175 réponses à ce sujet

[DNC Protoman]

billy the squid wrote...

Either buff the weapon damage for SR's across the board, to restore it. (GodlessPaladin actually said this if Tac cloak was nerfed, but Bioware never implemented it, herp derp guys!) The sniper damage only became a problem because the Krysae was so poorly concieved and implemented. It got nerfed, but I ecrtainly don't want the damn thing comming back to spam levels again.

So either boost SR damage across the board and leav tac cloak as is/ boost Tac cloak to 40% and leave SR damage as it is.

Oh and reduce shield gate or ignore shield gate fr the Javelin. It's an Ultra rare SR with limited ammo capacity, can fire through a metre of metal and I'm stopped by a single block of centurion shield... seriously, come on.

Way I see it the best solution is a combo.  give 5% back to TC rand 6 to hit 30% sniper bonus.  Then give snipers cross the board a 10% damage boost.  That way infils get their snipe power back and snipers become less infil or damage boost class only.  Keep base duration as it is now to force the choice between damage or invsi time at rank 4.

Then you work on restoring boss headshot damage.  Maybe not as much as before, but bring some % back.

Modifié par DNC Protoman, 10 août 2012 - 11:33 .

[Talhydras]

I would much rather see boosts to the SRs themselves than more SR-specific bonuses to infiltrators. So I'm going to have to disagree with you, OP. If you boost SRs globally instead of TC specifically infiltrators will still be amazing at using them and will still have a modest but relevant boost to using them through their TC skill as it exists now. The other weapon using class - soldiers, deserves just as much of a shot at better SR damage as infiltrators in my opinion.

[nicethugbert]

Yuanrang wrote...

The stupidity of this thread baffles me. "Now the most recent overpowered thing has been stopped, let us rebuff the secondmost recent overpowered thing!!"

...no. Why? Because the buff to Sniper Rifle damage is more than enough for infiltrators. By raising the sniper rifle damage on the level 6 evolution of Tactical Cloak, you fix nothing except for Infiltrators.

The reasonable solution is to buff Sniper Rifles for everyone so not only Infiltrators can use them, soldiers should be able to use them too, as well as some Engineers, for instance. Infiltrators can be the best Snipers around with their current sniper boost, but buffing only Infiltrators is idiotic.

They want massive damage from as far away as possible.  Yet, having to get close to do that damage and risk getting killed is somehow overpowered.

[DNC Protoman]

nicethugbert wrote...

Yuanrang wrote...

The stupidity of this thread baffles me. "Now the most recent overpowered thing has been stopped, let us rebuff the secondmost recent overpowered thing!!"

...no. Why? Because the buff to Sniper Rifle damage is more than enough for infiltrators. By raising the sniper rifle damage on the level 6 evolution of Tactical Cloak, you fix nothing except for Infiltrators.

The reasonable solution is to buff Sniper Rifles for everyone so not only Infiltrators can use them, soldiers should be able to use them too, as well as some Engineers, for instance. Infiltrators can be the best Snipers around with their current sniper boost, but buffing only Infiltrators is idiotic.

They want massive damage from as far away as possible.  Yet, having to get close to do that damage and risk getting killed is somehow overpowered.

No sniper rifle was ever anything near as  OP as the Piranha

[nicethugbert]

DNC Protoman wrote...

nicethugbert wrote...

Yuanrang wrote...

The stupidity of this thread baffles me. "Now the most recent overpowered thing has been stopped, let us rebuff the secondmost recent overpowered thing!!"

...no. Why? Because the buff to Sniper Rifle damage is more than enough for infiltrators. By raising the sniper rifle damage on the level 6 evolution of Tactical Cloak, you fix nothing except for Infiltrators.

The reasonable solution is to buff Sniper Rifles for everyone so not only Infiltrators can use them, soldiers should be able to use them too, as well as some Engineers, for instance. Infiltrators can be the best Snipers around with their current sniper boost, but buffing only Infiltrators is idiotic.

They want massive damage from as far away as possible.  Yet, having to get close to do that damage and risk getting killed is somehow overpowered.

No sniper rifle was ever anything near as  OP as the Piranha

So it's because of the piranha that you guys want to do massive damage from as far away as possible with a cloak?  You guys didn't want this before?

[PaperAlien]

Sure, rebuff the sniper damage, but cut the universal damage. I don't particularly mind if it makes snipers a fair bit stronger, what I do mind is infiltrators using other weapons better than classes that are supposed to be good with them.

[Klokos]

PaperAlien wrote...

Sure, rebuff the sniper damage, but cut the universal damage. I don't particularly mind if it makes snipers a fair bit stronger, what I do mind is infiltrators using other weapons better than classes that are supposed to be good with them.

 What ?

[vonSlash]

If we restore Evolution 6 sniper damage to 40%, then we also need to reduce the base damage bonus to 30% and the Evolution 2 damage bonus to 30%.

[vkt62]

+1

[dysturbed0ne]

DNC Protoman wrote...

nicethugbert wrote...

Yuanrang wrote...

The stupidity of this thread baffles me. "Now the most recent overpowered thing has been stopped, let us rebuff the secondmost recent overpowered thing!!"

...no. Why? Because the buff to Sniper Rifle damage is more than enough for infiltrators. By raising the sniper rifle damage on the level 6 evolution of Tactical Cloak, you fix nothing except for Infiltrators.

The reasonable solution is to buff Sniper Rifles for everyone so not only Infiltrators can use them, soldiers should be able to use them too, as well as some Engineers, for instance. Infiltrators can be the best Snipers around with their current sniper boost, but buffing only Infiltrators is idiotic.

They want massive damage from as far away as possible.  Yet, having to get close to do that damage and risk getting killed is somehow overpowered.

No sniper rifle was ever anything near as  OP as the Piranha

The Krysae was very close, but just on an Infiltrator. The Krysae has been neutered now and I agree TC should be restored. Even the 5% to evo 6 and 10% to SR's you suggested would be a step in the right direction. The BW, Valiant and Javelin should be effective on platinum.

[DNC Protoman]

On a side note it's funny to see these people running in here to oppose this idea because of the very small piranha nerf a couple days ago

[dysturbed0ne]

PaperAlien wrote...

Sure, rebuff the sniper damage, but cut the universal damage. I don't particularly mind if it makes snipers a fair bit stronger, what I do mind is infiltrators using other weapons better than classes that are supposed to be good with them.

I agree, but at this moment you have a few dozen shotgun Infiltrators with the claymores aimed at your head. You won't see them because your head will be gone before they uncloak.

Modifié par dysturbed0ne, 10 août 2012 - 01:05 .

[PaperAlien]

Klokos wrote...

PaperAlien wrote...

Sure, rebuff the sniper damage, but cut the universal damage. I don't particularly mind if it makes snipers a fair bit stronger, what I do mind is infiltrators using other weapons better than classes that are supposed to be good with them.

 What ?

Reduce the universal damage bonus from the current 40-80%, and raise the sniper damage bonus. Too many infiltrators specialising in other classes' signature weapons (eg vanguards are supposed to be good with shotguns, yet most shotguns are used more by infiltrators).

dysturbed0ne wrote...

PaperAlien wrote...

Sure,
rebuff the sniper damage, but cut the universal damage. I don't
particularly mind if it makes snipers a fair bit stronger, what I do
mind is infiltrators using other weapons better than classes that are
supposed to be good with them.

I agree, but at this
moment you have a few dozen shotgun Infiltrators with the claymores
aimed at your head. You won't see them because your head will be gone
before they uncloak.

That.. was exactly my point.

Modifié par PaperAlien, 10 août 2012 - 01:06 .

[Klokos]

PaperAlien wrote...

Reduce the universal damage bonus from the current 40-80%, and raise the sniper damage bonus. Too many infiltrators specialising in other classes' signature weapons (eg vanguards are supposed to be good with shotguns, yet most shotguns are used more by infiltrators).

 I understood the part about damage, not the second one. I don't think there is a problem with infiltrators not using SR. There is no class specific weapons anymore (I always liked shotgun infiltrator the best, even when they where considered a liability).

Modifié par Klokos, 10 août 2012 - 01:08 .

[PaperAlien]

It becomes a problem when shotgun infiltrators are arguably more effective than sniper infiltrators.

[NuclearTech76]

PaperAlien wrote...

Sure, rebuff the sniper damage, but cut the universal damage. I don't particularly mind if it makes snipers a fair bit stronger, what I do mind is infiltrators using other weapons better than classes that are supposed to be good with them.

Umm. Infiltrators and sniper rifles go together. They should be better with a sniper rifle than other classes.

You have a balance right now with infiltrators. You can either spec for duration or go the damage path. Any more balance changes that nerf the damage evolution and everyone will just spec for duration. The class needs diversity. With a damage hike on the sniper damage, you have duration or damage snipers, melee infiltrators, grenadier infiltrators, duration or damage shotgun infiltrators. That's probably the most diversified class in the game. They don't want to break the class. They should be asking how they can improve other classes diversity.

[NuclearTech76]

PaperAlien wrote...

It becomes a problem when shotgun infiltrators are arguably more effective than sniper infiltrators.

Shotguns in general are more effective than any other weapon in the game. This isn't infiltrator specific.

[jessestond]

Agreed, please restore!

[dysturbed0ne]

PaperAlien wrote...

It becomes a problem when shotgun infiltrators are arguably more effective than sniper infiltrators.

Arguably? It is pretty clear they are. Even before the TC nerf the shotgun infi's were more effective. You never saw any speed runs (before the Krysae) with group of Infiltrators carrying a BW, Widow or Valiant. The only thing BW did when they changed TC was push the SR Infi's away with no other options. I guess it accomplished their goal to reduce the the number of Infiltrators, as little sense as it seems to make.

[DNC Protoman]

dysturbed0ne wrote...

PaperAlien wrote...

It becomes a problem when shotgun infiltrators are arguably more effective than sniper infiltrators.

Arguably? It is pretty clear they are. Even before the TC nerf the shotgun infi's were more effective. You never saw any speed runs (before the Krysae) with group of Infiltrators carrying a BW, Widow or Valiant. The only thing BW did when they changed TC was push the SR Infi's away with no other options. I guess it accomplished their goal to reduce the the number of Infiltrators, as little sense as it seems to make.

Right.  As I've said a few times now it boils down to this:  Snipers can have their damage back now as it will bring diversity not dominance.  the addition a bunch of powerfull auto-fire options and the new N7 classes make this possible.

TC 6 and boss headshots gotta make the comeback.

[rmccowen]

NuclearTech76 wrote...

PaperAlien wrote...

It becomes a problem when shotgun infiltrators are arguably more effective than sniper infiltrators.

Shotguns in general are more effective than any other weapon in the game. This isn't infiltrator specific.

This. Shotguns > snipers is an interaction with the fundamental mechanics of the game, and can't be tuned for or by Infiltrators. Consider for a moment that the major difference between a Claymore and a Javelin is that the Claymore ignores shield gate. If the Javelin fired 12 small particles at 1200 RPM for 100 damage each, instead of 1 round for 1200 damage, it would be hard to argue against Infiltrators using anything else.

Instead, it takes two Widow or Javelin rounds to kill Gold infantry versus one Claymore round. That's why the Black Widow and Valiant rule the sniper roost (such as it is): unless you're shooting at Brutes, doing 4000 damage with a single round is substantially less effective than doing 1000 damage per round with three rounds.

Unfortunately, it's a problem that can't be solved by adjusting Evo 6 of Tactical Cloak--and trying to solve it that way could have a number of unfortunate unintended consequences, like bringing the Krysae back from the grave. We need to start simply, with a damage adjustment for most sniper rifles, and see how that shakes out.

[DNC Protoman]

rmccowen wrote...

NuclearTech76 wrote...

PaperAlien wrote...

It becomes a problem when shotgun infiltrators are arguably more effective than sniper infiltrators.

Shotguns in general are more effective than any other weapon in the game. This isn't infiltrator specific.

This. Shotguns > snipers is an interaction with the fundamental mechanics of the game, and can't be tuned for or by Infiltrators. Consider for a moment that the major difference between a Claymore and a Javelin is that the Claymore ignores shield gate. If the Javelin fired 12 small particles at 1200 RPM for 100 damage each, instead of 1 round for 1200 damage, it would be hard to argue against Infiltrators using anything else.

Instead, it takes two Widow or Javelin rounds to kill Gold infantry versus one Claymore round. That's why the Black Widow and Valiant rule the sniper roost (such as it is): unless you're shooting at Brutes, doing 4000 damage with a single round is substantially less effective than doing 1000 damage per round with three rounds.

Unfortunately, it's a problem that can't be solved by adjusting Evo 6 of Tactical Cloak--and trying to solve it that way could have a number of unfortunate unintended consequences, like bringing the Krysae back from the grave. We need to start simply, with a damage adjustment for most sniper rifles, and see how that shakes out.

The RoF adjustment on the Krysae will keep it in check. 

[xtorma]

DNC Protoman wrote...

On a side note it's funny to see these people running in here to oppose this idea because of the very small piranha nerf a couple days ago

How do we know the reason bioware reduced evolution rank six on tc was because of the krysae? If that were the case , they would have left it alone for the time between the tc nerf and the krysae nerf.

The entire argument for the tc nerf was that it was always overpowered, and that all the krysae did was make it easier for everyone to see.

[nicethugbert]

DNC Protoman wrote...

On a side note it's funny to see these people running in here to oppose this idea because of the very small piranha nerf a couple days ago

What?  Where were you before the TC nerf?

P.S.  You didn't answer my last question in the post above.

[DNC Protoman]

nicethugbert wrote...

DNC Protoman wrote...

On a side note it's funny to see these people running in here to oppose this idea because of the very small piranha nerf a couple days ago

What?  Where were you before the TC nerf?

P.S.  You didn't answer my last question in the post above.

to be honest i don't waste time reading your posts.