Mind Blast
9) Force Field 
10) Shock
11) Tempest
12) Mana Drain
13) Mana Cleanse
14) Spell Might

Desire tome) Blood Magic (Take bloodmage/spirithealer specs)
Arcane tome 1) Blood Sacrifice
Arcane tome 2) Blood Wound
Arcane tome 3) Telekinetic Weapons
Redcliffe Talent) Crushing Prison

15) Mana Clash
16) Blood Control
17) Spell wisp
18) Arcane Shield
19) Staff Focus
20) Arcane Mastery


Taking Lightning/Life Drain early since you need addiitonal no-friendly-fire nukes for Redcliffe defense, else you're stuck with only Arcane Bolt and Winter's Grasp (which is almost useless there). 

Last 4 points can be for anything, but Fireball to take advantage of Staff of Magister Lord's +10% fire damage and Animate Dead to have a pet for the final battle seems good to me.

[Time4Tiddy]

The glyph combo Paralysis Explosion is an excellent wide range CC that will keep all your mobs in one spot while your AOEs destroy them. It lasts for what seems forever. Something like Waking Nightmare is also good for keeping everyone milling about (and attacking each other) while something like Walking Virulent Bomb or Storm of the Century is wasting them. Blood Wound is a lot like an AOE version of Crushing Prison, highly recommended as it doesn't hit your friendlies.