1214 réponses à ce sujet

[Seival]

Isz Niv wrote...

In my opinion the Synthesis and control endings end the trilogy. But the Shepard lives destroyed ending is different. It leaves more questions in the air rather then answering them.What Iam trying to say is that if you look at the DLC that is coming out and the ones that have just been released each adds something about the reapers. In leviathan it introduces their creators and omega and citadel DLC are more than likely going to have something reaper involved.What Iam trying to say is that in the destroy ending the reapers themselves have been defeated, but what happens to their bodies, these leaves questions that only the future and Bioware know of.

A really good story always leave some questions. Questions, that reader can answer only by himself. Each ME ending leaves such questions even after EC and Leviathan releases.

Modifié par Seival, 15 septembre 2012 - 07:15 .

[Seival]

This is only partially ending-related, but still want to share my new fan art. Hope you will enjoy it

[Xilizhra]

P.S. Please, be polite and constructive. Remember, anger is counter-productive and can do nothing good. Let's show BioWare some support. They deserved it.

The people who worked hard and passionately to produce work for bad ideas deserve support. The people who came up with and forced said bad ideas to begin with do not.

[Mazebook]

Xilizhra wrote...

P.S. Please, be polite and constructive. Remember, anger is counter-productive and can do nothing good. Let's show BioWare some support. They deserved it.

The people who worked hard and passionately to produce work for bad ideas deserve support. The people who came up with and forced said bad ideas to begin with do not.

I thought it was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. But support is support i guess.

[Xilizhra]

maaaze wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

P.S. Please, be polite and constructive. Remember, anger is counter-productive and can do nothing good. Let's show BioWare some support. They deserved it.

The people who worked hard and passionately to produce work for bad ideas deserve support. The people who came up with and forced said bad ideas to begin with do not.

I thought it was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. But support is support i guess.

That part wasn't bad, certainly. I like the fact that the Reapers had more depth. Even the form it took wasn't horrible; I don't really hate the Catalyst or anything. The only thing that bugs me is that there's no way for Shepard to survive without committing genocide, and I don't believe it was a good way to end a game with such character focus, everything being such vague smears, in addition to choices that rather came out of nowhere.

[Nkaj]

Loved Me2/3 but the endings were so disappointing. No mention of what the actual consequences of my actions were (I know there is in Extended cut but even they were disappointing) and after all of my epic adventures with my squadmates, I don't even see most of them in the final flashbacks. Plus, Garrus and Liara were my squadmates in the final mission and I didn't see them at all in the ending, did they die at the beam? Major Coats reports that everyone failed to get to the beam so I guess they are.

[Seival]

Xilizhra wrote...

maaaze wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

P.S. Please, be polite and constructive. Remember, anger is counter-productive and can do nothing good. Let's show BioWare some support. They deserved it.

The people who worked hard and passionately to produce work for bad ideas deserve support. The people who came up with and forced said bad ideas to begin with do not.

I thought it was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. But support is support i guess.

That part wasn't bad, certainly. I like the fact that the Reapers had more depth. Even the form it took wasn't horrible; I don't really hate the Catalyst or anything. The only thing that bugs me is that there's no way for Shepard to survive without committing genocide, and I don't believe it was a good way to end a game with such character focus, everything being such vague smears, in addition to choices that rather came out of nowhere.

That's the point. You were given the really tough choice in the end. There is no other valid way to end a story which is built around moral choices you make. Each victory has its own price. The question is are you really ready to pay that price, or you prefer just to refuse and surrender.

[Seival]

Those, who still dislike the endings (or have some doubts) should imagine what would happen if the story was real, and you were Shepard managed to get the the end heavily wounded. Complaints will not help. You have to make the final choice, knowing that the fate of the entire Galactic Civilization depends on you...

...I hope this will help each anti-ender to become the pro-ender.

[Seival]

maaaze wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

P.S. Please, be polite and constructive. Remember, anger is counter-productive and can do nothing good. Let's show BioWare some support. They deserved it.

The people who worked hard and passionately to produce work for bad ideas deserve support. The people who came up with and forced said bad ideas to begin with do not.

I thought it was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. But support is support i guess.

It really was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. This made the story even more deep, instructive, and unique.

[The Night Mammoth]

Seival wrote...

It really was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. This made the story even more deep, instructive, and unique.

Mysterious evil machines, to the souless mooks of something as stupid as the Catalyst.

What a trade. 

[AlexPorto111]

Seival wrote...

maaaze wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

P.S. Please, be polite and constructive. Remember, anger is counter-productive and can do nothing good. Let's show BioWare some support. They deserved it.

The people who worked hard and passionately to produce work for bad ideas deserve support. The people who came up with and forced said bad ideas to begin with do not.

I thought it was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. But support is support i guess.

It really was a good idea to make the Reapers more than evil machines. This made the story even more deep, instructive, and unique.

I agree.

[drayfish]

The reason that the Joker is scary in The Dark Knight is because he is an irrational agent of chaos. He is anarchy personified. We don't know who he is, where he comes from, what he might do. He taps into our most primal fears and shakes the cage of our conformist comforts.

The Reapers accessed a similar primal terror in the first two games: they came from beyond time and understanding; they were motivated by aims to vast for our puny comprehension to grapple with...

Personally, finding out that they were driven by a glitchy program that didn't know the difference between the terms 'preserve' and 'smoothie' somewhat devalued them.

It would be like finding out that the Joker had a piece of paper in his pocket that said:

Dear John Joker,

I am leaving you.
You are just not homicidal enough.
I wish you could prove that you are somehow...


- Harley

Modifié par drayfish, 19 septembre 2012 - 09:33 .

[Link Ashland 614]

Seival wrote...

Those, who still dislike the endings (or have some doubts) should imagine what would happen if the story was real, and you were Shepard managed to get the the end heavily wounded. Complaints will not help. You have to make the final choice, knowing that the fate of the entire Galactic Civilization depends on you...

...I hope this will help each anti-ender to become the pro-ender.

We don't need to make them pro-enders. Tastes and opinions always differ, and I do understand why they would like or not like the ending. The hate however, isn't justified, so I don't condone that, but it's what they want so.

Now then, now that ME4 is more possible than ever. How would the game even have a new villain, or something like that?

[Xilizhra]

Seival wrote...

Those, who still dislike the endings (or have some doubts) should imagine what would happen if the story was real, and you were Shepard managed to get the the end heavily wounded. Complaints will not help. You have to make the final choice, knowing that the fate of the entire Galactic Civilization depends on you...

...I hope this will help each anti-ender to become the pro-ender.

I could. Except I'd be far more upset at the end there than I am right now, just complaining about a game, so I don't really want to.

[D24O]

drayfish wrote...

It would be like finding out that the Joker had a piece of paper in his pocket that said:

Dear John Joker,

I am leaving you.
You are just not homicidal enough.
I wish you could prove that you are somehow...


- Harley

I wouldn't blame him.
https://encrypted-tb...6XNcpt8uCk7Ibg 

[teh DRUMPf!!]

drayfish wrote...

The reason that the Joker is scary in The Dark Knight is because he is an irrational agent of chaos. He is anarchy personified. We don't know who he is, where he comes from, what he might do. He taps into our most primal fears and shakes the cage of our conformist comforts.

The Reapers accessed a similar primal terror in the first two games: they came from beyond time and understanding; they were motivated by aims to vast for our puny comprehension to grapple with...

Joker was a brilliant character. The Reapers and Sovereign were as well... in ME1.

ME2 pissed that away. Harbinger was laughable, the Collectors were cliched bug army, and they were possibly the least interesting part of the whole game. They reclaimed that title in ME3, and never struck fear in me at any point pre-catalyst.

Mystique is great if done well. For the Reapers, it mostly made them boring and largely an afterthought.

Personally, finding out that they were driven by a glitchy program that didn't know the difference between the terms 'preserve' and 'smoothie' somewhat devalued them.

So they were a mistake of a past civilization that got out of hand. You had to figure as much.

And there really can't be any sound, worthy reason behind the periodic galactic genocide. There had to be messed up motive behind it... it's messed up to begin with.

[knightnblu]

Did BioWare have a right to create the original endings as they did? Absolutely. Did BioWare have to create the EC DLC? Absolutely not, but they chose to anyway. What BioWare had no right to do was to intentionally mislead the fans and tell them falsehoods about ME3. I liked ME3 right up until the point where Anderson died and Shepard went on a field trip to see the Starbrat.

Some people were thrilled and I am happy for them. I didn't care for the original ending, but I am happy with the EC DLC. Never the less my point remains: BioWare lied. I don't know about you, but it pisses me off when somebody lies to me. Worse, BioWare never admitted to deceiving its fans. It just cited 'art' as if it were a get out of jail free card. The trouble with a lie is that you can never feel comfortable with what is said again. You have to verify it in order to believe it. That's because BioWare breached the trust between the players and the company.

Needless to say, I don't agree with your "anger never solves anything" approach because it is patently untrue both logically and tactically. To re-iterate, no problem with how BioWare chooses to create its product. It will stand or fall on its own, but spreading falsehoods designed to amp up the fans is unquestionably stupid when said fans are destined to discover the lie merely by playing the game.

[Seival]

Link Ashland 614 wrote...

Seival wrote...

Those, who still dislike the endings (or have some doubts) should imagine what would happen if the story was real, and you were Shepard managed to get the the end heavily wounded. Complaints will not help. You have to make the final choice, knowing that the fate of the entire Galactic Civilization depends on you...

...I hope this will help each anti-ender to become the pro-ender.

We don't need to make them pro-enders. Tastes and opinions always differ, and I do understand why they would like or not like the ending. The hate however, isn't justified, so I don't condone that, but it's what they want so.

Now then, now that ME4 is more possible than ever. How would the game even have a new villain, or something like that?

There will be no ME4. As developers already said - Shepard's story is over.

There will be a new game (with new protagonist) in ME Universe (I hope for a sequel RPG trilogy).

[Seival]

Xilizhra wrote...

Seival wrote...

Those, who still dislike the endings (or have some doubts) should imagine what would happen if the story was real, and you were Shepard managed to get the the end heavily wounded. Complaints will not help. You have to make the final choice, knowing that the fate of the entire Galactic Civilization depends on you...

...I hope this will help each anti-ender to become the pro-ender.

I could. Except I'd be far more upset at the end there than I am right now, just complaining about a game, so I don't really want to.

Yes, you'd be far more upset. And you'd feel exactly what Shepard felt in the end. And you'd still had to chose.

What would be your choice in this case?

[Seival]

Does anyone else think this music-video is Control ending related?


...Or it's just me?

Modifié par Seival, 28 septembre 2012 - 08:54 .

[Seival]

knightnblu wrote...

Did BioWare have a right to create the original endings as they did? Absolutely. Did BioWare have to create the EC DLC? Absolutely not, but they chose to anyway. What BioWare had no right to do was to intentionally mislead the fans and tell them falsehoods about ME3. I liked ME3 right up until the point where Anderson died and Shepard went on a field trip to see the Starbrat.

Some people were thrilled and I am happy for them. I didn't care for the original ending, but I am happy with the EC DLC. Never the less my point remains: BioWare lied. I don't know about you, but it pisses me off when somebody lies to me. Worse, BioWare never admitted to deceiving its fans. It just cited 'art' as if it were a get out of jail free card. The trouble with a lie is that you can never feel comfortable with what is said again. You have to verify it in order to believe it. That's because BioWare breached the trust between the players and the company.

Needless to say, I don't agree with your "anger never solves anything" approach because it is patently untrue both logically and tactically. To re-iterate, no problem with how BioWare chooses to create its product. It will stand or fall on its own, but spreading falsehoods designed to amp up the fans is unquestionably stupid when said fans are destined to discover the lie merely by playing the game.

BioWare lied? When? I don't remember such thing. The original endings were just too blurry and provoked a lot of misunderstanding. That was the reason for creating EC. BioWare didn't lie to us.

Modifié par Seival, 01 octobre 2012 - 11:34 .

[JasonShepard]

Seival wrote...

knightnblu wrote...
Snip

BioWare lied? When? I don't remember such thing. The original endings were just too blurry and provoked a lot of misunderstanding. That was the reason for creating EC. BioWare didn't lie to us.

He's probably referring to the whole "Shepard won't just find a Reaper off switch" quote. Which, to be fair, was made fairly early in development, and plans do change. In any case, the Crucible is not just a Reaper off switch. It blows them up. As well as the Geth. And EDI. And a lot of technology throughout the galaxy. We also spent the whole gme building it, rather than just finding it ready made.
That said, I do feel sympathetic to fans who feel they were given exactly what they were told they wouldn't get.

As for the choices don't matter complaint - this seems to be a multi-sided issue. On the one hand, most choices get, in-game, relegated to EMS and a codex-like description on the War Room computer. On the other hand, on the final mission I tore through London with Garrus and Ashley at my back, both of whom could have been dead. I left the galaxy with the genophage cured, the Geth at peace with the Quarians, and with everyone having hope for the future.
But yes, I'll never get to see this hopeful galaxy in game. I'm okay with that - I have my imagination - but I can understand why some people aren't happy.

(This wasn't entirely directed at you Seival - I was just doing my best to find common ground between people who say Bioware lied, and those who still love the company.)

[Jawsomebob]

You can support the endings but you cant support Kai Lang.

[Seival]

JasonShepard wrote...

Seival wrote...

knightnblu wrote...
Snip

BioWare lied? When? I don't remember such thing. The original endings were just too blurry and provoked a lot of misunderstanding. That was the reason for creating EC. BioWare didn't lie to us.

He's probably referring to the whole "Shepard won't just find a Reaper off switch" quote. Which, to be fair, was made fairly early in development, and plans do change. In any case, the Crucible is not just a Reaper off switch. It blows them up. As well as the Geth. And EDI. And a lot of technology throughout the galaxy. We also spent the whole gme building it, rather than just finding it ready made.
That said, I do feel sympathetic to fans who feel they were given exactly what they were told they wouldn't get.

As for the choices don't matter complaint - this seems to be a multi-sided issue. On the one hand, most choices get, in-game, relegated to EMS and a codex-like description on the War Room computer. On the other hand, on the final mission I tore through London with Garrus and Ashley at my back, both of whom could have been dead. I left the galaxy with the genophage cured, the Geth at peace with the Quarians, and with everyone having hope for the future.
But yes, I'll never get to see this hopeful galaxy in game. I'm okay with that - I have my imagination - but I can understand why some people aren't happy.

(This wasn't entirely directed at you Seival - I was just doing my best to find common ground between people who say Bioware lied, and those who still love the company.)

Yes, Crucible is a bomb, not a "Reaper off switch" or a "hacking device"... Complicated, smart and too good to be developed by one of the previous galactic civilizations. That's why I have a feeling that it were Leviathans, who actually developed the Crucible, and then "leaked" the schematics to lesser races. The Leviathan's reaction on the question about the Crucible was rather strange, so I gues that I'm probably right

Modifié par Seival, 01 octobre 2012 - 08:22 .