901 réponses à ce sujet

[ol MISAKA lo]

While I use the Typhoon on Silver & Gold, I find it to be alright, but not nearly as good as it once was. Then again, I get full-rev every time due to corner-glitch-shooting, so I think it's probably alot worse than it should be.

[Ronan Murphy]

This patch has drawn me out of the woodwork.

I don't understand some of these nerfs.The Falcon was understandable,the krysae was not due to the sheer length of time it still took to kill(maybe they should have changed it so it wouldn't stagger enemies) but the Typhoon...............honestly Bioware you guys need to stop listening to people who don't like accepting anything less than 1st in a lobby.The Typhoon was brilliant for Platinum and Gold matches(especially if you had bad teammates).
I shudder to think that the Piranha is probably going to be next.While you patch the game well for the most part,give us free DLC and really support this game very well you are totally destroying the experience imo.

This isn't a COD game where the community play in an annoying manner.It's a 3rd person horde based multiplayer.Let us have more powerful weapons.If you intended for all the weapons to have complete balance then buff the avenger,phaeston,disciple,raptor ect.....

Half of the guns are unusable on anything other than bronze and maybe silver.

[P51Mus7ang]

Rifneno wrote...

PKTracer wrote...

In all the missions I did today, I didn't see one Destroyer with a Typhoon.  I saw a lot of Destroyers with Revenants, Piranhas, and Strikers.  Combos that stood out were Piranha/Striker Destroyer and a GPS/Striker Destroyer.

God.  That's just depressing.

Did three pugs tonight, then met up with friends,  no one in pugs and all of my friends have put it aside also, I personally am running the Saber, I kind of like it and damage is good. Sometimes I will run the Harrier, just depends on the map the folks want to play.

It is interesting as a week ago in pugs even characters that should not have it on (Asari) were running it, I am hoping that the numbers get someone's attention.

[Assassin9589]

loved this gun before all the nerfs. still love it after. I feel it's pretty balanced as is. works great for taking down bosses. phantoms with their obsessive flipping can be a little annoying though.

[ryoldschool]

@immortal you say the gun is fine for you post nerf. Specter showed video evidence that the gun got nerfed in half. So how is it OK for you? Do you prefer it as an only weapon in a build? Specter in his platinum solo mainly used GPS and only typhoon for bosses. So it may still be OK, but is it good anymore, compared to other less rare options?

[parico]

I ran with it on my destroyer in silver for a few matches then went back to my phaeston X and my game scores improved. Its done for me now since its too heavy, not much more accurate than other choices and it takes time to get it going so I wont use it again. RIP Typhoon. Its too bad my sentinel krogan was having a blast before they nerfed it.

Modifié par parico, 05 août 2012 - 02:05 .

[Impulse and Compulse]

I tried it. I only have it at level I, and honestly thought it was absolutely perfect before. It was hella powerful; but it was hardly viable on almost any class that relied on powers, kicked like a mule, took forever to spin up, and ran through ammo as fast as a Reegar.

Yes, that damage bonus against non-health protections is nice and all, but it doesn't change the fact that you still took away a substantial amount of damage because it was good when used with the one class it was designed for.

We've had enough of these nerfs. Honestly, what is it going to take to get you guys to focus on buffing stuff that we've complained about being terrible since the game's launch, or maybe even fixing the variety of borderline game-breaking bugs like the Vanguard glitch or the numerous amount of power upgrades that have literally no effect? How about you guys take your time and effort and put it into patching those, instead of weakening weapons in a non-competive game where a bunch of whiners can't stand to see somebody do slightly better than them?

[Raging Nug]

ryoldschool wrote...

@immortal you say the gun is fine for you post nerf. Specter showed video evidence that the gun got nerfed in half. So how is it OK for you? Do you prefer it as an only weapon in a build? Specter in his platinum solo mainly used GPS and only typhoon for bosses. So it may still be OK, but is it good anymore, compared to other less rare options?

You've got to remember that the point of nerfing is to bring balance. The Black card weapons are only marginally better than their Gold card counterparts - worse when you factor in that you'll usually be comparing a level X Gold weapon to a level II Black card because of how difficult they are to obtain.

The Typhoon was overpowered. Phenomenal and wonderful as it was - it was overpowered compared to the other weapons in the game. The Kishok and Krysae had the same overabundance of amazing, and because of that they needed to be brought down to the level of the other weapons.

Is it good compared to the other less rare weapons? For sure. I'll take it over the GPR or the Falcon any day. Whether it still does what it could two weeks ago is a different question entirely, and I think that's what a lot of people will be complaining about.

[WrathAscending]

Yajuu Omoi wrote...

@WrathAscending

That's exactly what i meant.

When farming, you're basically relying on that counter to keep you alive and shooting at a shorter range. Therefore the Typhoon will be mere dead weight to you, the Rev would fare much better, I AM surprised you gave up on it, but I can understand where you are coming from, and as far as the Harrier goes...I like the thing...nuff said.

Not so much. Standing behind the counter provides a great degree of cover while unloading on enemies coming down the stairs to the right, and even when there were no enemies spawning upstairs and I could just concentrate on a Prime (or whatever) standing almost still outside I was still quite exposed to enemy fire, to the point that emptying the Piranha's clip took less time, was safer, and delivered better damage. And that was despite having the Warfighter V package equipped and an AR Amp III on.

As it was, the Harrier was miles ahead of the Revenant and Typhoon in delivering damage. It just runs out of ammunition way too quickly, especially on a RoF Destroyer.

I only got the Typhoon after the first nerf; it felt fine then. After the second nerf, though? It sits on the shelf and gathers dust. While I do change my arsenal (especially if I know what map the squad will be on before deploying), the Typhoon doesn't even enter into consideration.

Most Typhoons I see in use are Level I and swapped for something else after a match. I think the overwhelming majority of players have realised it's just not worth it; I see more Falcons, Strikers, and Harriers on Destroyers than any other assault rifle, and Turians usually have the Phaeston or Revenant instead.

Modifié par WrathAscending, 05 août 2012 - 02:29 .

[Immortal Strife]

ryoldschool wrote...

@immortal you say the gun is fine for you post nerf. Specter showed video evidence that the gun got nerfed in half. So how is it OK for you? Do you prefer it as an only weapon in a build? Specter in his platinum solo mainly used GPS and only typhoon for bosses. So it may still be OK, but is it good anymore, compared to other less rare options?

I tried the revenant and it's too inaccurate for my taste. The typhoon is accurate and still deals good damage and that is why I find it to be very useful. I never called for this gun to be nerfed and I never though it was op. I'm just stating that it is far from bad post nerf, or at least the level X is. The Krysae got slammed much harder than the Typhoon and warrants more discussion IMO.

Modifié par Immortal Strife, 05 août 2012 - 02:33 .

[Rifneno]

Typhoon didn't deserve a nerf at all. Its power was fine. Extremely high dps? Sure, but it had enough negatives to warrant that. Ultra rare, it weighed as much as a yahg with an eating disorder, and the rev up time meant serious risk in gold/platinum.

I look forward to the DLC that lets us use the krysae in SP. If the nerfers are to be believed, we'll get a whole new ending because it should be possible to just straight up kill Harbinger with the krysae.

[Ogrinash]

You can kill the universe with the original Krysae by just firing it.

[Lyria]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Just to clarify a few things on the recent N7 Typhoon balance changes...

We've done a lot of internal tests on the N7 Typhoon comparing it to other assault rifles and other weapons, and even with the recent nerf it is still incredibly powerful. One of the reasons for this is that the weapon has an inherit 50% damage bonus versus armor, shields, and barriers. This far outclasses other weapons in terms of damage bonuses against resistances. The Revenant, for example, does not get this bonus and does regular damage to armor, shields, and barriers.

As always, we'll keep an eye on the balance of the N7 Typhoon, but if you have the weapon please test it out in game against different enemies to see how it feels. The numbers can often be deceiving so it's difficult to tell how effective a weapon is on paper.

Nerfing the N7 Typhoon seems to defeat the purpose of making it an Ultra Rare.  While some enterprizing individuals have managed to get it to rank X, others have only just recieved it.  A few of the videos showcasing the might of the Typhoon fail to showcase how powerful the gun is on its own and instead make use of Assault Rifle Amps, Gear, Warp Ammo, a Stabilization mod, Devastator Mode, and other damage buffing abilities. With such things, even the Revenant X would be leathal.  

Actually, that brings me to my main point, the N7 Typhoon in its current itteration is just a Revenant with built in bonus versus barriers, armor, etc.  Even with the damage bonus, a Revenant I seems to be just as powerful as a Typhoon I.

I find playing a Soldier on Gold and Platinum extremely annoying.  The various characters in the soldier class are lacking the "oomph" needed to compete on the higher difficulties.  They derive their ability to kill from their use of guns.  Adepts could take a Shuriken to a gold match and they will still do good as their killing ability comes from their powers.  When a Soldier gets its guns nerfed, it becomes even more useless on gold.  Without using the highest level of amps, gear, ammo, and armor abilities, the N7 Typhoon takes too long to rev up to its full damage potential, and by that point the enemy unit has been killed by the guy who could spam 10 grenades, or the Asari biotic bombshell.

The N7 Typhoon was one of the few weapons that allowed soldiers to compete with the power spamming classes on the higher difficulties.  Even with the awesomeness of the Devastator, the N7 Tyhpoon just doesn't pack the punch it once did.  I'm all for balance, but balance should consider how difficult a gun is to aquire. Morover, the gun should be better than what came before it if it would allow a under used class to shine at the higher difficulties that previously didn't have such an advantage.

[Tal_Elmar]

I'd gladly test it, Eric, but I STILL after 3+ millions spent on packs don't have it! All I'm getting is lvl 4 ammo. Would be great to change it instead of nerfing every good weapon

[Rifneno]

There sure are a lot of "I've spent craploads of creds and I still don't even have the first level of it" posts since the hyperbolists like to judge its pre-nerf dps based on rank x with warp ammo IV and ARRA III.

[Xaijin]

Any of you guys reading this topic can show me equal speed of taking down Atlas on Platinium with any other weapon , full gear&consumables on?

Geth engineer, hunter mode 6, revenant X AR V, ARA III, Stab III, AP/Warp V

Salarian Engineer, single target ED 6, Piranha X, WARP IV, Shotgun V, SA III

TSo, Damage Acc 6, Prox 6 Revenant X/Hurricane VI+/Hornet X, warp IV, appropriate mods, stab III+

GI, Hunter mode 6, Prox 6, pick a damn weapon and mods.

Please keep your foot away from your mouth in the future, thanks.

Nerfing the N7 Typhoon seems to defeat the purpose of making it an Ultra Rare.

The elephant in the room is the store and URs period. They should be flagship weapons and most of them aren't. In fact most of them underperform against the gold equivalent. The store in and of itself prevents them being as good as they should be, because the outcry will be haves versus have-nots, which BW has been rather keen to ignore in the past since the outcry over the FirePower Pack. It's simply an ill thought decision, simple as.

If a weapon costs 15 million credits to max on average, it damn well better be worth the money. Current blacks aren't, period. You can't even argue that objectively, as stats are a known quantity.

Modifié par Xaijin, 05 août 2012 - 04:21 .

[Gamemako]

Rifneno wrote...

Or it simply doesn't work. How many things in this game are just broken?

Lots, but in this case, evidence shows that it being fully broken is extremely unlikely. Quite the contrary, the most accurate model suggests that the bonus is there and is half of the ramp-up bonus.

Yajuu Omoi wrote...

Gamemako, I've seen you here on countless threads always doing your best to troll everyone. Just stop, its become pathetic.

Here are the numbers for the Revenant X w/ Stabil;ity Damp and AP Mod, PPR X with Extended Clip and AP Mod, and the Typhoon X with Extended Barrel and AP Mod.
And these are NOT from my Manifest, they are from IN GAME. I don't even have a PPR, so that simply proves that.

                  Revenant X   |   PPR X   |   Typhoon X
Clip: ----------- 60 ------------ 180 --------- 100
Reserve: ----- 480 ---------- ~~~ --------- 500
Accuracy: ---- 15 ------------ 40 ----------- 30
Recoil: -------- 0.2 ----------- 0 ------------ 1.1
Burst DPS: -- 861.3 -------- 1226.9 ---- 1109.6
Sustained: -- 656.3 -------- 895.3 ------- 836.2
vs. Armor: ---- 441 ---------- 725 --------- 694
Reload: ------- 2.9 ----------- 5 ------------ 2.9
Penetration: -- 1.10 ---------- 1.10 ------ 1.35


And look, The PPR, and Typhoon (both URs) outclass the Revneant (Rare)..on EVERYTHING.

Oh look, this ignorant fool again claiming more ridiculous rubbish.

1) Lol @ using AP mods in a DPS comparison. Nice failure to comprehend the game mechanics.

2) Lol @ using disparate mods. That'll give you totally comparable numbers, amirite?

3) Lol @ PPR numbers. Protip: the gun uses 2 ammo per shot once charged. Your average burst damage with a clip is 1068.64, not 1226.9. You also made the error of including only 26 shots in the warmup where 27 are actually fired. And then you went and assumed a 5-second reload, which is also hilarious because that's also not how the gun works -- 5 seconds is the full animation on overloading, and 4 seconds is how long it takes to start regenerating ammo. The actual full cycle time on overloading is around 6 seconds; if you stop just prior, it takes about 4 seconds to get back to full (there's a ~1.5s delay followed by a ~2.5s recharge, independent of total clip size -- bigger clip, same recharge time). Instead, the actual sustained DPS is to the tune of 730. I could do a frame-by-frame to ensure that things are working exactly as anticipated (because I actually have the PPR and you don't), but that's a rough number for you.

//EDIT: Thanks to Cyonan, I know know that the actual regen is 35% per second with a 1.5s delay. The maximum possible sustained DPS you can get with the PPR is 707.74.

4) Lol @ you failing to understand Typhoon mechanics, omitting the 25% protection multiplier.

5) Lol @ whatever the hell that sustained DPS on the Rev X is. You used a 1.73s reload time. That's just plain bizarre: full reload is 2.9 and canceled is 1.334 (0.460 ejectshellcasingratio on 2.9 base). Arbitrarily adding 0.4s doesn't make sense in any context: a gamer's reaction time is to the tune of 0.15s, and it won't take him very long to learn to anticipate properly and do much better than pure reaction.

6) Lol @ doing armor calculations without character modifiers. Protip: armor DR is applied as a flat reduction after multipliers, so doing calculations on base damage is pretty worthless.

7) And to your final point, if you include a clip mod on both the PPR and Rev and properly RC the Rev, the sustained DPS of the Rev is just under 760, making it actually superior to the PPR on a sustained basis.

Now go away and stop spreading misinformation.

Modifié par Gamemako, 05 août 2012 - 05:52 .

[Fang92]

My opinion: roll back the nerf, increase the weight. lower shield and barrier multipliers, increase armor one. Put shield and barrier multipliers on other weapons as well.

[RainMane]

Just because your good players post videos wrecking everything with top tier consumables doesn't mean your average player will do the same. Taking an average player's skill and consumables into account, I think the Typhoon's nerf was a mistake.

[Gamemako]

RainMane wrote...

Just because your good players post videos wrecking everything with top tier consumables doesn't mean your average player will do the same. Taking an average player's skill and consumables into account, I think the Typhoon's nerf was a mistake.

Actually, he didn't use a barrel or gear, sacrificing 40% weapon damage. He could have killed even faster. Furthermore, your average player certainly is able to stand in one place and hold the trigger for 6 seconds while a very large target melts away.

//EDIT: the 40% weapon damage ultimately translates to a little less than a 20% average damage and DPS boost because it is additive. Just FYI.

Modifié par Gamemako, 05 août 2012 - 05:32 .

[IrishDeath420]

Gamemako wrote...

RainMane wrote...

Just because your good players post videos wrecking everything with top tier consumables doesn't mean your average player will do the same. Taking an average player's skill and consumables into account, I think the Typhoon's nerf was a mistake.

Actually, he didn't use a barrel or gear, sacrificing 40% weapon damage. He could have killed even faster. Furthermore, your average player certainly is able to stand in one place and hold the trigger for 6 seconds while a very large target melts away.

//EDIT: the 40% weapon damage ultimately translates to a little less than a 20% average damage and DPS boost because it is additive. Just FYI.

You just really enjoy arguing with people don't you

[Rifneno]

IrishDeath420 wrote...

Gamemako wrote...

RainMane wrote...

Just because your good players post videos wrecking everything with top tier consumables doesn't mean your average player will do the same. Taking an average player's skill and consumables into account, I think the Typhoon's nerf was a mistake.

Actually, he didn't use a barrel or gear, sacrificing 40% weapon damage. He could have killed even faster. Furthermore, your average player certainly is able to stand in one place and hold the trigger for 6 seconds while a very large target melts away.

//EDIT: the 40% weapon damage ultimately translates to a little less than a 20% average damage and DPS boost because it is additive. Just FYI.

You just really enjoy arguing with people don't you

I should find that post where he said to stop whining and just hack your coalesced.  That was epic.

[Gamemako]

PKTracer wrote...

Gamemako -- Sp3cter's video didn't lie.  The math is broken. The devs who coded this have yet to respond, so I'm not sure they even know what's broken.  I'm puzzled why you push against the obvious: Typhoon does half damage now.  Either you say that's fine, or you say it isn't.  Most of the people posting don't think it's fine. 

My post was in regard to the pre-nerf video. In that video, someone holds the trigger for 6 seconds while standing in one spot. Any monkey in the storm can do that quite easily. That is not skill. That is why the gun needed a nerf. Whether it deserved the magnitude of nerf it got is up for debate.

And again, I did show previously that the most consistent model suggests that the 50% multiplier Eric talked about is tied to the ramp-up, which would cause a 37.5% nerf instead of the initially-apparent 25%. Again, I do not know whether this was intended, and again, the entire thing not functioning is essentially impossible.

[pmi0126]

I picked it up the day it came out & immediately tried it. I'm not a big on machine guns type of player but I liked it. I noticed problems with it in cqb but not so much that I'd avoid it entirely.

After the penetration Nerf (for lack of better term), I didn't notice a difference at all. I usually don't spam shot walls, so that's probably why.

After this latest Nerf though, i've played with it 3 or 4 times & even though I got an upgrade for it, I don't see myself using it very often.

As I said, I'm not a machine gun fan but I use the revenant from time to time. If I'm going to use an Mg, it'll be that one. The rev doesn't have as much ammo but its stability & accuracy are similar enough that to me, the only separation is the damage & the damage plus ramping rof just doesn't cut it for me after the Nerf.

Just my opinion but it has n7 on it for a reason. And yea its power creep & that's a valid argument. Thing is, why introduce a gun then cut its damage so soon? At minimum, I think you all should have waited longer. At best, the first Nerf was all it needed.