309 réponses à ce sujet

[Core_Commander]

Terminus Echoes wrote...

[*]Then nerf the Destroyer!
As I said earlier, no. The Destroyer only has one useful power: the Devastator Mode. Its Missile Launcher just shoots curving spitballs, and the multi-frag doesn't do anything helpful. The Destroyer is a well-balanced character and should not be touched.

Ok, I'll be (somewhat) polite: you're wrong on two counts. Multi-frag is a short range carpet bombing, it kills pretty much everything in front of you... which is pretty helpful as one of the best spawn clearers/panic buttons. It's one of the best grenade powers in the game. And the second thing: having only one good ability (and the destroyer has two awesome ones, I know some people fear nerfs like the devil himself, but... seriously, nobody's going to fall for that?) isn't "balanced".

Modifié par Core_Commander, 02 août 2012 - 01:41 .

[Arppis]

Sure, why not? Typhoon was already a balanced before nerf. No matter what people say.

- it has the heaviest weight of all AR's
- slow reloadspeed
- bullet spread sucks, if you are not against cover
- bullet damage because of this isn't so great when you shoot from standing
- with N7Destroyer it has a lot more random kick
- you have to "rev-up" the gun to make it do damage, because of this you will have hard time vs Geth as they will stun you

These are few things that make the gun balanced. I have no idea why they reduced the damage and penetration. It's ultra-rare. Ignorance seems to run rampant. Before, it was viable "fun" choice of Harrier for me... But it isn't anymore.

Modifié par Arppis, 02 août 2012 - 01:41 .

[viruz777]

Lkv999 wrote...

So, how about an official petition based on this thread?

Do petitions actually work? I think the length of the thread (subject to on-topic legitimate discussion) would obviously speak for itself and get bioware's attention. Any petition can be created frivolously and be unfounded. The mere mention of the word already raises eyebrows.

[TMB903]

Nice post OP...I agree it needs to be returned to its former self

[Fyurian2]

Terminus Echoes wrote...

Then nerf the Destroyer!
As I said earlier, no. The Destroyer only has one useful power: the Devastator Mode. Its Missile Launcher just shoots curving spitballs, and the multi-frag doesn't do anything helpful. The Destroyer is a well-balanced character and should not be touched.

Multi-frag is very, very helpful.
It staggers Brutes and forces Banshees to drop teammates being picked up.
It staggers Hunters and Pyros, again helpful if/when one or more of the team are in danger of being swarmed by them.
Missiles... More like curving bouncey balls. Spit balls at least make someone stop and wipe them off.

[Rifneno]

Core_Commander wrote...

Ok, I'll be (somewhat) polite: you're wrong on two counts. Multi-frag is a short range carpet bombing, it kills pretty much everything in front of you... which is pretty helpful. It's one of the best grenade powers in the game. And the second thing: having only one good ability (and the destroyer has two awesome ones, I know some people fear nerfs like the devil himself, but... seriously, nobody's going to fall for that?) isn't "balanced".

The multi-frag isn't bad, certainly better than the bottle rocket launcher, but I don't think it's even a candidate for best grenade power.

[Arppis]

Rifneno wrote...

Core_Commander wrote...

Ok, I'll be (somewhat) polite: you're wrong on two counts. Multi-frag is a short range carpet bombing, it kills pretty much everything in front of you... which is pretty helpful. It's one of the best grenade powers in the game. And the second thing: having only one good ability (and the destroyer has two awesome ones, I know some people fear nerfs like the devil himself, but... seriously, nobody's going to fall for that?) isn't "balanced".

The multi-frag isn't bad, certainly better than the bottle rocket launcher, but I don't think it's even a candidate for best grenade power.

Yep, it doesn't do enough damage. And unless you take grenade gear, you can only use them now and then.

Modifié par Arppis, 02 août 2012 - 01:47 .

[Core_Commander]

Rifneno wrote...

Core_Commander wrote...

Ok, I'll be (somewhat) polite: you're wrong on two counts. Multi-frag is a short range carpet bombing, it kills pretty much everything in front of you... which is pretty helpful. It's one of the best grenade powers in the game. And the second thing: having only one good ability (and the destroyer has two awesome ones, I know some people fear nerfs like the devil himself, but... seriously, nobody's going to fall for that?) isn't "balanced".

The multi-frag isn't bad, certainly better than the bottle rocket launcher, but I don't think it's even a candidate for best grenade power.

One of the best, considering it fits the class perfectly. You can mow things down with the Typhoon at longer range (the rumors of its ruination are highly exaggerated) and blow anything that ambushes you up close to kingdom come.

As a panic "enemy up close" button it's on par with Arc Grenades (although weaker overall) and second to none (LG will take time to blow up unless you get a direct hit, IG will kill slower and won't stagger a Phantom, the rest is no contest).

Arppis wrote...

Yep, it doesn't do enough damage. And unless you take grenade gear, you can only use them now and then.

612 x 5 up close isn't enough damage now?

And complaining about its damage at long ranges is like complaining that you can't stab a guy from 50 m away. It's not what it is for, and it excels at what it does (close range destruction). For targets further away... I'd recommend the gun.

Modifié par Core_Commander, 02 août 2012 - 01:53 .

[tetsutsuru]

+1 for the OP.

Used my N7 Destroyer & Typhoon last night. Those nerfs to both the Destroyer and Typhoon are significant... and painful. Pre-nerf, the word that could define the N7 Destroyer and Typhoon combo is, "effective". Post-nerf, it's "inadequate".

Unless some of the resident, self-proclaimed "game balance experts" have been privately messaging BioWare developers, whining about how those two are "OMG they're sooo Oh-Pee. NERF IT!!11one!!1eleven", there really was no defining reason for the nerf.

Or has it become common practice here to nerf whatever is popular, just so we see "variety"?

Modifié par tetsutsuru, 02 août 2012 - 01:50 .

[AbhijitSM]

Rifneno wrote...

Core_Commander wrote...

Ok, I'll be (somewhat) polite: you're wrong on two counts. Multi-frag is a short range carpet bombing, it kills pretty much everything in front of you... which is pretty helpful. It's one of the best grenade powers in the game. And the second thing: having only one good ability (and the destroyer has two awesome ones, I know some people fear nerfs like the devil himself, but... seriously, nobody's going to fall for that?) isn't "balanced".

The multi-frag isn't bad, certainly better than the bottle rocket launcher, but I don't think it's even a candidate for best grenade power.

Yes..it loses its shine if you fire it at anything longer than close range as the spread of the 5 nades shot is too much. Very awesome at close range though. You need to fire it in between enemies in a narrow/closed part of any map for it to be effective. Upclose stagger & mow them down with your weapon.

[Beezilbub]

Bump. Well written and thought out and I agree completely.

[Fixx21]

I Agree 100% !!

[viruz777]

Bump. Bioware needs to be aware that causing an endless repetition of nerfing ultra rares so players should stick more to 'combat-proven' rare weapons really give no incentive for players to purchase PSPs, especially when it could make them more money.

The balancing team needs to rethink the way they handle balancing, not just through unfounded rants and whines of people who don't actually own the weapon but rather witness its destructive use, all because they didn't get to kill enough stuff and they feel angry about it and thinks it needs a nerf.

Seriously Bioware, if you're gonna end up nerfing all ultra-rares and cripple them to be on-par with rares, just at least make them AS easy to obtain as rares or just downright remove them! You may boast a 50 weapon count to unlock but it's really no use to just put URs on display considering how you should feel rewarded for actually unlocking a gem of a weapon which should likewise perform as such, otherwise we'll never feel that "it was worth it" after all the hard earned play time + actual money spent in unlocking URs, it still fails to distinguish itself in actual firefights.

[Relix28]

/signed

[SoundWraith]

/signed

[theffernan]

Agreed and /salute to you sir.

[xtorma]

chielhier313 wrote...

You sir, are THE MAN!! Perfectly said and completley true.
Finally there`s a decent soldier with a decent assault rifle and everybody(who`s get outscored) starts complaining??
At first you needed a adept or sorts with biotic explosions or an infiltrator with a (black)widow to be valuable in gold.
So buff the typhoon back to what it was and buff the ex-wife

Turian and human soldiers can own on the highest difficulty. Turian soldier with piranha can melt atlas from across the map. Human soldier with claymore is a beast. Typhoon is not the only viable boss killing weapon out there. Destroyer is not the only  viable soldier out there.

I believe the adjustment to the typhoon was a little to harsh, but it's the nature of the beast. When they collected data , they probably saw gold and platinum dominated by one choice in a class. The destroyer. The other soldiers began collecting dust, and the stats showed it. They took the most logical course they could come up with.

Like most people on the boards, nerfers and non nerfers alike, I would have prefered small upward adjustments to the lesser used soldiers and weapons, as opposed to a nerf to the most widly used ones. The reason they nerf one, as opposed to raising all the others, has been explained in the past. Whether you agree with it or not, they have stated thier case as to why why nerfs are sometimes necessary, ie... the huge amount of work that across the board buffs can lead to.

You stated the case for the logic in why they chose to nerf the destroyer/typhoon combo youself.

"Finally there`s a decent soldier with a decent assault rifle"

When a vast majority of the players think this way, which seems to be the case, there is no reason to have the other soldier choices.

[nasteerus]

thank the matrix! someone out there is saying something good about the old typhoon. That gun should be the official "Hold the line" weapon. I was happy to finally start promoting my soldier class again. I only promote and re-spec the classes that I like. Give my destroyer back his toy! He wasn't done killing stuff Bioware!

[Joe1962]

Kudos, TC.

[Define Clarity]

Humming wrote...

*shrug*

Destroyer/Typhoon combo is still my favourite on Platinum. If it's not a viable option anymore, people will stop using it, thus making Bioware consider giving it a buff.

Look at the patch notes; what is given a buff? Most it is stuff that no-one is using anyway. What is 'nerfed'? Things that most players use.

I like these changes; having combinations that are clearly better than the other combinations makes for a boring game. I don't want lobbies that only consist of Destroyer/Typhoon or GI/Krysae combos. These 'nerfs' makes sure that someone that does not want to play the powerhouses doesn't get kicked in public lobbies.

Try some new guns. Perhaps you learn how to use them and start to love them? When was the last time you brought your Scorpion or Acolyte? I don't like these weapons, but I play with people who knows how and when to use them.

Also, don't listen to the herd on BSN. Remember when the Particle Rifle came? It was deemed to be the worst gun ever. Oh, so bad it was. It was a joke. But now? People keep posting how much better it is than the Typhoon and since it has a couple of numbers higher than the Typhoon people start using it. Same with Revenant. No-one mentioned this gun before the Typhoon 'nerf'. And that was way before the Typhoon was even released! Now it no longer has any drawbacks since it has a higher DPS than the Typhoon. Same with Harrier. Everyone complained about it needing to be buffed since it had no ammo. No one is complaining about that now since it is so much better than the Typhoon and no longer has any drawbacks.

Sorry for rambling.

tl;dr: Typhoon is OK.

Incorrect. Repeated use of "overpowered" or good builds makes the game boring for the player. No one has a gun to your head forcing you to use GI/Reegar.

Also false. The Revenant was brought to light again because it was the closest comparison in terms of DPS and weapon-class when it came to the Typhoon. It still has it's drawbacks such as; Bad spread, recoil, and decreased mobility. It's still a perfectly viable gun. When BoomDynamite created his comparison thread, people were more inclined to trying out Revenant/Destroyer.

The Harrier is still a problem when it comes to ammo on most classes. No one is complaining now because we have two new classes (Destroyer/Demolisher) which can utilize it better than before (Damage/Ammo). It still has a relatively high ROF and runs out of ammo fast. The Typhoon was in a unique spot due to the fact that it has nice damage, a deep clip, and it was almost handmade for the Destroyer, hence being a hold-the-line tankier Soldier.
tl;dr Typhoon is OK for a Rare. Most of your post is a bit overblown. Typhoon still needs to be rolled back.

[dddawda]

They nerfed it because of this
www.youtube.com/watch

I somewhat agree..but since bioware made this system with RNG packs and Ultra rare weapons..they should be a bit stronger.

Modifié par dddawda, 02 août 2012 - 03:14 .

[Kenadian]

Terminus Echoes wrote...

InTheZone wrote...

The Soldier class has the Human Soldier... Batarian Soldier... Vorcha... if you believe these classes are asthmatic then you just can't play them properly.

Out of all of those, I'd say that only the Vorcha is somewhat usable. But it, like the Batarian Soldier, are kind of like the Krogan. They're more meant for "up close and personal" combat, not conservative Platinum combat. This works better on Gold and below, as there is more infantry than bosses. They are all also outperformed by the other classes.

Perhaps I should rephrase that, though. I'm thinking in Platinum terms, not overall terms.

I'm sure you could do quite well with a HSo, BSo and even a TSo on Plat. The Vorcha's flamer + Reegar would melt any boss in your face.

[JG The Gamer]

Great read. Hopefully BW sees this and restores the Typhoon to its proper UR glory.

We need to keep this up until next Tuesday. And beyond if necessary.

/signed

[Gamemako]

Define Clarity wrote...

Incorrect. Repeated use of "overpowered" or good builds makes the game boring for the player. No one has a gun to your head forcing you to use GI/Reegar.

So then you propose that he lock himself out of all random games and solo everything so he doesn't have to deal with their nonsense? Hell, try to use a Drellguard in a platinum game. See if you don't get kicked.