901 réponses à ce sujet

[Vaneke]

I like the Destroyer very much, as such, whoever came up with it, great job.
I feel the Typhoon has been designed purely for him, so i have been playing alot with it.

If i wouldn't check the forums i wouldn't have noticed the changes. The weapon is, for being an "ultra rare" very weak if not modded. I find it to be purely a support weapon.
Unmodded, taking out, for example an atlas alone on platinum, takes time, alot.
Geth infiltrators take it out with an Piranha in less then two clips. But that's another discussion.

i don't mind what you change to it.

Howhever, i do have one question, if you feel like answering it.

I was in a platinum game few days ago, 3 Destroyers, and 1 Demolisher.

The other two Destroyers besides me carried a Harrier X, i had a Typhoon equipped and modded, and tried very hard, but ended third, the first destroyer had +250.000 points, next one had +150.000 points, i had 75.000.

I couldn't get that much kills, few kills i did got was because they had to reload. But in that game i really noticed the shear power of the Harrier. (never used it much)
Why did you feel you had to change a recently released weapon (being "ultra rare", so in some way should be powerfull), when the Harrier has been around much longer, and is seemingly way more powerfull?

[Poison_Berrie]

Sp3c7eR wrote...

Sorry, I think in my OP I said "half armor". Before nerf it took me around 160 to 175 bullets to take down an Atlas with Warp ammo IV and full equipment. Post-nerf it took me 215 bullets to take down all shields + 1 bar less than half of Atlas armor (if Armor is 20 bars, I took down 9). Meaning, even with full ammo capacity this gun has to reload (wasting a lot of time) and ramp up again in order to kill a boss.

Do you remember how much you took off an ATLAS with 1 clip post-nerf?

Modifié par Poison_Berrie, 03 août 2012 - 09:14 .

[Ares Caesar]

NeferiusX3 wrote...

Ares Caesar wrote...

NeferiusX3 wrote...
No, he didn't.

YES, he did.

http://social.biowar...3153/2#13493707

Thats the original post in question it has NOT been edited.

That's not the post you quoted.

Yeah, as I was clarifying what Sp373r (or whatever the F its spelled) said originally... his post didnt quote the original which is why it wasnt captured in it. Figured anyone with half a brain could figure out that it wasnt losing THAT much damage (come on kill 1 atlas prenerf to 1/2 shields damage postnerf?)

[Ares Caesar]

Poison_Berrie wrote...

Sp3c7eR wrote...

Sorry, I think in my OP I said "half armor". Before nerf it took me around 160 to 175 bullets to take down an Atlas with Warp ammo IV and full equipment. Post-nerf it took me 215 bullets to take down all shields + 1 bar less than half of Atlas armor (if Armor is 20 bars, I took down 9). Meaning, even with full ammo capacity this gun has to reload (wasting a lot of time) and ramp up again in order to kill a boss.

Do you remember how much you took off an ATLAS with 1 clip post-nerf?

He just told you... at least on an N7 Destroyer. 214 bullets is 1 clip for a properly specced Destroyer.

[Sp3c7eR]

I'm working on a comparison video of pre- and post- nerf Typhoon and I'll post it in a few mins. That will clear up the confusion, I hope.

[Offender_Mullet]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

As always, we'll keep an eye on the balance of the N7 Typhoon, but if you have the weapon please test it out in game against different enemies to see how it feels. The numbers can often be deceiving so it's difficult to tell how effective a weapon is on paper.

It is fine. I've used it against all the enemy factions on every difficulty. On gold/platinum I throw on an assault rifle gear amp V + assault rifle amp III + level IV ammo power.

Sure, it doesn't decimiate an Atlas or other boss enemies like it did pre-nerf, but it's still a badass weapon on the Destroyer (and I've always had the extra ammo power maxed, not rate-of-fire...even pre-nerf).

I keep forgetting to use it with a Turian Solder + marksman though. That has to be fun.

Signed,
A Not Disappointed Anti-Nerfer

[Ares Caesar]

Vaneke wrote...

I like the Destroyer very much, as such, whoever came up with it, great job.
I feel the Typhoon has been designed purely for him, so i have been playing alot with it.

If i wouldn't check the forums i wouldn't have noticed the changes. The weapon is, for being an "ultra rare" very weak if not modded. I find it to be purely a support weapon.
Unmodded, taking out, for example an atlas alone on platinum, takes time, alot.
Geth infiltrators take it out with an Piranha in less then two clips. But that's another discussion.

i don't mind what you change to it.

Howhever, i do have one question, if you feel like answering it.

I was in a platinum game few days ago, 3 Destroyers, and 1 Demolisher.

The other two Destroyers besides me carried a Harrier X, i had a Typhoon equipped and modded, and tried very hard, but ended third, the first destroyer had +250.000 points, next one had +150.000 points, i had 75.000.

I couldn't get that much kills, few kills i did got was because they had to reload. But in that game i really noticed the shear power of the Harrier. (never used it much)
Why did you feel you had to change a recently released weapon (being "ultra rare", so in some way should be powerfull), when the Harrier has been around much longer, and is seemingly way more powerfull?

The Harrier is limited by ammo capacity... if they're getting ammo from a Demolishers pylon every 10 seconds, its pretty easy to negate that "weakness"

Besides you're also taking 1 game as a complete comparison? A lot depends on who got the actual "kill" as you get a ridiculous amount of points for killing a Banshee, Brute, Atlas, Phantom, or any other boss, even if you actually only killed the last little bits of armor/health... so you could have been doing TONS of damage (which you probably were) and the Harrier Destroyers just happened to sneak in the last few shots of damage for the kill.

Pre-nerf on a Destroyer the Typhoon was easily more effective than a Harrier.

On most classes the entire ammo capacity of a Harrier isnt enough to take out 1 Atlas on Gold (not using equipment).... which is what "balances" the weapon.

Modifié par Ares Caesar, 03 août 2012 - 09:24 .

[CHAw]

While I'm not completely certain I agree with BioWare's assessment of the current iteration of the N7 Typhoon, I do appreciate the fact that they have explained their reasoning for the latest change.

So thank you, Eric and Derek, for your continued communication with the community.

[Shikyo808]

nerf was unneeded. All nerfs are unneeded seeing as its a coop game. Every time a gun that actually feels different is released it gets nerf into oblivion and we are back to seeing the same 3 guns used and it makes me just want to stop playing.

[UKStory135]

IrishDeath420 wrote...

UKStory135 wrote...

Eric Fagnan wrote...

Just to clarify a few things on the recent N7 Typhoon balance changes...

We've done a lot of internal tests on the N7 Typhoon comparing it to other assault rifles and other weapons, and even with the recent nerf it is still incredibly powerful. One of the reasons for this is that the weapon has an inherit 50% damage bonus versus armor, shields, and barriers. This far outclasses other weapons in terms of damage bonuses against resistances. The Revenant, for example, does not get this bonus and does regular damage to armor, shields, and barriers.

As always, we'll keep an eye on the balance of the N7 Typhoon, but if you have the weapon please test it out in game against different enemies to see how it feels. The numbers can often be deceiving so it's difficult to tell how effective a weapon is on paper.

So basically, what the Typhoon is meant to do is be absolutely godly against bosses, while being only above average against mooks?  I like that concept.  It would be really helpful, and might even slightly reduce some butthurt on here if we knew things like that.

Although it doesn't seem to work that way at all. I find myself switching to the Pirhana to take down bosses, and any enemy close up, and only use the Typhoon for distance now.

I've always done that, anyway.

[Lambda_00]

I would also like to point out that a reduced damage output for a suppression type LMG would be good in theory, but completely falls apart in practice in this game.

The reason is due to two factors:
-Suppression fire is generally used to keep enemy heads down so that they cannot fire back as effectively and are forced to seek cover primarily.  Damage output is secondary.
-Unless you actually hit the enemies in ME3MP, they will not seek out cover if you fire near them (even within 1-10 meters distance).

[ryoldschool]

CHAw wrote...

While I'm not completely certain I agree with BioWare's assessment of the current iteration of the N7 Typhoon, I do appreciate the fact that they have explained their reasoning for the latest change.

So thank you, Eric and Derek, for your continued communication with the community.

???  "We've done a lot of internal tests on the N7 Typhoon comparing it to other assault rifles and other weapons, and even with the recent nerf it is still incredibly powerful. One of the reasons for this is that the weapon has an inherit 50% damage bonus versus armor, shields, and barriers. This far outclasses other weapons in terms of damage bonuses against resistances."

That does not stack with a lot of players experience in-game.  Hopefully Sp3c7eR will post his video.

Also if what they say is correct, then why did they not test is before they released it?

[Omnifarious Nef]

Ares Caesar wrote...

NeferiusX3 wrote...

Ares Caesar wrote...

NeferiusX3 wrote...
No, he didn't.

YES, he did.

http://social.biowar...3153/2#13493707

Thats the original post in question it has NOT been edited.

That's not the post you quoted.

Yeah, as I was clarifying what Sp373r (or whatever the F its spelled) said originally... his post didnt quote the original which is why it wasnt captured in it. Figured anyone with half a brain could figure out that it wasnt losing THAT much damage (come on kill 1 atlas prenerf to 1/2 shields damage postnerf?)

How am I supposed to know that? I heard they nerfed it, and that it was around gold grade now. Do I have magical math skills now? I can just caculate numbers off the top of my head? 4 * X 4 (3) edr dk lkej ;FJ oe FFE ASDFGERP3NI5FK.... E'hem. Wait, wait wait wait. Are you calling me stupid? Is that what you're doing?

Modifié par NeferiusX3, 03 août 2012 - 09:31 .

[a-karpen]

ryoldschool wrote...

CHAw wrote...

While I'm not completely certain I agree with BioWare's assessment of the current iteration of the N7 Typhoon, I do appreciate the fact that they have explained their reasoning for the latest change.

So thank you, Eric and Derek, for your continued communication with the community.

???  "We've done a lot of internal tests on the N7 Typhoon comparing it to other assault rifles and other weapons, and even with the recent nerf it is still incredibly powerful. One of the reasons for this is that the weapon has an inherit 50% damage bonus versus armor, shields, and barriers. This far outclasses other weapons in terms of damage bonuses against resistances."

That does not stack with a lot of players experience in-game.  Hopefully Sp3c7eR will post his video.

Also if what they say is correct, then why did they not test is before they released it?

This.

[Lambda_00]

PKTracer wrote...

Lambda_00 wrote...

I would also like to point out that a reduced damage output for a suppression type LMG would be good in theory, but completely falls apart in practice in this game.

The reason is due to two factors:
-Suppression fire is generally used to keep enemy heads down so that they cannot fire back as effectively and are forced to seek cover primarily.  Damage output is secondary.
-Unless you actually hit the enemies in ME3MP, they will not seek out cover if you fire near them (even within 1-10 meters distance).

I like the possible idea of phantoms running to cover when getting hit with suppressive fire and Banshees teleporting back to the spawn point

It's probably not terribly a bright idea to be implemented, considering the engine they're using.
Even the Reality Virtual engine that calculates all projecticles/impacts serverside tends to bog things down quite dramatically (then again, RV Engine is calculating per bullet, so that might be part of the issue).
I'd honestly hate to see how the Unreal Engine would handle this. Personally I'm pretty sure that it might melt most current-gen consoles and low-end PCs.

Modifié par Lambda_00, 03 août 2012 - 09:34 .

[Ares Caesar]

Lambda_00 wrote...

I would also like to point out that a reduced damage output for a suppression type LMG would be good in theory, but completely falls apart in practice in this game.

The reason is due to two factors:
-Suppression fire is generally used to keep enemy heads down so that they cannot fire back as effectively and are forced to seek cover primarily.  Damage output is secondary.
-Unless you actually hit the enemies in ME3MP, they will not seek out cover if you fire near them (even within 1-10 meters distance).

Agreed.

Suppresive Fire - as far as this game is concerned is completely worthless. This isnt Battlefield 3 where enemies screens get blurred and they lose accuracy when firing at you or run away/take cover.

If enemies actually bunkered down, retreated, and lost accuracy when returning fire while "suppressed" it'd actually have a point... but this game is about DPS and nothing else, ESPECIALLY on Gold/Platinum when Bosses are swarming you.... those Banshees and Geth Primes dont look very "suppressed" to me, despite several players shooting everything they have at them.

[Reapinger]

xTexas Ripper wrote...

1. UR's should kick ass

2. I assume you test weapons before you release them so why is this a problem now?


i call b.s.

According to the Krysae double nerf and now this double nerf, I fail to see how pre-release testing does any good if you're just going to destory it's capabilities. 

[shaorang]

then why this gun is even UR if it should not perform greater than the other weapons?
huge sacrifice on recharge speed and gets some hot firepower - is it wrong?
more nerfs on typhoon will make one more scrap weapon and take away one more tactical choice (which is very fun and one of the reasons of playing MP). I have Typhoon X and used it with various classes under various circumstances, here is my thought - DO NOT touch anything except the weight. like increasing it x1.5 or x 2.0 , whatever. you guys made this weap as a LMG and made great - THINK about it if you have some tea-time, for god's sakes !

[Clarkkent434]

 It think it was good on paper but in really game practice it does not match. Numbers and experiences are two different thing. On paper the AP(50% armor damge and .25 meter penetration.) of the Typhoon is equal to AP rounds 1  which is fine for bronze and silver game from my test of characters. But on gold and platinum it sucks. I now take the AP mod or rounds for gold or platinum. I know the AP mod is night and day. Look at the ammo statics below and do the math. Typhoon number don't match with in game expierence.
Look here for Ammo statistics. https://docs.google....EE&output=html' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'>https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0ArNVjEsDluBFdHdMZlltdVFuNmFKS1c0bkl6WG5PUEE&output=html 
Remeber AP mod is like AP ammo 2.5 becasue its Armor reduction of 65% and Penetration distance +1m.

Modifié par Clarkkent434, 03 août 2012 - 10:04 .

[Gamemako]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

One of the reasons for this is that the weapon has an inherit 50% damage bonus versus armor, shields, and barriers. This far outclasses other weapons in terms of damage bonuses against resistances.

Holy ****, we've been misinterpreting that the whole time. No wonder I was still crushing things post-nerf.

So the Typhoon is not only hyper-accurate, it deals 50% more DPS against shields, barrier, and armor than the Rev. Oh God. The gun actually needs another nerf...

[Rifneno]

xis3 wrote...

so it take around 18-20 seconds to kill an atlas in plat ? ( with your buid )
I can down it with my revenant X in 13-14 (densified ammo V, ARRA III, warp IV , EB PA), so yea something is wrong.

third edit, just tried with my typhoon I, desified ammo V, ARRA III, warp IV, EM EB, took me 12 seconds, nothing is wrong the gun is fine.

LOL. ... Oh, you're serious. ... ROFL. That just makes it funnier.

Lambda_00 wrote...

I would also like to point out that a reduced damage output for a suppression type LMG would be good in theory, but completely falls apart in practice in this game.

The reason is due to two factors:
-Suppression fire is generally used to keep enemy heads down so that they cannot fire back as effectively and are forced to seek cover primarily. Damage output is secondary.
-Unless you actually hit the enemies in ME3MP, they will not seek out cover if you fire near them (even within 1-10 meters distance).

Agreed. This isn't real life. Suppression fire doesn't work in this game.
"There is no self-preservation in these machines!" - Javik upon his fire firefight with the geth. And he's right. Suppression fire works because people have self-preservation instincts. They don't want to die. I've seen more self-preservation instincts in a game of Lemmings than ME3.

Unrelated to suppressive fire: I'm still wondering if he's talking about the ramp up damage modifier that we all already knew about. Without that mod, the typhoon only hits a little harder and a little faster than the locust.

[TMB903]

Change it to a 1.75 modifier and increase it's weight so only the Destroyer can use it( It's obvious this gun was meant for him)...I nicknamed my Typhoon "Old Painless" (Predator FTW) and I'll still use it but not as much