317 réponses à ce sujet

[JaimasOfRaxis]

I encountered, earlier today, some Plat farmers on Firebase Glacier when I was hopping random games. They're already well-prepared for when the Slayer and Shadow get nerf-batted next due to their ability to hit through walls. Among other things, they mentioned farming tricks they can use on Rio, London, and even Reactor.

Believe me when I say the Smash nerf has not, and will not stop farming in the slightest. You could nerf every wall-pierce ability into uselessness, and it won't stop the farming attempts. It will, however, screw the community over and invite further bitterness and cynicism from a playerbase who already has justified doubts about this game's support.

[Bonza99]

The whole credit system begs for farming. People want better guns, they need lots of credits on a lottery system to get them, therefore they are likely to farm till the farm is dry or until they have what they want.

I tend to like a mix of both. I might farm a platinum game once or twice to keep my credits stocked, and then I play another one or two games of UUG with a class/loadout I think will be fun.

Modifié par Bonza99, 03 août 2012 - 03:12 .

[ToaOrka]

+9001 Internets

Seriously, OP pretty much summed up every problem with Bioware's logic.

[ll_valence_ll]

i dont understand whats so bad about farming its not hurting u in any way same goes to nerfers why do u care if he has a op weapon tht just means less atlas/primesetc to fight and huntermode needs to go back to normal cause the vision through walls sucks donky n uts by the time u see them their in your face by then if anything they should focus on fixing things instead of breaking them.... thank you for your time

[MP-Ryan]

The original post in this thread is bang-on.

The trouble, as I've said before, is that skill is only a minor factor in what keeps people out of higher difficulties. What actually keeps talented new players from moving above silver is unlocks, which is stupid.

Why, if I'm looking for more of a challenge, should I be essentially prevented from moving up because of gear you unlock RANDOMLY? Especially weapons. It creates a massive incentive for farming (I've done it) because you want to play higher difficulty, but to do so you need higher-tier weapons. To get higher-tier weapons, you need more credits. To get more credits, you either play more matches or harder matches. If you can't play more matches (job, family, life), then your choice is harder matches, which you can't play without higher-tier weapons. So instead, to beat the vicious cycle, you farm.

The store needs a preferential unlock system. Or an option to either use in-game credits randomly or real money to purchase specific upgrades. Something.

Otherwise, people - especially new players - will continue to farm. The more weapons they nerf - in particular, those easily unlocked - the more people are going to farm to get the better ones.

The best thing they could do is create a standardized DPS for each weapon tier (lower for common, higher for uncommon) and balance all of each rarity weapon to have the same base DPS, with each having different special abilities that increase effectiveness in certain circumstances and decrease it in others, but otherwise the weapons give the same general performance. That way, the unlocks affect the nuance of gameplay rather than acting as a barrier to new players who just haven't got the time in but do have the skill to do so.

Unlocks should add shiny new toys to play with, but the game should be playable (at all difficulty levels) for any level 20 player regardless of unlocks.

Oh, and all classes/races should be available without unlocking or be unlocked by class level rather than the RNG. How ridiculous that what you are able to play as depends on a random system that gives no weight to preference.

At any rate, until BioWare acknowledges that some people want a challenging game without spending hours and hours every day to get it, I will continue to both play U/U/G and to farm on specific maps, because I refuse to play at boring silver level just to get the unlocks I need to play in Gold/Platinum.  I've solo'd Bronze and Silver with nothing more than a Human Vanguard equipped with a Carnifex V now... I don't belong in silver, but the RNG creates some serious annoyance for my viability in gold as pretty much anything other than a Piranha-toting Kroguard.

Modifié par MP-Ryan, 03 août 2012 - 03:27 .

[himegoto]

Good read. I read the whole post and wholeheartedly agree.

The game currently is going in a vicious cycle and if this continues, all the players is just going to leave early. The store lottery system is already creating more harm than good if they continue to balance/nerf most of the things it's simply not rewarding anymore for anyone to want to play.

[Cellar_Cat]

There will be farmers as long as people have to grind for gear. Always. I don't know why they try to stop it (except for glitches), since there's no game economy to ruin - unless they expect these people to pay instead. Actually... yeah that's probably it.

If BioWare don't want people to farm, they should make a game people are happy to play for the sake of playing, NOT to get unlocks.

[bclagge]

+1

There has never been a truer posting on these forums.

[NihongoHiro]

I usually never read such lengthy posts, but the more I read I found myself agreeing completely. That's one of the best posts i've ever read.

[Impulse and Compulse]

I cannot salute you enough, sir. Excellent read, and very well written. (something all too rare in these forums..... >.>)

I farm from time to time so I can actually enjoy the game more when I just chill with friends, but I've never found my farming attempts to be afouled in the slightest by the nerfs, only by dumb people who come to FBWGG thinking that it will be the easiest thing and that they don't have to even try.

But meanwhile, the game is still plagued is horrifying bugs (SOMEBODY TELL ME WHY THE VANGUARD GLITCH IS STILL A THING. I'M NO PROGRAMMING EXPERT, BUT I'VE SEEN WAY MORE COMPLICATED BUGS WITH LESS INSIGHT TO THEIR PROBLEM FIXED IN LESS TIME) and underpowered weapons that need absolutely more priority. The highlight of my week is seeing new weapons buffed into the splotlight and made actually fun, while the negative side is seeing fun stuff made un-fun.

[Dracian]

OP, you should be rewarded by your walltext.

I am an honest player who plays for fun. I have farmed a little bit in the past, but now, I play for fun with 3 regular friends, and we play mostly on Silver, along with a few bronze game for levelling and some gold when we reach a decent level... And we only play on Random/Random, even on gold.

And I have to say that Geth are now a pain in the azz, not because it's challenging, but because they are OP.

I used to enjoy playing Sniping Infi, now I just find them useless on gold, thank to TC annihilation.

And I won't mention all the other nerfs that killed the fun of playing some weapons, skills and characters. Fun is the reason I play ME3MP. By constantly nerfing it, EA narrows the number of builds I enjoy playing.

When there will be no more remaining, I'll be out of the game. And I don't think I'm the only one to think that. Think about it, EA.

[Necrotron]

I agree on the Geth point. They were designed well and were really fun to play against, now they are just obnoxious to play against, still plenty beatable, but they just have cheap tactics now.

Modifié par Bathaius, 03 août 2012 - 03:57 .

[haisho]

OP is right and I wholeheartedly agree.

As long as the random store system exists and players have no intention of giving up their money to EA/BW, they can and will find ways to farm a higher difficulty with ease.

Two months is enough time to allow veteran players to familiarize themselves with AI behavior, and the longer the game runs, players will find more little nuances and tricks. It'd be a matter of time before we find legitimate ways to trivialize content regardless of difficulty, just like how players have exploited Firebase White Geth Gold.

And as long as players feel they need to hoard credits to get their weapons, they will continue to do so, even in the face of nerfs.

[OzBoss]

+1

Even though I play mostly silver/bronze my low weapon levels really keep me away from gold.

[Yosuke]

+1

I support nerfing things when warranted, but Bioware needs to address farming more in a way that will fix the core issues, such as poor/predictable AI and pathing on FBW.

[GDragonFly7]

I agree, BioWare is nerfing too hard - also they're nerfing the wrong things... They should rework the AI and the store, that would help a lot more than making guns useless.

[steverw1975]

Kuriiiiiii wrote...

Here's what you do.

Played FBWGG in the last hour? You get half credits from that map.
Played it again in the last hour? Another quater taken off.

Played against Geth in the last hour? Half credits (If you play against cerberus or reapers the timer resets)

DIVERSITY!

Seriously tired of people trying to tell others how they're allowed to play a game they paid for. I both farm and roam. Why? Because I've spent millions upon millions of credits and I'm still at harrier II and typhoon I. Because of the horrible odds of getting the weapons/gear I'm looking for I grind from time to time. It happens in any game with a set up like this, and I have no problem with it at all. Seriously, what's wrong with someone actually using their brain and coming up with a tactical plan that boosts their chance of success? If you're upset at the nerfs, then blame BioWare and those that come on this forum whining that everything needs to be nerfed because players they assume are inferior are keeping up with them or outscoring them. If you want to go after the farmers, how about we hit the speed runners too. That's farming too. How about if you hit a group at a spawn point once, the next time you hit a spawn point you only do half damage. Hit another spawn point, another quarter taken off. Use a missile to clear out one spawn point, the next missile is a dud.

DIVERSITY

Modifié par steverw1975, 03 août 2012 - 08:06 .

[Dama733]

I think right now Bioware needs to focus less on the Nerfing and more on the player feedback, and its our job as the ME community to help them with that in a positive way.

I believe a seperate forum or even a simple pinned thread just for the discussion of feedback on the changes would help this issue, and while we the community have been vocal about these issues, I feel that Bioware should try to take a more active part in the feedback process, listning and discussing the issues with the players would, I believe go along way to making the game more enjoyable for everyone

[Impulse and Compulse]

steverw1975 wrote...

Kuriiiiiii wrote...

Here's what you do.

Played FBWGG in the last hour? You get half credits from that map.
Played it again in the last hour? Another quater taken off.

Played against Geth in the last hour? Half credits (If you play against cerberus or reapers the timer resets)

DIVERSITY!

Seriously tired of people trying to tell others how they're allowed to play a game they paid for. I both farm and roam. Why? Because I've spent millions upon millions of credits and I'm still at harrier II and typhoon I. Because of the horrible odds of getting the weapons/gear I'm looking for I grind from time to time. It happens in any game with a set up like this, and I have no problem with it at all. Seriously, what's wrong with someone actually using their brain and coming up with a tactical plan that boosts their chance of success? If you're upset at the nerfs, then blame BioWare and those that come on this forum whining that everything needs to be nerfed because players they assume are inferior are keeping up with them or outscoring them. If you want to go after the farmers, how about we hit the speed runners too. That's farming too. How about if you hit a group at a spawn point once, the next time you hit a spawn point you only do half damage. Hit another spawn point, another quarter taken off. Use a missile to clear out one spawn point, the next missile is a dud.

DIVERSITY

I'm with steve. If there was another way to actually get good stuff, boosting would be significantly less prevalent. Making things worse is only going to make boosting worse, since people will always find a way.

[friedricethem0n]

N7 Destroyer is now officially known as the phoon-handler...

[Barge6000]

Brilliant post. It's such a shame be can't let this game be a romp and makes it a grind. Make our guns feel awesome and more people will line your greedy pockets in the store. I think this game would be much more fun if your gun annihilated mobs if you got the jump on them instead of reloading half way through a trooper. You would still get nailed if you got cocky or flanked and would encourage risk/reward instead of 90% of games where everyone hides behind a desk on White.

[xSNPx ZoDiaC]

Be careful my friend! You discovered the truth behind balances... rEApers have you in their sight now!

[Jebel Krong]

the problem with the game is the stupid weapon/item unlock system. it might have proved lucrative enough to fund some DLCs through the markeplace but adding grinding to random luck = unhappy players. so what d they learn to do? - find the easiest way to maximise their return: farming through to glitching. personally given all the other problems i have no problem with farming, hell i do it and will keep doing it till i actually get the weapons i want to use. then i can play all the maps how i want, and only for fun. sadly that day will probably be after the servers are shut off due to inactivity the rate it's going. as for glithers, they just ruin the experience altogether.

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 03 août 2012 - 09:44 .

[DanielsMind]

MP dev team should read this.